Why do Catholics adore, worship and deify Mary so much?

[GodsGrace]

I read that some Catholics believe that Mary was born of a virgin too. Is this true? Do some Catholics believe this way?

I just think the repetition and prayers to Mary is too much and crosses over a line. Our prayers and worship need to be focused on the Father in the mighty name of Jesus Christ.

Mary was not born of a virgin.
Stop listening to weird people and get the facts.

 

[Mayflower]

Hail Mary...
hail

verb (2)
hailed; hailing; hails
Definition of hail (Entry 3 of 5)

transitive verb

1a: to greet with enthusiastic approval : ACCLAIMhailed as a great success
b: SALUTE, GREETreturning soldiers hailed with parades
2: to greet or summon by callinghail a taxi

Isn't this what Gabriel did in Luke 1:28?

Yes, you say it for every bead. Do you know the words?
See if you can recognize where they come from...
Hail Mary,
Full of Grace,
The Lord is with thee.
Blessed art thou among women,
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.
Holy Mary,
Mother of God,
pray for us sinners now,
and at the hour of death.
Glory Be to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit.

Sound familiar? Read Luke 1.
And do you know WHY the rosary was instituted?
You could find out you know...
Instead of living the rest of your life listening to lies and jokes,
why not use Professor Google to find out what Catholics REALLY teach?

And, if you're not really interested, that's fine too
but maybe you could stop making silly arguments against Catholicism?



Oh for goodness sakes Mayflower, the guy was pulling your leg.
He was probably tired of what we Protestants tend to do:
Always talk about Jesus. Sometimes this turns people to the off position and we have to know when to stop or we do more harm than good.
Don't you know that Catholic churches have bible studies?
And the bible is read at every Mass: The O.T., the N.T. epistle and one of the Gospels.

There are different cultural Catholics,,,but not different "denominations" like in Protestantism.
I think we've made a mess of God's Word.


Neither do I.
It's books that are not included in the bible.

Apocrypha (Ancient Greek: ἀπόκρυφος, 'the hidden [things]') are the biblical books received by the early Church as part of the Greek version of the Old Testament, but not included in the Hebrew Bible, being excluded by the non-Hellenistic Jews from their canon. Their position in Christian usage has been ambiguous.[1]

There are several levels of dubiety within the general concept of apocryphal works in Judeo-Christian biblical writings. Apocrypha per se are outside the Hebrew Bible canon, not considered divinely inspired but regarded as worthy of study by the faithful.[2] Pseudepigrapha are spurious works ostensibly written by a biblical figure. Deuterocanonical works are those that are accepted in one canon but not in all.[3]

Biblical apocrypha are a set of texts included in the Septuagint and the Latin Vulgate, but not in the Hebrew Bible. While the Catholic tradition considers seven of these books to be deuterocanonical, Protestants consider fourteen intertestamental books as Apocrypha, that is, non-canonical books that are useful for instruction.[4][2] Luther's Bible placed them in a separate section called the Apocrypha, setting the pattern for subsequent versions of 80 book Protestant Bibles that include the Old Testament, Apocrypha and New Testament.[5][6]

source: Apocrypha - Wikipedia

I haven't made arguments about the Catholic faith. People here are telling me of what I have heard about Catholicism is correct. You don't think that saying this verse for every bead of the Rosary is a little bit like worship and adoration? I believe it sounds like it.

As far as my friend, he was not pulling my leg. He was really upset about it.

 

[Mayflower]

Mary was not born of a virgin.
Stop listening to weird people and get the facts.

Immaculate conception means she was not born with original sin. This is not Truth. This is why Jesus had to be born of a virgin, so He would not have the curse of original sin.

 

[GodsGrace]

I haven't made arguments about the Catholic faith. People here are telling me of what I have heard about Catholicism is correct. You don't think that that saying this verse for every bead of the Rosary is a little bit like worship and adoration? I believe it sounds like it.

As far as my friend, he was not pulling my leg. He was really upset about it.

Mayflower,
why don't you learn to use google instead of listening to people that don't know what they're talking about.
It's 1:30 am here and I have to leave, but I'll tell you about the rosary really fast...

The rosary actually tells the story of Jesus.
It was for concentrated praying ( I've used it to get to sleep )
and in the middle ages it was used to teach illiterate people about the story of Jesus and it was a good
way for them to remember the story.
Colored glass windows in churches also portray biblical stories and for the same reason.
Ditto for paintings.

Let me see if I can find something fast... I can tell you more tomorrow if you want.
For now...
'night.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First, this concluding prayer reminds us that the rosary is a prayer for meditation on the mysteries of the life of Christ. In a daily Mass homily, Pope Francis said that prayer is not mindlessly repeating words “like a parrot!” The rosary, too, is not merely a matter of saying Our Fathers and Hail Marys. Rather, when we address the Blessed Mother using the words of the archangel Gabriel — “Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you!” (Lk 1:28) — she calms our spirit and leads us to Jesus. She helps us enter into the “mysteries” of her Son’s life.

THE PROMISE OF JOY

When we refer to the “mysteries” of the rosary, we do not mean something that is difficult or even impossible to explain. Rather, the word “mysteries” refers to events in the earthly life of Christ that reveal the saving work of our heavenly Father. Mary, who shared in these events like no one else, guides us through the incarnation, birth and childhood of Jesus (joyful mysteries); through the events of Jesus’ public life that manifested the Father’s glory (luminous mysteries); through Jesus’ saving passion and death (sorrowful mysteries); and through the triumph of the Lord over sin and death (glorious mysteries).

By allowing Mary to help us to reflect prayerfully on these events in the life of Christ, we begin to “imitate what they contain.” For example, the first joyful mystery is the Annunciation. As we greet Mary and ask her intercession, we ponder the news that the angel Gabriel brought — the birth of the Savior. We should be moved to give thanks and praise to God for loving the world so much that he sent us his only Son (cf. Jn 3:16). We should also ponder Mary’s response to this astonishing news: “Let it be done to me according to thy word!”

When we pray each successive Hail Mary attentively, we always receive some benefit for our spiritual life. The Good News that the angel brought might dispel our gloomy outlook and rekindle our Christian hope. The response of Mary might challenge our tendency to be a Christian on our own terms, not the Lord’s.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The mysteries of the Rosary are organized a specific way. Each set of mysteries contain five decades.

They have been organized into different sentiments like joy and sorrow and are usually arranged in chronological order of how events unfolded the life of Jesus.

• The first set tells the joys of Jesus and Mary, events that include the vistation and the nativity
  
• The next set casts the light of truth on the public life of Jesus including His baptism in the River Jordan and His transfiguration on Mount Tabor
• Next to follow is the set that commemorates the sorrows of Jesus and Mary, His passion and death on the cross
  
• The final set recounts the glories Jesus shared with Mary, which includes His glorious Resurrection and Ascension into heaven

If you have questions about any mystery of the Rosary, please ask it here...

source: Rosary Mysteries of the Catholic Rosary

 

[GodsGrace]

Immaculate conception means she was not born with original sin. This is not Truth. This is why Jesus had to be born of a virgin, so He would not have the curse of original sin.

I made a mistake.
I sure hope @Cassandra isn't around!

I meant to say, as you asked, that Mary's MOTHER was not born of a virgin.

This subject is too deep for now Mayflower.
Think about this:
Could Jesus, God incarnate, be born of a woman who had original sin in her?
Who had the sin nature in her?
Or do you think that maybe God would want her to be pure and without the sin nature?

We are born of original sin,,,all of us.
Even if Mary had never h ad relations with any man...
she STILL would have the sin nature.
Do you agree?

Tomorrow...

 

[Enoch111]

I will play your game....LOL....So lets say Yahweh did not impregnate Miriam? So what is Christ....not the Son of God?

Christ is the eternal and only begotten Son of God. He said "Before Abraham was I AM". So do you see that Christ did not become the only begotten Son of God when He was born or conceived as Jesus of Nazareth? Kindly pay close attention to what is stated in Micah 5:2: But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. If the "goings forth" of the babe in the manger were from "everlasting" does that not make Him the ETERNAL Son of God?

And it was the Holy Spirit -- not God the Father -- who overshadowed Mary and thus she conceived miraculously and while still a virgin: And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

So Christ was called "Son of God" because He was ALREADY the only begotten Son of God. It was "God the Word" (who is also the Son of God or God the Son) who was "made flesh" (became a human being) and dwelt among us. And your allegation that Christian have a problem with the miraculous virgin birth of Christ is total nonsense. The virgin birth is a fundamental Christian doctrine.

Now do you see why what you posted is indeed blasphemous nonsense?

 

[Mayflower]

I made a mistake.
I sure hope @Cassandra isn't around!

I meant to say, as you asked, that Mary's MOTHER was not born of a virgin.

This subject is too deep for now Mayflower.
Think about this:
Could Jesus, God incarnate, be born of a woman who had original sin in her?
Who had the sin nature in her?
Or do you think that maybe God would want her to be pure and without the sin nature?

We are born of original sin,,,all of us.
Even if Mary had never h ad relations with any man...
she STILL would have the sin nature.
Do you agree?

Tomorrow...

Yes, I believe Mary had the sin nature and the original sin in her. Jesus died for His mother too.

 

[Mayflower]

Mayflower,
why don't you learn to use google instead of listening to people that don't know what they're talking about.
It's 1:30 am here and I have to leave, but I'll tell you about the rosary really fast...

The rosary actually tells the story of Jesus.
It was for concentrated praying ( I've used it to get to sleep )
and in the middle ages it was used to teach illiterate people about the story of Jesus and it was a good
way for them to remember the story.
Colored glass windows in churches also portray biblical stories and for the same reason.
Ditto for paintings.

Let me see if I can find something fast... I can tell you more tomorrow if you want.
For now...
'night.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First, this concluding prayer reminds us that the rosary is a prayer for meditation on the mysteries of the life of Christ. In a daily Mass homily, Pope Francis said that prayer is not mindlessly repeating words “like a parrot!” The rosary, too, is not merely a matter of saying Our Fathers and Hail Marys. Rather, when we address the Blessed Mother using the words of the archangel Gabriel — “Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with you!” (Lk 1:28) — she calms our spirit and leads us to Jesus. She helps us enter into the “mysteries” of her Son’s life.

THE PROMISE OF JOY

When we refer to the “mysteries” of the rosary, we do not mean something that is difficult or even impossible to explain. Rather, the word “mysteries” refers to events in the earthly life of Christ that reveal the saving work of our heavenly Father. Mary, who shared in these events like no one else, guides us through the incarnation, birth and childhood of Jesus (joyful mysteries); through the events of Jesus’ public life that manifested the Father’s glory (luminous mysteries); through Jesus’ saving passion and death (sorrowful mysteries); and through the triumph of the Lord over sin and death (glorious mysteries).

By allowing Mary to help us to reflect prayerfully on these events in the life of Christ, we begin to “imitate what they contain.” For example, the first joyful mystery is the Annunciation. As we greet Mary and ask her intercession, we ponder the news that the angel Gabriel brought — the birth of the Savior. We should be moved to give thanks and praise to God for loving the world so much that he sent us his only Son (cf. Jn 3:16). We should also ponder Mary’s response to this astonishing news: “Let it be done to me according to thy word!”

When we pray each successive Hail Mary attentively, we always receive some benefit for our spiritual life. The Good News that the angel brought might dispel our gloomy outlook and rekindle our Christian hope. The response of Mary might challenge our tendency to be a Christian on our own terms, not the Lord’s.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The mysteries of the Rosary are organized a specific way. Each set of mysteries contain five decades.

They have been organized into different sentiments like joy and sorrow and are usually arranged in chronological order of how events unfolded the life of Jesus.

• The first set tells the joys of Jesus and Mary, events that include the vistation and the nativity
  
• The next set casts the light of truth on the public life of Jesus including His baptism in the River Jordan and His transfiguration on Mount Tabor
• Next to follow is the set that commemorates the sorrows of Jesus and Mary, His passion and death on the cross
  
• The final set recounts the glories Jesus shared with Mary, which includes His glorious Resurrection and Ascension into heaven

If you have questions about any mystery of the Rosary, please ask it here...

source: Rosary Mysteries of the Catholic Rosary

But where do you get that Mary or the saints can do any of these things like comfort your spirit or guide you? To me you are giving glory to someone that is really God working in you. Only Jesus can guide you to the Father.

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father except through Me. John 14:6

.

John 16:12-15

12I still have much to tell you, but you cannot yet bear to hear it. 13However, when the Spirit of truth comes, He will guide you into all truth. For He will not speak on His own, but He will speak what He hears, and He will declare to you what is to come. 14He will glorify Me by taking from what is Mine and disclosing it to you. 15Everything that belongs to the Father is Mine. That is why I said that the Spirit will take from what is Mine and disclose it to you.

We have Holy Spirit now. He is our Comforter and our guide. Anything past this is glorifying the wrong one. Mary is not God. Mary should be highly respected, but I do not believe she can do anything for us. She already did that having Jesus and caring for Him.

 

[Mayflower]

And as far as Google goes, I don't seriously research religions outside of Christianity because for example, I am not Catholic. Praying to saints and things, I would consider to be against God's Word. Unless a discussion like this comes up I might look into certain things, but no. I'll hear things and keep them in the back of my mind in case they ever come up for discussion. I like to hear what people of the actual faith believe. Not a wikipedia.

 

[Mayflower]

And when I do research religions I like to do so as compared to protestant Christianity

Compare 19 Beliefs of Catholics and Protestants

 

[Grailhunter]

Christ is the eternal and only begotten Son of God. He said "Before Abraham was I AM". So do you see that Christ did not become the only begotten Son of God when He was born or conceived as Jesus of Nazareth? Kindly pay close attention to what is stated in Micah 5:2: But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. If the "goings forth" of the babe in the manger were from "everlasting" does that not make Him the ETERNAL Son of God?

And it was the Holy Spirit -- not God the Father -- who overshadowed Mary and thus she conceived miraculously and while still a virgin: And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

So Christ was called "Son of God" because He was ALREADY the only begotten Son of God. It was "God the Word" (who is also the Son of God or God the Son) who was "made flesh" (became a human being) and dwelt among us. And your allegation that Christian have a problem with the miraculous virgin birth of Christ is total nonsense. The virgin birth is a fundamental Christian doctrine.

Now do you see why what you posted is indeed blasphemous nonsense?

So the scriptures say this....
The angel answered and said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; for that reason also the holy Child will be called the Son of God.
And the scriptures mention both and I am good with both....The Holy Spirit will come upon you....and and and....the power of the most high will overshadow you for that reason also the holy Child will be called the Son of God....I am good with that but you still have not given your description of how it happened. You cannot find your scripture but you can still tell us how you think it happened.

The Old Testament scriptures you gave are still talking about a human warlord king messiah. The Jews were not looking for a God messiah....if they were things would have went a lot better for Christ and them. The Jews did not and ...still do not believe in the devil or hell so they were not looking for a God messiah to "save" them from the devil or hell or offer heaven. They were looking for a human warlord king messiah to redeem them from their oppressors. Much of this is discussed through the Old Testament. And it is reflected in the history of the Jews.

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; Christ did not become a ruler or king in Israel...they rejected Him. This is still talking about a human king, which would be no surprise from the Old Testament perspective.

whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. whose goings forth? God knew he would go forth from the beginning...other than that I do not see a connection to a God messiah.....In context, if you read on this is about a human warlord king that would take on their oppressors of that time period....namely the Assyrians....so this is referring to a human warlord king. Christ was not a warlord king....but that is a different topic. Open a thread....

The topic at hand is how do you describe the event of how God caused Miriam to conceive the baby Christ?

 

[Cassandra]

I made a mistake.
I sure hope @Cassandra isn't around!

I meant to say, as you asked, that Mary's MOTHER was not born of a virgin.

This subject is too deep for now Mayflower.
Think about this:
Could Jesus, God incarnate, be born of a woman who had original sin in her?
Who had the sin nature in her?
Or do you think that maybe God would want her to be pure and without the sin nature? (The IC was not recognized till 1854. Is that correct?)

We are born of original sin,,,all of us.
Even if Mary had never h ad relations with any man...
she STILL would have the sin nature.
Do you agree?

Tomorrow...

Present!
(Where did thee faith admit it was a mistake? I didn't see it. If it were an actual mistake, that is a different thing entirely)
Anyway, if Mary had to be immaculately conceived because she had to be to have Jesus,then why wouldn't her mother also have to be immaculately conceived so Mary could be?

 

[Mayflower]

Present!
(Where did thee faith admit it was a mistake? I didn't see it. If it were an actual mistake, that is a different thing entirely)
Anyway, if Mary had to be immaculately conceived because she had to be to have Jesus,then why wouldn't her mother also have to be immaculately conceived so Mary could be?

I think we just disagree with immaculate conception period.... Mary held original sin. Where would it point to that not being the case?

 

[Grailhunter]

Present!
(Where did thee faith admit it was a mistake? I didn't see it. If it were an actual mistake, that is a different thing entirely)
Anyway, if Mary had to be immaculately conceived because she had to be to have Jesus,then why wouldn't her mother also have to be immaculately conceived so Mary could be?

Got to be careful of words that are not in the Bible....the word immaculate does not occur in the Bible. These type of theological words are usually something that someone wants you to believe....that is a lie or something they believe. In this case they believed that Miriam's mother had conceived in a special way. But it is more or less the same way that John the Baptist's mother conceived. These were special people in this sequence. This occurs in the Old Testament when God is going to bring forth a champion.

But because He causes a woman to conceive, that does not mean their babies are His sons or daughters....that is what makes Miriam's conception of Christ different....Christ is the actual Son of God the Father.

 

[Pearl]

Mary is the blessed mother of Jesus. We can perhaps all agree to honor her as Christ would want us to. She raised him and cared for him when he was a baby and child. He is God and ascended and is with her now in heaven. Cheers to all!

Yes I do honour her but I don't worship her or pray to her because she was just a woman and not God.

 

[theefaith]

Not sure what you mean.

I was replying to #182

 

[theefaith]

LIES:
"Ever Virgin"
Consecrated to God’s service must be Perpetual

"Never had kids other than Jesus"
Isa 7:14 a son singular
Lk 1:34 no sex
Nowhere does scripture say anyone is a biological child of Mary accept Jesus

"Mary was SINLESS"
"Mary was Immaculately conceived"
gen 3:15 enmity total war none of satan’s works are found in her
Lk 1:28 Hail Mary full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou amongst women
Rev 12:1 clothed with immaculate purity

"Mary was Assumed into Heaven"
and queen of heaven rev 12:1 crown and in heaven

"Jesus has to OBEY HER", so Roman Catholics are trained to pray to HER to get what they want out of Jesus.

Christ said I come to do Thy will!
The commandments are God’s will
Honor Thy father and mother her prayers cannot be refused
Even when God’s appointed time for Christ’s public life and miracles had not yet come, He still obeyed His mother and worked a miracle Jn chapter 2 and because of her intercession His disciples believed

 

[theefaith]

Brothers and sisters of Jesus?

They are not the children of Mary!

Is 7:14 a virgin shall conceive and bear a son!
(One son, singular)

James is the son of zebedee, and the other James is the son of Alpheus not Joseph!
Matt 10:2-3

In Hebrew culture any close relative can be called brother or sister, lot was called Abraham’s brother but was his nephew.

Gen 12:5 and Abram took Sarai his wife, and Lot his brother's son..

Gen 13:8 And Abram said unto Lot, Let there be no strife, I pray thee, between me and thee, and between my herdsmen and thy herdsmen; for we are Brothers.

The 12 sons of Jacob are brothers but all are not the children of Leah and all are not the children of Rachel! They had 4 mother’s, These may be brothers but they are simply not the children of One mother and the brothers of Jesus are not the children of Mary!

Jose’s, Simon Salome are children of another Mary!

Mk 15:40 There were also women looking on afar off: among whom was Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the less and of Joses, and Salome;

Is Mary the mother of James?
If you mean the Blessed Virgin Mary then no. Her sister-in-law, Mary of Clopas, was the wife of Alphaeus (St. Joseph's brother), and mother of Simon, Joseph, and the apostles Judas Thaddeus, and James (the Less, brother of the Lord): Jesus' cousins.

The "sisters" of Jesus refer to women disciples

Salome, or Mary Salome, was the wife of Zebedee, and mother of apostles John (the beloved), and James (the greater).

 

[theefaith]

A good tree!

Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

The fruit of the tree of Mary is our salvation! Matt 1:21 Lk 2:30 Jesus is our salvation! This reflects the immaculate conception of Mary and the miraculous conception of Jesus!
Lk 1:30 Mary found our salvation!
Lk 1:38 consented to our salvation!

A good tree (immaculate conception) Lk 1:49 God has done this and it is marvelous in our eyes!

Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Matt 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

A sinner would be an evil tree with evil fruit, but the fruit of Mary is salvation!

Mary brings in the good fruits of our redemption and salvation!

Only a queen can bear a king!

 

[theefaith]

Blessing from God thru Mary!

All graces come to us they Mary, from God by the merits (blood) of Christ!
Jn 1:16
Of His fullness we have all received, grace for grace!

Salvation Lk 1:30
Consented to our salvation Lk 1:38
Mother of Christ Matt 1:16
Mother of the word Jn 1:1
Mother of our savior Matt 1:21
Mother of our salvation Lk 2:30
Our mother Jn 19:26-27

Elizabeth filled with the Holy Spirit!

Lk 1:41 And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the salutation of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost:

John sanctified in the womb!

Lk 1:15 For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.

Lk 1:44 For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.

Zacharias is filled with the Holy Spirit and prophecy!

Lk 1:67 And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,

The wedding couple have wine and not shame!

Jn 2: 10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.

The disciples are supplied with faith, hope, and charity!

11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.

All these blessings from God because of Mary most holy!

Mother of Divine Grace!

Hebrews 4:16
Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

The throne of Grace is the throne of Mary the ever Virgin mother of God!

We come boldly to this throne cause Mary is our mother and advocate!

Mary is the storehouse of divine graces!

Lk 1:28
And the angel entered to her, and said, Hail Mary, full of grace; the Lord is with thee; blessed be thou among women.

All graces come from the merits of Christ, from His passion and death and come thru Mary to the glory of Her only begotten Son!