Once Saved Always Saved

[MatthewG]

Maybe, maybe not. The important thing is that we focus on believing to the very end.

That is true!

 

[Taken]

Well, Taken, I don't know where you hang around....:)

Christians in my circle of friends are not like what you just posted.
Makes me wonder where you go to church as far as "denomination" is concerned.

People at large...come in all flavors.
Christians specific... come in all flavors.
The Bible is FULL of Examples. I READ.
The World is FULL of Examples. I LISTEN.

A Church "denomination" is mans division, and mans "indicator".
* The Members or Attendees of a Church "denomination" are "indications"...
* That "Members" are Committed TO Christ.
**That "Members" are Committed TO THAT denominations "Doctrine".
* That "Attendees" are Learning ABOUT Christ.

I am a Committed Member of the Church Christ Jesus Established and Committed to Him and His Doctrine.
* I encounter People of every flavor.
Some Learning About Christ.
Some Rejecting Christ.
Some Rejecting God.
Some Committed to "their man-made Church & Doctrine".
Some Committed to Christ Jesus' Established Church and His Doctrine.

 

[Taken]

Maybe, maybe not. The important thing is that we focus on believing to the very end.

I DO NOT FOCUS on Believing to the very end.

WHY?
Because THAT WARNING, DOES NOT APPLY TO me.

WHY?
"CONVERSION"!

WHO?
TO Whom is the WARNING given, TO BELIEVE, to the very END?

WARNING GIVEN TO;
1) those 'who" Believe IN GOD, but NOT Jesus IS THE CHRIST.
Particularly...JEWS, who REMAIN UNDER, KEEPING THEIR LAW....
(WARNING TO "keep" Obedient TO THEIR LAW)
2) those 'who" Believe IN God, Believe IN Jesus IS THE CHRIST...
But HAVE NOT YET MADE, a "Commitment", and BECOME "Converted."
( WARNING TO "keep" Believing.)

END of What?
END, of the Individuals Natural Physical LIFE.

The END...
of an individuals Natural Physical LIFE,
IS the END, of the individuals TIMELINE, TO MAKE "a COMMITMENT", To God, To Chirst.

* The WARNING...IS GIVEN...EXPRESSLY TO:
Jews...WHO can be Influenced BY Wickedness OF the World, to STOP adhering to "THEIR" Law.
* We already KNOW...the LAW of the JEWS, was NOT destroyed...(BY their OWN POWER, IF they continue being Obedient TO their LAW (to their END), THEY Shall be CONVERTED and Saved.

* The WARNING...IS GIVEN...EXPRESSLY TO:
Gentiles...WHO can be Influenced BY Wickedness OF the World, to STOP "hearing, listening, following, believing."
We already KNOW...(BY their OWN POWER,
IF they continue "hearing, listening, following, believing" (to their END), THEY Shall be CONVERTED and Saved.

* The WARNING...IS MOOT...NOT APPLICABLE, TO:
Any man WHO "IS" Converted "IN CHRIST JESUS"...
EXPRESSLY... BECAUSE;
A man "CONVERTED IN CHRIST"...
IS KEPT BY THE POWER OF GOD .

A Converted man ....
* IS SEALED with Gods SEAL, BY Gods POWER.
No one CAN UNDO....
* Gods SEAL.

ONCE; SAVED, Always SAVED.
ONCE; a man IS SEAL, he IS SEALED for ever

The WARNING, IS TO MEN;
WHO ARE NOT SEALED By the Power of God.

The WARNING, IS TO MEN;
WHO are STILL relying on their OWN Power, to obey the Law...to keep believing.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Grailhunter]

Grailhunter ; if it is possible for me to lay out my belief at the end (Revelation 22)

The only message that can be seen about this in scripture is all people receive resurrection of life (belief), or resurrection of condemnation (unbelief) -

God is going to raise up all people at the end of their life. There will people who will die with a hard heart of unbelief - ~ Though they are going to be resurrected with a spiritual corrupted body ~ Which may not be well equipped to dwell in the light.

These people are raised up resurrection of condemnation ~ Are placed outside the Kingdom of God.

Those who are resurrected of life ~ Are given a spiritual body that is equipped to dwell inside the Kingdom of God where the Father, and the Son are.

Now though do not believe this is a wrong way of seeing Revelation 22; some if not many may disagree ~ So do not believe me but believe God, and in the Lord Jesus Christ.

~ Some believe in something very different than (my own personal scripture supported belief)

Adequate interpret, given the perimeters set.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

The WARNING, IS TO MEN;
WHO ARE NOT SEALED By the Power of God.

The WARNING, IS TO MEN;
WHO are STILL relying on their OWN Power, to obey the Law...to keep believing.

The warning was given to Timothy....

fight the good fight, holding on to faith and a good conscience, which some have rejected and thereby shipwrecked their faith. 1 Timothy 1:18-19​

If it was applicable to him, then it's applicable to us.

 

[MatthewG]

Adequate interpret, given the perimeters set.

Haha, at least you were kind enough to say so, sir, praise be to God, and the Lord Yeshua Christ. :)

 

[Grailhunter]

Haha, at least you were kind enough to say so, sir, praise be to God, and the Lord Yeshua Christ. :)

Not being coy...I worded it that way because the Bible is going to focus on the Middle East...
And I agree that how you interpreted it, is accurate.
But within the perimeters set, because it is not going to discuss the fate of those that never heard the Gospel. Nor the salvation of Eskimos.
There are differing opinions on that.

 

[MatthewG]

Not being coy...I worded it that way because the Bible is going to focus on the Middle East...
And I agree that how you interpreted it, is accurate.
But within the perimeters set, because it is not going to discuss the fate of those that never heard the Gospel. Nor the salvation of Eskimos.
There are differing opinions on that.

Am believing to understand and agree as well.

 

[Triumph1300]

I am a Committed Member of the Church Christ Jesus Established and Committed to Him and His Doctrine.

Yes, that's what they all say, including the many cults.
Twisting scriptures, taking it out of context, etc.
Printing their own versions of Bibles, etc.
Nothing new.

Not saying you are, just asking which "kind of church" you attend.
Don't be offended. :-)

 

[Triumph1300]

I DO NOT FOCUS on Believing to the very end.

WHY?
Because THAT WARNING, DOES NOT APPLY TO me.

Which other scriptures don't apply to you?

 

[Taken]

Not saying you are, just asking which "kind of church" you attend.
Don't be offended. :)

* Not offended, Not ashamed.
* I am not a member of a man-established denomination or an attendee of a man-made church or follow man-made religious doctrines.
* I am a member of Christ Jesus' Church,
(Established by His Offering and my freewill Choice.)
Jesus is my Teacher.
Christ Jesus is my Minister, my Priest.
(Because He IS The True Holy High Priest of God and
Because He IS The One Time Offering of Salvation, Redemption and Forgiveness of my Sin Against God.
* I have no particular DAY, or TIME, or BUILDING required;
To Worship, Praise, Pray, Converse with, Remember, Christ the Lord God Almighty.
* I have no particular day, time, building required;
To converse with, pray for, converted saints, or pray for those who are ignorant of the Lord God and His Offerings and Consequences to accept or reject Him.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Which other scriptures don't apply to you?

There are nearly 30,000 Verses in Scripture.
So the short answer, without explaination, to your question IS MOST verses 'do not" Apply to me.

With a bit of explaination, verses that Do NOT Apply to me, but that Apply Specifically To;
ISRAEL (Tribes),
Jewish Laws,
kings,
particular genders,
babies,
those who have not Heard,
those who Reject God Almighty,
those who Reject Jesus IS the Christ Messiah, those who have Not Heartfully Submitted, those who are Not Sanctified,
those who have Not willfully given "their ...body", "their soul", "their spirit", to be ..."made changed" by the Power of God,

Inanutshell; All verses that DO NOT APPLY TO "those Specific" IN Faith-FULLNESS, TO:
Christ Jesus the Lord God Almighty...DO NOT APPLY TO me.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Triumph1300]

Well I suggest that all scripture applies to all.

I guess you are the exception, hang in there!

Good luck.

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
In my reading, those who turn away willingly and remain that to the end, only shows that they were not of the church of God, or were not among the sheep of Jesus. For if they were, they would have remained in the body of Christ.

Maybe, maybe not. The important thing is that we focus on believing to the very end.

Maybe or maybe not? I disagree. I would agree with scriptures on that matter which teach me that.

On a personal note, I have believed in God and Jesus Christ. I don’t really focus on that anymore. My focus now is in Him whom I believed. I am focusing on getting to know Him more, living my life with Him, and how I could do everything for His glory, day by day. Continuing to believe in Him, for me, had been a natural part of me, as I believe it is with every true Christian.

If one is still focused on continuing to believe, I would take that as an indication of a weak faith, if not, doubt. What one needs is to have a faith that is from God, which is inherently strong and with power, and without a shadow of doubting. And needless to say, that such faith only comes from God. So, such a one who still thinks and believes that he could someday reject Jesus Christ or believes that it is possible for him to do that, I suggest that he should pray about that.

Tong
R2856

 

[Tong2020]

Hello Tong,

Would agree that that God desires for us to trust in Him, and His Son. Not abandoning the faith but staying in the faith. May God give the increase always.

Believe that at any time a person could if they desire walk away from God, if they make the choice to do so, but only God knows the heart of individuals so while you can be set in faith and trust in God completely.

Others however whom may be weak in faith and they may need encouragement in holding on to faith, rather than giving up.

In my view, a true believer in God and Jesus Christ is one who have no room of later rejecting God and Jesus Christ. If one still thinks and believes that he still have that choice, then he really haven’t truly made the choice. He ought to make the choice today and not remain in that situation.

Tong
R2857

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Maybe or maybe not? I disagree. I would agree with scriptures on that matter which teach me that.

Okay.

It doesn't matter. It's a curious but meaningless question of doctrine. What matters is that you are believing, now and to the very end. That's what counts. That's what the Bible says to do.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

If one is still focused on continuing to believe, I would take that as an indication of a weak faith, if not, doubt.

Maybe, maybe not. At the very least it's just simply choosing to not give up the forgiveness of our sins when the temptation to return to the world comes a knocking.

What one needs is to have a faith that is from God, which is inherently strong and with power, and without a shadow of doubting.

You mean like the faith John the Baptist had, who had the Holy Spirit from the womb, who saw the Holy Spirit descend on Jesus, but who later had to ask from prison if Jesus was really the Messiah?

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
Maybe or maybe not? I disagree. I would agree with scriptures on that matter which teach me that.

Okay. It doesn't matter. It's a curious but meaningless question of doctrine. What matters is that you are believing, now and to the very end. That's what counts. That's what the Bible says we are to do.

Meaningless perhaps to you.

As I pointed out, if one is still focused on his salvation, such as how to remain saved or stay saved, he is should pray about that. For he must have peace with that matter, in faith. He must move on in the things that God had prepared in advance for him to do, doing all things for the glory of God, that is, for God and not really for himself.

Tong
R2858

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
If one is still focused on continuing to believe, I would take that as an indication of a weak faith, if not, doubt.

Maybe, maybe not. At the very least it's just simply choosing to not give up the forgiveness of our sins when the temptation to return to the world comes a knocking

Give up the forgiveness of your sins? Forgiveness of sins is by grace and so is not conditioned on any one’s continuance of whatever. Again this is a matter of faith.

If every day of your life, you still have the choice of rejecting Jesus Christ or not, then you have not truly and really have made your choice. And if you say you had, then that choice would no longer be there for you to consider and make.

Tong2020 said: ↑
What one needs is to have a faith that is from God, which is inherently strong and with power, and without a shadow of doubting.

You mean like the faith John the Baptist had, who had the Holy Spirit from the womb, who saw the Holy Spirit descend on Jesus, but who later had to ask from prison if Jesus was really the Messiah?

There is only one faith, not many, and not as though John the baptist, the apostles, the rich, the poor, the intelligent, the unintelligent, the very loving and the not so loving, the patient and the not so patient, and so on, have different faith. They all have the same faith that comes from God.

Tong
R2859

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Give up the forgiveness of your sins? Forgiveness of sins is by grace and so is not conditioned on any one’s continuance of whatever. Again this is a matter of faith.

Yes, it is a matter of faith.......continuance of faith.

Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to what we profess. Hebrews 4:14​