John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

[Behold]

John 1:18
No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in thebosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

The word of God is so very interesting and mystical.
Its beautiful and wonderful and ALIVE.

Notice your verse says..>Jesus the 1st-Born-of God, = is in the Bosom of the Father.
So, how can Jesus the man on EARTH, be in the Bosom of God who is "A" Spirit, who is in Heaven. ??
Ahhhh.
Hummmm.

Listen now..
So, being born, makes Jesus a man in a body, and God is A SPIRIT, in Heaven, .. and Jesus is IN Him.
Thats interesting isn't it.?
How does that work?

This verse. John 1:18 is corresponding with John 1 and its revealing that the Word of God, is not God's mouth, as a Spirit does not have a mouth, reader.
A HUMAN or an ANIMAL has a mouth.

Next.
When God Spoke....creation into existence, He is still the Holy Spirit, so, the Word, who is Jesus, is HOW God "spoke" through the Pre-Incarnate Christ, all of creation into existence.

How do you know?

Because John 1:10 says that the world, the earth, all of Creation, was made THROUGH JESUS.. (as the WORD)..... before He came down here, ... obviously.

So, all this is very mystical, and when you try to analyze the bible with your thinking, you will fail to get the revelation, as revelation is not a mind thing, its a "spiritual EYES"... being ENLIGHTENED by "the LIGHT OF THE WORLD"..... process of spiritual discernment.

Notice this verse.. Romans 8:9

Paul is teaching that God's Spirit and Jesus's Spirit, are the Holy Spirit.
Not that they HAVE the Spirit, but that both ARE the Holy Spirit.

That's Trinity" teaching.... coming out of Paul's verse.

 

[Rich R]

Still correcting the bible with "scholarship" and other such?

RichR....Do you know who first "corrected" God's word?
its was Satan, formally Lucifer. It was in the Garden, and He questioned God's word...."Hath God said"?
And today his owned are still trying to change, question, and cast doubt on the Bible, which is a work of the Devil, by correcting it with "originals" that dont exist or by "scholarship" that sits on a Pride filled Throne looking down their nose upon God's word as they correct it according to what they want it to say., and usually they correct it with "in the original greek" which does not exist.
So, the next time you read or hear someone say....>"a better rendering is found in the Original GREEK", then realize you are listening to a LIAR.
And yet, people follow these liars, and actually try to use their lies to correct the word of God.
Don't you just hate that, RichR?
If not, you should.

And also....about that....>"they all agree"...... stuff.
Its quite obvious that when a group (cult) believes something, they will all believe it, which is why they are in that particular group.
So, what isn't honest is to say that "ALL Scholarship" believes that some verses were altered by Translators, just to cherry pick the one you want.

Here is way to understand the Trinity.

Genesis says.. 'Let US create man, in OUR image".. So, >Us and OUR<, can't be singular, no matter what devil led scholarship tells you otherwise.

So, when you read where Jesus said....>"when you've seen me, you've seen the Father", and "I and the Father are one", and "I am from above and you are from below", and that Jesus said ""HE is (I am) the living bread who came down from Heaven".. its a good idea to believe it, as the Bible does not lie.

= Jesus stated 2x that He and Father are the same.....and then He stated 2x that He came DOWN from Heaven.

Now, we know that Jesus became a man, on earth, with a body, Virgin born, but before He "came down", He said He was "UP there".
So, that was not Jesus in a Body.. UP THERE.. which tells us that Jesus up there, as WHO and WHAT exactly?
He had no body until he was Virgin born on earth, so UP THERE, where He said He came from, ... what was He? and WHO was He?
In General most "scholarship" does not know, so just ignore all that is the best idea, generally speaking.

This is where John 1 comes into play, as it says that Jesus was the WORD..Who was God..

Our"daily bread" is the Scriptures, and Jesus said that He is the "Living Bread". "The WORD made Flesh".
So, where was He located UP THERE?.. .as the WORD, pre-incarnate?
He was IN God.
How do you know?
Well, God is "A" Spirit.......and this is the Holy Spirit.
= Now, when you read Romans 8:9, you'll notice that is says that the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ are the SAME SPIRIT. = The Holy Spirit
So, its impossible for the same SPIRIT, to not be the same......= God.
Then you look at 2 Corinthians 3:17, and there it is again... "Jesus the Lord is that SPIRIT". = Holy Spirit.
And what Spirit does God have, who is "A" Spirit? John 4:24...... He is the Holy Spirit.
So, now you have multiple verses that say that Christ was in Heaven, and came down, and is the same Holy Spirit as God..
2 are 1.
And the Holy Spirit is 3.

Thats 3 in One. = Trinity.

Here is one more for you RichR.

In John 20:22, Jesus Gave the 11 Apostles the Holy Spirit, ..Jesus GAVE MEN the HOLY Spirit.
And RichR, and other readers... only GOD can do that......exactly as Adam received it from God in Genesis 2:7

There is GOD as the GOD man JESUS, doing what GOD the Father did..... = Giving the Holy Spirit.
Only GOD can do that, and THEY BOTH(2) did.

So, let no deceiver, and no deceiving Scholarship keep you from the truth, as they will if they can., as that is what "doctrines of Devils" is all about.
Hebrews 13:9

I think scholarship is far better than tradition. Not one single verse you quoted is as clear in saying Jesus is God as John 17:3 and 1 Cor 8:6 are in saying only the Father is not God.

 

[Rich R]

The word of God is so very interesting and mystical.

"Mystical" - A perfect description of Gnosticism.

 

[Rich R]

So, all this is very mystical, and when you try to analyze the bible with your thinking, you will fail to get the revelation, as revelation is not a mind thing, its a "spiritual EYES"... being ENLIGHTENED by "the LIGHT OF THE WORLD"..... process of spiritual discernment.

Notice this verse.. Romans 8:9

Rom 8:9,

But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.​

Just because there is a spirit of God and a spirit of Christ, they are both God?

There are no less than 4 verses that talk about "the spirit of man." We are all God. Now there's some mysticism for you!

Why not leave the mysticism out of the equation and just read what's written?

1 Cor 8:6,

But to us [there is but] one God, the Father, of whom [are] all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom [are] all things, and we by him.
​

Nothing mystical there. Just a clear declaration that only the Father is God. Even if there was a "God the Son" found anywhere in the scriptures (which of course there isn't), he still wouldn't be the one God.

 

[Behold]

I think scholarship is far better than tradition. Not one single verse you quoted is as clear in saying Jesus is God as John 17:3 and 1 Cor 8:6 are in saying only the Father is not God.

Who is teaching Tradition?

The way i teach God as Christ, is not what other's teach. Not even your dreaded Trinitarians.
I didnt learn it from scholars.
Thats a fact.
The first verse that showed me what i came to realize was John 1:14, and then Colossians 1:16, because they teach John 1:10.

See those? Those verse are specifically talking about CREATION.
And that means, they are describing the CREATOR.
And who is that? Its GOD, as GOD is the Creator of all Things..yet....There is JESUS doing it, by being the WORD of Creation, who later became "Flesh".

Remember that Jesus said to you..>>"When you've seen me, you've seen the Father".. and the same Jesus told you..>>"You believe in God, believe also in ME".
So, you dont find any of that as "clear", as you look through the lens of your preferred scholastic hero's favorite anti-deity verses.
That's unfortunate., but i do understand.

You have an opinion.......and you said that what i wrote does not prove... because its not as "CLEAR."
So, you mean, "It does not prove it to you".
And that's ok.
Others here will read that God gave the Holy Spirit, and Jesus gave the Holy Spirit, and that God and CHRIST are the same Holy Spirit, and will see it.

 

[theefaith]

The word of God is so very interesting and mystical.
Its beautiful and wonderful and ALIVE.

Notice your verse says..>Jesus the 1st-Born-of God, = is in the Bosom of the Father.
So, how can Jesus the man on EARTH, be in the Bosom of God who is "A" Spirit, who is in Heaven. ??
Ahhhh.
Hummmm.

Listen now..
So, being born, makes Jesus a man in a body, and God is A SPIRIT, in Heaven, .. and Jesus is IN Him.
Thats interesting isn't it.?
How does that work?

This verse. John 1:18 is corresponding with John 1 and its revealing that the Word of God, is not God's mouth, as a Spirit does not have a mouth, reader.
A HUMAN or an ANIMAL has a mouth.

Next.
When God Spoke....creation into existence, He is still the Holy Spirit, so, the Word, who is Jesus, is HOW God "spoke" through the Pre-Incarnate Christ, all of creation into existence.

How do you know?

Because John 1:10 says that the world, the earth, all of Creation, was made THROUGH JESUS.. (as the WORD)..... before He came down here, ... obviously.

So, all this is very mystical, and when you try to analyze the bible with your thinking, you will fail to get the revelation, as revelation is not a mind thing, its a "spiritual EYES"... being ENLIGHTENED by "the LIGHT OF THE WORLD"..... process of spiritual discernment.

Notice this verse.. Romans 8:9

Paul is teaching that God's Spirit and Jesus's Spirit, are the Holy Spirit.
Not that they HAVE the Spirit, but that both ARE the Holy Spirit.

That's Trinity" teaching.... coming out of Paul's verse.

1 Jn 5: 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

I posted two new threads in unorthodox forum, hope you can respond
Grace and works
And the do nothing gospel

 

[PinSeeker]

Why not leave the mysticism out of the equation and just read what's written?

Totally with you, there, Rich. But the issue is concerning what is truly written... :) So to your quote:

1 Cor 8:6,

But to us [there is but] one God, the Father, of whom [are] all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom [are] all things, and we by him.
​

Nothing mystical there.

Agreed. :)

Just a clear declaration that only the Father is God.

No, but a clear declaration that there is only one Father and one Lord ~ a direct refutation of the common belief at the time (and even today in some circles) that there are multiple gods and multiple lords. In Paul's declaration there, what follows 'God' is a compound appositive phrase, which provides information that further identifies or defines its antecedent. So 'God' is further defined as the Father ("of Whom are all things, and we in Him") and the Lord (Jesus Christ, by Whom are all things, and we by Him).

Even if there was a "God the Son" found anywhere in the scriptures (which of course there isn't)...

Those exact words are not necessary; Christ Jesus is described and self-proclaimed in the Scriptures as being wholly of God and wholly of man ~ the Son of God and the Son of Man, and in the form of (Greek 'morphe'... the very thing) God and the form of (again, Greek 'morphe'... the very thing) man, as Paul says in Philippians 2.

Psalm 110 has been discussed ("the LORD says to my Lord..."). We all agree that the Father is speaking to Jesus there, which is good. But let's be consistent and compare that with what we read in Psalm 16, where the word used for "my Lord" is the same:

"I say to the LORD, “You are my Lord..." (Psalm 16:2);
"The LORD says to my Lord..." (Psalm 110:1)​

The New World Translation attempts to re-engineer Psalm 16:2 as "I have said to Jehovah: “You are Jehovah, my Source of goodness," deliberately removing ~ or unsuccessfully removing, anyway, as, again, Jehovah is a plural singularity ~ David's praise of Jehovah as his Lord. The same root Hebrew word is used in both Psalm 16:2 and Psalm 110:1, Psalm 16:2 being 'adonay', an emphatic form of what is found in Psalm 110:1 ('adon' ~ from an unused root meaning to rule).

Ah, I hear it coming now: "the same, except different," right? Well, if you were to do that, that would just be stone-headedness. :)

Grace and peace to you, Rich.

 

[Jack]

Right, dream on, as @Rich R already said. Jack will move names and relationships around in a verse or two and call it good. And he will keep judging others in sheer ignorance and who are not of his cloth with direct edicts of fire and brimstone and hellfire.

Trinitarians will always struggle with scripture because they, as you have said many times, try to superimpose their Triune god doctrine into scripture and then onto others, especially Unitarians. And it never truly works because the verses they choose as a 'study' do not jive or harmonize with others when a rigorous comparison and test is made. And don't even bring up contextual study in verses. That concept is really alien for them. It is much easier for them just to verse pick at will.

I think @Jack falls nicely into the same school of non-thought as @Kermos and @theefaith. And Jack might have been set back a class or two because all I hear from him lately are canned marquee-type message posts or responses, like no one is home, or is out to lunch.

Typical JW insults! No Scripture? Of course not!

 

[Behold]

"Mystical" - A perfect description of Gnosticism.

True Gnostics, do not believe that sin exists.
The "father of Gnostics", who is Valentinus, almost became a POPE.
Contemporary Gnostics would include Mary Baker Eddy, Tom Cruise, and L. Ron Hubbard (Scientology).

Also, when i say "mystical", regarding the things of God, im not comparing that to Fantasy, or European Paganism Rituals
Or something like the "cult of Mary" with their Incense and reading from the Latin Text while all their members can't understand any of what is being read. So, im not talking about that man made stuff.

When i say that God and God's ways are mystical, I mean like this...

Isaiah 55:9. """For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts."""

1 Corinthians 13:12... "for NOW we see through a glass, darkly""

All this changes when we meet Jesus face to face.

 

[theefaith]

Totally with you, there, Rich. But the issue is concerning what is truly written... :) So you're quote:


Agreed. :)


No, but a clear declaration that there is only one Father and one Lord ~ a direct refutation of the common belief at the time (and even today in some circles) that there are multiple gods and multiple lords. In Paul's declaration there, what follows 'God' is a compound appositive phrase, which provides information that further identifies or defines its antecedent. So 'God' is further defined as the Father ("of Whom are all things, and we in Him") and the Lord (Jesus Christ, by Whom are all things, and we by Him).


Those exact words are not necessary; Christ Jesus is described and self-proclaimed in the Scriptures as being wholly of God and wholly of man ~ the Son of God and the Son of Man, and in the form of (Greek 'morphe'... the very thing) God and the form of (again, Greek 'morphe'... the very thing) man, as Paul says in Philippians 2.

Psalm 110 has been discussed ("the LORD says to my Lord..."). We all agree that the Father is speaking to Jesus there, which is good. But let's be consistent and compare that with what we read in Psalm 16, where the word used for "my Lord" is the same:

"I say to the LORD, “You are my Lord..." (Psalm 16:2);
"The LORD says to my Lord..." (Psalm 110:1)​

The New World Translation attempts to re-engineer Psalm 16:2 as "I have said to Jehovah: “You are Jehovah, my Source of goodness," deliberately removing ~ or unsuccessfully removing, anyway, as, again, Jehovah is a plural singularity ~ David's praise of Jehovah as his Lord. The same root Hebrew word is used in both Psalm 16:2 and Psalm 110:1, Psalm 16:2 being 'adonay', an emphatic form of what is found in Psalm 110:1 ('adon' ~ from an unused root meaning to rule).

Ah, I hear it coming now: "the same, except different," right? Well, if you were to do that, that would just be stone-headedness. :)

Grace and peace to you, Rich.

it says and!

A N D or including the Lord Jesus Christ!

If Jesus is not God then how can he be lord? Psalm 23 the Lord is God and Jesus is Lord therefore God or you would have 2 Lords and scripture Deut 6:4 says one Lord!

Phil 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

only God can be our salvation!
Christ is salvation Lk 2:30

Only God is the shepherd! Psalm 23
Jn 10 Jesus is the good shepherd

Only God can be the way, the truth, and the life! Jn 14:6

 

[PinSeeker]

it says and!

A N D or including the Lord Jesus Christ!

If Jesus is not God then how can he be lord? Psalm 23 the Lord is God and Jesus is Lord therefore God or you would have 2 Lords and scripture Deut 6:4 says one Lord!

Phil 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

only God can be our salvation!
Christ is salvation Lk 2:30

Only God is the shepherd! Psalm 23
Jn 10 Jesus is the good shepherd

Only God can be the way, the truth, and the life! Jn 14:6

Um... you're preaching to the choir, TF. I'm... right with you. :) Grace and peace to you.

 

[theefaith]

Um... you're preaching to the choir, TF. I'm... right with you. :) Grace and peace to you.

Thanks

 

[Behold]

Just because there is a spirit of God and a spirit of Christ, they are both God?

They are both the Holy Spirit, unless you think one of them is a different Spirit.

Notice that the verse is teaching that they are both the Holy Spirit......Not that they each have the Holy Spirit, but that they ARE the Holy Spirit, both,.... that is in the born again, as proof the person is redeemed.

Notice this.. the born again are become "the Temple of the HOLY Spirit". = "Christ IN YOU< the hope of Glory".

So, there it is again... Christ THE Holy Spirit is in you if you are born again as the "temple of the HOLY Spirit".

"Christ IS that Spirit"..... and "God is A Spirit", and "where the Spirit of Christ is, there is Liberty"

See it?
Over and over the NT keeps presenting God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit as ONE...= the same.

Why? Because its true.

 

[PinSeeker]

They are both the Holy Spirit, unless you think one of them is a different Spirit.

Notice that the verse is teaching that they are both the Holy Spirit......Not that they each have the Holy Spirit, but that they ARE the Holy Spirit, both,.... that is in the born again, as proof the person is redeemed.

Notice this.. the born again are become "the Temple of the HOLY Spirit". = "Christ IN YOU< the hope of Glory".

So, there it is again... Christ THE Holy Spirit is in you if you are born again as the "temple of the HOLY Spirit".

"Christ IS that Spirit"..... and "God is A Spirit", and "where the Spirit of Christ is, there is Liberty"

See it?
Over and over the NT keeps presenting God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit as ONE...= the same.

Why? Because its true.

So... I know you're replying to Rich, here, Behold, but I'm not sure I get you... not sure if I understand exactly what you believe. Do you or do you not understand the Holy Spirit to be a third distinct Person, Who is one with the Father and the Son and they one with Him (in the same manner as Jesus said that He and the Father are one, that He is in the Father and the Father in Him? I mean, Jesus is very clear about that in John 14 and 15. Maybe you can clarify exactly where you stand.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[Behold]

So... I know you're replying to Rich, here, Behold, but I'm not sure I get you... not sure if I understand exactly what you believe. Do you or do you not understand the Holy Spirit to be a third distinct Person, Who is one with the Father and the Son and they one with Him (in the same manner as Jesus said that He and the Father are one, that He is in the Father and the Father in Him? I mean, Jesus is very clear about that in John 14 and 15. Maybe you can clarify exactly where you stand.

Grace and peace to you.

Hey PinSeeker,

1.) God is the author of Creation, Jesus is the Word of Creation, and the Holy Spirit is the means of Creation.

Its all the same....

2.) God Spoke creation into existence, and Jesus is the Pre-incarnate WORD...

John 1:10

Its the same....


God is "A" Spirit.
Jesus is The Messiah, and has a body., but before He did, He was Christ pre-incarnate, as John 1. The Word was God., and the "word became flesh".

Its the same..


God breathed the Holy Spirit into ADAM, and Jesus BREATHED the Holy Spirit into the 11 Apostles after Jesus rose from the Dead.

Its GOD doing that in both cases... just a different manifestation.


Thomas said....>"My Lord and my GOD" upon 1st seeing the Risen Messiah, and Jesus didn't correct Him, as why would God correct the Truth.


Moses said....>"what is your name".... And God said..>"I Am that I Am". (no beginning and no ending)
Jesus said to the Pharisees, "before Abraham was born I AM"... who is "the alpha and omega"..

Its the same.


God is The Father, the Creator
Jesus is the Pre-Incarnate CHRIST, the WORD of Creation, and God manifested in the Flesh.
The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Christ and "God is A Spirit".

These 3 are One.

 

[Rich R]

Totally with you, there, Rich. But the issue is concerning what is truly written... :) So to your quote:


Agreed. :)


No, but a clear declaration that there is only one Father and one Lord ~ a direct refutation of the common belief at the time (and even today in some circles) that there are multiple gods and multiple lords. In Paul's declaration there, what follows 'God' is a compound appositive phrase, which provides information that further identifies or defines its antecedent. So 'God' is further defined as the Father ("of Whom are all things, and we in Him") and the Lord (Jesus Christ, by Whom are all things, and we by Him).


Those exact words are not necessary; Christ Jesus is described and self-proclaimed in the Scriptures as being wholly of God and wholly of man ~ the Son of God and the Son of Man, and in the form of (Greek 'morphe'... the very thing) God and the form of (again, Greek 'morphe'... the very thing) man, as Paul says in Philippians 2.

Psalm 110 has been discussed ("the LORD says to my Lord..."). We all agree that the Father is speaking to Jesus there, which is good. But let's be consistent and compare that with what we read in Psalm 16, where the word used for "my Lord" is the same:

"I say to the LORD, “You are my Lord..." (Psalm 16:2);
"The LORD says to my Lord..." (Psalm 110:1)​

The New World Translation attempts to re-engineer Psalm 16:2 as "I have said to Jehovah: “You are Jehovah, my Source of goodness," deliberately removing ~ or unsuccessfully removing, anyway, as, again, Jehovah is a plural singularity ~ David's praise of Jehovah as his Lord. The same root Hebrew word is used in both Psalm 16:2 and Psalm 110:1, Psalm 16:2 being 'adonay', an emphatic form of what is found in Psalm 110:1 ('adon' ~ from an unused root meaning to rule).

Ah, I hear it coming now: "the same, except different," right? Well, if you were to do that, that would just be stone-headedness. :)

Grace and peace to you, Rich.

Would you mind explaining why my not agreeing with you is "stone headedness"? Why isn't you who is stone headed for not agreeing with me?

I think it's a pretty convoluted answer you gave to 1 Cor 8:6. Did you ever do sentence diagramming in school? If so, you might try applying it to Corinthians. I think it would say that only the Father is God and that Jesus is Lord (I trust you know that not all lords are God).

But apart from Corinthians, how about John 17:3? Would you agree that Jesus wasn't talking to himself when he said, "that they may know thee, the only true God"? Seems like whoever he directed his speech was is the one true God.

Psalm 16:2 is talking about Yahweh, period. David was simply saying Yahweh was his Lord, his boss if you will. No need or justification for bringing Jesus into the verse.

The Bible in Psalm 110:1 actually gives the Messiah the title that never describes God. The word is adoni, and in all of its 195 occurrences in the Old Testament it means a superior who is human (or occasionally angelic), created and not God. So Psalm 110:1 presents the clearest evidence that the Messiah is not God, but a supremely exalted man. When the word "lord" is applied to God, it is always adonai.

The Hebrew Lexicon by Brown, Driver and Briggs (BDB), considered by many to be the best available, makes the distinction between these words. Note how in BDB the word adoni refers to “lords” that are not God, while another word, adonai, refers to God.

 

[Rich R]

True Gnostics, do not believe that sin exists.
The "father of Gnostics", who is Valentinus, almost became a POPE.
Contemporary Gnostics would include Mary Baker Eddy, Tom Cruise, and L. Ron Hubbard (Scientology).

Also, when i say "mystical", regarding the things of God, im not comparing that to Fantasy, or European Paganism Rituals
Or something like the "cult of Mary" with their Incense and reading from the Latin Text while all their members can't understand any of what is being read. So, im not talking about that man made stuff.

When i say that God and God's ways are mystical, I mean like this...

Isaiah 55:9. """For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts."""

1 Corinthians 13:12... "for NOW we see through a glass, darkly""

All this changes when we meet Jesus face to face.

Isaiah 55:9 has a context and it's not saying nobody can understand God. Jesus himself said he came to make God known (John 15:15), so Isaiah can't be saying God can't be known. It certainly is no justification for the Athenasian Creed. Isaiah is just saying He knows better than man what is good for them.

1 Cor 13:12 also has a context. It is talking about how we don't really understand how much God really loves us but we will when Jesus comes back. We'll know ourselves as He already knows us. Again no justification for the enigmatic statements in the Athenasian Creed.

 

[Behold]

But apart from Corinthians, how about John 17:3? Would you agree that Jesus wasn't talking to himself when he said, "that they may know thee, the only true God"? Seems like whoever he directed his speech was is the one true God.

.

God manifested in the Flesh, as a virgin born man, who was God as the Word....is true, but its not something that can understood as if someone just said..... 4x=8. and X=2.
The bible is not divined by Scholarship, its revealed by the Spirit.
You read that "with God all things are possible" and then when you are presented with something that is only OF God's capability, you run to man made scholarship to try to not believe that verse.
RichR, its Scholarship that has caused you to believe what you believe, as everything you use to disbelieve is taught by people you BELIEVE.

Look at this..

God made man 4 different ways.

Out of Dirt
Out of a Rib
Inside a Virgin
and by Flesh joining flesh.

God is what He is, and Jesus is God pre-incarnate, but He's not the FATHER...>He is the WORD who became the Son, who became the Messiah, who is now coming again soon.

 

[Behold]

Isaiah 55:9 has a context and it's not saying nobody can understand God. Jesus himself said he came to make God known (John 15:15),

Isaiah 55:9 says that God's Ways are higher than Mans ways.........this is not the same as God being Revealed.

Another verse by Paul gives more context....Its says that no one, not me, you, your favorite scholars, have any idea what God has prepared "up there" for those who have become His, down here, who love Him.

1 Corinthians 2:9

So, we can Know God, and we can receive revelation, but as compared to Jesus who is "ALL the Treasures of Wisdom and Knowledge".... even Soloman was clueless.

 

[Behold]

When the word "lord" is applied to God, it is always adonai.

One day, both you and your scholars are going to bend your knees and your tongue WILL confess, that "Jesus IS LORD".

Watch and see.