What is the purpose of infant baptism?

[JBO]

False.
Peter did say the water in Water Baptism is symbolic of internal, spiritual Salvation. In other words, the water itself doesn't save. The ritual "saves" only in the sense that it represents the internal reality that *preceded* the ritual.

Nah, Peter didn't say anything like that at all. He simply stated the purpose for baptism which you seem to reject. Neither water itself nor the ritual itself saves. It is only God who saves.

It is non sequitur because it does not follow that getting baptism is part of the formula that produces the Salvation. If it is only the Faith that is producing the Salvation. Water Baptism is just an add-on ritual, confirming that Salvation has already taken place.

I am not surprised that you would disagree with Jesus. You think salvation takes place before sins are forgiven? That is a bit odd to say the least.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Nah, Peter didn't say anything like that at all. He simply stated the purpose for baptism which you seem to reject. Neither water itself nor the ritual itself saves. It is only God who saves.

I am not surprised that you would disagree with Jesus. You think salvation takes place before sins are forgiven? That is a bit odd to say the least.

I don't really care if you want to believe Water saves you. Peter said it doesn't, that it's purely symbolic of internal Salvation.

1 Pet 3.21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God.

If Water Baptism was literal, the water would be used to wash the body of bodily pollution. That is how water literally cleanses!

But this water in Baptism is *not* literal! The water purely symbolizes purification, not externally but inwardly. Therefore, the water, whether of the Flood or in Baptism, is symbolic of internal, spiritual purification.

Baptism is described as a symbolic ritual, patterned after the waters of the Flood, that represents our identification with Christ through faith and through our confession. Baptism itself is a form of confession. It is a "pledge of a clear conscience toward God."

It is the *pledge* that saves--not waters that are purifying our bodies of bodily pollution. The ritual itself, is said to be a work bringing Salvation, is being advanced as a form of Salvation by Works, or Legalism, or self-redemption.

Christ atoned for our sin. He did not die to give us Water Baptism so that Water Baptism could purify us of our sin. He died so that we could confess his work as our Salvation and thus turn from our own ways and rely on him, or identify with him spiritually.

We get Water Baptized as part of our confession, as part of our "pledge," so that we identify with Christ via the ritual of Baptism, showing that we have *already made the choice to follow Christ,* and have *already been saved by our choice to live for Christ.* Water Baptism is part of the confession that has saved us, and continues to save us.

You are corrupting Salvation with your Works theology. Rituals do not save. Confessing our choice to follow Christ does.

 

[quietthinker]

Because your response was nonsense.

If you want to have a real conversation - then refute the Scriptural evidence I've presented add make a solid case for your position.
This is Debating 101 . . .

you wouldn't believe BOL, even if one rose from the dead.

 

[Fred J]

False.
Peter did say the water in Water Baptism is symbolic of internal, spiritual Salvation. In other words, the water itself doesn't save. The ritual "saves" only in the sense that it represents the internal reality that *preceded* the ritual.

It is non sequitur because it does not follow that getting baptism is part of the formula that produces the Salvation. If it is only the Faith that is producing the Salvation. Water Baptism is just an add-on ritual, confirming that Salvation has already taken place.

That's your version but the scripture is very clear, even declared by Apostle Peter the 'rock' himself.

John 3:
5. Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the Kingdom of GOD.

Acts 2:
38. Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 10::
47. Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
48. And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. .....................

Romans 10:
17. So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of GOD.

2Timothy 3:
16. All scripture is given by inspiration of GOD, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17. That the man of GOD may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

First we're baptized with water for the remission of sins, and then we receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Shalom in the name of Jesus Christ

 

[Spyder]

At some point, those who wish to discuss scripture must realize that they are discussing only their translations in English - translated from the perspective of the translator. Those who choose to NOT do it word for word end up creating a different understanding than the writer intended. 1 Peter 3:21 reads differently depending on the translator used:

Berean Literal Bible
which also prefigures the baptism now saving you, not a putting away of the filth of flesh, but the demand of a good conscience toward God, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

King James Bible
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

New King James Version
There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

New American Standard Bible
Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

NASB 1995
Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you— not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience— through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

NASB 1977
And corresponding to that, baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Legacy Standard Bible
Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal of a good conscience to God—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Not many translations even try to say that baptism is only a symbol of some done deal.

 

[JBO]

I don't really care if you want to believe Water saves you. Peter said it doesn't, that it's purely symbolic of internal Salvation.

1 Pet 3.21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God.

If Water Baptism was literal, the water would be used to wash the body of bodily pollution. That is how water literally cleanses!

But this water in Baptism is *not* literal! The water purely symbolizes purification, not externally but inwardly. Therefore, the water, whether of the Flood or in Baptism, is symbolic of internal, spiritual purification.

Baptism is described as a symbolic ritual, patterned after the waters of the Flood, that represents our identification with Christ through faith and through our confession. Baptism itself is a form of confession. It is a "pledge of a clear conscience toward God."

It is the *pledge* that saves--not waters that are purifying our bodies of bodily pollution. The ritual itself, is said to be a work bringing Salvation, is being advanced as a form of Salvation by Works, or Legalism, or self-redemption.

Christ atoned for our sin. He did not die to give us Water Baptism so that Water Baptism could purify us of our sin. He died so that we could confess his work as our Salvation and thus turn from our own ways and rely on him, or identify with him spiritually.

We get Water Baptized as part of our confession, as part of our "pledge," so that we identify with Christ via the ritual of Baptism, showing that we have *already made the choice to follow Christ,* and have *already been saved by our choice to live for Christ.* Water Baptism is part of the confession that has saved us, and continues to save us.

You are corrupting Salvation with your Works theology. Rituals do not save. Confessing our choice to follow Christ does.

I am sorry, but that is about the stupidest analysis of 1 Peter 3:21 that I have ever read. The water of the flood of Noah washed away the evil in the world (Gen e:5-7: 21-23). It was a type. The antitype is the water of baptism which washes away sin (Acts 22:16; 1 Cor 5:11)).

Peter said "Baptism, ......., now saves you, ........., through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,"

 

[BreadOfLife]

you wouldn't believe BOL, even if one rose from the dead.

Not only do I believe that with every fiber of my being – it was the Catholic Church who told the WORLD about the Resurrection of Jesus Christ and declared the Canon of Scripture.

 

[Fred J]

Not only do I believe that with every fiber of my being – it was the Catholic Church who told the WORLD about the Resurrection of Jesus Christ and declared the Canon of Scripture.

It's not surprising these blind guides lie to fit their papacy denominational agenda, as the Jew blind guides lied to Jesus to fit their sect agenda.

Let me give you wise readers by scripture the similarity between this denomination and Jesus' time Jewish sect. For it is written;

Matthew 23:
15. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

This is how in similarity the catholic denomination on it's own made disciples of all nation in catholicism. On the other hand, in the same era of this denomination, we the reformationist with the Waldenses among others, made disciples of all nation as how the Apostles of Jesus did.

The Waldenses, members of a Christian movement that originated in 12th century France, the devotees of which sought to follow Christ in poverty and simplicity. The movement is sometimes viewed as an early forerunner of the Reformation for its rejection of various catholic tenets.

Shalom in the name of Jesus Christ

 

[Truther]

Purposes of paedobaptism:

1. As a parallel with circumcision in the Old Testament, Luke 2:21.
2. Initiate the baby into the Christian community because his parent is a Christian, Acts 16:33, 1 Corinthians 7:14.

I baptized all my 5 kids by near submersion in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit when they were 8 days old. I understand that the evidence for infant baptism in the Bible is not explicit and is debatable. So, when my kids were teenagers, I told them that if they believed that was sufficient, there would be no need to be baptized again; but if not, feel free to have an official adult believer's baptism from a reputable local church.

Infants are unable to obey Acts 2:38.

 

[Truther]

Another weird thing that the Roman Catholics practice, the Bible says to go and teach all nations baptizing them… I have never heard of a Catholic teaching an infant and baptizing them. What’s wrong with this picture?

 

[Truther]

The biblical order is to teach them then to baptize them. Not baptize them, then teach them. Boy what a mess.

 

[Truther]

The Roman Catholics teach you, he that is baptized then eventually believeth shall be saved.

They are as bad as their protestant daughters that teach he that believeth and is saved shall be baptized… Lol

 

[Truther]

Not only do I believe that with every fiber of my being – it was the Catholic Church who told the WORLD about the Resurrection of Jesus Christ and declared the Canon of Scripture.

Wrong, over 500 people witnessed the resurrected Jesus and told the world of it. Then the NT was written about it, pre Catholicism.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Wrong, over 500 people witnessed the resurrected Jesus and told the world of it. Then the NT was written about it, pre Catholicism.

The 500 witnessaes were all Catholics.
Catholics wrote, compiled and declated the Canon of Scripture in 382 AD at the Council of Rome.

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

The Roman Catholics teach you, he that is baptized then eventually believeth shall be saved.

They are as bad as their protestant daughters that teach he that believeth and is saved shall be baptized… Lol

Truther borrows this lie from the Seventh Day Adventists, but will deny any association with them.

 

[BreadOfLife]

It's not surprising these blind guides lie to fit their papacy denominational agenda, as the Jew blind guides lied to Jesus to fit their sect agenda.

Let me give you wise readers by scripture the similarity between this denomination and Jesus' time Jewish sect. For it is written;

Matthew 23:
15. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

This is the kind of blunder one makes what he ignotantly yanks verses out of their proper context
Peter spoke wisely about YOU when he wrote:
2 Pet. 3:16
There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.

This is how in similarity the catholic denomination on it's own made disciples of all nation in catholicism. On the other hand, in the same era of this denomination, we the reformationist with the Waldenses among others, made disciples of all nation as how the Apostles of Jesus did.

The Catholic Church is the Original Tree from whih Protestantism splintered into "denominations" ceturies later

The Waldenses, members of a Christian movement that originated in 12th century France, the devotees of which sought to follow Christ in poverty and simplicity. The movement is sometimes viewed as an early forerunner of the Reformation for its rejection of various catholic tenets.

Shalom in the name of Jesus Christ

The Catholic Church originated in FIRT century Jerudalem
You ALL came centuries later . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Truther borrows this lie from the Seventh Day Adventists, but will deny any association with them.

Yes, I've had many wacjy exchanges with him about hius aberrant beliefs . . .

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

The Church is the mystical body of Christ. In Scripture, Jesus says, “Where two or three gather in my name, there am I with them.” (Matt. 18.20)

From early on, Christians dedicated buildings for their communal worship to God. Most of these early churches are long lost to history, yet some from the first few centuries still remain, at least in some condition.

Here is a picture of the oldest known church, which is partially still standing:​

This might not seem like much, but wait until you see what they found inside.​

Located in Dura-Europos, Syria, it is known today simply as the “Dura-Europos house church.” It is believed to have been built around A.D. 229 as a house and started being used as a church between A.D. 233 and 256. This means that it’s around 1791 years old.
As you can see from the picture, only a few walls are left. It was excavated in the early 20th century, and scientists found some pretty interesting things.

First of all, they found fragments of scrolls with Eucharistic prayers that are related to the text of the Didache (an early, extra-biblical Christian text dated to the first century).

But most amazingly, the church had incredible frescoes in the area used as a baptistry (where they did baptisms). These are some of the oldest Christian images in the world.

Here is a photo of a Baptistry wall painting, which includes an image of David and Goliath (with an inscription):​

​

This one is a depiction of the Gospel story of the healing of the paralytic:​

​

Here’s Christ and Peter walking on water:​

​

Here is Christ as the Good Shepherd:​

​

The Samaritan woman at the well:
​

​

And the women at the tomb:​

This 1791 year old church is not the property of the Catholic Church,
it is the property of humanity.

​

 

[Jude Thaddeus]

“I believe in God, not in a Catholic God; there is no Catholic God. There is God and I believe in Jesus Christ, his incarnation. Jesus is my teacher and my pastor, but God, the Father, Abba, is the light and the Creator. This is my Being.”
Pope Francis

 

[Truther]

The 500 witnessaes were all Catholics.
Catholics wrote, compiled and declated the Canon of Scripture in 382 AD at the Council of Rome.

Your post is a false witness of the 500 true witnesses. There was no such thing as the Roman Catholic Church in the first century.