Why belief in a god is an unfalsifiable claim that serves no purpose

[BreadOfLife]

Irony



So before I expose your own ignorance on this issue I should first say that your style of response to the other poster here is woefully unrepresentative of what one would expect from a loving Christian. You might want to step back for a short period and consider what your hateful attitude is signalling to other readers here.

And so to abortion and science.

The FACTS are that :

1. An embryo has no brain, no nervous system, no sentience, can feel no pain. It cannot survive by itself as a separate organism. In many ways it is akin to a brain dead adult being kept alive on a life-support machine. I would hazard a guess that you would callously like to force all such people to be kept artificially alive on those machines instead of compassionately releasing the trapped body and soul from it's prison with zero quality of life.

2. A foetus doesn't have any brain for at least the first 8 weeks of pregnancy and then it takes weeks for it to fully develop and start to actually function as a brain. The nervous system similarly takes many weeks to develop. During this period, what you have is PATENTLY NOT a human being but rather a human organism that is under development. Like the embryo, the foetus cannot survive by itself. It is a parasite totally dependent on the woman carrying it.

In many ways a human sperm is more of a complete human organism than an embryo or foetus.

A sperm can survive by itself
A sperm is a life form
A sperm has human DNA so is a human organism / life form
A sperm has senses with which it can seek out and find a female egg
A sperm can swim, purposely and deliberately.
A sperm can instigate the process of creating new life

An embryo or foetus can do none of the above. It is a human organism but of extremely limited value at that point in time.

Anti-abortion zealots love to play to emotion and play with English language terms frequently citing "human", "person", "Human being", "baby" etc. They do this because they have absolutely no evidential foundation for their extremist views. They also very conveniently ignore the screaming hypocrisy of worshipping a God that is a baby killer, child killer, unborn child killer and who is genocidal whilst themselves professing to be pro-life. You couldn't make it up really!

The abortion laws in the UK make abortion legal so long as the pregnancy is no more than 24 weeks established. This makes perfect sense because until that point you're not dealing with an actual human being. You're dealing with a human organism that to any sane and critical thinking person does not remotely have the same intrinsic value as an adult human.

Using terms like "murder" is particularly offensive and akin to hate speech for which people should be jailed in the same way that they would for speaking racial hatred.​

I'm extremely glad to be living in the UK and not the various Authoritarian States of the USA who have gone back to the Dark Ages.

Thank you, my painfully-ignorant friend.

FIRST of all – here is the breakdown of Abortions in the U.S. by weeks of gestation. According to the Guttmacher Institute - of the 862,423 human lives that were snuffed out las year:
< 9 weeks - 65.4%
9-10 weeks - 14.7%
11-12 weeks - 8.2%
13-15 weeks - 6.3%
16-20 weeks - 4.1%
21+ weeks - 1.3%

So, WHICH ones are the “good” ones?

Your anti-American nonsense with regard to my use of the term “murder” to describe the extermination of an innocent human life as hate speech, for which I should be “jailed”. This is ludicrous.
NOBODY should be jailed in the United States for what they SAY, according to the First Amendment. You are jailed for the things you DO that are against the law, NOT for speaking – your fascist notions notwithstanding.

Finally, as to your claptrap about a fetus being “PATENTLY NOT a human being” – would it be okay if I walked up to a pregnant woman, punched her in the stomach and ended the “unhuman” growth in her womb?
Why is it that people who kill a fetus while attacking the mother are attacked with MURDER in a country that has legalized murdering children?

Do you know that in California, they just voted to codify abortion in the State Constitution – THROUGH the 9th month?? In that same state – they ALSO banned plastic straws and flavored tobacco.
You can butcher a baby by delivering the bottom half and inserting surgical scissors into the baby’s brain and sucking it out - but you can’t buy cherry-flavored tobacco.

YOU’RE part of that same hypocrisy.


Jer. 1:5
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you . . ."

Good luck telling GOD that YOU think He’s a Liar . . . . . .


PS – I’m also “extremely glad” that you live in the UK.

 

[Illuminator]

No it just makes Jesus simply another in a long line of people who have exploited the Stone for themselves at the expense of humanity.

Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone​

 

[Lapidem]

Jesus was executed by the snooty priests and bonehead romans, then most of the disciples were executed later, so that stone thing didn't help them much did it..;)

It prevented Jesus from dying or at the least allowed him to be revived shortly after dying. Doubtless the other disciples has similar help and quietly disappeared.

 

[Lapidem]

A sperm is not an unborn baby.

Correct. It is a human organism. A living human organism. So is an embryo and foetus. I'm guessing you have no problem killing a sperm yes?

An embryo or foetus has potential to develop into a full grown adult human being, that alone gives them value.

A sperm also has the potential to create a new human being. It's a prerequisite for such life. That should equally attract similar value.
And BTW no-one is suggesting that an embryo or foetus have no value. They just don't have the same value as the fully developed woman in whom they reside.

Your view of God is based on insanity, which is a separate discussion.

Insults don't lend you credibility

Project Rachel is a ministry based on scripture, through which you can experience the love, mercy, and forgiveness of our Lord Jesus Christ.

It's always staggering to see religious subordinates trying to justify taking choice and bodily autonomy from women in the name of a od they worship when that God himself is perfectly happy to murder babies, children, unborn babies, as well as men and women and anumals. The hypocrisy is palpable.


Your testimonials simply serve to highlight and expose the utterly disgusting ethos of stigma and guilt that religious zealots put on other women. Without it women wouldn't be worried at all They'd make their choice and have perfectly safe abortion procedures. Similar stigma is deliberately geenerated for the LGBGT community. Shame on all those who perpetuate it.

 

[Lapidem]

Thank you, my painfully-ignorant friend.

FIRST of all – here is the breakdown of Abortions in the U.S. by weeks of gestation. According to the Guttmacher Institute - of the 862,423 human lives that were snuffed out las year:
< 9 weeks - 65.4%
9-10 weeks - 14.7%
11-12 weeks - 8.2%
13-15 weeks - 6.3%
16-20 weeks - 4.1%
21+ weeks - 1.3%

So, WHICH ones are the “good” ones?

Your anti-American nonsense with regard to my use of the term “murder” to describe the extermination of an innocent human life as hate speech, for which I should be “jailed”. This is ludicrous.
NOBODY should be jailed in the United States for what they SAY, according to the First Amendment. You are jailed for the things you DO that are against the law, NOT for speaking – your fascist notions notwithstanding.

Finally, as to your claptrap about a fetus being “PATENTLY NOT a human being” – would it be okay if I walked up to a pregnant woman, punched her in the stomach and ended the “unhuman” growth in her womb?
Why is it that people who kill a fetus while attacking the mother are attacked with MURDER in a country that has legalized murdering children?

Do you know that in California, they just voted to codify abortion in the State Constitution – THROUGH the 9th month?? In that same state – they ALSO banned plastic straws and flavored tobacco.
You can butcher a baby by delivering the bottom half and inserting surgical scissors into the baby’s brain and sucking it out - but you can’t buy cherry-flavored tobacco.

YOU’RE part of that same hypocrisy.


Jer. 1:5
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you . . ."

Good luck telling GOD that YOU think He’s a Liar . . . . . .


PS – I’m also “extremely glad” that you live in the UK.

Again your language and hatred is appalling for a so-called Christian. You are nothing of the sort.

Here's some data on miscarriages:

"Spontaneous abortion, also known as miscarriage, is defined as the loss of pregnancy less than 20 weeks gestation. The American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists (ACOG) estimates it is the most common form of pregnancy loss. It is estimated that as many as 26% of all pregnancies end in miscarriage and up to 10% of clinically recognized pregnancies."

Nothing happens without the hand and will of God. Seems then that he is the biggest murderer of unborn babies. This is on top of the myriad of babies, unborn babies, embryos, foetuses and children, men and women that the OT records him murdering. But I guess you just gloss over that inconvenient problem right?

 

[Illuminator]

Again your language and hatred is appalling for a so-called Christian. You are nothing of the sort.

Here's some data on miscarriages:

"Spontaneous abortion, also known as miscarriage, is defined as the loss of pregnancy less than 20 weeks gestation. The American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists (ACOG) estimates it is the most common form of pregnancy loss. It is estimated that as many as 26% of all pregnancies end in miscarriage and up to 10% of clinically recognized pregnancies."

Nothing happens without the hand and will of God. Seems then that he is the biggest murderer of unborn babies. This is on top of the myriad of babies, unborn babies, embryos, foetuses and children, men and women that the OT records him murdering. But I guess you just gloss over that inconvenient problem right?

It's not normal for a mother to kill her baby. Miscarriage is not an act of God, it is part of the consequences of The Fall of man. Blaming God is childish. God is the author and giver of life; you claim God has no right to take what belongs to Him. You give too much credibility to Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone. It's time you grew up.

I think you are projecting a painful childhood onto all of Christianity, which may explain why your view of God is so warped.

 

[Dropship]

It's always staggering to see religious subordinates trying to justify taking choice and bodily autonomy from women..

When my mother became preggers out of wedlock in 1948 she could have aborted me to cover up her social "shame", and most of her family and friends wouldn't have minded, but as the fetus in question I might have minded..:)

 

[Dropship]

God himself is perfectly happy to murder babies, children, unborn babies, as well as men and women and anumals.

God's not some lukewarm wishy-washy wimpy social worker, so when heathens were running riot he had to cull them out of the human race to improve the gene pool, nobody better mess with him..:)
"Ungodly...These men blaspheme in matters they do not understand. They are like brute beasts, creatures of instinct, born only to be caught and destroyed.." (2 Peter 2:12)

 

[Dropship]

It's Christmas Day today, so Merry Christmas to all atheists..:)-

 

[Lapidem]

It's not normal for a mother to kill her baby.

It's entirely normal for humans to remove parts of their body that they don't want. An embryo is not a baby, that's just the defacto appeals to language terminology used by the cruel anti-abortion brigade for emotional effect. I note that you've glossed over all the discussion regarding sperm.

Is it ok to kill a sperm in your world? yes/no?

And you are clearly happy worshipping an entity that willfully kills babies, unborn babies, innocent children, men and women at will. Pretty questionable ethics imo. A bit like worshiping Putin or Hitler.

Miscarriage is not an act of God

Of course it is ! God's hand rules everything. Nothing happens but by his consent and will. Or are you ignoring those parts of the scripture too?!! You're starting to sound like a typical "Pick 'n' mix" Christian. Conveniently ignoring all the difficult challenging parts of the Bible and just clinging to the nice parts. That's self-delusion and denial. Your misguided theology would mean man can do things without it being the will of god. Go back to your scriptures and read the truth.

Harry Potter jibes are childish. A typical retort from those who are not ready for the "mysteries of the kingdom".

Proverbs 1:5-7 "Let the wise listen to these proverbs and become even wiser. Let those with understanding receive guidance by exploring the meaning in these proverbs and parables, the words of the wise and their riddles. Fear of the LORD is the foundation of true knowledge, but fools despise wisdom and discipline."

Colossians 1:26-27
"The mystery hidden for ages and generations but now revealed to his saints. To them God chose to make known how great among the Gentiles are the riches of the glory of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory."

Matthew 13:11-13
"And he answered them, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given. For to the one who has, more will be given, and he will have an abundance, but from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away. This is why I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. "

 

[Lapidem]

but as the fetus in question I might have minded..:)

This is just emotional rhetoric Dropship. As a foetus you would not have had a brain for at least the first 8 weeks or so and not a funtionin, thinking, sentient brain for many weeks beyond that. You would have had no nervous system, so you couldn't feel. To have "Minded" you would require a brain, a developed brain, and sentience.

 

[Lapidem]

God's not some lukewarm wishy-washy wimpy social worker, so when heathens were running riot he had to cull them out of the human race to improve the gene pool, nobody better mess with him..:)

You paint the picture of a sick despotic tyrant. Putin, Pol Put, Idi Amin . . . . Bill Gates?

This seems cowardly. You submit to a tyrant out of fear. Doesn't matter what sick and cruel deeds the tyrant engages in. Genocide, ethnic cleansing, child killing, baby murdering, pregnant women killing . . . . You worship such an entity? What does that make you? Would you be happy to go and live in Saudi Arabia or Iran?

 

[-Phil]

Beliefs aren’t unfalsifiable claims.
They’re, beliefs.

 

[Dropship]

This seems cowardly. You submit to a tyrant out of fear.

Nah mate, we Christians don't fear God, why should we?
He calls us his 'Elect' and his 'children', how kool is that?.. :cool:
I like him because he's tough and stands like a rock in this waffling world of liberals and snowflakes.

 

[Dropship]

Beliefs aren’t unfalsifiable claims.
They’re, beliefs.

Jesus is not a 'belief', he's JESUS, and he wants CHUMS..:)

Beats me why atheists don't like him, was it something he said?
And for the record he never said a word about GLBT's, he simply never mentioned them at all..:)

 

[-Phil]

@Dropship
A believe is just a thought, that’s believed to be true.
There’s nothing wrong or sinful about any beliefs, as wrong & sinful are just more beliefs.
When there’s no Jesus, what’s said is hear…. and seen, as it were.

 

[Dropship]

..When there’s no Jesus, what’s said is hear…. and seen, as it were.

Elvis has gone and I never saw him myself, but I'm quite prepared to believe the people who saw and heard him who say he existed..:)
Likewise the whole of Israel saw Jesus, that's a lot of ears and eyeballs, right Elv?

 

[-Phil]

Elvis has gone and I never saw him myself, but I'm quite prepared to believe the people who saw and heard him who say he existed..:)
Likewise the whole of Israel saw Jesus, that's a lot of ears and eyeballs, right Elv?

Oh for sure. Please don’t misunderstand… I’m not suggesting there’s anything wrong with believing people, or believing there are people. I’m just pointing out that it’s blasphemous. Tis better to be all shook up.

 

[Lapidem]

Elvis has gone and I never saw him myself, but I'm quite prepared to believe the people who saw and heard him who say he existed..:)
Likewise the whole of Israel saw Jesus, that's a lot of ears and eyeballs, right Elv?

Elvis lived in the last 100 years so of course testimonies are many and there's a multitude of proof in the form of pictures, films and so on.

Jesus lived 1000s of years ago and the testimonies you base your belief on were written 100s of years after he lived. Kinda odd that don't you think!!


Also the ridiculous defacto image of Jesus you keep putting out in the form of memes and images is nothing like Jesus would have been. He would have had typical Middle Eastern brown skin.

It's also extremely likely that he was gay

Was Jesus gay? Probably | Paul Oestreicher

Paul Oestreicher: I preached on Good Friday that Jesus's intimacy with John suggested he was gay as I felt deeply it had to be addressed

www.theguardian.com

JESUS WAS GAY, ACCORDING TO MARK

 

[Dropship]

Jesus lived 1000s of years ago and the testimonies you base your belief on were written 100s of years after he lived.
It's also extremely likely that he was gay

1- Gospel-writers Matthew and John were disciples and wrote their gospels in c70 AD and c95AD, Mark wrote his c60AD, he was a friend of Jesus's right-hand man Peter, and Luke wrote his c65AD, he was a friend of Paul who spoke with the risen Jesus..:)
2- Nah, if Jesus was a poofter, he wouldn't have said-
"The Creator made them male and female, for this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh' So they are no longer two, but one." (Matt 19:4)
Below- Jesus rescues a prossie from the fundy mob-

"On yer bikes, she's with me!"
"Hold your head up baby"
"Thanks JC, shall we go for a pizza?"