'Who is able to make war with him?'

[bbyrd009]

"spiritualizing: bringing a concept into the realm of life."
hmm

 

[Jay Ross]

!

bc we cant think of a country that no one wants to go to war with today, huh JR?

You know that when a brawl is brewing, everybody wants a piece of the action.

 

[bbyrd009]

You know that when a brawl is brewing, everybody wants a piece of the action.

ah; no, i didnt know. Not sure what that might have to do with the subject, even if it was true wadr

 

[Bobby Jo]

I'm reminded of a person who sits around and does nothing for himself or others, but has the temerity to point and comment.

Bobby Jo

 

[bbyrd009]

I'm reminded of a person who sits around and does nothing for himself or others, but has the temerity to point and comment.

Bobby Jo

whatever deflects away from the subject, huh bj?
ok with me bro.
this is a forum, commenting is a bad thing?

 

[bbyrd009]

Hello @amadeus,

You appear to be spiritualizing this, yes? Bringing it into the realm of the believer's life experience, in Christ Jesus. Rather than viewing it as describing powers and events prophetically, which will take place in the course of world history.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

i guess its easy to believe that those who have left the world might be giving a Revelation of Christ that concerns the world, yeh. They arent though, surely.

 

[Bobby Jo]

... commenting is a bad thing?

Not if you're also contributing, -- which I'm still waiting to see ... :)

It's a "funny" thing that you recognized yourself. Self awareness is the starting point towards the path of mental health.
Bobby Jo

 

[amadeus]

Hello @amadeus,

You appear to be spiritualizing this, yes? Bringing it into the realm of the believer's life experience, in Christ Jesus. Rather than viewing it as describing powers and events prophetically, which will take place in the course of world history.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

I don't get into the overall course of human events on planet Earth too much, not even in prophecy. World events will not prevent a person choosing to follow God or not, which is of more concern to me. You may call it spiritualizing, but for me it is more of Life versus death for the individual.

 

[Bobby Jo]

I don't get into the overall course of human events on planet Earth too much, not even in prophecy. ...

Ummmmmm, I think the Topic is a World SITUATION, with REAL participants, and a REAL outcome. -- It's called "prophecy":

Deut. 18:22 when a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the word does not come to pass or come true, that is a word which the Lord has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously, you need not be afraid of him.​

Please don't eat Spiritual Ice Cream, -- it's spiritually fattening?
Bobby Jo

 

[amadeus]

Ummmmmm, I think the Topic is a World SITUATION, with REAL participants, and a REAL outcome. -- It's called "prophecy":

Deut. 18:22 when a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the word does not come to pass or come true, that is a word which the Lord has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously, you need not be afraid of him.​

Please don't eat Spiritual Ice Cream, -- it's spiritually fattening?
Bobby Jo

If you read my initial post #14 on this topic, I made it clear that I was speaking about two questions posed by the OP.

What is it that should be most needful to followers of Jesus: what is going to be happening on and to the larger chunk of earth called planet Earth and those dwelling on it ... or what is going to be happening in and to the little lump of earth of each of those followers and its contents?

If neither you nor the writer of the OP want to consider what I said because you consider it not on topic... I would say, you are allowed to do that. I am also allowed to do what I do within the rules of the forum and according to God, no? My purpose really was not to derail the thread but hopefully to open up our hearts to what are probably to some people more important things.

 

[Bobby Jo]

... My purpose really was not to derail the thread but hopefully to open up our hearts to what are probably to some people more important things.

I don't discount a salvation message, but I equally don't discount GOD's instructions to HIS children, -- through Bible Prophecy. And where these heedings might be ignored, people WILL PERISH, and it's not GOD's plan that his children should suffer loss when judgement comes to the world.

And it's not only the hearer which will suffer, but the spouse, children, and grandchildren. So I adjure everyone to set their households for a future where we won't be able to buy or sell, and where we will have global thermonuclear war. And war ain't pretty.

Good Luck to ALL,
Bobby Jo

 

[Bobby Jo]

...
Who is like unto the beast?

"Nevertheless man being in honour abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish." Psalm 49:12

Who is able to make war with him?

How about who could defeat him?
"She [Wisdom = antecedent from verse 1] hath killed her beasts; she hath mingled her wine; she hath also furnished her table." Prov 9:2

So then we should be always for God so that we are fighting with Him who is already for us and then we need not concern ourselves with those beasts which will be killed by wisdom. The beasts to kill are our own, no matter what else may be happening outside of us:

"What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?" Rom 8:31

As to where to encounter wisdom:

"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom..." Psalm 111:10

Pardon me for stating the obvious, but you offer platitudes. I have no idea what you're attempting to present except that words supplant reality, and that we simply need more empty phrases!?!

Amadeus, if you don't know about the one-world-government, ASK. I'm more than willing to get ANYONE (anyone who has an ear) up to speed. We're in the 42 month Tribulation and the church is running out of time if they're going to avoid the Great Falling Away. -- Or not.


Bobby Jo

 

[amadeus]

Pardon me for stating the obvious, but you offer platitudes. I have no idea what you're attempting to present except that words supplant reality, and that we simply need more empty phrases!?!

Amadeus, if you don't know about the one-world-government, ASK. I'm more than willing to get ANYONE (anyone who has an ear) up to speed. We're in the 42 month Tribulation and the church is running out of time if they're going to avoid the Great Falling Away. -- Or not.


Bobby Jo

Platitudes? I guess you know what that means?

Platitudes: "a remark or statement, especially one with a moral content, that has been used too often to be interesting or thoughtful."

And you have effectively said that about what is written in the scriptures. Hmmm? "Empty phrases"? Lots of preachers perhaps preaching that way, but it is NOT because something better is NOT available. Jesus did bring something better for those who are hungry and thirsty for it.

"Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled." Matt 5:6

What you, my friend @Bobby Jo are teaching is very empty sounding to me.

Do you really believe that being aware of a coming one world government is going to save anyone from whatever evil fate he has already chosen for himself? Remember the rich man who asked Abraham to send Lazarus to his five brothers so that they might avoid the torment he was already in? Remember what then followed?

"Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead." Luke 19:29-31

Now people have available both the teachings of Moses and the prophets; AND ONE has risen from the dead on their behalf. Rather than testify to these who do not believe today of that ONE who rose from the dead you would want to warn them of the dangers of a One World Government? Most of them will likely approve of such a government and call you a religious fanatic for preaching Jesus but at least they would have heard the most important message, or...?

 

[Bobby Jo]

... "Empty phrases"?

Yep, Scripture without any association. You, my dear friend should read:

2 Timothy 3:10 Now you have observed my teaching, my conduct, my aim in life, my faith, my patience, my love, my steadfastness, 11 my persecutions, my sufferings, what befell me at Antioch, at Ico′nium, and at Lystra, what persecutions I endured; yet from them all the Lord rescued me. ​

Yeah, it has NOTHING TO DO with our conversation. It's an empty platitude.

Do you really believe that being aware of a coming one world government is going to save anyone ...?

Yep, the church. They can join the unbelievers in their punishment, -- but why would they if they were warned?

Revelation 18:4 Then I heard another voice from heaven saying,
“Come out of her, my people,
lest you take part in her sins,
lest you share in her plagues;​

Maybe the plagues in Southern California are merely the beginning of judgement. Would YOU like to swim in that ocean, live in those cities, be infested with the fleas which the rats carry, come down with typhus, bubonic, PLUS?

... you would want to warn them of the dangers of a One World Government? ...

Nope! Not me, but GOD wants to warn them in the Prophetic Scriptures. So are you standing in the way of GOD's calling to his children? Will you choose to perish? Will you take others with you?

Hosea 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge;​

Luke 22:35 And he said to them, “When I sent you out with no purse or bag or sandals, did you lack anything?” They said, “Nothing.” 36 He said to them, “But now, let him who has a purse take it, and likewise a bag. And let him who has no sword sell his mantle and buy one.​

Where's the watchman? Why isn't he on the tower? The future is here.
Bobby Jo

 

[amadeus]

Yep, Scripture without any association. You, my dear friend should read:

2 Timothy 3:10 Now you have observed my teaching, my conduct, my aim in life, my faith, my patience, my love, my steadfastness, 11 my persecutions, my sufferings, what befell me at Antioch, at Ico′nium, and at Lystra, what persecutions I endured; yet from them all the Lord rescued me. ​

Yeah, it has NOTHING TO DO with our conversation. It's an empty platitude.


Yep, the church. They can join the unbelievers in their punishment, -- but why would they if they were warned?

Revelation 18:4 Then I heard another voice from heaven saying,
“Come out of her, my people,
lest you take part in her sins,
lest you share in her plagues;​

Maybe the plagues in Southern California are merely the beginning of judgement. Would YOU like to swim in that ocean, live in those cities, be infested with the fleas which the rats carry, come down with typhus, bubonic, PLUS?


Nope! Not me, but GOD wants to warn them in the Prophetic Scriptures. So are you standing in the way of GOD's calling to his children? Will you choose to perish? Will you take others with you?

Hosea 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge;​

Luke 22:35 And he said to them, “When I sent you out with no purse or bag or sandals, did you lack anything?” They said, “Nothing.” 36 He said to them, “But now, let him who has a purse take it, and likewise a bag. And let him who has no sword sell his mantle and buy one.​

Where's the watchman? Why isn't he on the tower? The future is here.
Bobby Jo

You should know that I do NOT disagree with all you have said and I do understand more of what you said than you seem to think, but you are missing the most important message of our Lord. You certainly do not understand where I am coming from...nor where I am.

All the scriptures are dead without the Spirit and it is the Holy Spirit in men that brings the dead scriptures to Life if there is any raw material there. Without that Life we have no hope at all no matter what happens out here in the places you depict and with the predictions you predict.

Then we have to led by the Holy Spirit along the highway of holiness. Taking that road following the lead of the Holy Spirit will make it possible to endure to the end.

You want to fight the wrong battles in the wrong places. The battles to be won are in people's hearts, but we cannot fight there without an invitation and those are few enough.

Since you are not understanding me... or you are disagreeing with what you think you understand, I will leave you for now. May God richly bless as you seek His will.
Give God the glory!

 

[Bobby Jo]

... You want to fight the wrong battles in the wrong places. The battles to be won are in people's hearts, but we cannot fight there without an invitation and those are few enough. ...

I sat in a Sunday School Class where the "teacher" wanted to go over the Salvation Message AGAIN. Afterwards I chastised him for serving Milk instead of MEAT. -- How many times do we need to hear the SALVATION MESSAGE? Once should be enough, but for some it's all they have. There IS no MEAT either for them or from them.

Hebrews 5:12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need some one to teach you again the first principles of God’s word. You need milk, not solid food; 13 for every one who lives on milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a child. 14 But solid food is for the mature, for those who have their faculties trained by practice to distinguish good from evil.​

This IS a Christian Forum. So STOP PREACHING SALVATION TO A "SAVED" COMMUNITY. The OP deals with a subject the Church needs to know, but apparently you ain't got it in ya to chew the deeper things of GOD and Scripture.


And yeah, I understand you completely. Do YOU understand GOD?
Bobby Jo

 

[Mal'ak]

'And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast:
and they worshipped the beast, saying,
"Who is like unto the beast? [therion = a wild beast (G2342)]
Who is able to make war with him?'
(Rev. 13:4)

Hello there,

In the days in which we are living I can envisage a nation rising up, of whom it will be said, 'Who is able to make war with him?' This monstrous kingdom by which Gentile dominion in the earth will end. All of the nations appear like so many wild beasts, of which Nebuchadnezzar is symbolic, who became as a wild beast for seven times (Daniel 7:25).

Does anyone have anything to share on this?

In Christ Jesus
Chris

2 Thessalonians 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

2 Thessalonians 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

2 Thessalonians 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

2 Thessalonians 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

2 Thessalonians 2:12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
​

Right on the mark, pun intended, but with most rapture and other anti-Biblical Christians around these days you will get push back. Considering 90% of Christians think they will be raptured away, none of them even read Revelations or take the time to understand it. Which we are told in Thessalonians, that because they refuse to receive the truth God will allow them to believe a lie so they will be "damned".

Revelation 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Revelation 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
Revelation 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Revelation 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

As we are told in verse 5 "power was given unto [the beast] to continue forty and two months. And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God", which goes along with 2 Thessalonians 2 which says "God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie". The power given or the ability to be allowed to blasphemy God was granted by God himself to, as Jesus said, "Matthew 13:29 But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn."

Obviously not going to be raptured, as in verse 7 we are told directly God "given unto [the beast] to make war with the saints, and to overcome them". Now more to your "kingdom", the "beast" is shown as a kingdom by verse 7 and 8, "power was given [the beast] over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life". So every nation and people will be under the control of the "beast" by the authority of God, the "dragon" who is satan will also be here as the anti-Christ pretending to be Jesus as well. The point of the Tribulation is to weed out the tares from the wheat, those that study the Bible will know satan comes first pretending to be Jesus and there is no rapture so they will not receive the mark of the beast. While other "Christians" that did not study the end times and/or think there is a rapture will "believe a lie".

Revelation 14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
Revelation 14:4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
Revelation 14:8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.
Revelation 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
Revelation 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

Matthew 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Matthew 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Most "Christians" call Jesus Christ a liar, because in Matthew 24 Jesus himself tells us "Immediately after the tribulation...shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven....And he shall send his angels.....they shall gather together his elect". Which is the start of Revelation 14, where it shows Jesus already standing on the mount Sion and the elect are with him, having already been gathered at this point. We are hinted once more of the symbolic kingdom you were speaking of by satan's kingdom on Earth being called "Babylon", which was the enemy of Israel in the Old Testament which served as an example to us. Finally we told by the Angels "If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God". Which this goes along with 2 Thessalonians, "And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned"

 

[Bobby Jo]

...

Well Presented!

The church should know who each of the participants and aspects are, but as you suggested, none take the time to understand either Scripture or modern history. So where you adequately outlined what Scripture SAYS, do YOU understand for whom it applies? :)

With Best Regards,
Bobby Jo

 

[amadeus]

I sat in a Sunday School Class where the "teacher" wanted to go over the Salvation Message AGAIN. Afterwards I chastised him for serving Milk instead of MEAT. -- How many times do we need to hear the SALVATION MESSAGE? Once should be enough, but for some it's all they have. There IS no MEAT either for them or from them.

Hebrews 5:12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need some one to teach you again the first principles of God’s word. You need milk, not solid food; 13 for every one who lives on milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a child. 14 But solid food is for the mature, for those who have their faculties trained by practice to distinguish good from evil.​

This IS a Christian Forum. So STOP PREACHING SALVATION TO A "SAVED" COMMUNITY. The OP deals with a subject the Church needs to know, but apparently you ain't got it in ya to chew the deeper things of GOD and Scripture.


And yeah, I understand you completely. Do YOU understand GOD?
Bobby Jo

I do hear you my friend, but you do not hear me. You are foolish to say that you know me and act as if you know so well the Way of God because of your experiences, your studies and your knowledge of the scriptures. Don't let what you have received and direction God may have given you cause you to lose sight of some things God has decided are important. Neither should you presume that every part of the Body has the same function that you do...

"But Martha was cumbered about much serving, and came to him, and said, Lord, dost thou not care that my sister hath left me to serve alone? bid her therefore that she help me.
And Jesus answered and said unto her, Martha, Martha, thou art careful and troubled about many things:
But one thing is needful: and Mary hath chosen that good part, which shall not be taken away from her." Luke 10:40-42

"Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord
And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all." I Cor 12:4-6

"For the body is not one member, but many." I Cor 12:14

"If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling?" I Cor 14:17

"Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?
But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet show I unto you a more excellent way" I Cor 12:29-31

What are these first principles mentioned in your quoted verses [Heb 5:12-14]? I suspect that there are some on this forum who may have missed that in their lessons. Are you able to help them?

"Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment" Heb 6:1-2

So then presuming you have those 6 principles [if 6 it is] down pat, I would guess you are now moving on toward perfection. If not, why not?

And then I would presume you have the charity [love] without which as the Apostle Paul says it, even though a person had all knowledge and faith that person is nothing:

"And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing." I Cor 13:2

You don't need to respond to this post...

 

[charity]

i guess its easy to believe that those who have left the world might be giving a Revelation of Christ that concerns the world, yeh. They arent though, surely.

Hello @bbyrd009,

Forgive me, but I don't understand. :)

In Christ Jesus
Chris