What does it mean to be born again?

[stunnedbygrace]

And this to you isn't fleshy?

Much love!

Mmm…no, not to me.
Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these.

Why? do you think that when you come into every single thread Epi starts and say the same exact things you say in each of his threads - how awful, dangerous, false and abusive to you he is (either directly or in your passive aggressive preferred way) that your dissension, strife, enmity, division, grudging, offendedness and rivalry are my fault? If you’ve already brought all that flesh in and I post silly stuff because there’s no way to take you seriously any more, the fault is mine even though YOU are the one who brings the flesh? That is your modus operandi - accuse others of what YOU do.
It’s been a years long grudge and harassment. At this point, it’s so over the top ridiculous that I mostly ignore you because it’s just the same old things you say in every single one of his threads. It’s like being held hostage by a stubborn and pouting three year old and forced to watch the same cartoon over and over again. The sheer ridiculousness of it cannot be overstated.

And we all know exactly what comes next - you shriek about how I’ve just attacked your ”character” and told outright lies about you until you’re cranked up to high.

 

[Brakelite]

Oh my gosh, once again, to trust God and hope in a promise is NOT a lack of faith. Yes, Abraham believed God. Abraham did NOT assert that he already was the father of many since God promised it would happen. Because Abraham did not assert that he was already the father of many before he even had a child, does that mean he lacked trust?? Why then, if I see my flesh Is not crucified yet do you insist it means I don’t trust God to do it?

I might introduce here something that isn't often acknowledged.
First, this little missive is not directed at you personally, or anyone else on this forum. Just a general observation.
Although Abraham "believed" God and was thus accounted righteous, even to the point of being included in the famous hall of fame in Hebrews, Abraham had times of intense doubt and lack of faith, restoring to lying to disguise his relationship with Sarah, and accepting Sarah's offer of Hagar in order to fulfill God's promise. God had to correct Abraham several times, saying "through yours and Sarah's relationship" shall the promised child come. So like Abraham, we can still trust in Christ wholly, but have our theology wrong in some details, and living in a manner that appears to deny the very faith we aspire to.
I think with Abraham, God had a greater purpose and was patient with him, and Abraham was willing to accept the purpose and embrace it. Sadly, many Christians are all too willing to live selfish lives and interested only in attaining worldly recognition, power, fame, and money, believing they lead to happiness and peace, so long as they are 'saved'. These ones also seem to have an entrenched theology and philosophy in life that resists correction. They are trusting in themselves, and building their own kingdom over which they lord themselves and proclaim themselves king.
Surrender is the only real solution to our confused theologies, mixed emotional, mental and spiritual hubris. And Abraham's faith and willingness to surrender was amply demonstrated on Mt Moriah. Abraham was dead to self, and fully open to God's purposes.

 

[Brakelite]

Don't get diverted away from the topic.

I didn't ask him to begin with. The idea is absurd anyway. Episkopos routinely deflects to ad hominem avoiding those things that must be difficult for him.

Epi's point here is to impugn my Scriptural interpretation, and the way he uses the Scriptures mock it, and I suggest don't playing along.

Revelation 3:14-22 KJV
14) And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
15) I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
16) So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
17) Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
18) I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
19) As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
20) Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
21) To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
22) He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Here's the game:

2 Peter 1:2-4 KJV
2) Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,
3) According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4) Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Do you believe this? That God has already given you all things that you need for living, and living godly?

I do!!

And because I do, I am branded, "You say you are rich, in need of nothing!"

Colossians 2:8-12 KJV
8) Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
10) And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
11) In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
12) Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

Ye are complete in Him, do you believe that? I do!!

And because I do, I'm branded, "You say you are in need of nothing, but you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked".

Because I say, Christ in me is the certain expectation of glory. Because I'm trusting in Jesus, believing His Word. That's what it comes down to.

But remember, this is a deflection.

Much love!

We walk by faith and not by sight.

 

[Brakelite]

For years Romans 6 has been at or near the top of my hit parade of verses that strengthen and encourage my faith.
Marks had been hitting the nail squarely on the head when using Romans 6 to describe the Christian walk. We are crucified in Christ. I think Epi confuses things a little by referring to the inner and outer man. I prefer the old man which is dead in Christ, and the new man which is raised with Him. We have faith in God's word that what he declares to be true, then it is true, whether we see it using our physical eyes or not. We don't live by sight. We walk in the spirit and believe that if God says it, it's done. The old fleshly carnal nature is dead. The old man of sin and selfishness and lust and covetousness and pleasure seeking, is DEAD.
Praise God for that, and the evidence I have for that is a changed life, a life that is even daily getting better, so long as I feed from the Vine, remaining in connection to the only source of grace and power. And praise God also that it isn't up to me to retain that relationship, but to trust Him to do that. The only thing that can destroy our future together is a firm irrevocable decision on my part to walk away, to break off the relationship of my own accord. And believe me, that for any of us will take some doing. And God Himself will be wooing us back to Him with relentless and furious love. Butt Romans 6. It spells the glorious promise that we at this moment have power over sin, and power to overcome all that opposes and exalts itself against God. Born again. Raised with Him. And again as marks pointed out,
KJV 2 Peter 1:3-4
3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

That I "disparage" righteousness is another false accusation or misunderstanding of what is being said.

No, it isn’t. On my part, it is not a misunderstanding of what you say.
You say when any man does the right thing in Gods sight that it is filthy. It is EXACTLY what you say, clearly and without any misunderstanding. And you have repeatedly said it. You keep saying anything a man does that is right in Gods eyes is filthy rags. And I clearly see how you arrive at your wrong conclusion and what makes you do it. But you will NOT hear so there’s no reason to repeat it.
But it absolutely is what you say, without any misunderstanding of you on my part, that anything God considers the right thing to do, that a man then does, is filthiness.

Its excruciatingly awful to see you and Johann stuck and see the desire in both of you to advance and not be able to help you do so.

 

[Lizbeth]

No, it isn’t. On my part, it is not a misunderstanding of what you say.
You say when any man does the right thing in Gods sight that it is filthy. It is EXACTLY what you say, clearly and without any misunderstanding. And you have repeatedly said it. You keep saying anything a man does that is right in Gods eyes is filthy rags. And I clearly see how you arrive at your wrong conclusion and what makes you do it. But you will NOT hear so there’s no reason to repeat it.
But it absolutely is what you say, without any misunderstanding of you on my part, that anything God considers the right thing to do, that a man then does, is filthiness.

Its excruciatingly awful to see you and Johann stuck and see the desire in both of you to advance and not be able to help you do so.

Not seeing much in the way of advancement here to be honest. For one thing those who are supposed to be advanced aren't grasping paradox in scripture. It's not me who declares man's righteousness to be as filthy rags, I was only pointing out that the word of God says it.

But you've already forgotten Cornelius I guess, which you never did acknowledge. And I've asked/suggested more than once that we put aside foundational things for the time being, that we clearly disagree on, and try to examine "going on to perfection". Oh well, not a problem. The LORD is my Shepherd, who is yours? Bible says (not me), cursed is the man one who trusts in man and makes flesh his strength.

There is a Tree of Knowledge of GOOD and Evil sister. How well did that turn out for Adam and Eve. And what was that Tree.....really a subtle seducing COUNTERFEIT that allures through the flesh to draw people away from the Tree of LIFE. No, in our flesh dwells no good thing even though humans can exhibit goodness. Whoops, a paradox. The wrong Tree glorifies flesh and MAN, the other Tree glorifies JESUS. (A Tree in scripture represents a man...remember the blind man Jesus was healing....as his vision was clearing but not yet clear, he saw trees walking about, but they were men.)

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Not seeing much in the way of advancement here to be honest. For one thing those who are supposed to be advanced aren't grasping paradox in scripture. It's not me who declares man's righteousness to be as filthy rags, I was only pointing out that the word of God says it.

But you've already forgotten Cornelius I guess, which you never did acknowledge. And I've asked/suggested more than once that we put aside foundational things for the time being, that we clearly disagree on, and try to examine "going on to perfection". Oh well, not a problem. The LORD is my Shepherd, who is yours? Bible says (not me), cursed is the man one who trusts in man and makes flesh his strength.

There is a Tree of Knowledge of GOOD and Evil sister. How well did that turn out for Adam and Eve. And what was that Tree.....really a subtle seducing COUNTERFEIT that allures through the flesh to draw people away from the Tree of LIFE. No, in our flesh dwells no good thing even though humans can exhibit goodness. Whoops, a paradox. The wrong Tree glorifies flesh and MAN, the other Tree glorifies JESUS. (A Tree in scripture represents a man...remember the blind man Jesus was healing....as his vision was clearing but not yet clear, he saw trees walking about, but they were men.)

So as to the last two of your paragraphs I, bewilderingly, have no idea what you were trying to say, despite reading them three times, except for where you say you’ve asked to put aside foundational things and examine going on to perfection. That’s the one thing I grasped. And I am positive that what you request is impossible. You are missing a key that unlocks scripture. So it’s like you’ve refused, and asked to skip, addition and subtraction but insist to be taught division. It’s impossible. You MUST first understand add/sub before you can learn division and until you do, how on earth could you be taught division…? It’s the equivalent of “line upon line, precept upon precept.“ And it’s equivalent to “I have many things to tell you but you’re not ready to bear them yet.” Or it’s like…refusing to learn the primary colors but wanting to know how to make green. It’s IMPOSSIBLE to make green without adding together yellow and blue. So if you refuse to learn yellow and blue, how the heck could you move on to green…? You couldn’t.

So I could repeat to you, over and over again, that “all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags” is not associated with righteousness but with holiness but no Lightbulb just went off, right? And that’s because you refuse the foundation of righteousness. And you can’t do away with righteousness and say it is filthy and get to holiness. It’s literally impossible.

I guess there is one other thing I grasped, in your second paragraph. When you ask me, who is your shepherd, I perceive that you are insinuating that Epi is my shepherd? The same Epi you have almost begged to tell you what he has been given about perfection? And then you asked it from me since you think he is refusing it to you and since he is the one who shared it with me, you then want me to start a thread and try to get it from me? But no one is trying to withhold information from you like…refusing you until you agree. That’s not what is occurring. You are the one refusing the information you need to move on. And even now, after I just spent 40 minutes struggling how to word and how to explain to you what the problem is, you will insist I am the one not understanding anything.

And all of that is aside from the fact that you earlier said to me, “Please don't let anyone lead you astray with flattery and rob you of THE ONLY GOSPEL THAT CAN SAVE, with pats on the back,” to intone that Epi was flattering me and leading me away from the gospel of our Lord. So it strikes me as insane that you want to extract anything from a snake like that! What good thing could a snake like that share with you…??!

And, sigh, now it seems you’ve said something about Cornelius that I apparently didn’t catch or address that you want to discuss and I don’t know if I have the strength right now to go find it wherever it is.

 

[Lizbeth]

So as to the last two of your paragraphs I, bewilderingly, have no idea what you were trying to say, despite reading them three times, except for where you say you’ve asked to put aside foundational things and examine going on to perfection. That’s the one thing I grasped. And I am positive that what you request is impossible. You are missing a key that unlocks scripture. So it’s like you’ve refused, and asked to skip, addition and subtraction but insist to be taught division. It’s impossible. You MUST first understand add/sub before you can learn division and until you do, how on earth could you be taught division…? It’s the equivalent of “line upon line, precept upon precept.“ And it’s equivalent to “I have many things to tell you but you’re not ready to bear them yet.” Or it’s like…refusing to learn the primary colors but wanting to know how to make green. It’s IMPOSSIBLE to make green without adding together yellow and blue. So if you refuse to learn yellow and blue, how the heck could you move on to green…? You couldn’t.

So I could repeat to you, over and over again, that “all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags” is not associated with righteousness but with holiness but no Lightbulb just went off, right? And that’s because you refuse the foundation of righteousness. And you can’t do away with righteousness and say it is filthy and get to holiness. It’s literally impossible.

I guess there is one other thing I grasped, in your second paragraph. When you ask me, who is your shepherd, I perceive that you are insinuating that Epi is my shepherd? The same Epi you have almost begged to tell you what he has been given about perfection? And then you asked it from me since you think he is refusing it to you and since he is the one who shared it with me, you then want me to start a thread and try to get it from me? But no one is trying to withhold information from you like…refusing you until you agree. That’s not what is occurring. You are the one refusing the information you need to move on. And even now, after I just spent 40 minutes struggling how to word and how to explain to you what the problem is, you will insist I am the one not understanding anything.

And all of that is aside from the fact that you earlier said to me, “Please don't let anyone lead you astray with flattery and rob you of THE ONLY GOSPEL THAT CAN SAVE, with pats on the back,” to intone that Epi was flattering me and leading me away from the gospel of our Lord. So it strikes me as insane that you want to extract anything from a snake like that! What good thing could a snake like that share with you…??!

And, sigh, now it seems you’ve said something about Cornelius that I apparently didn’t catch or address that you want to discuss and I don’t know if I have the strength right now to go find it wherever it is.

Is this what you call being weaned from the flesh? Or maybe you are still "learning righteousness" too?

You need to meditate on these things prayerfully, and not rely on the carnal mind.

Elijah was given bread by a raven, so it's not unheard of. Couldn't help but smile a bit when Epi started to bring crows into the conversation.

The righteousness that is by FAITH is not filthy. But it's the flesh that profits nothing. It's not by might, not by power (of the flesh) but by my SPIRIT says the Lord.

Jesus said there is no one good but God. You know, even animals can be "good" and even appear "selfless" at times. The natural man without the Lord is much the same as brute beasts. We are not to judge by outward appearances, God doesn't judge things with our limited vision and fleshly emotions. And His word says there is no flesh that shall be justified in His sight.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Is this what you call being weaned from the flesh? Or maybe you are still "learning righteousness" too?

Do you mean to ask if having A firm grasp on righteousness vs. holiness is what being weaned from the flesh is? If that’s what you’re asking, no. Being weaned, as when David says, ”my soul is like a weaned child within me,” is having your passions calmed. At first, when it happened, I thought it must be that my flesh had died finally, and it was not like I could go read some books about it because I’d never once heard anyone teach about such a thing. So amid great amazement, I tried to understand what the heck had just happened to me. And, as is most usually the case with us, my first assumption was that I was further than I actually was. And God gave me David’s verse to show me, along with what I call “first motions towards.” While it was shocking to quite suddenly not have my passions rule over me any more (which I can talk about in greater detail if you would like) after a while I began to see those first motions towards, which are like…temptations, or small tugs, towards the accustomed habit of being ruled by my passions. So I saw that if there were even so much as first motions towards, then there was still some flesh remaining alive somewhere in me. But it’s a small nag, or vague annoyance, and I have been always able to firmly say - absolutely not, you will shut up. Because of the indescribable peace and calm, I guard this like a hawk and allow it to go no further than a whisper or tug. It’s like…He put the enemy of my flesh/passions under my boot and I don’t dare take my foot off the neck of that enemy or I am convinced all would be lost of what I have gained.

I think another way to try to convey it would be to say God put my flesh in subjection to His Spirit in me. And I can’t explain much past this because that’s where I am but I vaguely see that…there is still something deeper, and of longseated habit, that still needs to be subjected to His Spirit. It’s like…the difference between removing a fresh stain versus trying to remove a stain more deeply set into fabric. But like I said, I can’t really explain it much more past that yet.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Some of the rest of your last post has intrigued me a bit. What did you mean by the ravens that fed Elijah?

 

[stunnedbygrace]

The righteousness that is by FAITH is not filthy. But it's the flesh that profits nothing. It's not by might, not by power (of the flesh) but by my SPIRIT says the Lord.

Also, this has some good direction…but once again, you must get a firm grasp on whether righteousness or holiness is being addressed. And there’s a whole missing chapter about Gods judgement that men have not (and cannot) teach you. I say cannot because they are missing the key also.

 

[Lizbeth]

Do you mean to ask if having A firm grasp on righteousness vs. holiness is what being weaned from the flesh is? If that’s what you’re asking, no. Being weaned, as when David says, ”my soul is like a weaned child within me,” is having your passions calmed. At first, when it happened, I thought it must be that my flesh had died finally, and it was not like I could go read some books about it because I’d never once heard anyone teach about such a thing. So amid great amazement, I tried to understand what the heck had just happened to me. And, as is most usually the case with us, my first assumption was that I was further than I actually was. And God gave me David’s verse to show me, along with what I call “first motions towards.” While it was shocking to quite suddenly not have my passions rule over me any more (which I can talk about in greater detail if you would like) after a while I began to see those first motions towards, which are like…temptations, or small tugs, towards the accustomed habit of being ruled by my passions. So I saw that if there were even so much as first motions towards, then there was still some flesh remaining alive somewhere in me. But it’s a small nag, or vague annoyance, and I have been always able to firmly say - absolutely not, you will shut up. Because of the indescribable peace and calm, I guard this like a hawk and allow it to go no further than a whisper or tug. It’s like…He put the enemy of my flesh/passions under my boot and I don’t dare take my foot off the neck of that enemy or I am convinced all would be lost of what I have gained.

I think another way to try to convey it would be to say God put my flesh in subjection to His Spirit in me. And I can’t explain much past this because that’s where I am but I vaguely see that…there is still something deeper, and of longseated habit, that still needs to be subjected to His Spirit. It’s like…the difference between removing a fresh stain versus trying to remove a stain more deeply set into fabric. But like I said, I can’t really explain it much more past that yet.

Praise the Lord for His goodness in your life sister. Keep on keeping on in Him.

 

[Lizbeth]

Also, this has some good direction…but once again, you must get a firm grasp on whether righteousness or holiness is being addressed. And there’s a whole missing chapter about Gods judgement that men have not (and cannot) teach you. I say cannot because they are missing the key also.

What missing chapter do you mean....?

I have to go out , so won't be back for several hours.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

What missing chapter do you mean....?

I have to go out , so won't be back for several hours.

okay, well actually, it’s probably more like two or three chapters. Lol.
Its found most in the parables. I would really prefer to let Epi explain but you seem averse to hearing it from him and open to hearing it from him but only filtered through me. Except that I think I have gathered that you two have had some extensive conversation and I’m pretty certain you would reject it from me if he covered it and you already rejected it from him…
It can be extensively shown from the whole of scripture but if you cling to erroneous doctrines, refusing to consider some of them could possibly be wrong, you will not hear it because a little leaven hinks up the whole batch.
But I guess I could try. But you won’t get anything out of it if you aren’t at least willing to consider you may have some things wrong.
But understand, I will be talking about what God gave Epi to understand which he in turn freely shared with me.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

I have to give some thought to where to start and to what I should do if you attack me in the same way. I guess if you begin to say I am trying to harm and lead away from the gospel I will just cease.

 

[Lizbeth]

okay, well actually, it’s probably more like two or three chapters. Lol.
Its found most in the parables. I would really prefer to let Epi explain but you seem averse to hearing it from him and open to hearing it from him but only filtered through me. Except that I think I have gathered that you two have had some extensive conversation and I’m pretty certain you would reject it from me if he covered it and you already rejected it from him…
It can be extensively shown from the whole of scripture but if you cling to erroneous doctrines, refusing to consider some of them could possibly be wrong, you will not hear it because a little leaven hinks up the whole batch.
But I guess I could try. But you won’t get anything out of it if you aren’t at least willing to consider you may have some things wrong.
But understand, I will be talking about what God gave Epi to understand which he in turn freely shared with me.

Well my outing has been postponed til tomorrow due to snow, so here I am after all.

Yes I had some conversation with Epi not long after coming to this forum. That was before I knew about his take on what I call foundational things. Not sure I'd categorize it as extensive that I remember but we had an area of agreement that I kept hoping we could get back to and look into some more on the threads.

I thought you meant a chapter that is missing from the bible, but I gather these are parables that are in the bible that you feel I'm missing the point of..? Anyway no pressure....you don't have to dive into the fray if you're not comfortable.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Okay, well it was me stating that there are some very wrong teachings and leaven regarding judgement and how the missing key comes into play regarding it that you asked about. I had previously also said there was a lot about Gods judgement you had not yet seen and that He was MORE merciful and right than men teach.

God will have to help us here because it is such a tangled mess men have made that there is no other way for us to escape the judgement their mess will bring on us than if He is merciful and helps us here.

8 But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives.2 And early in the morning He came again into the temple area, and all the people were coming to Him; and He sat down and beganteaching them. 3 Now the scribes and the Pharisees *brought a woman caught in the act of adultery, and after placing her in the center of the courtyard, 4 they *said to Him, “Teacher, this woman has been caught in the very act of committing adultery. 5 Now in the Law, Moses commanded us to stone such women; what then do You say?” 6 Now they were saying this to test Him, so that they might have grounds for accusing Him. But Jesus stooped down and with His finger wrote on the ground. 7 When they persisted in asking Him, He straightened up and said to them, “He who is without sin among you, let him be the first to throw a stone at her.” 8 And again He stooped down and wrote on the ground. 9 Now when they heard this, they began leaving, one by one, beginning with the older ones, and He was left alone, and the woman where she was, in the center of the courtyard. 10 And straightening up, Jesus said to her, “Woman, where are they? Did no one condemn you?” 11 She said, “No one, [a]Lord.” And Jesus said, “I do not condemn you, either. Go. From now on do not sin any longer.”]]

Verse 6, They were trying to find grounds to accuse Jesus. That was their goal, to catch Him breaking the law.
We’ve all heard this taught on and don’t need to bring up and regurgitate all we’ve heard men say about it.
But why do you think the Pharisees left and wouldn’t throw the first stone yet Christian’s will judge men that they are going to be cast into fire? Why did the Pharisees refuse to judge and condemn and begin the stoning process and why do Christian’s have no qualms about pronouncing judgement of eternal fire on people. And why did let he without sin throw the first stone shut up the Pharisees but it doesn’t shut up Christian’s even though we were also told to not judge anything before the time, to not judge those outside, that we will be judged in the same manner that we judge, that if we don’t forgive we will also not be forgiven, that with the merciful He shows Himself merciful and many other verses too.
So how have we become convinced that judging someone worthy of the second death is safe for us and acceptable? If we didn’t embrace a doctrine that says we are as righteous and holy as Jesus, even while we sin, would we then feel loathe to make the judgement that we do on unbelievers?

Could a case be made that Christian’s today are WORSE than those Pharisees…?

 

[stunnedbygrace]

We also can look at the parable about the man whose debt was forgiven who then went out and demanded of another rather than forgiving as he had been. He will be thrown into some type of prison for this and will not be released until he pays his debt, which was reinstated after what he did.

 

[Enoch111]

Or you can just, you know, continue to make stuff up about me.

Why does everything have to devolve into personal attacks? Let's get back to simply discussing what is in Scripture, and how false teachers like Episkopos constantly attack the truth. Since you are a fan of his, kindly tell us what true Bible doctrine he actually adheres to. Spell it out, since almost every one of his posts is spiritual nonsense.

 

[amigo de christo]

Because they constantly harass anyone moving on from elementary things and speaking of anything deeper. They call such a man a false teacher and worse, say he teaches a false gospel if he speaks of picking up your cross to follow, saying they have already been crucified and are as righteous as Jesus and are holy. I could go on and on about the crazy things they say if anyone talks of moving on.

if anyone here is following such concepts as has been portrayed in this lil video skit , My advice is FLEE THEM and fast .
THIS IS HOW the dragon has been transforming the churches into His own image .
preaching a grace that does and allows all this stuff . As i said a while back i am seriously SHOCKED , STUNNED
by what the churches are calling grace these days . Watcher beware for this type of stuff IS all over christendom .
Take a good peek at some of those shirts that lady is wearing . CAUSE ITS HOW THEY GOT IT ALL INTO THE CHURCHES .