Saying you are without sin verses in 1 John

[savedbygrace1]

Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach. 12 It is not up in heaven, so that you have to ask, “Who will ascend into heaven to get it and proclaim it to us so we may obey it?” 13 Nor is it beyond the sea, so that you have to ask, “Who will cross the sea to get it and proclaim it to us so we may obey it?” 14 No, the word is very near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart so you may obey it.

15 See, I set before you today life and prosperity, death and destruction. 16 For I command you today to love the Lord your God, to walk in obedience to him, and to keep his commands, decrees and laws; then you will live and increase, and the Lord your God will bless you in the land you are entering to possess. Deut30:11-15




7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness 2Corinthians3:6-9
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Moses told the Israelites it would not be too difficult for them to obey God's laws he gave them, it was not beyond their reach.
Yet Paul stated, the letter of the law killed, and the law was the ministry of death and condemnation. Why two completely differing views on obedience?

 

[savedbygrace1]

Speak for yourself instead of bearing a false witness against a believer.

I think it is you who just bore false witness against me

 

[savedbygrace1]

Speak for yourself instead of bearing a false witness against a believer.

Is the following statement incorrect? Please respond honestly. If it is correct, why tell me I bore false witness against you?
''There is not one day you yourself even try to obey each and every command of Christ in the Gospels''

 

[ChristisGod]

Matthew 22:36-40
“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”

37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

hope this helps !!!

 

[ChristisGod]

One of the most revealing things about a thread or discussion like this is always the following things.

1- man tries to justify their sin/lifestyle and not justify the Holiness of God but their own unholiness.
2- man deflects the conversation outward towards others rather than looking inwards at self.
3- we are to be Holy , live righteous, be salt and light, not darkness. 1 John 2
4- we are not to be conformed to this world but be transformed having our minds renewed. Romans 12
5- we who have died with Christ have died to the sinful nature and its lusts/desires. Romans 6

 

[savedbygrace1]

You would literally be surprised at the number of people who actually say they are without sin maam. Puzzles the heck out of me, I sin every single day. The world is designed to see to it that individuals do sin every day. You know though, one day in the near future that will not be the case.

There are two types of sin aren't there. Sin you will not wilfully and with premeditation set out to commit, but sin you are going to commit in your everyday life simply because in your body of flesh you will never perfectly obey the letter of the law/commandments, none of us will. I think you hold the law to the pinnacle it has been set at, and do not dumb it down. That is why you know you constantly fall short in obedience to that level. Then there is sin that is committed that is wilfull and premeditated. They are two completely different things. Many people join churches and leave because others like to insinuate they either do not commit sin, or they are nigh on sinless. Those who believe them and are sincere of heart, in far too many cases walk away crushed. It is much better to be humble and honest, rather than give a false impression of oneself, that may crush your brother
God bless, and thank you for your humility and honesty

 

[marks]

Focusing on sin is looking in the wrong direction. Focusing on Jesus keeps one from sin.

1 Corinthians 4:3-5 KJV
3) But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self.
4) For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.
5) Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.

Paul didn't go so far as to say that though his conscience was clear, that didn't mean he was right in all he did, only so far as he knew, and his knowledge was not complete as is Jesus'.

Much love!

 

[marks]

There are two types of sin aren't there. Sin you will not wilfully and with premeditation set out to commit, but sin you are going to commit in your everyday life simply because in your body of flesh you will never perfectly obey the letter of the law/commandments, none of us will. I think you hold the law to the pinnacle it has been set at, and do not dumb it down. That is why you know you constantly fall short in obedience to that level. Then there is sin that is committed that is wilfull and premeditated. They are two completely different things. Many people join churches and leave because others like to insinuate they either do not commit sin, or they are nigh on sinless. Those who believe them and are sincere of heart, in far too many cases walk away crushed. It is much better to be humble and honest, rather than give a false impression of oneself, that may crush your brother
God bless, and thank you for your humility and honesty

Do you believe it is possible that we can live with a clean conscience, not aware of any wrongdoing? Walking in continuous trust in Jesus, without committing any known sin? For an hour? For a day? A week? A coffee break?

I believe that we can live in Christ's power by trusting Him, and we can walk in the Spirit not committing sin, and that we can grow in consistency in doing that. And otherwise we find ourselves struggling to control sin, and sinful thoughts, in the flesh.

Much love!

 

[savedbygrace1]

Do you believe it is possible that we can live with a clean conscience, not aware of any wrongdoing? Walking in continuous trust in Jesus, without committing any known sin? For an hour? For a day? A week? A coffee break?

I believe that we can live in Christ's power by trusting Him, and we can walk in the Spirit not committing sin, and that we can grow in consistency in doing that. And otherwise we find ourselves struggling to control sin, and sinful thoughts, in the flesh.

Much love!

A Baptist minister, of fifty years once said
'If we all followed after the Holy Spirit every minute of our lives we would never commit sin. The reality of which escapes us all'

 

[savedbygrace1]

Do you believe it is possible that we can live with a clean conscience, not aware of any wrongdoing? Walking in continuous trust in Jesus, without committing any known sin? For an hour? For a day? A week? A coffee break?

I believe that we can live in Christ's power by trusting Him, and we can walk in the Spirit not committing sin, and that we can grow in consistency in doing that. And otherwise we find ourselves struggling to control sin, and sinful thoughts, in the flesh.

Much love!

BTW
Where do you set the bar for not committing sin?
If we have unkind thoughts of anyone, is that sin?
If we have impure thoughts, are they sin?
If we are self seeking in any regard, is that sin?
If we get angry without just cause, is that sin?
If we put other things before God(anything) is that sin?
To be honest with you, I constantly fail where I believe the bar is set at, not to commit sin. But am I happy to fail? No. Do I seek to excuse my failures? No. Do I hate my faliures? Yes I do. That is very different from being happy and content to sin as much as you like. No, I am far from being perfect in my flesh, but admitting that, does not mean I seek to excuse my shortcomings. I would prefer to admit it, lest I crush someone else who mistakenly beleived I was at a place I am not at, and they then feel huge guilt for not attaining to where they percieve me to be at

 

[TLHKAJ]

So now you are disagreeing with Jesus and Paul shall we continue in sin that grace might abound.

I'm asking you what scripture declares to be the truth. Not what your or my experience thinks the truth is. Do you understand the difference ?

Experience does not determine truth, Scripture is the truth. So failing to obey it doesn't nullify the truth. failing to walk in the spirit doesn't not justify living in the flesh. Sin is sin.

Are you a calvinist by chance ? are you reformed in your faith ?

hope this helps !!!

It all fits together. Our righteousness is from God (in Christ alone). But God forbid that we allow grace to be an excuse to commit acts that displease God. Love ....love compels us to keep His commandments.

John 14:15,21
[15]If ye love me, keep my commandments.
[21]He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

John 15:10-11
[10]If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
[11]These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.

1 John 5:1-3
[1]Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
[2]By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
[3]For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Love is the key. We love Him because He loved us first! And the response of a heart that loves God is to keep His commandments.

1 John 4:19
[19]We love him, because he first loved us.

Does this mean we will never miss the mark? I think not.

1 John 2:1-2
[1]My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
[2]And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

But, if we are in Christ, and we dwell in His love, we will keep His commandments. That is where the rest of the chapter comes in with ...if we love Him, we will keep His commandments.

The OP is correct, and so is @Behold's post. I don't see how they can't fit together into one complete picture. Surely no one here believes we are saved or justified by our own works or righteousness.

 

[marks]

Where do you set the bar for not committing sin?

Trust, and love.

Whatever is not in trust in Jesus is sin, and whatever is not of love is sin.

Much love!

 

[amigo de christo]

Trust, and love.

Whatever is not in trust in Jesus is sin, and whatever is not of love is sin.

Much love!

You might want to head over to the VICOTRY in JESUS thread . Cause we got a serious false gosple getting taught .
The all inclusive one . And we must contend for the one true faith that was orginally delivered unto the saints .
SO strap on that armour my friend and let us contend for the gospel .

 

[ChristisGod]

You might want to head over to the VICOTRY in JESUS thread . Cause we got a serious false gosple getting taught .
The all inclusive one . And we must contend for the one true faith that was orginally delivered unto the saints .
SO strap on that armour my friend and let us contend for the gospel .

Do you have a link thanks

 

[amigo de christo]

Do you have a link thanks

Its called The Victory of Jesus .

 

[amigo de christo]

Do you have a link thanks

The Victory of Jesus

 

[ScottA]

Therefore you agree it is sin not to obey Christ's commands in the Gospels. Now you are not really going to tell me you obey each and every command of Christ in the gospels faultlessly are you?

This is a problem for the world, and those of the world struggle with it. That being, not drawing the line of where sin ends correctly as God does, which end has a name given to Him, which is the End.

Many by unbelief seeing what appears as ongoing sin and temptations, assume that they have not yet died to sin--and by that same measure, it has not.

What then of what appears to be the same behavior by those who believe that they have passed from death to life? Have they not passed on--are the scriptures not true, but a lie? Not at all, but the world goes on until the time of God's choosing, and such a one, being in Christ, has entered that time before time before the foundation of the world. Which if one does not understand, would also say that Christ was only slain after and not before. Who then should the children born again of the Spirit believe, according to those who only believe as the world believes and how they perceive times and the acts of God, or as God perceives Christ in whom they are, who was before the world began?

So then, our choice is to only believe in part or believe in full...and so it is measured to each accordingly.

 

[marks]

Many by unbelief seeing what appears as ongoing sin and temptations, assume that they have not yet died to sin--and by that same measure, it has not.

For our walk is by faith and not by sight.

Much love!

 

[savedbygrace1]

This is a problem for the world, and those of the world struggle with it. That being, not drawing the line of where sin ends correctly as God does, which end has a name given to Him, which is the End.

Many by unbelief seeing what appears as ongoing sin and temptations, assume that they have not yet died to sin--and by that same measure, it has not.

What then of what appears to be the same behavior by those who believe that they have passed from death to life? Have they not passed on--are the scriptures not true, but a lie? Not at all, but the world goes on until the time of God's choosing, and such a one, being in Christ, has entered that time before time before the foundation of the world. Which if one does not understand, would also say that Christ was only slain after and not before. Who then should the children born again of the Spirit believe, according to those who only believe as the world believes and how they perceive times and the acts of God, or as God perceives Christ in whom they are, who was before the world began?

So then, our choice is to only believe in part or believe in full...and so it is measured to each accordingly.

Thank you for the above, though being a simple fellow I lost your train of thought as I was reading.
However, it is quite simple to me. Many berate others for their sin, or admittance of sin, whilst they themselves, according to their belief of what sin is, are no different from the person they are berating.

 

[ScottA]

Thank you for the above, though being a simple fellow I lost your train of thought as I was reading.
However, it is quite simple to me. Many berate others for their sin, or admittance of sin, whilst they themselves, according to their belief of what sin is, are no different from the person they are berating.

I think I understand what you mean, but if that were true Jesus would have said nothing of the hypocrites.