What Makes Ex-Christians Think They Once Were Christians?

[mailmandan]

I see a lot of these so called testimonies being given by what is known as deconstruction .
They all came on with stories about how they once believed in and served Christ .
And yet , yet when i hear what turned them from Christ i see something .
THEY had the wrong mindset of the gospel and of Christ . Its like they truly never knew HIM at all .
They had some head knowledge but never seemed to really know HIM .
Beware of the deconstruction stuff . This too is a plan to try and convert folks into a mindset
that its not really needed to beleive on Christ . i smell anti christ all over it .
But i have also talked with others who had also thought they blasphemed the HOLY SPIRIT
I ask questions . And often when i ask them , TELL me when you were a christain
what leaders and preachers did you like to hear , A HEAR A LIST OF FALSE ONES .
Which proves something big to me . WHY WOULD a lamb have sat under and love to embrace
the most false preachers in the first place .
Its dire important , however , that we do warn just like the early church did .
And if they reminded THE CHURCH to continue in CHRIST , WE NEED to do the same .
See all those reminders in the bible . THEY WERE SPIRIT INSPIRED to help keep the lambs safe .
But this i do know , IF in the end anyone comes out and follows a false gospel , a lie
THEN THEY WERE NEVER TRULY OF US . Now john says that , SO I SAY THAT .
But they also gave a lot of reminders about keeping the faith UNTO THE END and what would occur
IF ONE DID NOT . cast out . WE cannot try and omit those warnings either .
THERE IS GOOD reason for everything that was written . IT IS FOR OUR LEARNING and we would be wise
to heed it and to teach it .

Here is my testimony. I grew up attending the Roman Catholic Church and I was what you would call, "religious but not right with God." I came to receive Jesus Christ through faith several years ago on a late Saturday night. About a month prior to that, my mother-in-law had passed away and I was very heart broken and thinking very seriously about the afterlife. Soon after she had passed away, I remember asking Jesus Christ that whatever it takes to get me to heaven, just put the answer right in front of my face so that I will know with absolute assurance here is the answer and now it's up to me to accept the truth.

I had no assurance of salvation prior to my conversion because I was trusting in works for salvation (like most) and not in Jesus Christ alone. Also, just prior to my conversion, I had read through a gospel tract that really caught my attention which led me to thoroughly search through the Scriptures. I knew the Lord was drawing me. Finally, after reading through the book of Romans and eventually the book of Ephesians, I came to Ephesians 2:8,9 and that's when the light came on! I had then placed my faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and knew without a doubt that I had become born again! Praise the Lord! Jesus did put the answer right in front of my face. :)

1 John 5:11 - And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

Now toying with the idea of permanently falling away, turning my back on Jesus etc.. is unfathomable to me. As for my belief in the gospel I feel it's too engrained in me and I am too convinced. The born again experience really changed me! (2 Corinthians 5:17) :)

I remember over the years prior to my conversion how several different people had tried to share the gospel with me, but at that time I did not have ears to hear and the truth just went right over my head, but right after my conversion, I could look back and say, "that's what he meant, that's what she meant, that's what they were trying to tell me!" The blinders were finally lifted, and I finally got it! Praise God! :)

 

[Stumpmaster]

The present tense of the word "justified" implies that these Galatians were contemplating justification by the law. They were getting sidetracked by legalistic teachers. "You who are trying to be justified by the law have fallen away from grace," but had they fully come to that place yet? Galatians 3:3 reads: Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? The middle voice implies "making yourselves perfect" by means of self-effort. The present tense indicates that the action is in progress and that there is still time to correct the error.

If these Galatians lost their salvation and it was a done deal, then why didn't Paul simply say you "lost your salvation" and I'm done with you? Instead, in verse 10, he said - I have confidence in you, in the Lord, that you will have no other mind; but he who troubles you shall bear his judgment, whoever he is. Why would Paul have confidence in these Galatians if they lost their salvation and it's all over for them? In verse 12, Paul uses hyperbole, as for those agitators, I wish they would go the whole way and emasculate themselves!

Those who "permanently" fall away fit 1 John 2:19. Paul did not say these Galatians lost their salvation and it's all over for them. When Jesus was arrested, the 11 remaining disciples were said to "fall away" in Matthew 26:31-35. Did they lose their salvation?

Paul speaks to us of the problem of turning away, it happens, that is my sole point in this thread, not whether salvation can be lost.

Gal 1:6-7 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, (7) which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ.

Again, Paul speaks to us about the problem of receiving the Spirit by the hearing of faith, and having begun in the Spirit becoming "bewitched" by falsehoods that amount to falling from grace. It happens, and so it leads to forfeiture of salvation if not repented of.

Gal 3:2-3 This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— (3) Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh?

 

[amigo de christo]

Here is my testimony. I grew up attending the Roman Catholic Church and I was what you would call, "religious but not right with God." I came to receive Jesus Christ through faith several years ago on a late Saturday night. About a month prior to that, my mother-in-law had passed away and I was very heart broken and thinking very seriously about the afterlife. Soon after she had passed away, I remember asking Jesus Christ that whatever it takes to get me to heaven, just put the answer right in front of my face so that I will know with absolute assurance here is the answer and now it's up to me to accept the truth.

I had no assurance of salvation prior to my conversion because I was trusting in works for salvation (like most) and not in Jesus Christ alone. Also, just prior to my conversion, I had read through a gospel tract that really caught my attention which led me to thoroughly search through the Scriptures. I knew the Lord was drawing me. Finally, after reading through the book of Romans and eventually the book of Ephesians, I came to Ephesians 2:8,9 and that's when the light came on! I had then placed my faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and knew without a doubt that I had become born again! Praise the Lord! Jesus did put the answer right in front of my face. :)

1 John 5:11 - And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

Now toying with the idea of permanently falling away, turning my back on Jesus etc.. is unfathomable to me. As for my belief in the gospel I feel it's too engrained in me and I am too convinced. The born again experience really changed me! (2 Corinthians 5:17) :)

I remember over the years prior to my conversion how several different people had tried to share the gospel with me, but at that time I did not have ears to hear and the truth just went right over my head, but right after my conversion, I could look back and say, "that's what he meant, that's what she meant, that's what they were trying to tell me!" The blinders were finally lifted, and I finally got it! Praise God! :)

Yep , TRUST IN CHRIST JESUS TILL THE LAST BREATH MY FRIEND .

 

[amigo de christo]

Here is my testimony. I grew up attending the Roman Catholic Church and I was what you would call, "religious but not right with God." I came to receive Jesus Christ through faith several years ago on a late Saturday night. About a month prior to that, my mother-in-law had passed away and I was very heart broken and thinking very seriously about the afterlife. Soon after she had passed away, I remember asking Jesus Christ that whatever it takes to get me to heaven, just put the answer right in front of my face so that I will know with absolute assurance here is the answer and now it's up to me to accept the truth.

I had no assurance of salvation prior to my conversion because I was trusting in works for salvation (like most) and not in Jesus Christ alone. Also, just prior to my conversion, I had read through a gospel tract that really caught my attention which led me to thoroughly search through the Scriptures. I knew the Lord was drawing me. Finally, after reading through the book of Romans and eventually the book of Ephesians, I came to Ephesians 2:8,9 and that's when the light came on! I had then placed my faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and knew without a doubt that I had become born again! Praise the Lord! Jesus did put the answer right in front of my face. :)

1 John 5:11 - And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

Now toying with the idea of permanently falling away, turning my back on Jesus etc.. is unfathomable to me. As for my belief in the gospel I feel it's too engrained in me and I am too convinced. The born again experience really changed me! (2 Corinthians 5:17) :)

I remember over the years prior to my conversion how several different people had tried to share the gospel with me, but at that time I did not have ears to hear and the truth just went right over my head, but right after my conversion, I could look back and say, "that's what he meant, that's what she meant, that's what they were trying to tell me!" The blinders were finally lifted, and I finally got it! Praise God! :)

TIME TO CONTEND FOR THE TRUE FAITH . This junk of the muslims believing in the same GOD we do , GOTTA GO .
IF you have the time go to the other thread and help me defend the one true faith OF CHRIST JESUS .
Its the JESUS CHRIST or allah thread .

 

[Lizbeth]

2 Corinthians 1:22 - who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.

2 Corinthians 5:5 - Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.

Ephesians 1:13 - In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

Ephesians 4:30 - And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

I'm not finding the words "unsealed" anywhere in scripture. There are genuine Christians and there are "nominal/pseudo" Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers mixed together in various churches and on various Christian forum sites. I'm convinced that those who permanently fall away had a faith that was never firmly rooted and established in the gospel to begin with. (1 John 2:19)

1 Corinthians 15:1 - Now, brothers and sisters, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word, I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain. To believe in vain is to believe without cause or without effect, to no purpose. If, as some are saying in Corinth, there is no resurrection, then faith is vain and worthless (vs. 14). The people who fail to hold fast to the word (the gospel) that Paul preached in 1 Corinthians 15:3-4, demonstrated that they "believed in vain" (did not truly believe).

Now of course, we should heed warnings from God, yet this does not mean that God's promises in regard to His saints is to be negated. Psalm 37:28 - For the Lord loves justice and does not forsake His saints; They are preserved forever, But the descendants of the wicked shall be cut off.

When Jesus was arrested, we see that the disciples were said to "fall away" and Peter even denied knowing Jesus three times! (Matthew 26:31-46) Of course, this was only a temporary weak moment for the remaining 11 disciples and not a permanent decision. In Proverbs 24:16, we read - For a righteous man may fall seven times and rise again, But the wicked shall fall by calamity.

It's a guarantee and necessary because the 'balance remaining' will come forth out of the earnest of the Spirit. The down payment (bride price of our betrothal) is paid to seal the betrothal contract, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible for a "bride-to-be" to break her end of it and no longer be willing to go through with the "marriage", because of the deceitfulness of sin hardening her heart, or that she would grieve the Holy Spirit to the point of Him departing if she doesn't repent. Where is the sealing and guarantee then if either party departs? Jesus said remain in me and I will remain in you. That is a condition of Him remaining in us.

 

[Lizbeth]

So, Precious friend, Under Grace, "All things are possible"? Except for One Thing:

Impossible to "lose, forfeit, or otherwise throw away" God's Eternal Salvation - i.e.:

1) He Established This 'Eternal' Relationship With 'repentant' unbelievers, who "trusted
believed, and placed ( By Grace Through ) 100% faith in The Precious BLOOD ( By Death ),
Burial, and Resurrection of The LORD Jesus Christ, According To The Pure Scriptures.
(Ephesians 2:8-9; 1 Corinthians 15:3-4; Romans Chapters 3-5)

2) The "Sealing Of The Holy Spirit" is the Earnest Of The New Owner of said recipient Of
God's Eternal Salvation, Which Cannot be abrogated by one who has "less power" than
God! It would mean that said one "has MORE Power" Than God = Impossible!! Amen?
(Ephesians 1:13, ↓ 4:30 ↓; 1 Corinthians 3:16, 6:19)

Eph_4:30 "And grieve not The Holy Spirit of God, Whereby ye Are Sealed Unto The Day
Of Redemption." Again, Impossible for this to be abrogated by puny men, Correct?

3) Another Impossibility is that we Cannot simply do away with What God Has
'Predestinated' for All His elect, of which He Is The New Owner, Correct?:

"For whom He Did Foreknow, He also Did Predestinate to be conformed to ​

the image of His SON, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren.​

Moreover whom He Did Predestinate, them He also called: and whom He called,​

them He also justified: and whom He justified, them He also glorified."​

4) We prefer not to displease ( 'grieve' ) God, insinuating that Over 12-Dozen Of His 'Plain And
Clear' Passages Of His 'Eternal' Operation On new-born babes In Christ 'are false' which,
of course, is Impossible!:

God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST
+
God's Eternal Assurance
+
God's Eternal Life Insurance

----------------------------------

More about Differences of Relationship vs fellowship ( "work out our OWN salvation" ) is here:

God's Simple Will ( Three Tenses Of God's Eternal Salvation )!

Amen.

Many fish are caught in the net, but some prove not to be good for eating and get thrown back into the sea. And Jesus said to the unprofitable servant who buried what he had been given, that even what he has will be taken away - this is why Jesus is coming as a thief. Not everyone who says to Him, Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven. And some people are simply not willing to pay the price to follow Him and return to their wallowing in the mud. Perhaps we are to understand Him foreknowing the elect has to do with foreknowing who will be faithful and endure to the end.

 

[mailmandan]

It's a guarantee and necessary because the 'balance remaining' will come forth out of the earnest of the Spirit. The down payment (bride price of our betrothal) is paid to seal the betrothal contract, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible for a "bride-to-be" to break her end of it and no longer be willing to go through with the "marriage", because of the deceitfulness of sin hardening her heart, or that she would grieve the Holy Spirit to the point of Him departing if she doesn't repent. Where is the sealing and guarantee then if either party departs? Jesus said remain in me and I will remain in you. That is a condition of Him remaining in us.

<1,,728,arrabon>
originally, "earnest-money" deposited by the purchaser and forfeited if the purchase was not completed, was probably a Phoenician word, introduced into Greece. In general usage it came to denote "a pledge" or "earnest" of any sort; in the NT it is used only of that which is assured by God to believers; it is said of the Holy Spirit as the Divine "pledge" of all their future blessedness, 2 Corinthians 1:22; 5:5; in Ephesians 1:14; 4:30 particularly of their eternal inheritance.

Earnest - Vine's Expository Dictionary of NT Words -

Ephesians 4:30 says - Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed unto/for the day of redemption. *Nothing is mentioned about being UN-sealed by the Holy Spirit/departing if you grieve the Holy Spirit.

As Greek scholar AT Robertson points out - Grieve not the Holy Spirit of God (mh lupeite to pneuma to agion tou qeou). "Cease grieving" or "do not have the habit of grieving." Who of us has not sometimes grieved the Holy Spirit?

Ephesians 4:30 Commentary - Robertson's Word Pictures of the New Testament

Out of the 12 disciples who did not remain? Only Judas Iscariot who was an unbelieving, unclean devil who betrayed Jesus. (John 6:64-71; 13:10-11) Those who remain confirm they are born of God.

 

[Lizbeth]

<1,,728,arrabon>
originally, "earnest-money" deposited by the purchaser and forfeited if the purchase was not completed, was probably a Phoenician word, introduced into Greece. In general usage it came to denote "a pledge" or "earnest" of any sort; in the NT it is used only of that which is assured by God to believers; it is said of the Holy Spirit as the Divine "pledge" of all their future blessedness, 2 Corinthians 1:22; 5:5; in Ephesians 1:14; 4:30 particularly of their eternal inheritance.

Earnest - Vine's Expository Dictionary of NT Words -

Ephesians 4:30 says - Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed unto/for the day of redemption. *Nothing is mentioned about being UN-sealed by the Holy Spirit/departing if you grieve the Holy Spirit.

As Greek scholar AT Robertson points out - Grieve not the Holy Spirit of God (mh lupeite to pneuma to agion tou qeou). "Cease grieving" or "do not have the habit of grieving." Who of us has not sometimes grieved the Holy Spirit?

Ephesians 4:30 Commentary - Robertson's Word Pictures of the New Testament

Out of the 12 disciples who did not remain? Only Judas Iscariot who was an unbelieving, unclean devil who betrayed Jesus. (John 6:64-71; 13:10-11) Those who remain confirm they are born of God.

Grieving the Holy Spirit doesn't always mean He departs irrevocably, but if we were to keep on grieving Him in grievous ways without repenting, He may. Look how He departed Israel....Ichabod. These things happened to Israel for OUR example and warning.

We just can't myopically look at some scriptures while ignoring the clear teachings and admonitions of others:

2Pe 2:20-22

For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Heb 6:4-6

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Clearly it is possible to harden the heart and irrevocably fall away. We're warned that the devil prowls around seeking who he may devour for good reason, because sadly it can happen that some get devoured.

 

[mailmandan]

Grieving the Holy Spirit doesn't always mean He departs irrevocably, but if we were to keep on grieving Him in grievous ways without repenting, He may. Look how He departed Israel....Ichabod. These things happened to Israel for OUR example and warning.

We just can't myopically look at some scriptures while ignoring the clear teachings and admonitions of others:

2Pe 2:20-22

For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Heb 6:4-6

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Clearly it is possible to harden the heart and irrevocably fall away. We're warned that the devil prowls around seeking who he may devour for good reason, because sadly it can happen that some get devoured.

See posts #49 and #77 from the thread below:

What is "OSAS"?

These vile extremes do not represent Baptists or other Christians in general in the OSAS camp, so it's an unfair label. There are folks in the NOSAS camp who teach the extreme that if you don't live a sinless, perfect life 100% of the time after conversion then you will lose your salvation...

www.christianityboard.com

 

[amigo de christo]

Grieving the Holy Spirit doesn't always mean He departs irrevocably, but if we were to keep on grieving Him in grievous ways without repenting, He may. Look how He departed Israel....Ichabod. These things happened to Israel for OUR example and warning.

We just can't myopically look at some scriptures while ignoring the clear teachings and admonitions of others:

2Pe 2:20-22

For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.

For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Heb 6:4-6

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Clearly it is possible to harden the heart and irrevocably fall away. We're warned that the devil prowls around seeking who he may devour for good reason, because sadly it can happen that some get devoured.

JESUS warned we warn . the apostels warned we warn .
And this is coming from a man who believes whole heartedly what john said . IF THEY Come out from amongst us
they were never truly of us .
YET THOSE SAME MEN , WARNED the church to COTINUE IN CHRIST , and they warned what would occur IF WE DID NOT .
THIS OSAS DOES NOT DO . rather it creates a mindset that produces SLOTHUFLNESS and in turn
many become hardened through the deceitfulness of sin . SEE THE PROBLEM .
EVERY APOSTEL KNEW JESUS , EVERY APOSTEL WARNED TOO . THIS OSAS DOES NOT DO .
THEY have left off NEEDFUL REMINDERS . I mean even when i remind folks we must continue in CHRIST
THEY CALL Or think its legalism . TO EVEN REMIND WE MUST DO SO . SOMETHING HAS WENT BAD WRONG .
STAY DUG IN THAT BIBLE SISTER . SEE I KNOW if folks DO fall away they were NEVER TRULY OF US
BUT THE SAME SPIRIT that had JOHN say that , ALSO SAID , and warned the church Against the dire and deadly dangers of sin
OF THE DIRE NEED TO CONTINUE IN CHRIST .
YOU see , the problem is most folks see those reminders as legalism . I SEE THEM AS THE WORK OF GOD KEEPING US SAFE .
BINGO . SEE JESUS knows how to keep the lambs safe . ITS MEN who DONT . ITS MEN
who create acronyms TO FEEL safe , to feel saved . BUT GOD KNOWS WHAT WE NEED .
AND what we need , WELL ITS ALL THOSE REMINDERS DAILY . THOSE reminders
are OF THE LORD . If anyone of us has ever been a parent who loves our child
DO WE not remind them . SO DOES GOD REMIND US . These folks who surrendered to an acroynm
abandoned the needful warnings WHICH DO KEEP US SAFE . EVERY WORD IN THAT BIBLE was for our good .
ONLY NOW those reminders are either twisted or even omitted under the guise of the golden bull of men .
GOD KNOWS how to keep us safe . HIS WARNINGS ARE PART OF THAT . THEY OMIT THE WARNINGS .
That is why many fall .

 

[L.A.M.B.]

Salvation was purchased by Christ and is truly free to whosoever will.
Not by my might, not by my power, not by any work from myself could I ever purchase, sacrifice or earn this precious gift.
All I have to do is accept Jesus, to receive SALVATION. It is the gift of God for the penalty price of mans sin. Jesus said, " It is finished"; meaning no more bulls and goats but the door to God, the Father, is now opened thru his sacrifice.

Eternal life or eternal security is the continuing hope of our salvation but comes with conditions of obedience and faith.

Say I'm given, off the factory, a brand spanking new Hunter green convertible Jaguar, ( my dream car) I drive it home, park it in my covered garage and for 20 years, never CK the fluids, brakes, engine and never drive it again. That car may look pristine but is it usable ? I don't know, it hasn't been driven for 20 yrs. Maybe the engine is locked, the tires have dry rotted.......ect,ect.

Receiving salvation, a gift or way to have a relationship with God, thru Jesus is free. Neglecting so great a gift and not walking and increasing in my faith by study praying and obeying, neglects that gift, the same as my dream car. I am so against T. U. L I. but I strongly agree with the p or perseverance of that theology. We must, for we have no other choice but to continue in, hold fast, be unmovable, and bear fruit as we remain in the vine.ect ect. Be faithful unto the end, of our natural life or his 2nd coming.

Now we can claim the gift but through neglect of, it becomes useless to ourselves and the KOG. Like a broken watch, it will only be right twice in a 24h period.

Salvation free, eternal security, conditional on us to ENDURE ( not just sit and wait and do nothing in the building up in the KOG by increasing in soul gathering ) unto the end.


Choose to either be a good steward of that we have received or how shall we escape if we NEGLECT so great a salvation!

 

[mailmandan]

JESUS warned we warn . the apostels warned we warn .
And this is coming from a man who believes whole heartedly what john said . IF THEY Come out from amongst us
they were never truly of us .
YET THOSE SAME MEN , WARNED the church to COTINUE IN CHRIST , and they warned what would occur IF WE DID NOT .
THIS OSAS DOES NOT DO . rather it creates a mindset that produces SLOTHUFLNESS and in turn
many become hardened through the deceitfulness of sin . SEE THE PROBLEM .
EVERY APOSTEL KNEW JESUS , EVERY APOSTEL WARNED TOO . THIS OSAS DOES NOT DO .
THEY have left off NEEDFUL REMINDERS . I mean even when i remind folks we must continue in CHRIST
THEY CALL Or think its legalism . TO EVEN REMIND WE MUST DO SO . SOMETHING HAS WENT BAD WRONG .
STAY DUG IN THAT BIBLE SISTER . SEE I KNOW if folks DO fall away they were NEVER TRULY OF US
BUT THE SAME SPIRIT that had JOHN say that , ALSO SAID , and warned the church Against the dire and deadly dangers of sin
OF THE DIRE NEED TO CONTINUE IN CHRIST .
YOU see , the problem is most folks see those reminders as legalism . I SEE THEM AS THE WORK OF GOD KEEPING US SAFE .
BINGO . SEE JESUS knows how to keep the lambs safe . ITS MEN who DONT . ITS MEN
who create acronyms TO FEEL safe , to feel saved . BUT GOD KNOWS WHAT WE NEED .
AND what we need , WELL ITS ALL THOSE REMINDERS DAILY . THOSE reminders
are OF THE LORD . If anyone of us has ever been a parent who loves our child
DO WE not remind them . SO DOES GOD REMIND US . These folks who surrendered to an acroynm
abandoned the needful warnings WHICH DO KEEP US SAFE . EVERY WORD IN THAT BIBLE was for our good .
ONLY NOW those reminders are either twisted or even omitted under the guise of the golden bull of men .
GOD KNOWS how to keep us safe . HIS WARNINGS ARE PART OF THAT . THEY OMIT THE WARNINGS .
That is why many fall .

Here is a good warning, especially for "nominal" Christians.

2 Corinthians 13:5 - Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you—unless indeed you fail the test?

 

[L.A.M.B.]

Please do not start throwing your labels at me; a works salvationist, a lose your salvationists, a pharisee, a legalists, ect ect. I have seen and heard it all.

I live by and am led by the Spirit, I walk in what thus it is written. I am only responsible for what I do and say.

Working out my salvation is my continuous journey as I press toward the high calling mark of God, to be in his grace at the end of my journey!

This I say if responding to post 171 by myself.

 

[amigo de christo]

Please do not start throwing your labels at me; a works salvationist, a lose your salvationists, a pharisee, a legalists, ect ect. I have seen and heard it all.

I live by and am led by the Spirit, I walk in what thus it is written. I am only responsible for what I do and say.

Working out my salvation is my continuous journey as I press toward the high calling mark of God, to be in his grace at the end of my journey!

This I say if responding to post 171 by myself.

Hit the trenches sister . TO THE GLORIOUS LORD WE SHALL POINT . EVERY word is good for our soul .
March onwards dear sister .

 

[Stumpmaster]

It's a guarantee and necessary because the 'balance remaining' will come forth out of the earnest of the Spirit. The down payment (bride price of our betrothal) is paid to seal the betrothal contract, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible for a "bride-to-be" to break her end of it and no longer be willing to go through with the "marriage", because of the deceitfulness of sin hardening her heart, or that she would grieve the Holy Spirit to the point of Him departing if she doesn't repent. Where is the sealing and guarantee then if either party departs? Jesus said remain in me and I will remain in you. That is a condition of Him remaining in us.

Example: The three-part removal

Rev 22:19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part

• from the Book of Life,
• from the holy city, and
• from the things which are written in this book.

 

[Lizbeth]

JESUS warned we warn . the apostels warned we warn .
And this is coming from a man who believes whole heartedly what john said . IF THEY Come out from amongst us
they were never truly of us .
YET THOSE SAME MEN , WARNED the church to COTINUE IN CHRIST , and they warned what would occur IF WE DID NOT .
THIS OSAS DOES NOT DO . rather it creates a mindset that produces SLOTHUFLNESS and in turn
many become hardened through the deceitfulness of sin . SEE THE PROBLEM .
EVERY APOSTEL KNEW JESUS , EVERY APOSTEL WARNED TOO . THIS OSAS DOES NOT DO .
THEY have left off NEEDFUL REMINDERS . I mean even when i remind folks we must continue in CHRIST
THEY CALL Or think its legalism . TO EVEN REMIND WE MUST DO SO . SOMETHING HAS WENT BAD WRONG .
STAY DUG IN THAT BIBLE SISTER . SEE I KNOW if folks DO fall away they were NEVER TRULY OF US
BUT THE SAME SPIRIT that had JOHN say that , ALSO SAID , and warned the church Against the dire and deadly dangers of sin
OF THE DIRE NEED TO CONTINUE IN CHRIST .
YOU see , the problem is most folks see those reminders as legalism . I SEE THEM AS THE WORK OF GOD KEEPING US SAFE .
BINGO . SEE JESUS knows how to keep the lambs safe . ITS MEN who DONT . ITS MEN
who create acronyms TO FEEL safe , to feel saved . BUT GOD KNOWS WHAT WE NEED .
AND what we need , WELL ITS ALL THOSE REMINDERS DAILY . THOSE reminders
are OF THE LORD . If anyone of us has ever been a parent who loves our child
DO WE not remind them . SO DOES GOD REMIND US . These folks who surrendered to an acroynm
abandoned the needful warnings WHICH DO KEEP US SAFE . EVERY WORD IN THAT BIBLE was for our good .
ONLY NOW those reminders are either twisted or even omitted under the guise of the golden bull of men .
GOD KNOWS how to keep us safe . HIS WARNINGS ARE PART OF THAT . THEY OMIT THE WARNINGS .
That is why many fall .

Amen. It all needs to be preached, not just the easier parts - God's word has power to continually wash us, which we need.

 

[Lizbeth]

Salvation was purchased by Christ and is truly free to whosoever will.
Not by my might, not by my power, not by any work from myself could I ever purchase, sacrifice or earn this precious gift.
All I have to do is accept Jesus, to receive SALVATION. It is the gift of God for the penalty price of mans sin. Jesus said, " It is finished"; meaning no more bulls and goats but the door to God, the Father, is now opened thru his sacrifice.

Eternal life or eternal security is the continuing hope of our salvation but comes with conditions of obedience and faith.

Say I'm given, off the factory, a brand spanking new Hunter green convertible Jaguar, ( my dream car) I drive it home, park it in my covered garage and for 20 years, never CK the fluids, brakes, engine and never drive it again. That car may look pristine but is it usable ? I don't know, it hasn't been driven for 20 yrs. Maybe the engine is locked, the tires have dry rotted.......ect,ect.

Receiving salvation, a gift or way to have a relationship with God, thru Jesus is free. Neglecting so great a gift and not walking and increasing in my faith by study praying and obeying, neglects that gift, the same as my dream car. I am so against T. U. L I. but I strongly agree with the p or perseverance of that theology. We must, for we have no other choice but to continue in, hold fast, be unmovable, and bear fruit as we remain in the vine.ect ect. Be faithful unto the end, of our natural life or his 2nd coming.

Now we can claim the gift but through neglect of, it becomes useless to ourselves and the KOG. Like a broken watch, it will only be right twice in a 24h period.

Salvation free, eternal security, conditional on us to ENDURE ( not just sit and wait and do nothing in the building up in the KOG by increasing in soul gathering ) unto the end.


Choose to either be a good steward of that we have received or how shall we escape if we NEGLECT so great a salvation!

Amen - we need to have some fruits to show for our faith, otherwise faith without works is dead. And obedience is better than sacrifice - we need to be obeying His will for us individually as well as obeying His word generally. We serve a living God, not just a dead letter, who leads and guides us personally, and is actively involved in 'molding and making' us.

 

[Lizbeth]

Here is a good warning, especially for "nominal" Christians.

2 Corinthians 13:5 - Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you—unless indeed you fail the test?

Yes, make sure He is still in us, that we haven't departed Him, thus causing Him to depart from us.

Heb 3:12
Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

 

[Lizbeth]

Example: The three-part removal

Rev 22:19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part

• from the Book of Life,
• from the holy city, and
• from the things which are written in this book.

That kind of reminds me of this in the old testament as well:

Hos 9:11
As for Ephraim, their glory shall fly away like a bird, from the birth, and from the womb, and from the conception.

 

[mailmandan]

Yes, make sure He is still in us, that we haven't departed Him, thus causing Him to depart from us.

Heb 3:12
Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.

The apostle Paul said test yourselves to see if you are "in the faith" and not still in the faith.

You need to read Hebrews 3:12 in context. Hebrews 3:8 - Do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion, in the day of trial in the wilderness, 9 Where your fathers tested Me, tried Me, and saw My works forty years. 10 Therefore I was angry with that generation, and said, 'They always go astray in their heart, and they have not known My ways.' Not descriptive of genuine believers. There is no loss of salvation here. Only a failure to receive it. Verses 18-19 - And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who did not obey? So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief. That explains the hardened heart. It took them in the opposite direction of God. Heard the truth for a time, but then hardened heart and departing from God became their final answer.

*Jude 1:5 - The Lord delivered His people (the Israelites) out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe.

Hebrews 3:14 - For we have become [past tense Gk. verb, gegonamen, meaning we have become already] partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end. Notice that this is essentially a repeat of verse 6, where we read: but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house - whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end. The wording is not - "and you will become (future indicative) partakers of Christ if you (future indicative) hold fast." It is rather - "you have been, and now are, partakers of Christ (demonstrative evidence) if in the future you hold fast."

The point is that not all of these Hebrews have become partakers of Christ and of course, the only ones in the end who will be identified as genuine believers/partakers of Christ will have been those who held fast the beginning of their confidence steadfast to the end. Those faltering Hebrews who depart from God may begin with loud confidence and profession of loyalty. But then later? Future perseverance is proof of genuine conversion.

In Hebrews 4:1-2, we read - "For indeed the gospel was preached to US as well as to THEM; but the word which THEY heard did not profit THEM, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. For WE who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, 'They shall not enter My rest," although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. Obviously, not all of these Hebrews were genuine believers. Notice that verses 2-3 make a distinction between US who have BELIEVED and do enter that rest and THEM who heard the word but did not mix faith with what they heard and will not enter that rest because of UNBELIEF.