Born again = Righteous

[Ritajanice]

You can't crucify it.
You have to "reckon it dead".

See, if you are trying to crucify it, you are allowing it to live.
Instead what we do is recognize that "the old man of sin" "IS Crucified with Christ".

We can't DO that.....we have to believe that and in this right faith, is how its done.

Christianity is all about not seeing what we believe.
Its all faith based, as then, God steps in...with GRACE.
When we are trying to keep this, and confess that, and do do do....then God is set aside, because self righteousness is trying to do God's work.

In other words we have to rest in God.

A prime example....i was unruly at one time, I’m not going into detail......it was my flesh that was unruly, fighting against the Spirit, I remember it well..the flesh is at war with the Spirit, as we walk in faith , it becomes much easier as I have learnt through his word that it’s the “flesh”that is in opposition with the Lords Spirit,.... not my spirit, I am born again,my spirit has been birthed in the Spirit .....it’s the flesh that God deals with, we are being made into Jesus image through the power of the Holy Spirit.......we are being taught to walk in the Spirit.....of course we do our bit, by obeying his word......again we have to learn to obey his word....not saying I am right, just mho/ belief.

• Galatians 5:16-21
  I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. Now the works of the fleshare evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
  
• Romans 7:14-21
  For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin. For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good.
  
• Romans 7:23-24
  But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death?
  
• Romans 8:1
  There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
  
• Romans 8:4-6
  that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded isdeath, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
  
• Galatians 5:24
  And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
  

It’s the Lord/ Holy Spirit who gets our flesh under control, not us,..I used to try and right my behaviour in my own strength, well I failed miserably.....it’s the Holy Spirit who works in us with his power to bring us into line.

As you say we walk in faith, there is a battle of the flesh with the Spirit, ...but, the Holy Spirit will always overcome the flesh...but, imo / belief...it can take many years and everything is 100% in God’s timing.

Please correct me if I am in error Lord through my Brothers and Sisters in Christ.

Don’t get me wrong,I will listen to you all....but it’s only the Holy Spirit I can and will listen to...that’s if I believe he is speaking to ME through you.....we are all searching for the truth.

The one thing God has also taught me....I have no problem looking like a right fool with my questions and answers .....it’s whats in my heart and it must come out.


Here is more scripture Behold......we are being taught to walk in the Spirit,which can take years.

Galatians 5:16-26​

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New International Version​

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16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever[a]you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.
19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control.Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

 

[Johann]

Whoever is writing this commentary, is very legalisit.

He has a knack for sounding authentic, but his actual teaching is "here is what you do" "its all about me doing".
And that is exactly backwards.

Christianity is God forgiving and God delivering.
Its not about...>"ok, i trusted in Christ and now i have to try to do it all myself".
And that is what that "teacher" is teaching.

Christianity is not about trying to do it.
Its about realizing its already accomplished and new we exist IN THIS Redemption.

Paul teaches us to understand that '" i can do all things Through Christ"........ Its HIS POWER doing it.

Not, i can do all things if i try harder, and fail again to do it.

brother-after our rebirth, it is not "at ease in Zion" passivism, quitism, Hyper-Grace and Word of Faith-
There's WORK to be done for every believer-
The Indicative and Imperative Moods
Author
Gary DeLashmutt and Dennis McCallum





The terms "indicative" and "imperative" refer to two different verb moods commonly used by the New Testament authors in their teaching on sanctification.

WHAT IS A VERB MOOD?
The mood of a verb designates the relationship of the verb's action relative to reality. The following is a simple list of moods of verbs in the New Testament and what they generally signify:

indicative - mood of certainty, actuality
subjunctive - mood of probability
optative - mood of possibility
imperative - mood of command
As the list indicates, the New Testament uses indicative statements when discussing what God has done, is doing or will do. Imperative statements are used when saying what we should do. It is important to realize, not only that both moods are present in the Bible, but that there is a specific relationship between these two moods in the area of sanctification. Namely, what God commands us to do (the imperative) is based upon what he has done, is doing or will do (the indicatives). God is signifying by this consistent pattern that sanctification depends on God, but involves human volition and cooperation.

EXAMPLES
In the following examples, the imperative mood is bolded, while the indicative is in italics. Romans 6:1-19 and 8:1-13 are two of the best examples of this relationship, covered in detail in Walking in Victory.

Philippians 2:12b-13
. . .work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.

In this example, we see that the imperative command to work out our salvation is based on the fact that God is at work in us. The use of the word "for" indicates dependence or causality.

Colossians 3:1-17 Colossians 3:1-16
Since, then, you have been raised with Christ, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God. Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things. For you died, and your life is now hidden with Christ in God. When Christ, who is your life, appears, then you also will appear with him in glory. Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature: sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed, which is idolatry. Because of these, the wrath of God is coming. You used to walk in these ways, in the life you once lived. But now you must rid yourselves of all such things as these: anger, rage, malice, slander, and filthy language from your lips. Do not lie to each other, since you have taken off your old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its Creator. Here there is no Greek or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all. Therefore, as God's chosen people, holy and dearly loved, clothe yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience. Bear with each other and forgive whatever grievances you may have against one another. Forgive as the Lord forgave you. And over all these virtues put on love, which binds them all together in perfect unity. Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, since as members of one body you were called to peace. And be thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom, and as you sing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God. And whatever you do, whether in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him.

Again, by looking at the linkage between the statements (e.g. words like "since" "for" "as" and "because"), you will notice the imperatives are dependent on indicative statements. When we consider the thought development in this passage we realize Paul is at pains to regularly remind his readers of the basis for each ethical instruction.

Hebrews 10:19-25
Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, let us draw near to God with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water. Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess, for he who promised is faithful. And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another--and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

In this passage, no fewer than five separate imperatives are tied to two wonderful indicatives: our confidence to enter the holy place by the new way, and our great high priest. Notice the word "since" before both indicative statements, indicating that they provide the basis for the imperatives to follow.

Ephesians 4:32
Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.

It is because God has forgiven us that we should forgive others. Compare this to the statement in Matthew 6:14,15, where God's forgiveness is conditional on our forgiving others. The formulation in Matthew is typical of the sermon on the mount, with teaches the true nature of the law. There, the imperative is the condition for God's forgiveness, not a response to it.

DYNAMIC RELATIONSHIP
The New Testament also teaches that, although the imperatives are based upon the indicatives, in many cases the experience of the indicatives is dependent upon our willingness to respond to the imperatives by faith. In other words, if I fail to act in faith based on what God has commanded, I may not experience the reality of my position in Christ. Of course my position is no less real, but I may not experience it in the way God wants me to.

This corrects a common misconception among Christians: that even after we have understood God's promises, we should wait until we experience God's power, forgiveness, etc. before we act on what He says to do. On the contrary, we must act in the knowledge of the indicatives before we actually sense or experience the truth. Thus, the biblical order is not LEARN - EXPERIENCE - ACT, but rather LEARN - ACT - EXPERIENCE. This also corrects the erroneous position that man's response is not important in sanctification. Of course, our experience is not unimportant either, especially when it is understood in its proper place.

Examples - You may enjoy examining this relationship in the following passages:

Romans 12:1
John 13:17
1 Peter 2:2
Romans 6:15
1 Peter 3:7
Romans 8:4-13
1 John 3:14,18,19
Galatians 5:16-23
James 1:21-24
1 Peter 2:9-12
2 Peter 1:3-9
1 John 4:19

--and I can give you much more examples-if you cant "see" this-there is nothing I can to to help.

When I find a man who claims that he has found some new truth which no one else seems to know, I have normally viewed him and his conclusions with deep suspicion. It seems that he is probably arrogant in his assumptions that he has greater insight or ability or knowledge than others. If he thinks he knows more than brilliant scholars in Greek and Bible, he is probably wrong. However, I have found another possibility. It may be that he is simply more ignorant of what great scholars have taught than he knew, and brilliant scholars in Greek and Bible may have come to the same conclusions that he did, but his reading and studying has not been broad and deep enough to have discovered them.

 

[Johann]

..of course we do our bit, by obeying his word......again we have to learn to obey his word....not saying I am right, just mho/ belief.

Praise the Lord for this liner-"Of course we are to do our bit, obeying His word"
You ARE right, spot on-
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

2) "Created in Christ Jesus unto good works" (ktisthentes en christo iesou epi ergois agathois) "Having been created in Christ Jesus unto (upon exception toward) good works." One is created in Christ Jesus, born into the family of God, when he believes, 1Jn_5:1; 2Co_5:17. This salvation delivers from hell and calls one to a life of gratitude in service to Christ Jesus through the church, Luk_9:43; Act_20:28; Eph_3:21.

3) "Which God hath before ordained" (ois proetoimasen ho theos) "Which the God previously prepared or arranged." The church was divinely planned, not a mere after thought of God, alluded to in the Old Testament, established by Christ and empowered by the Holy Spirit to do His work, Zec_13:7; Mat_26:31-32; Mat_28:10; Mat_28:16-20; Mar_13:34-35; Act_1:8; Act_2:1-4.

4) "That we should walk in them" (hina en autois peripatesomen) "In order that we might walk in them" The good works that true servants of God are to do are authorized to be the a) making, b) baptizing, and c) teaching observance of all things prescribed by our Lord, Mat_28:18-20; Joh_15:14.

 

[Ritajanice]

A relationship with God takes time to build and mature, we don’t know God overnight,imo/ belief...again just my thoughts.
We also learn to Rest in the Lord, thank God I have got to that place of Rest, what a journey that’s been...

Got , commentary of resting in the Lord, Love it and makes perfect sense to me.



ANSWER

Rest in the Lord is a frequently used expression in the Bible. When the psalmist says, “Rest in the LORD, and wait patiently for Him” (Psalm 37:7, NKJV), he’s not talking about physical rest that involves taking a break from activity, relaxing, napping, or stopping to gather strength to continue or complete some physical undertaking. Rest in the Lord refers to a spiritual rest from confusion, worry, stress, useless human effort, and a break from all internal, external, mortal, and spiritual enemies.

The Hebrew word translated as “rest” means “to be at peace,” “to be still,” “to be quiet or calm.” In place of “rest in the Lord,” some Bible translations say, “Be still before the Lord” (ESV and NIV), “Be silent before the Lord” (CSB), “Surrender yourself to the Lord” (GW), and “Be still in the presence of the Lord” (NLT). These versions convey the essential idea that to rest and be at peace, one must dwell in the presence of the Lord, surrendered to His lordship.

In the Old Testament, God promised the people of Israel a life of peace in the Promised Land and rest in His presence (Exodus 33:14; Joshua 1:13–15). But this restful, peaceful living depended on the Israelites remaining faithful and obedient to God alone by keeping their covenant with Him. To those whose hearts strayed from Him, God said they would never enjoy His rest (Psalm 95:7–11).

Eventually, because of widespread disobedience and unfaithfulness, the nation of Israel was taken into captivity in Babylon. After returning from exile, once again, the promise of rest in the Lord’s presence was presented: “So do not be afraid, Jacob, my servant; do not be dismayed, Israel . . . For I will bring you home again from distant lands, and your children will return from their exile. Israel will return to a life of peace and quiet, and no one will terrorize them” (Jeremiah 30:10, NLT). But, again, the people failed to learn that resting in the Lord meant surrendering wholly to the Lord in righteous living: “The fruit of that righteousness will be peace; its effect will be quietness and confidence forever” (Isaiah 32:17).

In the New Testament, the book of Hebrews declares the good news that those who believe in Jesus Christ can enter His rest: “God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest” (Hebrews 4:1–3, NLT).

As believers, we are not granted immunity from life’s storms, but we have a choice about how we react to those storms. Our natural tendency might be to run around frantically looking for help, trying to save ourselves from trouble. We can either respond frenetically or rest in the Lord’s presence. We can either waste our time worrying or trust in the Lord to take care of us. Jesus said, “Come to me, all of you who are weary and carry heavy burdens, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you. Let me teach you, because I am humble and gentle at heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy to bear, and the burden I give you is light” (Matthew 11:28–30, NLT).

The writer of Hebrews also tells us that there is a future, final rest for believers in heaven (Hebrews 4:9–11). In the meantime, we can rest in the Lord by taking everything—all our burdens, problems, and anxieties—to Him in prayer. We can tell God what we need even as we remember and thank Him for all that He has done for us already. As we do this—as we abide in Jesus Christ and God’s presence—He promises to pour into us a supernatural, incomprehensible peace to guard our hearts and minds (Philippians 4:6–7).

Right here and now, we can quiet ourselves, be still, and surrender ourselves to the Lord. We can see Him as Isaiah did, high and lifted up (Isaiah 6:1). He is Sovereign over the whole earth, over our lives, and over every enemy, both internal and external, human and spiritual (Isaiah 46:9–11). We can peacefully wait for Him. We can be steadfast, longing, and always looking to Him for help. This is how we rest in the Lord.

 

[Ritajanice]

Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Amen!!.....All takes time Brother to understand, I’ve been walking with the Lord for over 30 yrs .....day by day, we are dying to self and are being renewed in our minds, it’s a process...

It’s great that we all have each other to talk to...of course we get stuck on some things of understanding, nothing to worry about, that’s when I believe we rest in God ,in other words, wait for Him to guide us through the Spirit....just my opinion and belief....

I will give an example.....I am estranged from a few family members, it worried me silly, tried to do all sorts to get them back, I failed, why, because I believe I was doing it inmy strength.....then one day I just let go and gave them over to God...I believed if I was meant to have a relationship with them, then God will fix it.

It’s taken 20 yrs....he brought my precious son back to me, a few months ago....he got in touch with me as I have grandchildren, now I believe the Lord will heal our broken relationship....all in God’s timing....that is my opinion and belief...Praise God.

 

[Johann]

Paul never told us to try to save ourselves.

Paul never told us to try to fight the old man of sin, by striving to put it away.

So, that commentary, that we are discussing, is deeply legalistic.

Everything its teaching is...."you do it". And Paul teaches that we understand that is done.

The old man of sin, is DEAD.
So, we dont try to kill what is Crucified, and that commentary He's using is teaching Him to try to resist what is Crucified.

That is the sly way that Legalist teacher is getting someone to try to fight sin, which causes sin consciousness, instead.

No brother-
Jas 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
Jas 1:23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
Jas 1:24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.
Jas 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
Jas 1:26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.
Jas 1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.
Jas 2:1 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.
Jas 2:2 For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment;
Jas 2:3 And ye have respect to him that weareth the gay clothing, and say unto him, Sit thou here in a good place; and say to the poor, Stand thou there, or sit here under my footstool:
Jas 2:4 Are ye not then partial in yourselves, and are become judges of evil thoughts?
Jas 2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?
Jas 2:6 But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?
Jas 2:7 Do not they blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?
Jas 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
Jas 2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
Jas 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
Jas 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
Jas 2:13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.
Faith Without Works Is Dead
Jas 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
Jas 2:16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Jas 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
Jas 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
Jas 2:22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
Jas 2:23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
Jas 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
Jas 2:25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
Jas 2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

before you reason this away--go to the 7 Churches in Revelation and do read Matthew 25
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

 

[Johann]

Amen!!.....All takes time Brother to understand, I’ve been walking with the Lord for over 30 yrs .....day by day, we are dying to self and are being renewed in our minds, it’s a process...

Imperatives – Indicatives = Impossibilities



George Verwer (1938–2023)

What Is a Man? What Is a Woman? How Our Laws Should Define Male and Female

Did Jesus Rise From the Dead? Three Historical Facts (+ Four Explanations That Don’t Work)

What Is the Bible to a Pastor?

The dominant mode of evangelical preaching on sanctification, the main way to motivate for godly living, sounds something like this:

You are not _____;

You should be _________;

Therefore, do or be ________!

Fill in the blank with anything good and biblical (holy; salt and light; feed the poor; walk humbly; give generously; etc.).

This is not how Paul and the other New Testament writers motivated the church in light of the resurrection and the outpouring of the Spirit. They did give imperatives (=what you should do), but they do so only based on indicatives (=what God has done).

The problem with the typical evangelical motivation toward radical or sacrificial living is that “imperatives divorced from indicatives become impossibilities” (to quote Tullian Tchividjian). Or another way that Tullian puts it: “gospel obligations must be based on gospel declarations.”

This “become what you are” way of speaking is strange for many us us. It seems precisely backward. But we must adjust our mental compass in order to walk this biblical path and recalibrate in order to speak this biblical language.

We see this all throughout the NT. Here are a few examples of this gospel logic and language:

“You really are unleavened” (indicative),
therefore “Cleanse out the old leaven that you may be a new lump” (imperative). [1 Cor. 5:7].

“You are not under law but under grace” and you “have been brought from death to life (indicatives),
therefore “Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body. . . .
Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness,
but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness” (imperatives). [Rom. 6:12-14]

“Having been set free from sin, [you] have become slaves of righteousness (indicatives) . . .
[therefore] now present your members as slaves to righteousness leading to sanctification (imperative). [Rom. 6:18-19]

“Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires” (indicative),
therefore, “walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh” (imperative). [Gal. 5:16, 24]

Pastor, are you encouraging your people to become who they already are in Christ Jesus?

I don't expect you to understand what I have posted-our rebirth was wholly from God-yet we have responsibilities to "work out our own salvation with fear and trembling= and many, many more Imperatives as recorded in Scriptures.

The “flesh” that must be crucified is the sin principle that exists in our fallen human nature. In this world we live in fleshly bodies, and the body, being weak (Mark 14:38), is the gateway to sin. Our bodies, though not sinful in themselves, naturally crave comfort and pleasure, and they too often succumb to temptation, producing the works of the flesh (Galatians 5:19–21). Sin entrenches itself in the flesh, which becomes dominated by iniquity of all kinds. It is the sinful passions and wayward deeds of the flesh that Christians must crucify.

In other places, Paul speaks of a crucifixion that happens to the believer through his or her union with Jesus Christ: “I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me” (Galatians 2:20; see also Romans 6:6). But in Galatians 5:24, it is the believer who has taken action. Crucify the flesh describes a deliberate putting to death of the old sin nature.

Paul’s instruction was inspired by Jesus Christ Himself, who said, “If anyone wants to follow after me, let him deny himself, take up his cross, and follow me” (Mark 8:34, CSB).

Take up the cross is a figure of speech closely related to crucify the flesh. Believers are to behave like a person carrying his own cross to the place of his execution. Paul follows the Lord’s words to their logical conclusion. Not only must believers pick up and carry their cross, but they must also make sure their death sentence gets carried out. Crucifying the flesh illustrates the putting to death of selfish, sinful desires.

To crucify the flesh is to obey the call to Christian discipleship. It means losing our life to find it in Him (Matthew 10:39). As we daily put to death the sinful nature, we begin to walk in victory over the flesh. Conquering the flesh is what Paul describes as walking in the Spirit: “So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh” (Galatians 5:16).

Although to many this sounds like "works-salvation" this is far from it-there are commands recorded in Scripture WE must do and yield obedience to the Imperatives.
J.

 

[Ritajanice]

I don't expect you to understand what I have posted-our rebirth was wholly from God-yet we have responsibilities to "work out our own salvation with fear and trembling= and many, many more Imperatives as recorded in Scriptures.

To be honest, I don’t understand a bit of what you post as I’m sure you are the same with my posts.

That’s not a problem...I have my own personal relationship with God Through the Holy Spirit....God is a living Spirit, he’s not a book,..my spirit is born again, therefore I have a personal living relationship with him.

I am led by the Spirit in every area of my life, which has taken time to understand, I know I must be obedient to God’s word,...as a new babe I was once ignorant to his leading and certainly didn’t understand obedience, well, he whipped me into line ( not literally) ...I can only be led by God..otherwise everything falls on deaf ears ,it just doesn’t penetrate my heart....that is my belief Brother,sorry if it offends you.

 

[Johann]

If you are repenting, the your flesh is not crucified., its alive and kicking. Its running your mind.

If its Crucified, you are like this.

"Christ always Gives me the Victory". ... over the world, the flesh, and the devil.

@Behold-answer to the whole post-don't take excerpts, as here.
Unlike you-I don't hold to "sinless perfection" and you really need to count the Imperatives recorded in the Pauline epistles brother.

There are 1,050 commands in the New Testament for Christians to obey. Due to repetitions
we can classify them under about 800 headings. They cover every phase of man's life in his
relationship to God and his fellowmen, now and hereafter. If obeyed, they will bring rich
rewards here and forever; if disobeyed, they will bring condemnation and eternal punishment.
Seven "Abstains" - Abstain From:
1. Idols (ACTS 15:20)
2. Fornication (ACTS 15:20,29; 1.THESS 4:2-3)
3. Strangled meats (ACTS 15:20)
4. Eating blood (ACTS 15:20)
5. Meats offered to idols (ACTS 15:29)
6. All appearance of evil (1.THESS 5:22)
7. Fleshly lusts (1.PET 2:11)
Seven things to avoid:
1. Troublemakers (ROM 16:17)
2. Profane and vain babblings (1.TIM 6:20)
3. False science (1.TIM 6:20)
4. Unlearned questions (2.TIM 2:23)
5. Foolish questions (TIT 3:9)
6. Genealogies (TIT 3:9)
7. Arguments about the law (TIT 3:9)
Three "Asks":
1. Ask and ye shall receive (MATT 7:7)
2. Ask no return of goods (LK 6:30)
3. Ask life for backsliders (1.JN 5:16)
Two things to awake to:
1. Awake to righteousness (1.COR 15:34)
2. Awake to life (EPH 5:14)
Seventy-four "Be's":
1. Be exceeding glad (MATT 5:12)
2. Be reconciled to a brother (MATT 5:24)
3. Be perfect (MATT 5:48; 2.COR 13:11)
4. Be wise as serpents (MATT 10:16)
5. Be harmless as doves (MATT 10:16)
6. Be ready for Christ's coming (MATT 24:44;
LK 12:40)
7. Be content with your wages (LK 3:14)
8. Be merciful as God (LK 6:36)
9. Be like faithful servants (LK 12:36)
10. Be thankful (COL 3:15)
11. Be at peace among selves (1.THESS 5:13)
12. Be patient toward all people
(1.THESS 5:14; 2.TIM 2:24)
13. Be no partaker of sin (1.TIM 5:22)
14. Be sober and hope (1.PET 1:13)
15. Be sober and pray (1.PET 4:7)
16. Be sober, grave, temperate, sound in faith,
charity, and patience (aged men, TIT 2:2)
17. Be sober, love husbands and children (young
women, TIT 2:4)
18. Be sober minded (young men, TIT 2:6)
19. Be in behaviour as becoming to saints (aged
women, TIT 2:3)
20. Be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good,
obedient (young women, TIT 2:5)
21. Be ready to give an answer of the hope that
is in you (1.PET 3:15)
22. Be of good cheer (JN 16:33)
23. Be baptized (ACTS 2:38)
24. Be converted (ACTS 3:19)
25. Be transformed (ROM 12:2)
26. Be kind of brotherly love one to another
(ROM 12:10; EPH 4:32)
27. Be fervent in spirit (ROM 12:11)
28. Be patient in tribulation (ROM 12:12)
29. Be given to hospitality (ROM 12:13)
30. Be afraid, if lawless (ROM 13:4)
Category "1,050 NEW TESTAMENT COMMANDS"
1050 NT commands Page 2
31. Be no idolater (1.COR 10:7)
32. Be followers of Paul as he followed Christ
(1.COR 11:1; PHIL 3:17)
33. Be followers of God (EPH 5:1)
34. Be followers of the faithful and patient
(HEB 6:12)
35. Be not children in understanding
(1.COR 14:20)
36. Be men in understanding (1.COR 14:20)
37. Be steadfast (1.COR 15:58)
38. Be unmoveable (1.COR 15:58)
39. Be always abounding in God's work
(1.COR 15:58)
40. Be strong in the Lord (1.COR 16:13;
EPH 6:10; 2.TIM 2:1)
41. Be of good comfort (2.COR 13:11)
42. Be of one mind (ROM 12:16;
2.COR 13:11; PHIL 2:2; 1.PET 3:8)
43. Be separate from the unclean
(2.COR 6:17)
44. Be renewed in spirit (EPH 4:23)
45. Be angry and sin not (EPH 4:26)
46. Be tender-hearted one to another
(EPH 4:32)
47. Be filled with the Spirit (EPH 5:18)
48. Be likeminded (PHIL 2:2)
49. Be one of accord (PHIL 2:2)
50. Be anxious for nothing (PHIL 4:6)
51. Be an example to believers in word,
conversation, charity, spirit, faith, and purity
(1.TIM 4:12)
52. Be a partaker of Christian sufferings
(2.TIM 1:8; cp. 1.PET 4:1)
53. Be gentle to all people (2.TIM 2:24)
54. Be apt to teach (2.TIM 2:24)
55. Be instant in season, out of season
(2.TIM 4:2)
56. Be careful to maintain good works
(TIT 3:8,14; cp. MATT 5:16)
57. Be content with what you have (HEB 13:5)
58. Be doers of the Word (JAS 1:22)
59. Be afflicted and mourn (JAS 4:9)
60. Be patient till Christ comes (JAS 5:7-8)
61. Be holy in conversation (behaviour)
(1.PET 1:15-16)
62. Be pitiful (1.PET 3:8)
63. Be courteous (1.PET 3:8)
64. Be examples of the flock of God, not lord over
it (1.PET 5:3)
65. Be subject one to another (1.PET 5:5)
66. Be clothed with humility (1.PET 5:5)
67. Be sober (1.PET 5:8)
68. Be vigilant (1.PET 5:8)
69. Be mindful of prophecies and commandments (2.PET 3:2)
70. Be diligent to be found in peace (2.PET 3:14)
71. Be diligent to be without spot, and blameless
(2.PET 3:14)
72. Be faithful to death (REV 2:10)
73. Be watchful, strengthen self (REV 3:2)
74. Be zealous and repent (REV 3:19)
Thirty "Be Not's":
1. Be not like the hypocrites in prayer
(MATT 6:5)
2. Be not like the heathen in prayer
(MATT 6:8)
3. Be not as hypocrites in fasting
(MATT 6:16)
4. Be not called "Rabbi" (MATT 23:8)
5. Be not called "Master" (MATT 23:9)
6. Be not afraid of man (LK 12:4)
7. Be not of doubtful mind (LK 12:29)
8. Be not many teachers (JAS 3:1)
9. Be not afraid of terror (1.PET 3:14)
10. Be not troubled (1.PET 3:14)
11. Be not ignorant of time with God
(2.PET 3:8; cp. ISA 57:15)
12. Be not deceived: 10 classes not to inherit the
kingdom (1.COR 6:9-10)
13. Be not conformed to world (ROM 12:2)
14. Be not slothful in business (ROM 12:11)
15. Be not conceited (ROM 12:16)
16. Be not overcome of evil (ROM 12:21)
17. Be not mere servants of men (1.COR 7:23)
18. Be not children in understanding
(1.COR 14:20)
19. Be not deceived by evil companions
(1.COR 15:33)
20. Be not unequally yoked together with
unbelievers (2.COR 6:14-15)
21. Be not entangled again with keeping the law
(GAL 5:1. See ‘Eighty-five Old and New
Covenant Contrasts’)
22. Be not deceived: man will reap what he sows
(GAL 6:7-8)
23. Be not partakers with sinners (EPH 5:7)
24. Be not unwise about God's will (EPH 5:17)
25. Be not drunk with wine (EPH 5:18)
26. Be not weary in well doing (2.THESS 3:13)
27. Be not ashamed of God (2.TIM 1:8)
28. Be not slothful (HEB 6:12)
29. Be not forgetful of strangers (HEB 13:2)
30. Be not carried about with different strange
doctrines (HEB 13:9)
Category "1,050 NEW TESTAMENT COMMANDS"
1050 NT commands Page 3
Fourteen "Beware's":
1. Beware of false prophets (MATT 7:15)
2. Beware of people (MATT 10:17)
3. Beware of leaven (doctrine) of Pharisees
(MATT 16:6-12)
4. Beware of leaven (doctrine) of Herod
(MK 8:15)
5. Beware of hypocrisy (LK 12:1)
6. Beware of covetousness (LK 12:15)
7. Beware of scribes (MK 12:38; LK 20:46)
8. Beware of lest you despise God and perish
(ACTS 13:40-41)
9. Beware of dogs (false teachers, PHIL 3:2;
ISA 56:10)
10. Beware of evil workers (PHIL 3:2)
11. Beware of the concision (Jews, PHIL 3:2)
12. Beware of being spoiled through philosophy
(COL 2:8)
13. Beware of being spoiled through vain deceit
(COL 2:8)
14. Beware of backsliding (2.PET 3:17)
Four things to believe:
1. The gospel (MK 1:15)
2. God's existence (HEB 11:6)
3. On Jesus Christ (1.JN 3:23)
4. God rewards diligent seeking (HEB 11:6)
One thing not to believe:
1. Believe not every spirit (1.JN 4:1)
Two classes to bless:
1. Those who curse you (MATT 5:44; LK 6:28)
2. Persecutors (ROM 12:14)
Three things to cast out or away:
1. The beam out of own eyes
(MATT 7:5; LK 6:42)
2. Devils (MATT 10:8)
3. All your cares upon God (1.PET 5:7)
Two classes to comfort:
1. One another-fellow Christians
(1.THESS 4:18; 1.THESS 5:11)
2. The feeble-minded (1.THESS 5:14)
Six classes to honour:
1. Fathers (MATT 19:19; MK 10:19; LK 18:20;
EPH 6:2)
2. Mothers (MATT 19:19; MK 10:19; LK 18:20;
EPH 6:2)
3. Others (ROM 12:10)
4. Widows indeed (1.TIM 5:3)
5. All people (1.PET 2:17)
6. Kings - rulers (1.PET 2:17)
Five things to charge:
1. Men to be blameless (1.TIM 5:7)
2. The rich to be humble (1.TIM 6:17)
3. The rich to trust in God (1.TIM 6:17)
4. The rich to do good works (1.TIM 6:18)
5. The rich to lay hold on eternal life (1.TIM 6:19)
Five things to consider:
1. The ravens (LK 12:24)
2. The lilies (LK 12:27-28)
3. Truth (2.TIM 2:7)
4. That you are capable of falling (GAL 6:1)
5. Christ (HEB 3:1; HEB 12:3)
Three things to continue in:
1. Love (JN 15:9)
2. Prayer (ROM 12:12; COL 4:2)
3. Truth (2.TIM 3:14)
Two things to covet:
1. The best gifts (1.COR 12:31)
2. To prophesy (1.COR 14:39); cp. things not to
covet (EX 20:17; DEUT 5:21)
One thing not to cast away:
1. Your confidence in God (HEB 10:35)
Two things to endure:
1. Hardness (2.TIM 2:3)
2. Sufferings (2.TIM 4:5)
Whom to fear:
God (MATT 10:28; LK 12:5; 1.PET 2:17; REV 14:7)
Three things not to fear:
1. Man (MATT 10:28; LK 12:5)
2. Persecutors (MATT 10:26)
3. No lack of provision (MATT 10:31; MK 6:8-9;
LK 12:7)
Five things to feed:
1. Enemies (ROM 12:20)
2. Lambs (JN 21:15)
3. Sheep (JN 21:16,17)
4. Flock of God (1.PET 5:2)
5. The church (ACTS 20:28)
Four things to flee from:
1. Fornication (1.COR 6:18)
2. Idolatry (1.COR 10:14)
3. Hurtful lusts (1.TIM 6:9-11)
4. Youthful lusts (2.TIM 2:22)

 

[Johann]

I am led by the Spirit in every area of my life, which has taken time to understand, I know I must be obedient to God’s word,...as a new babe I was once ignorant to his leading and certainly didn’t understand obedience, well, he whipped me into line ( not literally) ...I can only be led by God..otherwise everything falls on deaf ears ,it just doesn’t penetrate my heart....that is my belief Brother,sorry if it offends you.

Nothing offends me-I understand what you are trying to communicate, yet you don't understand me.
Are you in the Scriptures daily? Are you feeding from God's word-since you said "God is not a book"
Are you being led by the Spirit apart from Scriptures?
Care to elaborate?

 

[Ritajanice]

For me, I have been brought to obedience in many areas.....Arguing .....that is a big one for me....when the word of God told me not to argue...then I best listen...I don’t want his chastisement because it darn well hurts....as I’ve said, we are all at different places in our lives with God.....my relationship with God is Alive it’s not dead, his Spirit is in my heart through the rebirth....I have a direct line to God through the Spirit....my belief.

 

[Johann]

.I have a direct line to God through the Spirit....my belief.

In other words-you have a direct line to God, no need for studying the Scriptures, correct?
Since I have noticed you are "struggling" in that area-Scriptures.

 

[Ritajanice]

Nothing offends me-I understand what you are trying to communicate, yet you don't understand me.
Are you in the Scriptures daily? Are you feeding from God's word-since you said "God is not a book"
Are you being led by the Spirit apart from Scriptures?
Care to elaborate?

I don’t have to be in the Bible every day....I am led by the Spirit, God brings scripture into my mind, then I look it up,as I’ve said, I’ve been born of the Spirit,I’m fed daily ...God’s word is alive and active...I am led to scripture...scripture must talk to the heart of his child....he is the one who chooses to speak to me through scripture as and when it suits him...not when it suits me..

 

[Robert Gwin]

Are you referring to the 144,000 as per Revelation.

Yes sir, those are the ones that have been redeemed from the earth. Do you know why they were selected Joe?

 

[Ritajanice]

In other words-you have a direct line to God, no need for studying the Scriptures, correct?
Since I have noticed you are "struggling" in that area-Scriptures.

I am struggling with scripture...no I’m not struggling with any scripture...it depends if God speaks to me through it...only God can open up his word to my heart,as I’ve said i wait on God to reveal scripture to my heart...so I have no problem if there is scripture I don’t understand, as I rest in him...if he chooses to reveal scripture to me that I don’t understand..he will, when it suits him, not when it suits me...

Why would I worry about not understanding some scripture?

There is much scripture that I understand....why do I understand it because....God has spoken to me through it...I can’t understand scripture without the Holy Spirit.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Give me your biblical definition of salvation @Robert Gwin

Biblical saved and salvation are the same, they mean receiving the gift God gives; everlasting life. Thanks for asking Joe. May I ask if you agree, and if not why not?

 

[Johann]

I don’t have to be in the Bible every day....I am led by the Spirit, God brings scripture into my mind, then I look it up,as I’ve said, I’ve been born of the Spirit,I’m fed daily ...God’s word is alive and active...I am led to scripture...scripture must talk to the heart of his child....he is the one who chooses to speak to me through scripture as and when it suits him...not when it suits me..

Thanks-I don't agree with you at all.
I will stay in the Scriptures and "not when it suits me"

 

[Robert Gwin]

Oh, you will get to know @Robert Gwin -he is asking penetrating, valid questions.

I know this wasn't for me Joe, but I wanted to thank you for the kind and sincere commendation sir. I am somewhat embarrassed by it, but it did make me feel good. But as you know, we are nothing without God.

 

[Ritajanice]

Thanks-I don't agree with you at all.
I will stay in the Scriptures and "not when it suits me"

No problem, your relationship will not be the same as mine with God will it?

The Spirit is Alive he speaks to me through his word every day....I cannot fathom scripture out unless the Holy Spirit is leading me through it...you can’t understand scripture unless one is born again...that is my belief.

We can’t lead ourselves through scripture, we rely on the Holy Spirit to open up the word of God to our heart/ Spirit.

When I said, not when it suits me....it’s when it suits God if he decides to open up scripture to me....of course I read his word, but he doesn’t always speak to me through certain scripture.

 

[Johann]

Biblical saved and salvation are the same, they mean receiving the gift God gives; everlasting life. Thanks for asking Joe. May I ask if you agree, and if not why not?

I fully concur-salvation is a gift/dorean from God.