What Mormons Believe--according to a Former BYU Professor

[Jane_Doe22]

Doctrines and Covenants aren't considered important? I don't understand. Why have that book then? What are the doctrines people must believe to be a Latter Day Saint in good standing?

If salvation is the concern, then the question may be why Smith saw fit to start a new church. I think he said he was told that every church had gone wrong. Did that mean people in those churches could not be saved? Were their doctrines so bad that salvation was impossible for people who belonged to them?

The quote that Prayer Warrior is referencing and that subject arent in the Doctrine and Covenants.

LDS Christians readily acknowledge that many many non-LDS folks are indeed disciples of Christ (Christians) and will be rejoicing with Him in the eternities

(Sorry for short post, i’m on my phone and it’s awkward, will respond longer once back in my computer)

 

[Grailhunter]

Doctrines and Covenants aren't considered important? I don't understand. Why have that book then? What are the doctrines people must believe to be a Latter Day Saint in good standing?

If salvation is the concern, then the question may be why Smith saw fit to start a new church. I think he said he was told that every church had gone wrong. Did that mean people in those churches could not be saved? Were their doctrines so bad that salvation was impossible for people who belonged to them?

Giuliano, Just to add a dash of humor. Thousands and thousands of Protestant denominations, what was going through their heads? How many reasons can you have to start a new church?

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Giuliano, Just to add a dash of humor. Thousands and thousands of Protestant denominations, what was going through their heads? How many reasons can you have to start a new church?

Actually, there is a BIG move among born-again Christians away from denominations. More and more Christians in America consider themselves to be non-denominational at this point. (Research has shown this.) Then there are radicals like me who consider themselves to be anti-denominational.

 

[Grailhunter]

Actually, there is a BIG move among born-again Christians away from denominations. More and more Christians in America consider themselves to be non-denominational at this point. (Research has shown this.) Then there are radicals like me who consider themselves to be anti-denominational.

Ya...radical. It is nearly impossible to count the number of non-denominational churches. Some are denominational churches that bill themselves as non-denominational to appeal to a larger group of people. I think you are right that more and more people are becoming resistant to someone telling them what to believe. Culturally there is beginning to be political religions, the dividing line between conservative and liberal, democracy and communism. With less and less interest in God and focus on money.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Actually, there is a BIG move among born-again Christians away from denominations. More and more Christians in America consider themselves to be non-denominational at this point. (Research has shown this.) Then there are radicals like me who consider themselves to be anti-denominational.

And yet the same old arguments exist throughout. Calvinism vs Armninism, different leadership schemes, etc.

 

[farouk]

None of those things are equal to God's written word.

SOLA SCRIPTURA, indeed... :)

 

[Prayer Warrior]

And yet the same old arguments exist throughout. Calvinism vs Armninism, different leadership schemes, etc.

Do you understand that both sides of the free will/predestination coin (to name a major doctrinal difference
between the two) are found in the Bible? So, it's not the same thing as going outside the Bible for doctrine.

 

[Grailhunter]

Do you understand that both sides of the free will/predestination coin (to name a major doctrinal difference
between the two) are found in the Bible? So, it's not the same thing as going outside the Bible for doctrine.

a focus on any one scripture, particularly extremes can lead to misinterpretation of the meaning of the scripture or even the spirit of Christianity. Women are not save by child birth and washing feet....if we did not touch women, we would not be here talking....the lilies of the field do not toil, but if we did not work, we and our families would starve....we are not going to hate our mothers and fathers, we are not going to be bohemian Christians owning nothing but the clothes on our backs....helping the poor is the Christian thing to do, and may store treasures in heaven, but it is not salvation, do not resist evil would promulgate evil. You have to look at more than the words that are lined up in a sentence. In the case of Calvinism, it portrays God and a monstrous puppet master. What could possibly be the intent behind that.....to edify themselves? Which I would say violated the spirit of Christianity to the point of being sacrilegious.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

a focus on any one scripture, particularly extremes can lead to misinterpretation of the meaning of the scripture or even the spirit of Christianity. Women are not save by child birth and washing feet....if we did not touch women, we would not be here talking....the lilies of the field do not toil, but if we did not work, we and our families would starve....we are not going to hate our mothers and fathers, we are not going to be bohemian Christians owning nothing but the clothes on our backs....helping the poor is the Christian thing to do, and may store treasures in heaven, but it not salvation, do not resist evil would promulgate evil. You have to look at more than the words that are lined up in a sentence. In the case of Calvinism, it portrays God and a monstrous puppet master. What could possibly be the intent behind that.....to edify themselves?

Calvin didn't have it ALL right, but he didn't have it all wrong either. Same with Arminius, and Luther, and Wesley..... One thing to consider about these men is that none of them started their own religion based on a false vision. None of them wrote their own book and elevated it above Bible authority. That's a HUGE difference between Mormonism and the denominations started by these men.
.

 

[farouk]

None of them wrote their own book and elevated it above Bible authority.
.

We need SOLA SCRIPTURA indeed... :)

 

[Prayer Warrior]

We need SOLA SCRIPTURA indeed... :)

So, are you for it or against it, farouk??

 

[Grailhunter]

Calvin didn't have it ALL right, but he didn't have it all wrong either. Same with Arminius, and Luther, and Wesley..... One thing to consider about these men is that none of them started their own religion based on a false vision. None of them wrote their own book and elevated it above Bible authority. That's a HUGE difference between Mormonism and the denominations started by these men.
.

What organized religions has not been started by men? Some worst then others. Augustine was of such poor character that he thought all humanity was without discipline and as sinful as he. And he wrote theologies based on that. Calvin is the same, but I would mostly describe him as an insane genius. Based on the same Augustine concept that no one could control themselves. His answer was a God that controlled everything. He basically turned Christianity upside down....if you are forced by God to be good or bad, were does the blame lay? If your are predetermined, what is left Judge? If God predetermines sin then Satan is out of job, God becomes Satan.

 

[farouk]

So, are you for it or against it, farouk??

Very much for SOLA SCRIPTURA...

 

[Prayer Warrior]

What organized religions has not been started by men? Some worst then others. Augustine was of such poor character that he thought all humanity was without discipline and as sinful as he. And he wrote theologies based on that. Calvin is the same, but I would mostly describe him as an insane genius. Based on the same Augustine concept that no one could control themselves. His answer was a God that controlled everything. He basically turned Christianity upside down....if you are forced by God to be good or bad, were does the blame lay? If your are predetermined, what is left Judge? If God predetermines sin then Satan is out of job, God becomes Satan.

Hey, I'm all for debating Calvin's view of the BIBLICAL doctrine of predestination, but not on this thread. I happen NOT to agree with Calvin's view about this in case you didn't know.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Very much for SOLA SCRIPTURA...

Okay, I'm glad to know this. I wasn't sure what point you were trying to make, so I'm glad I asked you.
We can always ask and not assume, right? :)

 

[Grailhunter]

Hey, I'm all for debating Calvin's view of the BIBLICAL doctrine of predestination, but not on this thread. I happen NOT to agree with Calvin's view about this in case you didn't know.

I have never thought you were completely Calvinist, too independent for that. One of my points is that, all organized religions we know of today were organized by men.....we can blame the men for their errors....not to many women organized religions.

 

[farouk]

Okay, I'm glad to know this. I wasn't sure what point you were trying to make, so I'm glad I asked you.
We can always ask and not assume, right? :)

Glad to be clear!

 

[Prayer Warrior]

I have never thought you were completely Calvinist, too independent for that. One of my points is that, all organized religions we know of today were organized by men.....we can blame the men for their errors....not to many women organized religions.

The question is: what is the basis for their doctrine?? Is it the Bible or the Bible and something else or a mistranslated Bible?

Hey, you and I agree that men did this (mostly)! It started with the first Adam. But praise God that sin's dominion over us ended with the last Adam!

 

[Grailhunter]

Calvin didn't have it ALL right, but he didn't have it all wrong either. Same with Arminius, and Luther, and Wesley..... One thing to consider about these men is that none of them started their own religion based on a false vision. None of them wrote their own book and elevated it above Bible authority. That's a HUGE difference between Mormonism and the denominations started by these men.
.

None of them wrote their own book and elevated it above Bible authority. That's a HUGE difference between Mormonism and the denominations started by these men.

Yes a "modern" religion that has additional books....still within the spirit of Christianity and produces an application and character in it followers that is very Christian like. You and I are going to agree that Calvinism comes from scriptures....what good did it do them? The character of the followers of a religion and its application, speaks a lot to its correctness.

 

[Nondenom40]

What organized religions has not been started by men? Some worst then others. Augustine was of such poor character that he thought all humanity was without discipline and as sinful as he. And he wrote theologies based on that. Calvin is the same, but I would mostly describe him as an insane genius. Based on the same Augustine concept that no one could control themselves. His answer was a God that controlled everything. He basically turned Christianity upside down....if you are forced by God to be good or bad, were does the blame lay? If your are predetermined, what is left Judge? If God predetermines sin then Satan is out of job, God becomes Satan.

Read Romans 1-4.