Why do Catholics adore, worship and deify Mary so much?

[Bob Carabbio]

Jesus did not found the Catholic church; that would be one of the Roman emperors.

BINGO!!! That would be Constantine in 325 who made the Christian church "legal", and "Formalized" it. In 590 Pope Gregory (the "Great") really created the "Roman Catholic" Corporation, as a Religio/Political system. Then in 1054 under Pope Leo 9 the Roman Catholics became the first Protestants when they tossed the "Orthodox Catholics" under the bus and grabbed the primacy for themselves.

 

[theefaith]

There is only one true Church and it isn't the Catholic church.

There is and has only ever been one true Church; the church which can only be entered through the narrow gate. the Church that Jesus talked about – his bride. The biblical Church, which is made up only of those who are Born Again believers from whatever church background, or none, worldwide, past , present and future. Those who through the revelation of the Holy Spirit have seen Jesus for who he is, recognised what he did, turned from their sin and accepted him into their hearts and lives as Lord and Saviour. Anybody who hasn’t taken these steps towards him and made that commitment is not, in my view, part of the biblical meaning of Church. And in my experience many church-goers and even clergy fall outside these criteria. And that is the Church that I belong to. The one led by the Holy Spirit and not a man.

mk 16:16 by faith and baptism

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

 

[theefaith]

I Agree Completely!!! NOW - what makes you think the "Roman Catholic Church Corporation" has anything to do with that???

Apostolic succession!

Only the one true universal church has the authority of Christ in His apostles
Matt 28:19-20 I am with you (the apostles) until the end

apostolic succession!

explicit and implicit in scripture

Judas was an apostle
Acts 1:17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.

acts 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.

Matthias succeeded him as apostle

acts 1: 26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

now if it applies to judas how much more to Peter and the other apostles

Matt 28:19-20
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Jesus is with His church and His apostles until the end! So the apostles must remain until the end governing the church administering the kingdom

Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:

Lk 22:32
Jesus prays for Peter:

Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:

Isa 22 21-22 prime minister called father!
Holding the keys of the kingdom under the king Lk 1:32-33 in the line of david!
Matt 16:18

 

[theefaith]

i feel so sad for Catholic people who refuse to accept the truth because they believe their leaders and are deceived by false doctrines. I once read book about a Jewish lad who became a Christian and his father was courageous enough to try to prove him wrong using scripture but instead the father and the whole family became Christians.

I have suggested before to Catholics and also JWs that they take responsibility for their own eternal souls by finding out the truth for themselves rather than relying on misguided leaders to feed them.
I now suggest to any of you to do this prayerfully and without fear of reprisals.

I provided ample scripture
You’re just emoting not thinking

for example what is the source of truth?

 

[Pearl]

How do they know if they got it right?

You know if you are born again or not - if you don't know then you probably aren't.

What do you think Christ and the Apostles would think of these Churches of Ones?

What are 'Churches of Ones'? I think you made that up. i certainly didn't say that.

I do not subscribe to any one denomination

Neither do I.

And...even if I did...I would still fellowship with many denominations.

So would I.

I have degrees and have traveled the world to find the truth about Christianity, t

You don't need a degree to find the truth about Christianity, Jesus said:

Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.

Matthew 18:3
And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

But do I have it all right?

You would know if you did. Blessed assurance isn't just a song.

Should I call myself a Church?

You alone cannot be a church. I don't know where you got this idea from.

Yeshua has not signed off on any one belief....So what I am saying is that "The one true Church" that you imply has not been identified.

No, he hasn't, but they have to come in through Him - it's the only way and that's why I say that the biblical Church, which is made up only of those who are Born Again believers from whatever church background, or none, worldwide, past , present and future. Those who through the revelation of the Holy Spirit have seen Jesus for who he is, recognised what he did, turned from their sin and accepted him into their hearts and lives as Lord and Saviour. Anybody who hasn’t taken these steps towards him and made that commitment is not, in my view, part of the biblical meaning of Church.

I hope you understand better now - with all your degrees it should be easy enough.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

People love to say this....over the last 2000 years do you think someone got it right?

Nope - the "Visible churches" From Catholicism forward have never been anything close to "Right" totally. SOME, are closer than others. I'm satisfied in the "Assemblies of God Denomination, but I'm not DEFINED by it.

The Church that Jesus started has always been perfect, and the pillar and ground of TRUTH. It's composed of ALL Born Again believers both alive and physically dead.

ALL the VISIBLE church iterations/denominations have been less than perfect to one degree or another, and will remain so until the Mature church of Eph 4:13 is realized - probably immediately before the end of the age.

Do you think that God kept it a secret until the 1500's and the Protestant reform.

The Reformation was a "course correction" to get the church back on track, and restore Eph 2:8,9 = Salvation NOT by "Works" but by FAITH, which the Roman Church had suppressed/forgotten.

which one of the 30,000 Protestant denominations is right?

None of 'em is 100% "right"

The one thing that all the Protestant denominations prove is confusion.

Which is all that "Theologians" skilled in the art will ever be able to produce. It's the same on any religious system - ISLAM is split 100 ways, Catholicism is, and Protestantism is - etc. SO everything's "Normal" for humanity.

Next question???

 

[Pearl]

Isa 22:21-22 keys
Matt 16:18-19 keys

The keys to the kingdom are not actual keys for a lock they are like the keys to a map or diagram which explain what everything means and how it all fits together.

 

[Pearl]

I provided ample scripture
You’re just emoting not thinking

for example what is the source of truth?

But I believe the scripture you provide have been interpreted wrongly.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Apostolic succession!

Except there's never been any such thing, Rome can't even demonstrate a pure line of Popes, and the one they have now probably isn't even a Christian - given Bergoglio's penchant toward "Universalism".

READ YOUR OWN HISTORY!!!!

 

[Grailhunter]

What are 'Churches of Ones'? I think you made that up. i certainly didn't say that.

Yeap it is my term 'Church of Ones" it is a little sarcasm and a little humor. You have Christians that do not fellowship. That does not mean they are not good Christians but churches are congregations and congregations are churches....with or without a building. But you cannot call one a church. You cannot call a person with personal beliefs a church.

You don't need a degree to find the truth about Christianity, Jesus said:

Historically, maybe because of these scriptures....Christians have been against education and science. Even today there are Protestant beliefs that women should know their place and that is not in school or collage.

I keep saying this to people....you cannot read the Bible like it is the latest edition of the local Sunday paper. Christ was not talking about Christian Universities....He was talking about Greek schools and and the wisdom thereof.....

But like you said you do not need a degree to be knowledgeable regarding Christianity. You can do it on your own.....
You can learn on your own the Bible at the level of the original languages.
You can learn on your own the history of Christianity.
You can travel the world to the oldest libraries and read some of the oldest Christian writings.
You can learn on your own the cultures and environments that the scriptures were written in.
You can even get into the archology associated with Christianity.

Should I call myself a Church?
You alone cannot be a church. I don't know where you got this idea from.

I got it from you....your term "One True Church" like the only one. Post # 277

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes and because of that we are all separated from God until we are reconciled to Him through the blood of Jesus.

How could Mary be separated from God when she carried Him in her womb?
Was Jesus God or not?
I used to think like you but I came to understand that God is separated from sin so MAYBE Mary had to be sinless and be born without the sin nature.
It seems reasonable to me.

 

[GodsGrace]

I don't think you could have read my post properly. The one true Church is nothing to do with denominations. There are members of the One True Church in all denominations right across the world. It's not about which denomination you belong to it's about belonging to Jesus.

I think we need to distinguish between church and Church.

Church, capital c, is the Body of Christ. All believers are part of the Body of Christ.

The word church, small c, is the institution.

 

[Taken]

Apostolic succession!

Only the one true universal church has the authority of Christ in His apostles
Matt 28:19-20 I am with you (the apostles) until the end

There is a CAVEAT, to being an Apostolic Successor OF Christ’s Church...
THAT THEY ACTUALLY TEACH AND PREACH THE WORD OF GOD!

Apostolic succession of the Catholic Church teaches and preaches Their words, under the guise of Christ Jesus’ authority.

 

[Taken]

Why do Catholics adore, worship and deify Mary so much?
OP ^

* First of all, Catholics will deflect from your point of WHY, to saying it’s merely adoration not worshiping.

Irrelevant since Catholics are simply individual persons, who all are well aware of the statues of “Mary”, and bow before the statues, lay trinkets around the statues, kiss the statues, pray before the statues;
saying whatever in their own prayers; be they asking or worshiping.

As far as WHY...because 2,000+ years ago Gentile men began being Appointed to early Church positions. As the Apostles were dying off, the Gentiles began creating non-Scriptural Traditions increasing the Traditions year by year, elevating their own Positions, as pseudo demigods, (which is easily observable to this day).
Consider ancient days of the common lowly ignorant nobody, being welcomed in beautiful Church, in the presence of some pseudo demigod, with a throne, crown, elaborate attire which
that notices the nobody, a nod, a smile, a greeting, a touch...
the ear will yield, the body will mimic.
Nothing new, “importance” by association, and continues to this day.

 

[Taken]

Correct - the Church formed by Jesus with him as its head. Not a church formed by Roman emperors with a pope at its head.

God appointed Abraham as an earthy father of many Nations.
Guess the Roman Nations felt left out and had to appoint their ‘own father’.

Pretty sad to take Biblical “servants” of the Lord and posthumously “elevate” them with leaning implications of being equal with Christ.

 

[Taken]

Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!

Jesus’ successors TEACH and PREACH the Word of God.

Catholics Admittedly reveal much of their teaching and preaching comes from OUTSIDE of Scripture.

Matt 16:17-19
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Simon Barjona...Simon son of a man, is blessed BECAUSE God revealed to him, (as well as the others thereafter following Simon)....(as well as ANY man who is Faithful)....Jesus IS the Christ!

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Newsflash...THE ROCK IS Christ. Christ’s CHURCH IS BUILT UPON...
The very saying God revealed to Simon Barjona....
JESUS IS THE CHIRST, THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD.

Every Christian Church is BUILT UPON “THAT ROCK”...”THAT REVEALING...”
JESUS IS THE CHRIST, THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD....

Every Converted man IN Christ....is a stone upon stone upon stone upon stone....building UPON
JESUS IS THE CHIRST, THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD.

CHRIST JESUS the ROCK.
He who hears a man SPEAK the WORD OF GOD, hears JESUS.

He who is hearing men speak outside of Scripture are hearing men, not Jesus.

1 Cor 10:
[4] And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

 

[Pearl]

Yeap it is my term 'Church of Ones" it is a little sarcasm and a little humor. You have Christians that do not fellowship. That does not mean they are not good Christians but churches are congregations and congregations are churches....with or without a building. But you cannot call one a church. You cannot call a person with personal beliefs a church.



Historically, maybe because of these scriptures....Christians have been against education and science. Even today there are Protestant beliefs that women should know their place and that is not in school or collage.

I keep saying this to people....you cannot read the Bible like it is the latest edition of the local Sunday paper. Christ was not talking about Christian Universities....He was talking about Greek schools and and the wisdom thereof.....

But like you said you do not need a degree to be knowledgeable regarding Christianity. You can do it on your own.....
You can learn on your own the Bible at the level of the original languages.
You can learn on your own the history of Christianity.
You can travel the world to the oldest libraries and read some of the oldest Christian writings.
You can learn on your own the cultures and environments that the scriptures were written in.
You can even get into the archology associated with Christianity.



I got it from you....your term "One True Church" like the only one. Post # 277

OK, so you may have degrees and study your bible but you don't understand that the Church consists of all born again Christians whether they 'go to church' or not. So I think something may be lacking in your education.

 

[theefaith]

I don't think you could have read my post properly. The one true Church is nothing to do with denominations. There are members of the One True Church in all denominations right across the world. It's not about which denomination you belong to it's about belonging to Jesus.

And how does one belong to Jesus?

 

[theefaith]

BINGO!!! That would be Constantine in 325 who made the Christian church "legal", and "Formalized" it. In 590 Pope Gregory (the "Great") really created the "Roman Catholic" Corporation, as a Religio/Political system. Then in 1054 under Pope Leo 9 the Roman Catholics became the first Protestants when they tossed the "Orthodox Catholics" under the bus and grabbed the primacy for themselves.

did they have a counsel at nicea in 325?

 

[Pearl]

I think we need to distinguish between church and Church.

Church, capital c, is the Body of Christ. All believers are part of the Body of Christ.

The word church, small c, is the institution.

Correct, so that is why I am careful to use a capital C when talking about the body of Christ worldwide.