Should Christians Always Be Healed?

[Hidden In Him]

But to the question asked earlier if it is always God's will a Christian to be healed, yes it is.

Remember, now. You still have to come up with answers to the questions I posed earlier in order to support this position. :) Until you can, you need to be careful about what you teach people, or you could end up potentially contributing to the same sorts of problems that destroyed that church ET was talking about in a previous post.

 

[Mayflower]

I agree. He will suffer..

This brings something else up. But my pastor mentioned you have to be careful who you surround yourself with and also what you mention to people, because you want prayers of faith/the right things prayed over you.

Like here agreeing for this man to be judged. Yes he is in the wrong. But if I was in the wrong, I'd want people to have grace on me in their thoughts and actions.

I just bring this up as a question, to ask what y'all think, but can our prayers effect how a person is healed?

 

[Mayflower]

Remember, now. You still have to come up with answers to the questions I posed earlier in order to support this position. :) Until you can, you need to be careful about what you teach people, or you could end up potentially contributing to the same sorts of problems that destroyed that church ET was talking about in a previous post.

So what are the questions again? With Ananias and Sapphira I agree they were judged. That doesn't mean it was God's will though to kill His kids.

 

[Mayflower]

Judgement was never part of God's will. Adam and Eve brought that on mankind (gtg. Man I like this discussion. LOL).

 

[DuckieLady]

This subject came up in a recent conversation on another thread, and I realized I don't think it's ever been discussed here on this forum before.

That said, the above is a Faith teaching, with which I am familiar. Be advised: I want all contributions to this thread to be respectful of the other people's positions. If not, you may be reported by yours truly. But there is both truth and falsehood in Faith teaching. Any post given should have a scriptural basis, so please post in full the verses you are using to establish your argument.

God bless,
Hidden In Him

2 Corinthians 12:8-10

I think it is dangerous to assume God will heal everyone and point strictly to faith matters.

There was a woman who had a grandson who was sick, they prayed over him and she knew she had faith, but he passed away. And she was totally distraught because she had the faith. A huge wound to the faith in God.

So will we judge and tweak our own faith or trust God's grace? Idk. I don't know how it works. I'm being honest.

But if we all could, I don't think James would have wasted his time saying to take the sick to the elders of the church.

I'm not a believer that God heals 100% of the time and I think it is dangerous to blame the faith of heartbroken parents (nobody would pray harder) or anyone who lost a family member.

I remember Justin Peters said (I'm paraphrasing by memory) if he was stuck in a wheelchair for the rest of his life, he was okay with it, because it brought him a lot of opportunities for his ministry and he had all of eternity without it.

 

[Hidden In Him]

This brings something else up. But my pastor mentioned you have to be careful who you surround yourself with and also what you mention to people, because you want prayers of faith/the right things prayed over you.

This principle is correct, and it applies especially to unbelievers you have to associate with. A ton of negativity all the time and negative confessions over one's life is a little hard to bear, because you know they are speaking doom over themselves and the demons can hear it.

Like here agreeing for this man to be judged. Yes he is in the wrong. But if I was in the wrong, I'd want people to have grace on me in their thoughts and actions.

I'm not agreeing for him to be judged. I hope he repents. What I'm saying is that he is heading for judgment regardless if he continues on the course he is on, whether I pray for him or not. I cannot override his judgment, and in fact I would be sinning against him by praying for God not to, in hopes of potentially returning him from the error of his ways. God HAS to do this, or His ministers will corrupt the people of God through false teaching, whether by example or through teaching or both.

Such judgments happened back during the great healing revival of the 1950s because they went off the deep end back then as well. Here is an excerpt from a book I read that discussed it:

- What is the painful lesson to be learned from the so-called "Healing Revival" that occurred fifty years ago? From 1947-1958 there was a great outpouring of healing power, unprecedented in modern times. Until that time, healing anointings were rare. It was only a handful of vessels - men and women like Maria Woodworth-Etter, John G. Lake, Stephen Jefferys, Smith Wigglesworth, Charles Price and Aimee Semple Macpherson - who were used in mighty healing miracles.
- But in 1947 things changed... There were hundreds of "healing evangelists" preaching throughout the United States and overseas, many of them with huge tents and even television ministries. Some outstanding miracles were taking place. But the vessels were not properly prepared, and many of them fell into sin and died before their time.
- One of the most prominent preachers of that era died of polio before He reached the age of forty. Another leader suffered fatal injuries in a head-on collision with a drunk driver. (He had already fallen into serious doctrinal error.) Another died in a motel room of cirrhosis of the liver - a chronic alcoholic while still in active ministry. Some became adulterers; others became corrupt and greedy. Although some were humble and pure at the beginning of their work, in less than fifteen years they became proud charlatans. The list goes on...
- Only a few of its ministers came out whole. The others simply couldn't handle the power; the anointing of God was simply more than they could bear. It takes holy servants to be channels of the Spirit. He cannot be separated from His gifts. They are a manifestation of Him. And He is totally Holy. An outpouring in today's church could be fatal. (Whatever Happened To The Power Of God, P.11-12)

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Judgement was never part of God's will. Adam and Eve brought that on mankind (gtg. Man I like this discussion. LOL).

the flood?

Just saying

 

[Hidden In Him]

So what are the questions again?

I'll go find the post(s). Gimme a sec. :)

 

[Hidden In Him]

So what are the questions again?

Post #159, under "The question then is this." It's in reference specifically to 1 Corinthians 11, but there might be questions on the other passages as well. We just hadn't covered it yet.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Judgement was never part of God's will. Adam and Eve brought that on mankind (gtg. Man I like this discussion. LOL).

Ah! Now in the beginning I believe this was correct. But the question here becomes the same: Once they had sinned, did it then become His will that judgment come upon them? You see, judgment actually DID come upon them, which means it had to have. And we have not even recovered from it yet. We are still dying, the thorns and thistles still grow, and women still have pain in childbirth.

What I'm saying is this: Judgment becomes the will of God once circumstances change, and we sin and must be corrected. Judgment becomes His will so that we not be condemned with the world by eventually giving ourselves over to sin completely and abandoning God altogether.

 

[amigo de christo]

Judgement was never part of God's will. Adam and Eve brought that on mankind (gtg. Man I like this discussion. LOL).

God is a God of jugement . Let us not say otherwise .
GOD is love . let us not say otherwise . THUS HE has given us a way out of His righteous judgement against the evil and ungodly .
HIS NAME IS JESUS CHRIST . BUT OH YES GOD IS a GOD of JUDGMENT .
HE cannot DENY HIS RIGHTEOUS JUDGMENT against EVIL . BUT HAS MADE A WAY OUT of said judgment , HIS NAME IS JESUS .
Did you know that it is even the righteous judgment of GOD to have us suffer for the KINGDOM .
Just as it is His righteous judgment to destroy all evil . WE better be careful with our words . Let us learn our bibles .
The more we learn the bible , the more our own mind gets cleared up on the things that pertain to GOD .

 

[Hidden In Him]

2 Corinthians 12:8-10

I think it is dangerous to assume God will heal everyone and point strictly to faith matters.

Paul's thorn in the flesh would be a separate discussion, Fluffy, but I agree with most of the rest of your post.

The problem here, as I was referring to in other posts, is that Faith teaching sometimes moves in absolutes too much, such as that people simply have to believe, PERIOD, based on what they will call "the principles of faith." This takes discerning the will of God for each individual completely out of the equation, which is a much more difficult thing to do, and often requires extensive prayer and spiritual gifts in operation such as discernment to know the source of the problem to begin with. There could be any number of reasons why a person is sick or dying, and sometimes one of them might be because they are suffering judgment for sin and will need to repent of it first, as was taking place during New Testament times and as is suggested in several NT passages such as James 5:14-16.

 

[Hidden In Him]

gtg. Man I like this discussion. LOL

Me too, LoL. When it dawned on me to start a thread on this I suddenly realized, "Man, I don't think this has been debated at Christianity Board before..."

It likely has, of course, just not during the time I've been around I don't think. But maybe the reason is because I used to see debates on this subject elsewhere, and they could get REALLY nasty. Faith people generally react badly to people not seeing what they see.

I know, I used to do so myself, Lol.

 

[ScottA]

Are we not first dead? And if dead, what is sickness but an episode coming or going? Is it a reminder of our condition, or a reminder of our being saved from it? God knows.

The Spirit is good also for the physical body, but the body of flesh dies.

Pray always, and thank God for the healing which is eternal. If we have given our life to Him, whether we live or die in the body, it is good. Hallelujah!

 

[DuckieLady]

There could be any number of reasons why a person is sick or dying,

 

[Hidden In Him]

Are we not first dead? And if dead, what is sickness but an episode coming or going? Is it a reminder of our condition, or a reminder of our being saved from it? God knows.

Well, yes. :)

Hi Scott.

The point I've been driving at in much of this thread, however, is that in order to effect healing, we need to know. We need to know if God wants us healed or not so as to effect it, or if we need to repent of something because we have been doing something wrong that has brought judgment upon us.

Certainly God knows. Our need is to find out from Him what He does.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Well thank you SO much, LoL!

Ahahahaha!! Thanks for the laugh. I think with that I'll go and start may day, LoL.

TTYL there, creepy (LOL).

 

[Hidden In Him]

When you're a servant of Christ, you have to think about finishing your calling. LoL!!!

Ah me, Thanks again for the post. Very "thought-provoking," Lol.

 

[ScottA]

Well, yes. :)

Hi Scott.

The point I've been driving at in much of this thread, however, is that in order to effect healing, we need to know. We need to know if God wants us healed or not so as to effect it, or if we need to repent of something because we have been doing something wrong that has brought judgment upon us.

Certainly God knows. Our need is to find out from Him what He does.

Okay.

But to expand upon that idea... Are you suggesting that every time we are under the weather we should pray and ask God what it is for? Every sniffle? Or just when we have the idea that it may be something more?

The reason I ask, is that I always appeal to God for healing when significantly sick, but otherwise consider most sickness like most consider growing old, as a normal condition of one dying over many years.

 

[DuckieLady]

Paul's thorn in the flesh would be a separate discussion, Fluffy, but I agree with most of the rest of your post.

I dont think it is because it's literally, "hey, take this thing from me"

"No"

"Okay I asked three times and I'm done"

And its just maybe like suffering is actually a normal occurring thing. This is a life of suffering. Everyone's life will be bad at some point.

It is a broken world and it sucks. We are not in Heaven yet. Why is the world sucky? I'll tell you.

(I'm proud of that I captioned it and uploaded it and everything)


Why did they waste time chasing people around with cloth Paul touched if they could have just done it themselves every single time? (Acts 19:12 for reference)

The other way is much more miracle.