Is Obedience a Condition of Salvation?

[Eternally Grateful]

Unfortunately, not everyone calling themselves a Christian has repented and been born again of the Spirit so cannot even begin to relate to Jesus taking away all desire to sin.

What have you been taught that the New Covenant is? It seems you believe in the Old Covenant and have just added Jesus' cross to it.

so you do think you are sinless? You did not answer that question

 

[Ritajanice]

Unfortunately, not everyone calling themselves a Christian has repented and been born again of the Spirit so cannot even begin to relate to Jesus taking away all desire to sin.

Maybe they haven’t reached that understanding yet, did you know everything as soon as you were Born Again ?

I’ve been Born Again over 30 yrs and have just come to that understanding....

Just because they don’t believe as you do....doesn’t mean they aren’t Born Again...

 

[Ritajanice]

so you do think you are sinless? You did not answer that question

She’s still got that old man, so, she can’t be sinless....to be honest, I know we have received that new nature/ spirit within.....but, where does that old man nature go?

Maybe @1stCenturyLady can help us on that one @Eternally Grateful .

 

[Ritajanice]

We put on the new man...so. @1stCenturyLady ...can you explain this scripture?

>Colossians 3:9-10

Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices, and have put on the new self who is being renewed to a true knowledge according to the image of the One who created him—

The old man is "in the flesh"; the new man "in the Spirit." In the former "the works of the flesh" (Galatians 5:19-21) are manifest; in the latter "the fruit of the Spirit" (Galatians 5:22,23). One is "corrupt according to the deceitful lusts"; the other "created in righteousness and true holiness" (Ephesians 4:22-24 the King James Version)

 

[brightfame52]

eternally grateful

But eternal life is not based on what you do or do not do. Its based on the cross.

So then everyone Christ died for, shed His Blood for shall be saved correct ?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

eternally grateful



So then everyone Christ died for, shed His Blood for shall be saved correct ?

Christ died for EVERYONE

But not everyone will recieve his gift..So they will nto be given the right to become children of God. because they did not believe

 

[brightfame52]

Christ died for EVERYONE

But not everyone will recieve his gift..So they will nto be given the right to become children of God. because they did not believe

Then you contradicted yourself, you just like the person you corrected, and believe one is saved by what they do !

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Then you contradicted yourself, you just like the person you corrected, and believe one is saved by what they do !

Nope

One is saved because they receive the gift God came to offer

But as many as have received him, to THEM

Receiving God is not a work.. You can;t boast in self because you received someone else's payment for your sins.. if anything, you are attacking yourself. because you are claiming you are totally worthless and totally guilty that you can not even help yourself.

 

[brightfame52]

Nope

One is saved because they receive the gift God came to offer

But as many as have received him, to THEM

Receiving God is not a work.. You can;t boast in self because you received someone else's payment for your sins.. if anything, you are attacking yourself. because you are claiming you are totally worthless and totally guilty that you can not even help yourself.

Yes, you say one thing, people aren't saved by what they do, then turn around and say some people aren't saved because of something they didn't do, that's madness.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

We put on the new man...so. @1stCenturyLady ...can you explain this scripture?

>Colossians 3:9-10

Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices, and have put on the new self who is being renewed to a true knowledge according to the image of the One who created him—

The old man is "in the flesh"; the new man "in the Spirit." In the former "the works of the flesh" (Galatians 5:19-21) are manifest; in the latter "the fruit of the Spirit" (Galatians 5:22,23). One is "corrupt according to the deceitful lusts"; the other "created in righteousness and true holiness" (Ephesians 4:22-24 the King James Version)

In Colossians the context is in the preceding chapter. It is about sin.

Colossians 2:11 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, 14 having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.

Romans 6:
5 For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, 6 knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. 7 For he who has died has been freed from sin. 8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, 9 knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him. 10 For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. 11 Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord. (Proverbs 23:5 For as a man thinks in his heart, so is he.)12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts. 13 And do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

1 John 3:8-9
8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Maybe they haven’t reached that understanding yet, did you know everything as soon as you were Born Again ?

I’ve been Born Again over 30 yrs and have just come to that understanding....

Just because they don’t believe as you do....doesn’t mean they aren’t Born Again...

The first thing every born again believer understands is that the desire to sin a major moral sin (Ten Commandments) IS GONE. I felt it leave my body. We are immediately RIGHTEOUS.

What is a progress is the maturing of the fruit of the Spirit. That is why Peter makes it progressive in 2 Peter 1:5-7. "5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control [a]perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love." When all the fruit of the Spirit are mature then we are as Peter said in 1 Peter 1:16 “Be holy, for I am holy.” HOLY

Revelation 22:11 Now you can understand this verse of two different groups of Christians (and those who are unsaved altogether). 11 He who is unjust, let him be unjust still; he who is filthy, let him be filthy still; he who is righteous, let him be righteous still; he who is holy, let him be holy still.”

1 John 3 is about the taking away of the major group of sins from the laws of God. Lawlessness 1 John 3:4. The last verse of this chapter is on ABIDING IN JESUS, AND HE IN US.

John 15:1-4 is about the venial sins of immature fruit of the Spirit. Again, verse 4 is on ABIDING IN JESUS, AND HE IN US.

“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. 2 Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 3 You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. 4 Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me.

Verse 2 should give us pause. It is linked with Matthew 7:19 (also on fruit)

15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them. 21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

 

[1stCenturyLady]

so you do think you are sinless? You did not answer that question

Of course! I have been born of God since 1977

 

[L.A.M.B.]

Belief is a condition of salvation......
Do you believe and accept that Jesus is God in the flesh, come down among man to bring a way for mankind to be forgiven of sins w/o the blood of bulls and goats?

Romans 10:9-10 KJV
that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

Being " born again" is not the finish line some attribute it to be........ but is JUST the beginning of our discipleship !

Sadly some only have this taste of God and are satisfied and therefore do not grow " IN CHRIST" but remain babes on the milk of the word .

We are to progress ( move forward ) in spirituality as we grow in the Spirit of God!

By feasting at the table of knowledge, the word of God, we strengthen our faith, building it up in the Holy Ghost. He is the guide, reminder, illuminator, personal fruit bearer, and director of our discipleship. With out being led of the Spirit, how can we know " we are the children of God"?

 

[1stCenturyLady]

She’s still got that old man, so, she can’t be sinless....to be honest

That is not true of those who are born of God because we have experienced a supernatural rebirth. The normal person without Christ does have the old man and sin nature forever. So, you're right, they can't be sinless. But he was speaking to me.

 

[Ritajanice]

That is not true of those who are born of God because we have experienced a supernatural rebirth.

Meaning what exactly?

The normal person without Christ does have the old man and sin nature forever. So, you're right, they can't be sinless.

The normal person?

Don’t you mean the unregenerate still have that sin nature?

Who knows if God will birth them in the Spirit?

What happens to those who aren’t Born Again?

But he was speaking to me.

He was speaking to you?

Where have you explained that you never sin?

Imo, you haven’t?

 

[Ritajanice]

Of course! I have been born of God since 1977

How is that ,what you say here answering his question about sin?

 

[brightfame52]

Belief is a condition of salvation......
Do you believe and accept that Jesus is God in the flesh, come down among man to bring a way for mankind to be forgiven of sins w/o the blood of bulls and goats?

Romans 10:9-10 KJV
that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Then you dont believe that many are made righteous/saved by the obedience of One as Per Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

You condition salvation on mans obedience in addition to only Christs obedience, thats works !

 

[Ritajanice]

Then you dont believe that many are made righteous/saved by the obedience of One as Per Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

You condition salvation on mans obedience in addition to only Christs obedience, thats works !

So, are you saying, that through the obedience of one ( Jesus)....many will be made righteous, Not all....is that what you are saying?

For as by one’s disobedience many were made sinners, that’s talking about Adam and Eve, ...the whole world inherited their sin, did it not?

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Of course! I have been born of God since 1977

Then you are decieved.

thats not me that said so. John did

If we (he included himself) say we are (present tense) without sin, we deceive ourselves and there is no truth in us.