What Is A Christian?

[Job]

Yes. It sounds like Krishna.

Ok.

Never mind.

o

 

[GodsGrace]

According to Scriptures, the meaning of “Christian” means to be “of Christ” and a follower of Christ, while a disciple is one who follows a teacher (any teacher).

To be of Christ a person must first become “born-again” as per John 3, and he cannot make himself born again unless he is born from above (John 1:13). To become a “child of God” he must also have been predestined/elected to salvation before the foundations of the world.

Jesus declared, “I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the father, but by me” (John 14:6).

AND

“No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day” (John 6:44).

So what is a Christian???...one who is saved and adheres to the Bible alone and in it's entirety is the word of God!

To God Be The Glory

To God be the Glory.

The persons who followed Jesus were called disciples. You quote John 6 a lot so I'm sure you've read that term in John 6.
John 6:66

Today the term disciple is also used to mean a follower of Christ.
In fact, IMHO, everyone should take discipleship course. Mine lasted about a year of going every week to a pastor's classroom and it changed how I saw Christianity. It became the Kingdom of God, which starts right here on earth.

Also, for those reading along, I do NOT want to derail this thread, but I must say that we were predestined before time to be LIKE CHRIST. NOT to be saved. Being saved is a decision we each make individually. God turns no man down.
Romans 8:29-30

EVERYONE who wishes to become born again or born from above is invited to do so because God calls ALL men to be saved.
John 3:16 WHOEVER BELIEVES
Romans 10:13 WHOEVER CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD
1 John 4:5 WHOEVER CONFESSES
2 Peter :9 THE LORD WISHES ALL TO COME TO REPENTANCE

 

[GodsGrace]

Ok.

Never mind.

o

Don't you agree that Jesus is unique?
The resurrection makes Him unique.

 

[GodsGrace]

First called Christians in the church at Antioch, so Scripture says. Were they all born again? Weren't there wheat and tares in that church?
So maybe they were all baptized, and that should be the sign of a person being a Christian.

Hi tabletalk,

Every Catholic is baptized.
Not every Catholic will be saved.

As far as everyone being called a Christian back then...
There was such a high price to be paid to being called Christian.
There probably were some tares, but most probably not many---as there are today.

Would you agree?

 

[GodsGrace]

As has been said...we just ARE... :)
Yet as we know, out in the world, the word 'Christian' is not what it used to be at the beginning... it has become a dirty word to many 'out there.' So I never use it to describe myself. I use the word "Believer." I find people ask more questions when I say I am a believer...depending who I am speaking to, I sometimes say-
"I am a believing believer." ( Believer in action, not just passively 'waiting for heaven.' )

Acts 11:26 "And when he had found him, ( Saul/Paul) he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch."
'Christian' was as it were ,a 'nick-name' for the followers of Jesus Christ put upon them by those who observed their walk and life.

Maybe believer should be the new word !
Is it necessary to believe that Jesus is God?

 

[lforrest]

Maybe believer should be the new word !
Is it necessary to believe that Jesus is God?

Yes.

 

[twinc]

Hi tabletalk,

Every Catholic is baptized.
Not every Catholic will be saved.

As far as everyone being called a Christian back then...
There was such a high price to be paid to being called Christian.
There probably were some tares, but most probably not many---as there are today.

Would you agree?

agreed not every Catholic will be saved but only Catholics will be saved - that is why one and all need to be, are and will be born again as Catholic = extra ecclesiam nulla salus - twinc

 

[tabletalk]

Hi tabletalk,

Every Catholic is baptized.
Not every Catholic will be saved.

As far as everyone being called a Christian back then...
There was such a high price to be paid to being called Christian.
There probably were some tares, but most probably not many---as there are today.

Would you agree?

I agree there was probably a lower percentage of tares in the very early church, compared with todays church.
The word Christian doesn't seem to be defined in Scripture as far as I can tell. I'd prefer a solid definition which would be an absolute determination of someone's salvation, but that can't be done, as only God knows the heart.
I made a profession of faith at 15 years old and was baptized, but led an ungodly life for the next 27 years; then I believed the Lord at 42 years old. So, even though I was baptized I was not converted until much later, and I don't think I should have been called a Christian all that time simply because of my baptism.

 

[GodsGrace]

agreed not every Catholic will be saved but only Catholics will be saved - that is why one and all need to be, are and will be born again as Catholic = extra ecclesiam nulla salus - twinc

Here are two ideas for you:

1. Back when EENS was pronounced, there was ONLY the catholic Church. There was no other Church to which one could belong.

So, of course, if one was OUTSIDE the Church, it meant they were not a believer and could not be saved. In the opinion of the Catholic Church, of course.

2. Everyone is saved through he Church somehow. How else would the message of God be proclaimed? It has Always been proclaimed through an organized institution - much as some may not like them, they ARE necessary.

Somehow or other, every person who believes is saved throught the catholic Church.
Now, do we mean the Catholic Church with offices down in Rome, or do we mean the universal Church (Body of Christ) this is not clear to me, and I've spoke to different persons who would know about this.

See:
CCC 832
837
847
1267
1268
1271

Also, see John 3:16

 

[GodsGrace]

I agree there was probably a lower percentage of tares in the very early church, compared with todays church.
The word Christian doesn't seem to be defined in Scripture as far as I can tell. I'd prefer a solid definition which would be an absolute determination of someone's salvation, but that can't be done, as only God knows the heart.
I made a profession of faith at 15 years old and was baptized, but led an ungodly life for the next 27 years; then I believed the Lord at 42 years old. So, even though I was baptized I was not converted until much later, and I don't think I should have been called a Christian all that time simply because of my baptism.

I agree with you and so does the bible.
Believing in Jesus and following Him will bring to saving faith.
Not baptism. Baptism by itself will not save.
Mark 16:16

Messianic Jews were first called THE WAY,
Acts 24:14

Then they were called Christian about 10 years later at Antioch.
Acts 11:26

 

[amadeus]

1. Yes. They may not understand what they are labeling themselves as, however.
2. The doctrine of the Trinity, the doctrine of the incarnation, the sum of the law, and the Resurrection of Christ are classic examples of orthodox doctrines.
3. Love perfectly
4. Worship God; serve neighbor.

And if a person believes but simply cannot embrace a doctrine or belief which you or someone has defined as necessary or orthodox, does that mean they are NOT a Christian... or should we look to God for the correct answer?

What more should we need than belief in the two great commandments as described by Jesus?

"Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." Matt 22:37-40

 

[pia]

the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch."

Thanks for that. Someone had taught me ( in one of the fellowships I attended ) that the term was first used in Rome.

 

[aspen]

And if a person believes but simply cannot embrace a doctrine or belief which you or someone has defined as necessary or orthodox, does that mean they are NOT a Christian... or should we look to God for the correct answer?

What more should we need than belief in the two great commandments as described by Jesus?

"Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." Matt 22:37-40

I took a few classes from a theologian named Jerry Sittser, as an undergraduate - he gave me some good advice, which has stuck with me, 'Experience life with a light touch". Driving hard for doctrinal and dogmatic superiority, often under the guise of striving for unity, at the expense of loving God and Neighbor is the clanging gong described by Paul. So my reply to you is please continue loving!

 

[amadeus]

I took a few classes from a theologian named Jerry Sittser, as an undergraduate - he gave me some good advice, which has stuck with me, 'Experience life with a light touch". Driving hard for doctrinal and dogmatic superiority, often under the guise of striving for unity, at the expense of loving God and Neighbor is the clanging gong described by Paul. So my reply to you is please continue loving!

Amen!
And so on we go my friend loving God and Neighbor and allowing God to add to us what he will when He will.

 

[aspen]

I have noticed a compulsion amongst conservative minded Christians, which drives them to check and 'make sure' people who claim Christ as their savior are "really saved" or "really Christian". Doctrinal like mindedness is the typical measuring stick of truth, but it can also include conservative Christianese - are you part of the tribe? Seems to be the burning question. It is interesting because Jesus didn't deal in doctrine - he was a healer and a lover and if you believed in his way you were baptized and sent forth to imitate it. Doctrine is important, but it is much more of a personal reckoning than loving. I know two people, a LDS member and a Quaker who do not think about the Trinity at all, but spend their days loving like crazy. In fact, I have learned unconditional love from both - can't say I've learned it from my church, which often displays the intimacy of a greyhound station. If I was a fundamentalist minded Catholic I would have missed the gift of these two holy women.

 

[Jun2u]

To God be the Glory.

The persons who followed Jesus were called disciples. You quote John 6 a lot so I'm sure you've read that term in John 6.
John 6:66

Today the term disciple is also used to mean a follower of Christ.
In fact, IMHO, everyone should take discipleship course. Mine lasted about a year of going every week to a pastor's classroom and it changed how I saw Christianity. It became the Kingdom of God, which starts right here on earth.

Also, for those reading along, I do NOT want to derail this thread, but I must say that we were predestined before time to be LIKE CHRIST. NOT to be saved. Being saved is a decision we each make individually. God turns no man down.
Romans 8:29-30

EVERYONE who wishes to become born again or born from above is invited to do so because God calls ALL men to be saved.
John 3:16 WHOEVER BELIEVES
Romans 10:13 WHOEVER CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD
1 John 4:5 WHOEVER CONFESSES
2 Peter :9 THE LORD WISHES ALL TO COME TO REPENTANCE

You said -Today the term disciple is also used to mean a follower of Christ.

Isn’t that what I’ve alluded to in the first paragraph of my post? It seems you’ve lost one full year of your life by going to discipleship class. A follower of Christ is also called a sheep. Jesus said:

“I am the good shepherd and know my sheep, and am known of mine. As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold (the Gentiles predestined to salvation): them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.”
John 10:14-16

“My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.”
John 10:27

You said - Also, for those reading along, I do NOT want to derail this thread, but I must say that we were predestined before time to be LIKE CHRIST. NOT to be saved. Being saved is a decision we each make individually. God turns no man down.
Romans 8:29-30

I heard all kinds of preaching on predestination and this is the first time I’ve heard that to be predestined is to be like Christ and NOT to be saved? What are we predestined to, Salvation! We do not decide when to become saved. Salvation is of God, it is a gift! Isn’t this what Jesus came to do, to lay down his life for the elect, those He came to save? “And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call His name Jesus: for He shall save His people from their sins.” I suggest you study more on the meaning of the word “predestinate” especially concerning Romans 8:30.

Also, we cannot decide whenever we want to become saved. You are speaking of “free will” which is a doctrine of man. Scripture declares in Romans 3:10-12:

10 As it is written, there is none righteous, no not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is
none that doeth good, no, not one.

If the above is God’s assessment of mankind, where is man’s free will? Adam and Eve were the only people created with free will, the rest is history.

You said - EVERYONE who wishes to become born again or born from above is invited to do so because God calls ALL men to be saved.
John 3:16 WHOEVER BELIEVES
Romans 10:13 WHOEVER CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD
1 John 4:5 WHOEVER CONFESSES
2 Peter :9 THE LORD WISHES ALL TO COME TO REPENTANCE

I beg to differ, the call “to believe in His Son” Is to the world but NOT ALL will hear and become saved because hell will heavily be populated.
The terms “whoever” and “all” must be qualified and those words can only be referenced to all believers.
“Whoever believes and confesses, and call on the name of the Lord” are terms contrary to Romans 3, but some did, what had to have happened? God had to intervene in their lives and give them the will to do so. Without God’s intervention and grace mankind is doomed and headed towards destruction!

To God Be The Glory

 

[GodsGrace]

You said -Today the term disciple is also used to mean a follower of Christ.

Isn’t that what I’ve alluded to in the first paragraph of my post? It seems you’ve lost one full year of your life by going to discipleship class. A follower of Christ is also called a sheep. Jesus said:

“I am the good shepherd and know my sheep, and am known of mine. As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold (the Gentiles predestined to salvation): them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.”
John 10:14-16

“My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.”
John 10:27

You said - Also, for those reading along, I do NOT want to derail this thread, but I must say that we were predestined before time to be LIKE CHRIST. NOT to be saved. Being saved is a decision we each make individually. God turns no man down.
Romans 8:29-30

I heard all kinds of preaching on predestination and this is the first time I’ve heard that to be predestined is to be like Christ and NOT to be saved? What are we predestined to, Salvation! We do not decide when to become saved. Salvation is of God, it is a gift! Isn’t this what Jesus came to do, to lay down his life for the elect, those He came to save? “And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call His name Jesus: for He shall save His people from their sins.” I suggest you study more on the meaning of the word “predestinate” especially concerning Romans 8:30.

Also, we cannot decide whenever we want to become saved. You are speaking of “free will” which is a doctrine of man. Scripture declares in Romans 3:10-12:

10 As it is written, there is none righteous, no not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is
none that doeth good, no, not one.

If the above is God’s assessment of mankind, where is man’s free will? Adam and Eve were the only people created with free will, the rest is history.

You said - EVERYONE who wishes to become born again or born from above is invited to do so because God calls ALL men to be saved.
John 3:16 WHOEVER BELIEVES
Romans 10:13 WHOEVER CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD
1 John 4:5 WHOEVER CONFESSES
2 Peter :9 THE LORD WISHES ALL TO COME TO REPENTANCE

I beg to differ, the call “to believe in His Son” Is to the world but NOT ALL will hear and become saved because hell will heavily be populated.
The terms “whoever” and “all” must be qualified and those words can only be referenced to all believers.
“Whoever believes and confesses, and call on the name of the Lord” are terms contrary to Romans 3, but some did, what had to have happened? God had to intervene in their lives and give them the will to do so. Without God’s intervention and grace mankind is doomed and headed towards destruction!

To God Be The Glory

I don't have much to say to you.
My time here is limited.
You're a Calvanist.
A doctrine straight out of hell.

GOD chooses whom will be saved and who won't?
Doesn't that kind of change God's character?
Is not God supposed to be LOVE?
1 John 4:8

HOW is God LOVE is He picks and chooses who will be saved?
AND arbitrarily, eenie, meenie, minnie, moe...
Too bad if we end up in hell because God didn't choose us? Right?

That's a nice God you serve there.
BUT not the One I know and love.

You've created a monster.
Have a good time serving the monster you've created.

BTW, You didn't exegete any of the verses I posted.
No matter.

Anyone with a thought process could see how wrong Mr. Calvin was.
And what a NICE man he was too. So happy that his opponent, who was armenian as myself, got burned at the stake.

You come from good stock.

 

[bbyrd009]

Ah yes, I am with you now. Sometimes just to eat what "they" eat will be offensive to my taste buds and my stomach. That's in the natural, but spiritually the same thing may apply. If God wants us to present our witness sometimes it may be necessary for us to tolerate for a little bit anyway so as to be allowed just to live in front them ... and maybe even be allowed to speak to them with their ears and hearts open.

well, i could comment on that, but it would all be from hindsight, and imo the point is likely to experience it and make one's own mistakes lol. Suffice it to say that you are going to be "wrong" to them though, too.

You are not going to be in any kind of control iow.
For most people, you are going to be in hell.

The situation is unique in that you prolly are not meeting peers from a setting of mutual understanding, a church or whatever, where you might have things in common--though i guess you could if you aimed that way--but more like you are being rescued, to their minds, even though you know God has sent these people to you. Hence the direction to stay in one house, which you are going to want to change houses, too.

 

[bbyrd009]

Would God not be able to do is both other parties are willing to submit themselves completely to Him?

might be possible, but i don't think that is what is meant by "agreement" anyway, "verbal agreement." nope. The reason i don't think that is because that is what we do now, befriend those who have stated a similar view to ours on a matter, or even that we see doing some little thing the same way we do it or something. These are just the people we judge to be "right" i think

 

[bbyrd009]

Communication is almost always one the greatest, if not the greatest obstacle to real discussion.

listening opens doors that talking shuts, i noticed