This topic has been a confusion with for many believers. In fact so many have so many different opinions about it you would think something this serious, God would make it very clear and black and white what this sin would be. I mean a sin that could never be forgiven?? Thats heavy stuff. We should know.The clue to this sin lies in the fact most Christians can not define it. God was not dumb when having his Word sent to earth. There is a reason this sin is not plainly clear to everyone. He meant it to be this way. No Christian should be concerned about this, thats why it was not very clear to EVERYONE, and those the commit this sin, it does not matter anyway. Lets get our foundation scriptures.Mat 12:31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. Mat 12:32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come. Mar 3:28 Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme: Mar 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation: These two dramatic statements came from Jesus when the people accused him of using Demonic power to perform miracles. If you read the whole account Jesus was talking about demons in both Matthew and Mark before making these statements. Luk 12:8 Also I say unto you, Whosoever shall confess me before men, him shall the Son of man also confess before the angels of God: Luk 12:9 But he that denieth me before men shall be denied before the angels of God. Luk 12:10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven. The statement in Luke is a little different. Jesus said if we deny him before man, then we shall be denied before the angles of God. This is important as the angles are sent to protect us. In effect we remove their ability to help us out. He then makes another statement. He said in effect that speaking bad about him can be forgiven, but not blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, or speaking against the Holy ghost. That will not be forgiven.So we have a sin that appears to be unforgivable, that is Speaking against the Holy Ghost. So now the question would be who does this apply to?We have to go to scripture and compare line upon line, precept (Like things) upon precept. Rom 5:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. For one to commit a sin they knew was completely unforgivable, then they would have to do it in full faith, knowing what they were doing. This is the only way that sin could be charged to them, and forgiveness unobtainable. There are many in the Nut Houses today that believe they have committed this sin and all hope is lost. I know one of them. They are in torment thinking they have committed this sin, when in reality they never committed the sin. We need to find an example of someone that has actually done this in the bible so we have something to compare to. Remember, this sin was speaking against the Holy Ghost. This sin included accusing the Holy Ghost of being demonic power, but not limited to that because of our statement by Jesus in Luke. Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Here we have a sin that can not be forgiven. They can not be renewed again unto repentance. The scripture says WE can not renew them again, not that they can't repent, however that can not happen because they fell away. (I will give a comparison to this latter.) So, all our prayers for them and talking to them is not going to help. They have fallen away and won't come back.Heb 6:6 If they then deviate from the faith and turn away from their allegiance--[it is impossible] to bring them back to repentance, for (because, while, as long as) they nail upon the cross the Son of God afresh [as far as they are concerned] and are holding [Him] up to contempt and shame and public disgrace. AmplifiedWhat are the qualification for this.They were enlightened: They knew the truth, they had a need for Jesus and that God was real.They tasted of the heavenly gift: For God so loved the Word he Gave his son!!! The Holy Ghost is also a free gift. They had both.They were partakers of the Holy Ghost: They were filled with the Holy Ghost and had a relationship with Him. They could hear him and follow him. He was real to them. (Most Christians have not gotten to this point.)They tasted the good word of God: God's Word is Good, and God will bring to pass his Word for those that believe he will for them and is able to do so. The word of God is more than just a book. It is life, and can change us from the inside out. God's Word also has the ability to change any Physical circumstance. (Lots of Christians have not experienced this yet.)They have experienced the powers of the world to come: This is someone that has experienced the awesome ability of God on earth. People were healed by Peter's shadow passing them by. Jesus said God's Will be done on earth as it is in Heaven, and there are no sick people in Heaven. Continued.........
Unforgivable Sin Explained.
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When Hebrews was written many were turning back to Judaism because of persecution. They were giving up all God had to offer to go back to the old ways. In effect they were telling God they did not want the Holy Ghost or what Jesus had done. This had a great spiritual effect in their heart because they knew what they were giving up. There hearts became dark and would never return back. The Holy Ghost stopped dealing with them and prompting their hearts to stay with Jesus. Joh 6:44 No one is able to come to Me unless the Father Who sent Me attracts and draws him and gives him the desire to come to Me, and [then] I will raise him up [from the dead] at the last day. Now we have another set of scriptures. Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, Once again, this sin has conditions on it. The knowledge of the truth would be those listed in Hebrews 6. It is not just a sin we commit knowing we committed it as some think. If that were the case we all would not make it.The conditions for the sin are listed below.Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? Heb 10:29 How much worse (sterner and heavier) punishment do you suppose he will be judged to deserve who has spurned and [thus] trampled underfoot the Son of God, and who has considered the covenant blood by which he was consecrated common and unhallowed, thus profaning it and insulting and outraging the [Holy] Spirit [Who imparts] grace (the unmerited favor and blessing of God)?(G) AmplifiedJesus in Luke tells us that if we deny him, he will deny us before the angles of God. He then went on to say that could be forgiven, but not speaking against the Holy Ghost. It is the Holy Ghost, the Spirit of grace that completes the work of being Born again. It is God in us, and the one the draws us. If that is rejected, and spoken against, after a person has full knowledge of what they are doing, saying that I now longer value the presence of God, (Holy Ghost) in me, then they can not come back to repentance. They have committed the unpardonable sin with full knowledge of what they did. The Holy Ghost leaves them, and no longer draws them back. This is why we can not renew them again. They would never want renewed, their hearts are forever darked, because they knew what they had given up. So a person that fully knew God and knew the truth speaks against against the Man named Jesus on earth can be forgiven, but someone that speaks against God, and NOT wanting God to dwell in them as a temple, that can not be forgiven. It was the Whole reason Jesus went to the cross, to bring us back to God. Turning away to worship another god is one way of accomplishing this. Converting to Muslim, Idol worship, new age belief. All fall into this category. So now the scripture in 1 John starts to make sense. I use to baffle me for a long time and when I asked others about it, nobody knew the answers. God had to show it to me.I was praying for a man one day that use to work for Billy Graham Ministries. Him and his wife. They severed God for years. He turned to Satanism, or The Necronomicon of Alhazred. The Holy Ghost spoke to me and said "Do not pray for him." I was confused as I never thought God would not tell me to pray for someone. That did not make sense, but I knew the Voice of God inside me and obeyed him. It was a month or so of seeking but God opened up this scripture to me. The problem was I stoped reading the scriptures in order and should have continued on.1Jn 5:16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. 1Jn 5:17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death. John went on to warn us what that sin was. 1Jn 5:21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen. John did not throw that in there because it's a good idea. It goes along with what He said not to pray for. So, if you think you commited the unpardonable sin, but want forgiveness, then you have not commited the unpardonable sin. You still have hope and can be forgiven. If you have commited that sin, then you would not be reading this.Jesus Is Lord.
MickinEngland
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It seems quite simple to me, Jesus said the Unforgivable Sin is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit (Matt 12:31)
MickinEngland: Well, to you and me it would seem that simple, but from reading all the post about this topic in the forum and other forums it would seemed that someone needed to explain it a little more.Don't speak against the Holy Ghost in which you were sealed with until the day of redemption. It is simple.......
MickinEngland
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I think you have missed the point of what Jesus really meant. Blasphemy against the "holy spirit" is to call what is holy: unholy. So to say the teachings of Christ, which teach us to love our enemies (for example), is from the devil, that would be blasphemy against the holy spirit; the words I speak are spirit and they are life.
Copperhead
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I was given a little insight on book of Hebrews from a Messianic Jewish believer name of Albert Israeli. He made a strong case that Hebrews is pure apologetic towards Jews that had been close to believers, who had heard of Jesus, but had not yet made any commitment to Him. After listening to the entire discussion by Albert, Hebrews became almost crystal clear and a lot of debate on its meaning dropped away.
One aspect is, if one has already believed in the Messiah, why would the letter have to go to great lengths to show Moses, Priesthood, Temple, etc, that Jesus is greater than these? It seems absurd that those who already had believed in Messiah would need to be told these things. And why, if they were already believers, would a long dissertation on how the just live by faith (chapter 8) need to be presented in this letter?
And that controversial Hebrews 6:6 which has been used to beat up those who trust in the security of eternal life thru Jesus, read the verses preceding it. These Hebrews had "tasted" of the heavenly gift. Jesus tasted the gall mixed with vinegar that was given Him on the cross, but He did not take it in (Matthew 27:34). These Hebrews had tasted of the heavenly gift, but had not taken it in. These had partaken of the Holy Spirit. There are many that been influenced by believers in Jesus, but are not actual believers themselves. These Hebrews the letter was addressed to, have "tasted" of the Word of God and the powers to come. Yet again, they tasted, but did not take it in, or accept it. They have partaken in the Heavenly Calling (Hebrews 3:1), and that was the heavenly calling of Israel to be a nation before God to bring forth His word, both the written word and the Messiah. Israel was established as a called out nation for God's purposes. These Hebrews, because they are Hebrews, have indeed partaken in that heavenly calling.
In Hebrews 10:26, the assertion is made that once one has received knowledge of the truth, there then remains no sacrifice for sin. The key is "knowledge of the truth". This is clearly not meant as a argument for those that already are believers, i.e. have accepted the truth. Just like in Hebrews 6:6, the argument is that if one doesn't accept the truth of the Messiah, then there is no other way. Again, pure apologetic meant for unbelieving Hebrews, not believers.
The writer of Hebrews went to great lengths to show the legalism of the Law could not save. The blood of bulls and goats cannot give eternal life. Verse 6 is saying that since that is the case, the only salvation is of the Messiah, and if they turn from accepting that, there is no other salvation available. It matches well to the statement that Jesus said that he is the fulfillment of the law. He was the goal the law was pointing to. So capitalizing on that assertion, the writer of Hebrews is telling this Jewish audience to consider Jesus (Hebrews 3:1) and accept Him or there is no other means of salvation. Why would a believer need to consider Jesus? This is an argument that one would use on an unbeliever. If I was witnessing to someone, I would ask them to consider Jesus and His claims. I wouldn't use that argument on a believer, no matter how they waivered in their faith. Verse 6 is arguing, that if these Hebrews turn from this truth of the Messiah, then there is nothing else, no other means of salvation. Game over. Repentance literally means "changing your mind". If they cannot see that Jesus is the fulfillment of the Law, and that He is the only means of salvation, then there is nothing else that will change their mind.
It is an alternative view that hasn't typically been used, but then, the church early in the game went to great lengths to disassociate itself from its Jewish roots. And we lost some perspective on the scriptures in the process. I found Albert's analysis very refreshing and enlightening. The discussion was lengthy and I have only given a very limited synopsis of what was discussed. But I think it is worthy of consideration.
One aspect is, if one has already believed in the Messiah, why would the letter have to go to great lengths to show Moses, Priesthood, Temple, etc, that Jesus is greater than these? It seems absurd that those who already had believed in Messiah would need to be told these things. And why, if they were already believers, would a long dissertation on how the just live by faith (chapter 8) need to be presented in this letter?
And that controversial Hebrews 6:6 which has been used to beat up those who trust in the security of eternal life thru Jesus, read the verses preceding it. These Hebrews had "tasted" of the heavenly gift. Jesus tasted the gall mixed with vinegar that was given Him on the cross, but He did not take it in (Matthew 27:34). These Hebrews had tasted of the heavenly gift, but had not taken it in. These had partaken of the Holy Spirit. There are many that been influenced by believers in Jesus, but are not actual believers themselves. These Hebrews the letter was addressed to, have "tasted" of the Word of God and the powers to come. Yet again, they tasted, but did not take it in, or accept it. They have partaken in the Heavenly Calling (Hebrews 3:1), and that was the heavenly calling of Israel to be a nation before God to bring forth His word, both the written word and the Messiah. Israel was established as a called out nation for God's purposes. These Hebrews, because they are Hebrews, have indeed partaken in that heavenly calling.
In Hebrews 10:26, the assertion is made that once one has received knowledge of the truth, there then remains no sacrifice for sin. The key is "knowledge of the truth". This is clearly not meant as a argument for those that already are believers, i.e. have accepted the truth. Just like in Hebrews 6:6, the argument is that if one doesn't accept the truth of the Messiah, then there is no other way. Again, pure apologetic meant for unbelieving Hebrews, not believers.
The writer of Hebrews went to great lengths to show the legalism of the Law could not save. The blood of bulls and goats cannot give eternal life. Verse 6 is saying that since that is the case, the only salvation is of the Messiah, and if they turn from accepting that, there is no other salvation available. It matches well to the statement that Jesus said that he is the fulfillment of the law. He was the goal the law was pointing to. So capitalizing on that assertion, the writer of Hebrews is telling this Jewish audience to consider Jesus (Hebrews 3:1) and accept Him or there is no other means of salvation. Why would a believer need to consider Jesus? This is an argument that one would use on an unbeliever. If I was witnessing to someone, I would ask them to consider Jesus and His claims. I wouldn't use that argument on a believer, no matter how they waivered in their faith. Verse 6 is arguing, that if these Hebrews turn from this truth of the Messiah, then there is nothing else, no other means of salvation. Game over. Repentance literally means "changing your mind". If they cannot see that Jesus is the fulfillment of the Law, and that He is the only means of salvation, then there is nothing else that will change their mind.
It is an alternative view that hasn't typically been used, but then, the church early in the game went to great lengths to disassociate itself from its Jewish roots. And we lost some perspective on the scriptures in the process. I found Albert's analysis very refreshing and enlightening. The discussion was lengthy and I have only given a very limited synopsis of what was discussed. But I think it is worthy of consideration.
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bbyrd009
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got a link to the discussion by any chance? ty
and, are/were you on AFF? your avatar looks familiar :)
Copperhead
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Copperhead
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