Insults

[Raccoon1010]

Whipp media's other site (Christianforums.com ) has stricter guide lines and rules against goading, Flaming, proselytizing, and even evangelizing.

It's definitely designed to be a safe space for fellowship, but by compartmentalizing various groups by various theologies, it just gives professing Christians a place to find agreement with like minded individuals without regard to truth.

As someone called to apply scripture for the correction of errant behaviors in the church, I find the site entirely useless for anything but "Holy huddles" and self justification. Truth is not relative, but absolute.

The division of the body of Christ with the incorporation of doctrinal error may have been predicted by the Lord Himself, but was that His intention?
Can maturity be achieved independently?

That forum banned me for having that vision of Heavenly Mother. I told them I believed in a heavenly mother and one of the mods said I couldn't call myself a Christian. Later as I watch the Catholic Mass I see them call Mary the Heavenly Mother, so apparently I was picked on for having a Catholic heavenly experience. But I was a bit tipsy at one point and went off on the mod who then banned me. It was a permanent ban after that point.

 

[michaelvpardo]

That forum banned me for having that vision of Heavenly Mother. I told them I believed in a heavenly mother and one of the mods said I couldn't call myself a Christian. Later as I watch the Catholic Mass I see them call Mary the Heavenly Mother, so apparently I was picked on for having a Catholic heavenly experience. But I was a bit tipsy at one point and went off on the mod who then banned me. It was a permanent ban after that point.

Well, visions of a "heavenly mother" aren't likely to be recieved well on any Christian forum other than a Catholic site (or one sponsored by a daughter church that observes customs like prayer to the saints,) because of a long history on Earth of paganism surrounding fertility cults.

In the middle east there were goddesses called Ashtoreth and Ishtar, and in the Mediterranean a number of goddesses like Ceres, Ops, Rhea, Demeter, and Hecate to just name a few. Fertility goddesses were common world wide sometimes associated with agriculture and horticulture, but also with human fertility. Some pagan cults practiced both ritual sex and infant sacrifice, so God dealt with them severely during the conquest of Canaan.

In Rome such gods were not only worshipped in temples, but people kept miniature versions in little sanctuaries within their homes for private prayer. When Christianity became lawful and the state approved religion under Emperor Constantine, the Roman Church permitted the continuation of this practice, but substituted "patron " saints for the old gods of Rome. The "mother of heaven" was the pagan concept of the wife of the principle god or father of the gods, Jupiter in Rome, Zeus in Greece.

Most Christians take a dim view of incorporating pagan practices into Christianity. However, there is a biblical precedent for associating cities with a feminine persona. Jerusalem itself is frequently referred to as a virgin daughter or a harlot in scripture.

The tribes of Israel and even the body of Christ are pictured as a bride. The queen of heaven is only mentioned in scripture as an idol of paganism, but the bride of Christ receives real authority from God. However, the bride isn't equal in authority to Christ, but under His "headship." There is at least one passage in scripture that rebukes the "widow" for taking that authority upon herself.

“Sit in silence, and go into darkness,
O daughter of the Chaldeans;
For you shall no longer be called
The Lady of Kingdoms.
6 I was angry with My people;
I have profaned My inheritance,
And given them into your hand.
You showed them no mercy;
On the elderly you laid your yoke very heavily.
7 And you said, ‘I shall be a lady forever,’
So that you did not take these things to heart,
Nor remember the latter end of them.

8 “Therefore hear this now, you who are given to pleasures,
Who dwell securely,
Who say in your heart, ‘I am, and there is no one else besides me;
I shall not sit as a widow,
Nor shall I know the loss of children’;
9 But these two things shall come to you
In a moment, in one day:
The loss of children, and widowhood.
They shall come upon you in their fullness
Because of the multitude of your sorceries,
For the great abundance of your enchantments.

10 “For you have trusted in your wickedness;
You have said, ‘No one sees me’;
Your wisdom and your knowledge have warped you;
And you have said in your heart,
‘I am, and there is no one else besides me.’ Isaiah 47:5-10

In context this was about Babylon and the Chaldean empire, but has a broader interpretation in reference to "Babylon the Great" as described in the book of the Revelation.

I would suggest that your dream would be more likely a reference to either the church, or the same Babylon, but I'm not familiar with your dream. Was your vision specifically identified as about the "mother of heaven" ?

Did you post it here?

Eve, the wife of Adam, is identified as the "mother of all living" by Adam, the son of God. That itself has certain implications in regard to the culmination of human society prior to the return of Christ (but thinking about it just gives me a headache.)

 

[Raccoon1010]

Well, visions of a "heavenly mother" aren't likely to be recieved well on any Christian forum other than a Catholic site (or one sponsored by a daughter church that observes customs like prayer to the saints,) because of a long history on Earth of paganism surrounding fertility cults.

In the middle east there were goddesses called Ashtoreth and Ishtar, and in the Mediterranean a number of goddesses like Ceres, Ops, Rhea, Demeter, and Hecate to just name a few. Fertility goddesses were common world wide sometimes associated with agriculture and horticulture, but also with human fertility. Some pagan cults practiced both ritual sex and infant sacrifice, so God dealt with them severely during the conquest of Canaan.

In Rome such gods were not only worshipped in temples, but people kept miniature versions in little sanctuaries within their homes for private prayer. When Christianity became lawful and the state approved religion under Emperor Constantine, the Roman Church permitted the continuation of this practice, but substituted "patron " saints for the old gods of Rome. The "mother of heaven" was the pagan concept of the wife of the principle god or father of the gods, Jupiter in Rome, Zeus in Greece.

Most Christians take a dim view of incorporating pagan practices into Christianity. However, there is a biblical precedent for associating cities with a feminine persona. Jerusalem itself is frequently referred to as a virgin daughter or a harlot in scripture.

The tribes of Israel and even the body of Christ are pictured as a bride. The queen of heaven is only mentioned in scripture as an idol of paganism, but the bride of Christ receives real authority from God. However, the bride isn't equal in authority to Christ, but under His "headship." There is at least one passage in scripture that rebukes the "widow" for taking that authority upon herself.

“Sit in silence, and go into darkness,
O daughter of the Chaldeans;
For you shall no longer be called
The Lady of Kingdoms.
6 I was angry with My people;
I have profaned My inheritance,
And given them into your hand.
You showed them no mercy;
On the elderly you laid your yoke very heavily.
7 And you said, ‘I shall be a lady forever,’
So that you did not take these things to heart,
Nor remember the latter end of them.

8 “Therefore hear this now, you who are given to pleasures,
Who dwell securely,
Who say in your heart, ‘I am, and there is no one else besides me;
I shall not sit as a widow,
Nor shall I know the loss of children’;
9 But these two things shall come to you
In a moment, in one day:
The loss of children, and widowhood.
They shall come upon you in their fullness
Because of the multitude of your sorceries,
For the great abundance of your enchantments.

10 “For you have trusted in your wickedness;
You have said, ‘No one sees me’;
Your wisdom and your knowledge have warped you;
And you have said in your heart,
‘I am, and there is no one else besides me.’ Isaiah 47:5-10

In context this was about Babylon and the Chaldean empire, but has a broader interpretation in reference to "Babylon the Great" as described in the book of the Revelation.

I would suggest that your dream would be more likely a reference to either the church, or the same Babylon, but I'm not familiar with your dream. Was your vision specifically identified as about the "mother of heaven" ?

Did you post it here?

Eve, the wife of Adam, is identified as the "mother of all living" by Adam, the son of God. That itself has certain implications in regard to the culmination of human society prior to the return of Christ (but thinking about it just gives me a headache.)

You have a lot of scriptural knowledge concerning that subject. No it was a vision of two heavenly spirits, both white and holy. A Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother were presented and my sins forgiven. I was filled with immense love and peace that lasted for hours. Heavenly Father shown me his mind and that he was of a super intelligence that was more intelligent than what I could discern. The Heavenly Mother appeared as a normal Holy spirit.

I had just gone to Catholic Mass for the first couple times before the vision appeared. So I have since attributed the Heavenly Mother to Mary. As the Catholics add a petition to her to intercede to us with the Jesus in their Mass. So it would be along those lines.

 

[michaelvpardo]

You have a lot of scriptural knowledge concerning that subject. No it was a vision of two heavenly spirits, both white and holy. A Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother were presented and my sins forgiven. I was filled with immense love and peace that lasted for hours. Heavenly Father shown me his mind and that he was of a super intelligence that was more intelligent than what I could discern. The Heavenly Mother appeared as a normal Holy spirit.

I had just gone to Catholic Mass for the first couple times before the vision appeared. So I have since attributed the Heavenly Mother to Mary. As the Catholics add a petition to her to intercede to us with the Jesus in their Mass. So it would be along those lines.

Roman Catholicism definitely affects dreams, and among the Catholics there is a theology surrounding the virgin Mary based entirely upon dreams and visions, including a state of perpetual virginity and the doctrine of the "assumption of the virgin Mary".

These are considered apostate and even Satanic by those who recognize only scripture (Sola scriptura) as a basis for faith (Satan transforms himself into an angel of light). I'd go so far as to say that these doctrines are more offensive to the reformation than the practice of sacramental distribution of grace.

Some Catholics even believe that salvation is granted by prayer to the Virgin Mary as an intercessor with her Son and so have been trying to elevate her "status" in the church to "coredemptrix" with Jesus Christ. This is incredibly offensive to Bible based faith in forcing men to acknowledge Mary's equality to God in opposition to the body of scripture.

Do you understand the conflict?

Catholics resolve the conflict by identifying the "Holy mother" as the church itself and keep the doctrine that there is no salvation outside the church for this reason.

 

[bbyrd009]

Truth is not relative, but absolute.

well, or so you say
care to state one?

prior to the return of Christ (but thinking about it just gives me a headache.)

lol, wait til you try to Quote it!

 

[Raccoon1010]

Do you understand the conflict?

The vision I had was holy and presented with the Fruits of the Holy Spirit (Galatians 5:22-23). If anyone suggests it was demonic, they would be tempting me to deny the Holy Spirit, which is sin. I just ignore them.

 

[Bob Estey]

Sometimes it's less about winning than having the last word. I've had a few people post something nasty directed at me on Twitter only to block me immediately after. That's one way to have the last word.;)

Yes, I like to respond when I've been insulted. I hate it when they ignore me.

 

[michaelvpardo]

well, or so you say
care to state one?

lol, wait til you try to Quote it!

Sure , there is One God and creator of the universe.

Deuteronomy 4:35
To you it was shown, that you might know that the Lord Himself is God; there is none other besides Him.

 

[michaelvpardo]

The vision I had was holy and presented with the Fruits of the Holy Spirit (Galatians 5:22-23). If anyone suggests it was demonic, they would be tempting me to deny the Holy Spirit, which is sin. I just ignore them.

No one can make you believe anything except God. I only asked if you understood the conflict (why Christians would reject your dream as "holy".)

 

[michaelvpardo]

lol, wait til you try to Quote it!

20 And Adam called his wife’s name Eve, because she was the mother of all living. Genesis 3:20

 

[bbyrd009]

Sure , there is One God and creator of the universe.

Deuteronomy 4:35
To you it was shown, that you might know that the Lord Himself is God; there is none other besides Him.

“the Lord said to my lord…”

 

[michaelvpardo]

“the Lord said to my lord…”

"Yahavah said to my Adonai." The English isn't specific, but your quote is irrelevant given that Christians worship One God manifest in three persons, not three persons manifest in One God.

Man reflects the image of God, through body, mind, and spirit, as God is manifest in Christ, the Holy Spirit, and the Father.
Is your identity found in your vocation, your purpose, or your faith?
Or is our identity the sum and total of what we do, how we think, and what we believe?

 

[bbyrd009]

The English isn't specific

then wadr why did you use it

One God manifest in three persons, not three persons manifest in One God

good luck Quoting that one, too, michael :)
“persons” in Yah, yuck! Catholic heresy, imo
There is only One Immortal, Who lives alone in unapproachable light
.

Sure , there is One God and creator of the universe

also, wadr this is hardly an Absolute Truth, as you have no “objective evidence” for it; it is a common belief, at best (not saying that i disagree)

 

[michaelvpardo]

good luck Quoting that one, too, michael :)
“persons” in Yah, yuck! Catholic heresy, imo
There is only One Immortal, Who lives alone in unapproachable light

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the Gentiles, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory. 1Timothy3:16
You might actually want to read the Bible at least 3 or 4 times before making a lot of foolish assertions. There's nothing I say in my posts regarding sound doctrine, that isn't supported by scripture, nothing at all.

 

[bbyrd009]

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the Gentiles, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory. 1Timothy3:16
You might actually want to read the Bible at least 3 or 4 times before making a lot of foolish assertions. There's nothing I say in my posts regarding sound doctrine, that isn't supported by scripture, nothing at all.

yes, Jesus was a person, sure
im guessing it arises from the desire to hold a personal conversation with Yah in some “afterlife” maybe?
anyway, “persons in Elohim” sure, “you are Elohim,” but persons in YHWH i dont think so

 

[OzSpen]

But if you ignore the insult and show the other person the error in their logic, I think you will quiet them down.

Bob,

I sometimes do this, pointing out their use of logical fallacies - using the name of the fallacy (if I know it). Most I meet have little knowledge of logic or illogical tactics. I find a better way to explain the insult is to show how the person has not dealt with the issue at hand but has switched to another way of avoiding the content of the discussion.

Oz

 

[Bob Estey]

Bob,

I sometimes do this, pointing out their use of logical fallacies - using the name of the fallacy (if I know it). Most I meet have little knowledge of logic or illogical tactics. I find a better way to explain the insult is to show how the person has not dealt with the issue at hand but has switched to another way of avoiding the content of the discussion.

Oz

Yes, I figure once they've insulted us, they've lost the argument.

 

[OzSpen]

Yes, I figure once they've insulted us, they've lost the argument.

Bob,

That's because there has been no, or little, discussion of the issues.

I've thought about this over lunch. Would you agree that our Western democracies are mostly built on the majority vote, which is erroneous reasoning?

This can be modified in the Party Room, where the issues are fleshed out with back and forth reasoning.

Oz

 

[Bob Estey]

Bob,

That's because there has been no, or little, discussion of the issues.

I've thought about this over lunch. Would you agree that our Western democracies are mostly built on the majority vote, which is erroneous reasoning?

This can be modified in the Party Room, where the issues are fleshed out with back and forth reasoning.

Oz

I'm no expert on politics. Democracies must be respectful of those in the minority.

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

The question that hasn't been asked though, is who gets to decide what is an insult? Jesus called the religious leaders "vipers", "white-washed tombs", and "fools", and the other apostles called people some stuff that would be categorized as derogatory. I imagine a lot of people got offended by the apostles calling them for what they were, especially the deceivers who were heavily involved with the counterfeit Christian movement. Paul didn't exactly mince words about those people in his letters.

Not unlike Christ, Stephen was murdered by the Jews simply for telling the truth about the Israelites' long history of rejecting God by practicing false religion. Sexually immoral people today consider it "hate speech" when they're told that God frowns on fornication, adultery, homosexuality, or abortion. The same goes for people who want to celebrate the Satan-inspired festivals that are extremely popular with this world.

If someone is simply calling a spade for what it is within biblical guidelines and according to the truth, it's less a matter of someone resorting to insults and more a matter of someone being sensitive about having to hear that their beliefs and practices are wrong.