The Biblical Basis for Catholic Distinctives

[amigo de christo]

Oh, good grief - the confusion and ignorance never ceases around here . . .

No , it sure dont . But there is a good and wholesome way to find out just who is in confusion and ignorance .
Let us open the bible for ourselves and read it for ourselves and watch how fast things can really get cleared up .
Just a friendly reminder is all . Yes indeed there sure is much confusion and much ignorance and on that we can agree .

 

[Illuminator]

Let us open the bible for ourselves and read it for ourselves

Which bible would that be, Amigo?
Protestant sources of their charges that the Catholic Church changed the Ten Commandments…

1. KJV…..first appeared on the scene in 1611, a product of Protestantism.
2. NIV…..first appeared on the scene in 1978.
3. NKJV…first appeared on the scene in 1982.
4. RSV…..first appeared on the scene in 1946

Catholic sources of our defense to the baseless charges of Catholics changing the Ten Commandments…

1. Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) appeared on the scene in 1992.
   It lists the Ten Commandments as they were before Christ.
2. NJB…first appeared on the scene in 1985. The NJB supports the CCC.
3. NAB…first appeared on the scene in 1970. The NAB supports the CCC.
4. JB……first appeared on the scene in 1966. The JB supports the CCC.
5. RSV-CE…first appeared on the scene in 1965. The RSV-CE supports the CCC.
6. NCE…first appeared on the scene in 1954. The NCE supports the CCC.
7. CE…first appeared on the scene in 1948. The CE (Confraternity Edition) supports the CCC.
8. Challoner-Rheims…first appeared on the scene in 1749. The Challoner-Rheims supports the CCC.
9. Douay-Rheims…first appeared on the scene in 1592-1609. The Douay-Rheims supports the CCC.
   Note that the date for this Bible predates any Protestant Bible by at least 2 years.
10. The Latin Vulgate…first appeared on the scene in 404. The Latin Vulgate supports the CCC.
    Note that the date for this Bible predates any Protestant Bible by over 1200 years.
11. The Septuagint…first appeared on the scene about 148 B.C. This is the Bible that was used by the Apostles.
    The Septuagint supports the CCC. Note that the date for this Bible predates any Protestant Bible by over 1700 years.

Now it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to prove that the Ten Commandments could not possibly have been changed by the Catholic Church which did not even exist for almost 200 years after the Septuagint was written. Add to that the fact that ALL Catholic Bibles, ALL the way back to 148 B.C. are in agreement, and yet Protestant Bibles which did not even appear on the scene until 1611, list the commandments in the ‘different’ order.

Please, if you are going to make charges against the Catholic Church, then do it with real evidence (if you can find any) and not by personal opinions.

We are all looking for the truth and not trumped up charges.

WHO REALLY CHANGED THE TEN COMMANDMENTS?

 

[Illuminator]

When Scripture is misapplied and misrepresented, it simply produces false doctrines. And the CCC is full of false teachings. Thus we find the fiction of Purgatory in the CCC:

1031 The Church gives the name Purgatory to this final purification of the elect, which is entirely different from the punishment of the damned.604 The Church formulated her doctrine of faith on Purgatory especially at the Councils of Florence and Trent. the tradition of the Church, by reference to certain texts of Scripture, speaks of a cleansing fire:605

Except that the texts of Scripture which they use DO NOT refer to Purgatory at all! That word is not found in the Bible even once.

Protestants falsely argue that Purgatory is a later corruption, but it was present early on and merely developed. Original Sin, however, was equally if not more so, subject to development. One cannot have it both ways. If Purgatory is unacceptable on grounds of its having undergone development, then Original Sin must be rejected with it. Contrariwise, if Original Sin is accepted notwithstanding its own development, then so must Purgatory be accepted.

Thus Protestantism is inconsistent in its selective espousal of Christian beliefs. The so-called “Catholic distinctives” were merely cast off at the time of the Protestant Revolt in the 16th century – basically due to prejudice and ignorance. Protestantism ever since has had to either distort, ignore, or be embarrassed by the facts of early Christian history which, again and again, are found to be much more in conjunction with Catholicism. Protestant anti-Catholic apologists are notorious for searching for quotes by Church Fathers which appear to support their presuppositions, while bypassing those (often by the same Father) which clearly suggest the Catholic outlook. I did this myself in the year before I was convinced of the truth of Catholicism.
READ MORE HERE

 

[Cassandra]

If this were a Commandment against the creation of images and statues, then God would have violated His own law by commanding Moses just a few chapters later to create 2 golden images of Cherubim to place atop the Ark (Exod. 25:18-22). This hypocrisy would have also extended to commanding Moses later on to create a bronze serpent and place it on a pole so that those who looked upon it would be healed (Num. 21:8-9).

God asked that those images be made.. None of them were to be bowed down tofoe veneration. it says here "You shall not bow down yourself to them or worship them." God did not tell the church to fill itself with icons.No one was allowed inside of the Holy or the Most holy Place in the Temple--only the priests.

We also read other examples of God being pleased with the creation of statues (I Kings 6:23-28, 9:3). When we read those verses in context, we see that God’s prohibition is against making idols to worship and not the creation of images. This is ALL covered in the Catholic rendering of the first Commandment about having “other gods”.

Well, thou shalt have no other gods before me is in both, so I don't know how it covers the graven image one.
We also see examples of God sending Judah into captivity because of idol worship.

What is the purpose of martyrs and saints images in your churches?

 

[Berserk]

Cassandra: "God asked that those images be made.. None of them were to be bowed down tofoe veneration. it says here "You shall not bow down yourself to them or worship them." God did not tell the church to fill itself with icons.No one was allowed inside of the Holy or the Most holy Place in the Temple--only the priests."

How ironic that you overlook Jesus' use of Moses' graven image of the serpent (Numbers 21:9) as a type of the healing power of His coming crucifixion (See John 3:14-15). Snake-bitten Jews were healed by gazing on the serpent!


Cassandra: "What is the purpose of martyrs and saints images in your churches?"

Do you disrespect Catholic celebration of pre-Reformation martyrs just because they gave their lives for the Gospel prior to the Protestant Reformation? A former priest friend and I were giggling over the evangelical misperception that Catholics pray to statues. Evangelicals tend to be tone-deaf to the inspiration of memorial sculptures and statues.

 

[BreadOfLife]

No , it sure dont . But there is a good and wholesome way to find out just who is in confusion and ignorance .
Let us open the bible for ourselves and read it for ourselves and watch how fast things can really get cleared up .
Just a friendly reminder is all . Yes indeed there sure is much confusion and much ignorance and on that we can agree .

Really?

How fast did things get "cleaned up" after the Protestant Revolt in the 16th century when people decided to inject their personal interpretations into every vers of Scripture?

Tell me - which one of the tens of thousands of disjointed and perpetually-splintering Protestant sects that ALL teach different doctrines has the correct interpretations and doctrines?

Some Protestant denominations believe in baptismal regeneration, while others do not.
Some believe in soul-sleep, while others do not.
Some believe in the total depravity of man, while others do not.
Some believe in the Holy Trinity, while others do not.
Some believe in doctrine of “once saved, always saved”, while others do not.
Some believe in a pre-tribulation “Rapture”, while others do not.
Some believe that only those who were predestined will make it to heaven, while others do not.
Some believe that some were predestined for hell, while others do not.
Some believe in a woman’s right to choose abortion, while others do not.
Some believe that practicing homosexuality is a sin, while others do not.
Most believe in contraception, while others do not – and the list goes on . . .

They yet ALL claim to have been “led” to this confusion by the Holy Spirit - and YOU think that God smiles on this perpetual division?
Think again.

 

[BreadOfLife]

God asked that those images be made.. None of them were to be bowed down tofoe veneration. it says here "You shall not bow down yourself to them or worship them." God did not tell the church to fill itself with icons.No one was allowed inside of the Holy or the Most holy Place in the Temple--only the priests.

And just like the Jews before us - Cathollics don't bow down to and worship statues or paintings,
That s simply a long-held anti-Catholic lie that you've been weend on.

Worshipping images is strictly forbidden by the 2nd Commandment.

Well, thou shalt have no other gods before me is in both, so I don't know how it covers the graven image one.
We also see examples of God sending Judah into captivity because of idol worship.
What is the purpose of martyrs and saints images in your churches?

Ummmm - that's because idol worship is a SIN and is forbidden by the Commandments.
That's why Catholic don't do this.

Praying before a REMINDER such as a Bible, statues, painting, picture in you wallet, etc is NOT the worship of those things as "gods".
THAT is what is forbiddeb by the Commandment. If the posture of bowing and praying was forbidden - EVERY Jew who visits the Wailing Wall or bowed before the Ark is guilty of idolatry.

Sooooo - which part of that is confusing you?

 

[BreadOfLife]

What is the purpose of martyrs and saints images in your churches?

Because they are great examples of true faith.
Faith is ONE thing - but giving up your life in the service of Christ is on another level.

As the Body of Christ - the martyrs and saints are family members - even in a more radical way than your husband, children or parents are. Do YOU have pictures of family members in your wallet or mantle at home or on your nightstand?
Would you consider that "worship" - or LOVE?

 

[Illuminator]

God asked that those images be made.. None of them were to be bowed down tofoe veneration. it says here "You shall not bow down yourself to them or worship them." God did not tell the church to fill itself with icons. No one was allowed inside of the Holy or the Most holy Place in the Temple--only the priests.

Doesn't the Bible describe Joseph as "righteous"??? (Matthew 1:19) Dontcha think Joseph knew better than to violate a Living Temple?

Well, thou shalt have no other gods before me is in both, so I don't know how it covers the graven image one.
We also see examples of God sending Judah into captivity because of idol worship.

What is the purpose of martyrs and saints images in your churches?

They are merely devotional aids.
What verse in the Bible forbids Scripture in art form?
What is the purpose of the Reformation Wall?
Reformation Wall - Wikipedia

Why are there statues of John Calvin who banned all statues?

Why does Calvin College have an arts department?

 

[amigo de christo]

Really?

How fast did things get "cleaned up" after the Protestant Revolt in the 16th century when people decided to inject their personal interpretations into every vers of Scripture?

Tell me - which one of the tens of thousands of disjointed and perpetually-splintering Protestant sects that ALL teach different doctrines has the correct interpretations and doctrines?

Some Protestant denominations believe in baptismal regeneration, while others do not.
Some believe in soul-sleep, while others do not.
Some believe in the total depravity of man, while others do not.
Some believe in the Holy Trinity, while others do not.
Some believe in doctrine of “once saved, always saved”, while others do not.
Some believe in a pre-tribulation “Rapture”, while others do not.
Some believe that only those who were predestined will make it to heaven, while others do not.
Some believe that some were predestined for hell, while others do not.
Some believe in a woman’s right to choose abortion, while others do not.
Some believe that practicing homosexuality is a sin, while others do not.
Most believe in contraception, while others do not – and the list goes on . . .

They yet ALL claim to have been “led” to this confusion by the Holy Spirit - and YOU think that God smiles on this perpetual division?
Think again.

Cause they were still under the influence of some false things . And ps , many within the protestant realm
were in error themselves .
Its why i say learn the bible for YOUR self . Just like Rome has taught many an error and some truth
so too do many within the protestant realm . Worse it all keeps getting too .
Forgive me early modern english , but return thou unto thine bible and unlearn much of what Rome has taught .
And just to let you know i aint just picking on you , I say the same thing to most all of protestantism , for many within that realm
teach just as deadly and dangerous doctrines as the R CC itself . Return to bible reading folks . or stay in confusion .

 

[Taken]

....- what can one expect from a hater of God's Word?

Your False Accusation makes consideration of your position irrelevant.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Your False Accusation makes consideration of your position irrelevant.

And yet YOUR posts are rife with false accusations.
hypocrisy noted.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Cause they were still under the influence of some false things . And ps , many within the protestant realm
were in error themselves .
Its why i say learn the bible for YOUR self . Just like Rome has taught many an error and some truth
so too do many within the protestant realm . Worse it all keeps getting too .
Forgive me early modern english , but return thou unto thine bible and unlearn much of what Rome has taught .
And just to let you know i aint just picking on you , I say the same thing to most all of protestantism , for many within that realm
teach just as deadly and dangerous doctrines as the R CC itself . Return to bible reading folks . or stay in confusion .

And once agaoin - whe YOU read the Bible for YOURSELF and your neighbor reads the Bible for HIMSELF and you both come to opposite interpretations - WHO is right? Apparently, you don't understand that this is exactly what has happened under Protestantism.

This is the WHY there are so many perpetually-splontering Protestant sects - because people like YOU actually believe that you are supposed to interpret for yourself and invent your own doctrines.

Remember the words of Jesus, my lost friend - and the Authority that He gave to His Church - and NOT every individual . . .

Matt 16:18-19
And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it.
I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. WHATEVER YOU BIND on earth shall be bound in heaven; and WHATEVER YOU LOOSE on earth shall be loosed in heaven."

John 16:12-15
“I have much more to tell you, but you cannot bear it now.
But when he comes, the Spirit of truth, he will guide you to ALL truth. He will not speak on his own, but he will speak what he hears, and will declare to YOU the things that are coming.
He will glorify me, because he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU.
Everything that the Father has is MINE; for this reason I told you that he will TAKE from what is MINE and declare it to YOU.

Luke 10:16
Whoever listens to YOU listens to ME. Whoever rejects YOU rejects ME. And whoever rejects ME rejects the ONE who sent ME."

 

[Taken]

And yet YOUR posts are rife with false accusations.
hypocrisy noted.

Your lying accusatory words are elementary and irrelevant regarding me.

 

[Marvelloustime]

No , it sure dont . But there is a good and wholesome way to find out just who is in confusion and ignorance .
Let us open the bible for ourselves and read it for ourselves and watch how fast things can really get cleared up .
Just a friendly reminder is all . Yes indeed there sure is much confusion and much ignorance and on that we can agree .

Bible reads are indeed the best way to know our Lord and to stay in the truth.

 

[Marymog]

Thanks for sharing my posts can reverse your frown.

I never said that your posts reverse my frown

I said they make me laugh kiddo!!

 

[Marymog]

Yes indeed there sure is much confusion and much ignorance.....

And it all started in 1517AD!

So amigo de christo: In your opinion, how do we end this confusion and ignorance in Christianity?

 

[Marymog]

What is the purpose of martyrs and saints images in your churches?

Hey Cassandra,

Do you have any pictures of family or friends, living or deceased in your house?

Mary

 

[amigo de christo]

And it all started in 1517AD!

So amigo de christo: In your opinion, how do we end this confusion and ignorance in Christianity?

By simple trust and faith in CHRIST and get in those bibles and learn HIM for yourself .
My advice to all , whether in the protestant realm or catholic realm . Come ye out from amongst them
and be YE holy and try seeking GOD for yourself . Since when did seeking GOD with the whole heart
and getting into the bible for yourself become such a sin to this generation .
As for me , I AM STAYING GLUED in the bible and after CHRIST . And all men shall be tested .
SEEK YE GOD with ALL the heart and stop trusting in men , but trust rather in GOD and get in the bible .
HIS INSPIRED WORD is in that book . And test all against that book and the lovely truth in it .
GOD will not abandon those who truly seek HIM . HE has given the SPIRIT unto all who do beleive in HIM
YE shall find HIM , when ye stop trusting in men and start seeking HIM with ALL the heart .
Have you ever wondered why there was a reformation . Cause a harlot was not allowing the children
to read the scrips for themselves . But rather , for power and control she taught them through her own scribes
and her own twisted version . SO as SHE could maintain the power and control over the masses .
GUESS what , ITS very deep within the protestant realm as well . FOR they also say
ALAS ye cannot learn the scrips On your own , YE NEED our scholars and teachers to help you . YET THEY teach
twisted docrine too , to maintain power and control . MY advice , FLEE those who teach such lies
and learn JESUS for yourselves . GOD wont abandon his children and He has given the SPIRIT unto all who are HIS .
Simply seek HIM OUT and do so quickly while there is still time to do so . GET in that bible and learn and grow wise in Christ . HURRY
dont LOOK back .

 

[BreadOfLife]

My advice to all , whether in the protestant realm or catholic realm . Come ye out from amongst them
and be YE holy and try seeking GOD for yourself . Since when did seeking GOD with the whole heart
and getting into the bible for yourself become such a sin to this generation .
As for me , I AM STAYING GLUED in the bible and after CHRIST . And all men shall be tested .
SEEK YE GOD with ALL the heart and stop trusting in men , but trust rather in GOD and get in the bible .
HIS INSPIRED WORD is in that book . And test all against that book and the lovely truth in it .
GOD will not abandon those who truly seek HIM . HE has given the SPIRIT unto all who do beleive in HIM
YE shall find HIM , when ye stop trusting in men and start seeking HIM with ALL the heart .
Have you ever wondered why there was a reformation . Cause a harlot was not allowing the children
to read the scrips for themselves . But rather , for power and control she taught them through her own scribes
and her own twisted version . SO as SHE could maintain the power and control over the masses .
GUESS what , ITS very deep within the protestant realm as well . FOR they also say
ALAS ye cannot learn the scrips On your own , YE NEED our scholars and teachers to help you . YET THEY teach
twisted docrine too , to maintain power and control . MY advice , FLEE those who teach such lies
and learn JESUS for yourselves . GOD wont abandon his children and He has given the SPIRIT unto all who are HIS .
Simply seek HIM OUT and do so quickly while there is still time to do so . GET in that bible and learn and grow wise in Christ . HURRY
dont LOOK back .

Soooooo, ass a Protestant - will you take that advice for yourself?