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Yup, I am surprised that individuals THINK they have landed on Spiritual Truths that have never been revealed before. I suspect they come to this 'truth' by fulfilling 2 Peter 3:16.
Are you saying that YOU are a Sanctified individual who has an express unique relationship with the Lord God?
Okay, well, we understand that differently, obviously.
Jesus always was, is, and forever will be one with the Father and the Spirit. As I said, He was never in need of salvation. For Him, being born again of the Spirit was not needed. He is the One Who baptizes with the Holy Spirit, as Mark, Luke, and John quote John the Baptist as saying. John ~ both Johns :) ~ are saying that water baptism itself is not effectual in making one eligible or conferring salvation upon the one receiving it. As Jesus says, "With man, this is impossible. But with God all things are possible."
I'm... sure you will have an answer... :) but why was baptism not a practice in the Old Testament, Mary? That's really a rhetorical question, as we can see in Hebrews 11 that all in Christ have been, are, and will be saved the same way... You might answer "circumcision," to which I would say, yes, that was the sign and seal of the Covenant in the Old Testament (Genesis 17:11,13), as baptism is in the New, having replaced circumcision (Colossians 2:11-12). But circumcision pointed to Christ, Who was cut off for our sake, and now we are the circumcision (Philippians 3:3), cut off by God from unbelievers/evildoers and unto Himself. God always was and is the true Circumciser..., and the Baptizer as well. This is not to say that water baptism is unimportant, but it is not salvific.
LOL!! My last two posts have been chock full of direct Scripture... Now, you might say that I have given my opinions regarding those Scriptures, and that's fine; I would say exactly the same of you.
So we are saved because we evangelize? Hmmm...
Well, the Holy Spirit is the one Who superintended the writing of all Scripture... and reminds us of all Jesus said... and the one Who gives true discernment concerning the Word. So, yes, me, too. :)
And I have said this is untrue. If you could provide examples, then maybe there would be something to talk about. :)
LOL! See directly above.
Thanks for admitting that. I disagree, and, no offense intended, would say that you cannot possibly make such an statement or assessment with any credibility.
See above. Regarding the first half of this statement, with no examples, no conversation can be had, and regarding the latter half, well, "tricked the flock" is just silly. :) And again, you can give me your opinion about who is guided by the Holy Spirit and who is not (over and over and over again), but it is yet still just an opinion.
<eyeroll>
All I'm saying is that the Holy Spirit is still at work, even as He was before and during the 16th century.
<eyeroll>
LOL! Mary, a denomination is a recognized autonomous branch of the Christian Church. I know full well you will disagree vehemently, but the Catholic denomination is... well, a denomination. :)
I said your assertion was naive, not you, Mary. Things are what they are.
Good, so you understand why denominations exist... including the Catholic denomination... and the non-denominational denomination. :)
A bit better crafted, but... :) There is one Church, Mary. Always has been and always will be. Christ's Church consists of God's elect.
(Ezekiel 36:16–38; Galatians 5:16–26) 1Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.a2For in Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set youb free from the law of sin and death. 3For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful man, as an offering for sin.c He thus condemned sin in the flesh, 4so that the righteous standard of the law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5Those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh; but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. 6The mind of the flesh is death, but the mind of the Spirit is life and peace,7because the mind of the flesh is hostile to God: It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. 8Those controlled by the fleshd cannot please God. 9You, however, are controlled not by the flesh, but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. 10But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alivee because of righteousness. 11And if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the deadf will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit, who lives in you. Heirs with Christ 12Therefore, brothers, we have an obligation, but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. 13For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15For you did not receive a spirit of slavery that returns you to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” 16The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are God’s children. 17And if we are children, then we are heirs: heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ—if indeed we suffer with Him, so that we may also be glorified with Him. Future Glory (2 Corinthians 5:1–10) 18I consider that our present sufferings are not comparable to the glory that will be revealed in us. 19The creation waits in eager expectation for the revelation of the sons of God. 20For the creation was subjected to futility, not by its own will, but because of the One who subjected it, in hope 21that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God. 22We know that the whole creation has been groaning together in the pains of childbirth until the present time. 23Not only that, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies. 24For in this hope we were saved; but hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what he can already see? 25But if we hope for what we do not yet see, we wait for it patiently. 26In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. For we do not know how we ought to pray, but the Spirit Himself intercedes for us with groans too deep for words. 27And He who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. God Works in All Things (Ephesians 1:3–14) 28And we know that God works all things together for the good of those who love Him, who are called according to His purpose. 29For those God foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers. 30And those He predestined, He also called; those He called, He also justified; those He justified, He also glorified. 31What then shall we say in response to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? 32He who did not spare His own Son but gave Him up for us all, how will He not also, along with Him, freely give us all things? 33Who will bring any charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. 34Who is there to condemn us? For Christ Jesus, who died, and more than that was raised to life, is at the right hand of God—and He is interceding for us. More than Conquerors (Psalm 44:1–26) 35Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall trouble or distress or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword? 36As it is written: “For Your sake we face death all day long; we are considered as sheep to be slaughtered.”g 37No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us.38For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor principalities, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, 39neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord. |
Are you saying, that a Born Again doesn’t have direct contact with God, via the Holy Spirit?
I thought he was talking about @Eternally Grateful
Yes, I am saying that because Scripture does not say that a person who is baptized in water (born again) has direct contact with God via the Holy Spirit.
Hate to break it to you Taken but Jesus was NOT talking to you in John 14:26. He was talking to me and here is a translation of that passage in the original Aramaic:
Lol....sooo since I am an adversary of you I have a lack of truth, understanding etc etc.? Fascinating.....Well, since you call me an adversary, I now call you an adversary therefore YOU now have a lack of truth, lack of understanding and jesting, mocking and you make false accusations.
Hey Ritajanice.....
Hello Pinseeker,
Hellow Pinseeker...........FYI: Water Baptism was a Jewish practice: https://www.oneforisrael.org/bible-based-teaching-from-israel/was-baptism-originally-jewish/
Well, Scripture does not equate being baptized in water (by men) with being born again of the Spirit in that moment. We cannot cause anyone else to be born again of the Spirit through any means. Only God can do that. It is possible for the two things (water baptism and being born again of the Spirit) to coincide, because whenever God purposes to do something, He can certainly do it at any time, but that's all that can be credibly said:
LOL! Jesus was talking to His disciples, Mary. His followers. And if you, like me, and apparently Taken, are a follower of Jesus, then you, too, along with me and Taken, are counted among His followers... and thus, have the Spirit. Thus, by extension, Jesus is talking there to all of us.
Well, we can all agree that He gave truth... :) But in our... infirmity, shall we say... our weakness, we can still be mistaken, from... time to time... :) He did speak truthfully, of course, but any one person may or may not be one of His disciples, which means some are excluded from what He says there. The Father has certainly sent this other Helper, the Holy Spirit, but He was not and will not be given to all, else all would be saved, and we know that's not the case.
Did Jesus or the Spirit tell you that Taken had/has a tickling in the tummy? :) Wow?
I realize you're speaking to Taken, here, Mary, but, well, I'm sorry to hear that...I am your adversary and YOU are now, by my declaration, an adversary. Now we are equals.
Lol....sooo since I am an adversary of you I have a lack of truth, understanding etc etc.? Fascinating.....Well, since you call me an adversary, I now call you an adversary therefore YOU now have a lack of truth, lack of understanding and jesting, mocking and you make false accusations.
Dang kiddo....what you gonna do now? In john 14:26 Jesus was talking to me and I am telling you that He gave ME the truth BUT you have this tickling in your tummy that He is talking to you and that he gave YOU the truth. I am your adversary and YOU are now, by my declaration, an adversary. Now we are equals.
That is ONE of the things we must do to be saved. But your men failed to teach you that so I will:
Yes Pinseeker, the Holy Spirit is the one who superintended the writing of all Scripture! No, the Holy Spirit does NOT remind US, 2,000 years later, of all that Jesus said. SOME of what Jesus said is written down so that we, 2,000 years later, can read it. The APOSTLES were told that the Holy Spirit would remind THEM of all that Jesus said. The twisting of that passage (John 14:26) started in the 16th century and has led to great division in Christianity because everyone who sits in their basement reading Scripture while eating their Doritos thinks the Holy Spirit is talking to them and giving THEM the truth. Even Martin Luther saw this happening in his time (less the Doritos
). He realized the CHAOS that self-interpretation of the bible brought. But YOU can't see that in OUR time?
Luther, Calvin and Zwingli were considered the top 3 Revolutionaries so I will provide examples from them:
