Patrick1966
Well-Known Member
It says they'll get out but not until they have paid in full.
Hellfire and brimstone has given way to eternal separation from God. - Why?
- Thread starter St. SteVen
- Start date
-
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It says they'll get out but not until they have paid in full.
Patrick1966 said:
Does that sound like never-ending punishment? @Patrick1966
Even humans are careful to avoid cruel and unusual punishment.
And the sentences are finite.
Does that sound like never-ending punishment? @Patrick1966
What does that say about God's justice? Sadistic, or merciful?
Even humans are careful to avoid cruel and unusual punishment.
And the sentences are finite.
@St. SteVen
It is wrong for adopted Children of God to be chastised, or is for the betterment of the person? Isnt that a type punishment from God? Is that sadistic or loving?
It is wrong for adopted Children of God to be chastised, or is for the betterment of the person? Isnt that a type punishment from God? Is that sadistic or loving?
I don't judge God or say he's cruel. I would caution you to do the same.
Another question,
There was a remark somewhere stating Atheist even believe in God, however if they claim there is no God, there was no Son of God, and they simply go on about there own way, even with the natural elements of the world from the universe, which claim the glory of God.
Is it fair for God not to punish them, or chastised them if he does it to his own children?
Many peope think of punishment of putting a persons head in a gullitoine, or perhaps on a stretcher as you spin the wheel and the body is being pulled slowly apart as you continue to rotate it.
Do you believe that being show truth can be torturous? However not in the way man things, but in the way God presents it? Not only through the elements, but also through His son, the Jewish people hated it, the Demons hated it, Satan wasnt all that well taken kindly to it either he enjoyed the darkness more.
Therefore does the Lake of Fire - not hold somethint of value that is light and the more closer you come to the light does it not hurt?
Does suffering for Christ hurt? Is that not also being baptised in Holy spirit and Fire? Doesnt fire hurt as it burns away things you did in your past life, trusting God even being taken away from the people you may have gotten high with before? Does those things not hurt?
If its all love and there is no hurt, like Gods repentance at destroying mankind, what is left to experience? How can there be anything learned if you are never hurt by your own choices you once done?
Perhaps being mean and hating people, taking life by gossiping and telling lies? By hurting your family by having sex with other women or your children by doing drugs?
There was a remark somewhere stating Atheist even believe in God, however if they claim there is no God, there was no Son of God, and they simply go on about there own way, even with the natural elements of the world from the universe, which claim the glory of God.
Is it fair for God not to punish them, or chastised them if he does it to his own children?
Many peope think of punishment of putting a persons head in a gullitoine, or perhaps on a stretcher as you spin the wheel and the body is being pulled slowly apart as you continue to rotate it.
Do you believe that being show truth can be torturous? However not in the way man things, but in the way God presents it? Not only through the elements, but also through His son, the Jewish people hated it, the Demons hated it, Satan wasnt all that well taken kindly to it either he enjoyed the darkness more.
Therefore does the Lake of Fire - not hold somethint of value that is light and the more closer you come to the light does it not hurt?
Does suffering for Christ hurt? Is that not also being baptised in Holy spirit and Fire? Doesnt fire hurt as it burns away things you did in your past life, trusting God even being taken away from the people you may have gotten high with before? Does those things not hurt?
If its all love and there is no hurt, like Gods repentance at destroying mankind, what is left to experience? How can there be anything learned if you are never hurt by your own choices you once done?
Perhaps being mean and hating people, taking life by gossiping and telling lies? By hurting your family by having sex with other women or your children by doing drugs?
Good question.
Children are children, but they are also individuals.
I have two sons of natural birth. (not adopted) Each one has their own individual needs and ways to receive from their father.
So, in general I treat each one equally, but in light of who they are. One son was definitely more of a challenge than the other.
I love both of them equally, but treat each according to our "adopted" relationship due to their individuality.
More to your point...
I think this applies to God's treatment of us all, whether we were called by His Spirit in this lifetime to be the Elect, or not.
And I think we make the WRONG assumption to think that those called in this lifetime will have an easier time in the Age of Restoration.
Which may seem to contradict an earlier statement of mine. Again, the individuality has a GREAT bearing.
Hard to find the passage, but Jesus asks about those who said they would obey, but didn't;
and those that said they wouldn't obey, but did. How should each group be judged?
Another question is all of mankind Children of God? Or are people adopted by faith?
“The Spirit of God, who raised Jesus from the dead, lives in you. And just as God raised Christ Jesus from the dead, he will give life to your mortal bodies by this same Spirit living within you. Therefore, dear brothers and sisters, you have no obligation to do what your sinful nature urges you to do. For if you live by its dictates, you will die. But if through the power of the Spirit you put to death the deeds of your sinful nature, you will live. For all who are led by the Spirit of God are children of God. So you have not received a spirit that makes you fearful slaves. Instead, you received God’s Spirit when he adopted you as his own children. Now we call him, “Abba, Father.” For his Spirit joins with our spirit to affirm that we are God’s children. And since we are his children, we are his heirs. In fact, together with Christ we are heirs of God’s glory. But if we are to share his glory, we must also share his suffering.”
Romans 8:11-17 NLT
“The Spirit of God, who raised Jesus from the dead, lives in you. And just as God raised Christ Jesus from the dead, he will give life to your mortal bodies by this same Spirit living within you. Therefore, dear brothers and sisters, you have no obligation to do what your sinful nature urges you to do. For if you live by its dictates, you will die. But if through the power of the Spirit you put to death the deeds of your sinful nature, you will live. For all who are led by the Spirit of God are children of God. So you have not received a spirit that makes you fearful slaves. Instead, you received God’s Spirit when he adopted you as his own children. Now we call him, “Abba, Father.” For his Spirit joins with our spirit to affirm that we are God’s children. And since we are his children, we are his heirs. In fact, together with Christ we are heirs of God’s glory. But if we are to share his glory, we must also share his suffering.”
Romans 8:11-17 NLT
Romans 8:11-17 The Spirit of God, who raised Jesus from the dead, lives in you. And just as God raised Christ Jesus from the dead, he will give life to your mortal bodies by this same Spirit living within you. There | New Living Translation (NLT) | D
The Spirit of God, who raised Jesus from the dead, lives in you. And just as God raised Christ Jesus from the dead, he will give life to your mortal bodies by this same Spirit living within you. There
bible.com
Thanks. I appreciate your concern.
And you have warned me before. Yet I continue... ???
To be clear, I agree with you. God is NOT cruel.
This is why I defend His good character against the hell doctrine.
The hell doctrine CANNOT be true for the very reason we agree on.
God is NOT cruel.
It is not me calling God cruel, but those who hold to the hell doctrine.
Okay, Steven.
okay.
Okay.
Fairly and rightly.
Got some more questions on post #85 #87.
Thank you for summing up those things. Justice is served for sure in this life through punishment in prison; however while some are saved through those means, there still those who reject.
Can eternal (age-during) separation happen for as long as a person desires it to happen be it in this life or the next life?
From my perception God doesnt force people to worship him, and Jesus said God is spirit and those who worship will worship him in spirit and in truth.
With the notion of Prison, I believe
Freedom to have life out side of that is a type of Paradise
And those in Jail are in the separated part of Paradise which is having confiment like Jonah in the whale
The free and imprisoned still have interaction. The police man that goes home, but the prisoner stays there confined.
Heaven has these same features? Considering hell has been done away with in my perview.
Freedom to have life out side of that is a type of Paradise
And those in Jail are in the separated part of Paradise which is having confiment like Jonah in the whale
The free and imprisoned still have interaction. The police man that goes home, but the prisoner stays there confined.
Heaven has these same features? Considering hell has been done away with in my perview.
Patrick1966
Well-Known Member
Lol at folks here cautioning you about what you say about God while they claim that Jesus is unforgiving, sadistic, monster that, by comparison, makes Hitler look like a humanitarian
Patrick1966
I never heard devin ever say anything like that, are there people on the board claiming that Jesus is unforgiving, and sadistic?
Patrick1966
Well-Known Member
Anyone who condemns another to forever suffering is definitely unforgiving and sadistic.
Hope to hear what your thoughts are on post #85, #87, @St. SteVen. Have a good afternoon.
Probably not an A/B response for that. (is it this, or that?)
It's a complex issue, with much to consider. IMHO
For starters, we find this at the end of one of the genealogies of Jesus.
On what basis was Adam, the son (child) of God?
Luke 3:38 NIV
the son of Enosh,
the son of Seth, the son of Adam,
the son of God.
Steven,
Adam was one of the first people to have relationships with God, but we never hear from him again. He also died spiritually the day him and eve left the Garden.
It then begs the question, can we even trust what Paul states about being adopted.
Are not all people creations of God? Then become his children through faith?
Or can we even trust what John writes,
Saying
“But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God. They are reborn—not with a physical birth resulting from human passion or plan, but a birth that comes from God.”
John 1:12-13 NLT
Saying
“But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God. They are reborn—not with a physical birth resulting from human passion or plan, but a birth that comes from God.”
John 1:12-13 NLT
John 1:12-13 But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God. They are reborn—not with a physical birth resulting from human passion or plan, but a birth that comes from G | New Living Translation (NLT) | Dow
But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God. They are reborn—not with a physical birth resulting from human passion or plan, but a birth that comes from G
bible.com
However, @St. SteVen
There have been many sons of God, who were faithful to the true and living God of the living who created the universe.
Adam was one of the first but then, they (Adam and Eve) died spiritually, the only one we hear after they left the Garden is Eve. She was thankful for her son cain and called upon the Lord. And we all know how that story went.
www.christianityboard.com
There have been many sons of God, who were faithful to the true and living God of the living who created the universe.
Adam was one of the first but then, they (Adam and Eve) died spiritually, the only one we hear after they left the Garden is Eve. She was thankful for her son cain and called upon the Lord. And we all know how that story went.
Genesis Chapter 4:1-16 (Verse by Verse)
#4 Genesis 4:1-3 #5 Genesis 4:4-7 #9 Genesis 4:8 #10 Genesis 4:9-10 #11 Genesis 4:11-16 “Now Adam had sexual relations with his wife, Eve, and she became pregnant. When she gave birth to Cain, she said, “With the Lord’s help, I have produced a man!” Later she gave birth to his brother and...
www.christianityboard.com
Patrick1966
Well-Known Member
Or can we even trust what John writes,
Saying
“But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God. They are reborn—not with a physical birth resulting from human passion or plan, but a birth that comes from God.”
John 1:12-13 NLT
John 1:12-13 But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God. They are reborn—not with a physical birth resulting from human passion or plan, but a birth that comes from G | New Living Translation (NLT) | Dow
But to all who believed him and accepted him, he gave the right to become children of God. They are reborn—not with a physical birth resulting from human passion or plan, but a birth that comes from Gbible.com
I don't believe that all people are of God but, eventually, ALL will be his.
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