Hebrews 3-4: Not About Sabbath-Keeping

[JesusFan1]

Jesus himself didn't keep the sabbath as was practiced by the religious leaders of his and

At that time Jesus went through the grainfields on the Sabbath. His disciples were hungry and began to pick some heads of grain and eat them. 2 When the Pharisees saw this, they said to him, “Look! Your disciples are doing what is unlawful on the Sabbath.” Matthew 12:1-2

9 Going on from that place, he went into their synagogue, 10 and a man with a shriveled hand was there. Looking for a reason to bring charges against Jesus, they asked him, “Is it lawful to heal on the Sabbath?” 11 He said to them, “If any of you has a sheep and it falls into a pit on the Sabbath, will you not take hold of it and lift it out? 12 How much more valuable is a person than a sheep! Therefore it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath.” Matthew 12:9-12

The other gospels also have accounts of things done by Jesus and his follower on the Sabbath.

Jesus was born under the Mosaic law, and they were indeed under the Jewish Sabbath, but when the New Covenant was ushered in, the church was never placed back under it!

 

[ReChoired]

Hebrews 4:9 - So there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God. (NASB) Notice that the Greek word "sabbatismos" here is used no where else in the Bible! W. E. Vine, Greek Dictionary points out:

Sabbath rest (4520) (sabbatismos from sabbatízo = keep the Sabbath) literally means a keeping of a sabbath or a keeping of days of rest. It is used in this passage not in the literal sense (meaning to keep a specific day, the "Sabbath" day) but to describe a period of rest for God’s people which is modeled after and is a fulfillment of the traditional Sabbath.

SABBATISMOS a Sabbath-keeping, is used in Heb. 4:9, R.V., "a Sabbath rest," A.V. marg., "a keeping of a Sabbath" (akin to sabbatizoµ, to keep the Sabbath, used, e.g., in Ex. 16:30, not in the N.T.); here the Sabbath-keeping is the perpetual Sabbath rest to be enjoyed uninterruptedly by believers in their fellowship with the Father and the Son, in contrast to the weekly Sabbath under the Law.

Because this Sabbath rest is the rest of God Himself, its full fruition is yet future, though believers now enter into it. In whatever way they enter into divine “rest,” that which they enjoy is involved in an indissoluble relation with God. (Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words)

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"Vine", a counterfeit to the true "Vine" (Jesus), is in error:

https://ia904604.us.archive.org/26/...-image/Hebrews 4 Vs 9 - Sabbatismos Image.png

Why do you take the assumption of (counterfeit) "Vine", in the place of the actual words in Hebrews 4, which comes from the true "Vine" (Jesus)?

 

[JesusFan1]

Great references. I made a note of them.

1 Corinthians 10:12 is a good dose of medicine for all who embrace OSAS and those who believe the Commandments are invalid now.

sabbath was NEVER re given to the Church in any NT Epistle!

 

[JesusFan1]

You are in error.

https://ia904600.us.archive.org/21/items/revelation-1-vs-10-the-lords-day-the-seventh-day-the-sabbath-of-the-lord/Revelation 1 Vs 10 - The Lord's Day - The Seventh Day The Sabbath Of The LORD.png

When John wrote "the Lord's day" by inspiration of the Holy Ghost, he was doing so in the midst of a parallelism drawing from the OT, as well as speaking in regards the Law and Testimony. It refers to the 7th day the sabbath of the LORD.

No ,John was in the Lords day, which was Sunday!

 

[JesusFan1]

"Vine", a counterfeit to the true "Vine" (Jesus), is in error:

https://ia904604.us.archive.org/26/items/hebrews-4-vs-9-sabbatismos-image/Hebrews 4 Vs 9 - Sabbatismos Image.png

Why do you take the assumption of (counterfeit) "Vine", in the place of the actual words in Hebrews 4, which comes from the true "Vine" (Jesus)?

The sabbath day rest is now NOT any particular day to observe, but the spiritual state now found in Christ!

 

[ReChoired]

Great references. I made a note of them.

1 Corinthians 10:12 is a good dose of medicine for all who embrace OSAS and those who believe the Commandments are invalid now.

Also add Revelation 3:10 and Revelation 17:12 "hour" of the "try(ing) [test]".

 

[ReChoired]

No ,John was in the Lords day, which was Sunday!

Based upon what Bible verse is "the Lord's day" = "Sunday" (a word not even found in scripture).

 

[Pearl]

Jesus was born under the Mosaic law, and they were indeed under the Jewish Sabbath, but when the New Covenant was ushered in, the church was never placed back under it!

Exactly.

 

[ReChoired]

The sabbath day rest is now NOT any particular day to observe, but the spiritual state now found in Christ!

The sabbath of God, from Genesis was always "spiritual".

 

[Pearl]

Based upon what Bible verse is "the Lord's day" = "Sunday" (a word not even found in scripture).

None of the weekdays as we know them are named in scripture and they are all pagan.

 

[ReChoired]

Exactly.

Help me then. I cannot find the words "Jewish Sabbath" anywhere in my Bible (KJB). To what verse or verses do you and they refer to?

 

[Pearl]

Help me then. I cannot find the words "Jewish Sabbath" anywhere in my Bible (KJB). To what verse or verses do you and they refer to?

Like you said 'Sunday' is not a word in the bible.

 

[ReChoired]

None of the weekdays as we know them are named in scripture and they are all pagan.

Non sequitur. The 7th day is called "the sabbath of the LORD thy God" however. I use scriptural designations for the days of the week, unless I need to help someone understand to which of the numbered days (of the 7) I am referring to, with details.

 

[ReChoired]

Like you said 'Sunday' is not a word in the bible.

Sunday is pagan Roman time, midnight to midnight. The Bible when referring to the "first [day] of the week", speaks of God's timing, "even unto even", sunset to sunset.

So, explain why "Jewish Sabbath" is not in scripture.

 

[Pearl]

Sunday is pagan Roman time, midnight to midnight. The Bible when referring to the "first [day] of the week", speaks of God's timing, "even unto even", sunset to sunset.

So, explain why "Jewish Sabbath" is not in scripture.

Probably because none but the Jewish people kept it so by default the sabbath was Jewish.

 

[ReChoired]

Probably because none but the Jewish people kept it so by default the sabbath was Jewish.

What about all of the Gentiles ("sons of the stranger") who kept it? Isaiah 56:1,8; John 10:16; Isaiah 56:2-7 KJB?

Was Moses a "Jew"? What about his wife "Zipporah"? What about the "mixed multitude" that came out of Egypt with the Israelites?

 

[Enoch111]

So, explain why "Jewish Sabbath" is not in scripture.

Who says that it is not in Scripture?
This passage makes it crystal clear that the 7th day Sabbath was for Israel.
EXODUS 31: THE SABBATH WAS GIVEN TO ISRAEL
12 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.
14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

Who are "the children of Israel"? They are the twelve tribes of Israel/Jacob. And did they obey this law perfectly? No.

 

[Hidden In Him]

They (most) were 7th day keepers, not sabbath keepers. The Pharisees, as such, were very meticulous about keeping the 7th day, not sabbath keeping, which Jesus had to show them the difference between the two things.

Ok, I'm struggling to make out your answers, but this right here seems to be a lot like fancy footwork to me, i.e. it reads like theological double talk. If you are going to interpret the text as referring to "7th Day keepers" one minute and "Sabbath keepers" the next, you appear to altering the meaning arbitrarily...

I'll give this more study, but at first glance I think you are playing with the text to maintain a particular doctrinal position rather than being honest with it. But until I can look at this further, if you could, which Jews were the true sabbath keepers and which were merely 7th day keepers?

God bless,
- H

 

[Hidden In Him]

Hebrews 4:9 - So there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God. (NASB) Notice that the Greek word "sabbatismos" here is used no where else in the Bible! W. E. Vine, Greek Dictionary points out:

Sabbath rest (4520) (sabbatismos from sabbatízo = keep the Sabbath) literally means a keeping of a sabbath or a keeping of days of rest. It is used in this passage not in the literal sense (meaning to keep a specific day, the "Sabbath" day) but to describe a period of rest for God’s people which is modeled after and is a fulfillment of the traditional Sabbath.

SABBATISMOS a Sabbath-keeping, is used in Heb. 4:9, R.V., "a Sabbath rest," A.V. marg., "a keeping of a Sabbath" (akin to sabbatizoµ, to keep the Sabbath, used, e.g., in Ex. 16:30, not in the N.T.); here the Sabbath-keeping is the perpetual Sabbath rest to be enjoyed uninterruptedly by believers in their fellowship with the Father and the Son, in contrast to the weekly Sabbath under the Law.

Because this Sabbath rest is the rest of God Himself, its full fruition is yet future, though believers now enter into it. In whatever way they enter into divine “rest,” that which they enjoy is involved in an indissoluble relation with God. (Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words)

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Much of this I agree with, Mailman. I'm just not sure if Vine's is clearly specifying what he takes the rest of God to be.

God bless, and good to see you again.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Unbelief leads to not keeping the commandment, even the seventh day, the sabbath of the LORD holy.

"whatsoever is not of faith is sin." (Romans 14:23 KJB)

"Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." (1 John 3:4 KJB)

Doubt in the heart, leads to transgression in thought and action, sin, or not keeping the commandment.

Doubt is the root. The transgression is the fruit. Paul deals with the root, to pull up the whole error, "plucked up by the roots" as it were. Plucking at leaves does nothing to solve the heart of the matter, just as Jesus in Matthew 5-7, etc which is dealing with the Ten Commandments at the heart (faith) level.

Ah... I'm guessing this may be my answer right here...

If so, and I hope you will forgive me here, but this position would make me chuckle a little. You see, they were not approaching obedience to the Law like this back then. You didn't have some who were circumcised "in faith" and others who were not. You were either circumcised or you were not. Same with the sabbath. People didn't die in the wilderness because they didn't keep the Sabbath "by faith." They died because they didn't keep the Sabbath period, i.e. literally.

Maybe I am misunderstanding your position still. I was just responding, if that is the argument you are trying to make here.