The NT manuscripts are full of mistakes

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KUWN

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This provides an excellent illustration for those interested:

Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at an Elingsh uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt ...
...snip...
... and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae we do not raed ervey lteter by it slef but the wrod as a wlohe.

People are often times in fearful shock with I inform them that the Greek manuscripts that preserve the New Testament have over 400,000 variants. The above paragraph well illustrates what is at stake with variants. Does anyone have a difficult time understanding the above paragraph? If not, you will find the Greek manuscripts a breath of fresh air compared to the above paragraph. At a quick glance, I count 69 words in the above paragraph with 34 variants or errors in spelling. But what is at stake? What can be disputed?

What is comforting with the 400,000 variants in the manuscripts that support the New Testament is this: what are the odds of finding one more manuscript that will alter the meaning of the existing New Testament. That is, we already have over 5,700 Greek manuscripts, and comparing these to each other, there are over 400,000 variants; what would be the odds of finding a new Greek manuscript (written back in the first century) that will significantly alter the meaning of the Bible. In fact, as we find more and more Greek manuscripts, the number of variants goes up and up, and yet despite all this, the ability to piece together what the original New Testament said becomes EASIER AND EASIER.

Assume the jumbled paragraph above is a copy of an original paragraph, and we wanted to determine what the original paragraph actually said. With just this one copy we can get pretty close. But if we were to find another paragraph written with such atrocities, we would at least have another source to compare it to in determining what the original paragraph actually said. If we were to find 5,000 such poorly written paragraphs, we could with relative certainty reproduce the original document.

The next time someone tells you that the Bible is full of mistakes, you better thank your lucky stars that that is indeed the truth, for without that very fact we would be at a loss in reconstructing the original New Testament. It is this unusual fact that gives evidence to a supernatural preservation of the Bible. How? 400,000 errors and not one cardinal doctrine is at stake!

As a side note, I had the opportunity to "talk" (via email) with one of the world's leading critics of our New Testament, Dr. Bart Ehrman of Duke Divinity School. In his own words, although with much reluctance, he conceded that "we can reproduce over 95 percent of what the New Testament originally said." To which Dr. Dan Wallace of Dallas Seminary adds, "...and not one major doctrine of the Christian faith is at stake within HIS disputed 5 percent." (What Dr. Wallace means by "HIS disputed 5 percent" is that most conservative scholars content that the original New Testament can be reconstructed to within 99.6 percent. As more manuscripts are dug up, that percent will approach 100 percent and beyond.)

By the way, Dan contends we have about 103% of the New Testament. We now need to remove the dross.

Just some thoughts,
 

Windmill Charge

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More than one commentator has suggested that we have so many n t quotes in the church fathers letters that we could almost reconstruction the n t from them.

How true that is ?

A basic check on biblical accuracy, look at the footnotes or use biblegateway to compare translations.

They both show no questionable translations on important biblical passages.
 

KUWN

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More than one commentator has suggested that we have so many n t quotes in the church fathers letters that we could almost reconstruction the n t from them.

How true that is ?

A basic check on biblical accuracy, look at the footnotes or use biblegateway to compare translations.

They both show no questionable translations on important biblical passages.
WIndmill asked:

"More than one commentator has suggested that we have so many n t quotes in the church fathers letters that we could almost reconstruction the n t from them.

How true that is ?"

Very true. The NT has been reconstructed using only church fathers quotes, and they were able to put the NT back together to all but 11 verses. I will admit that I have not done any research into this claim but I do know there are a lot of quotes!
 
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Spyder

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One day, people should discover than man has manipulated the scriptures to justify their own doctrines. The truth can still be found, but not from man. We have to prayerfully seek the Truth from God. Most of the people I know do not seek it from God. Strangely, for no understood reason, they turn to the early church fathers who even disagreed with each other. Once that is discovered, they turn to commentaries from a theologian suited to their chosen denomination.
The truth has to be diligently sought from the only true source.
 
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IndianaRob

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One day, people should discover than man has manipulated the scriptures to justify their own doctrines.
Very true. Every uninspired translator is only giving their opinions, biases and false doctrines they adhere to. The only way to possibly have an accurate bible today is if God inspired the translators.
 

St. SteVen

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400,000 errors and not one cardinal doctrine is at stake!
Interesting topic, thanks.
And welcome to the forum.

In my view, doctrines are man-made; they have nothing to do with cardinals. - LOL

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RedFan

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No doubt copyist errors -- which is to say deviations from the original (intentional or not) -- are responsible for some NT inconsistencies. But not all. Textual criticism -- reconstructing the original -- gets us as faithful a version of each gospel or letter as possible, but is of limited usefulness in resolving conflicts between gospels or letters.
 

IndianaRob

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No doubt copyist errors -- which is to say deviations from the original (intentional or not) -- are responsible for some NT inconsistencies. But not all. Textual criticism -- reconstructing the original -- gets us as faithful a version of each gospel or letter as possible, but is of limited usefulness in resolving conflicts between gospels or letters.
Interesting, I didn’t know there were conflicts in the gospels. Can you give one of the errors?
 

RedFan

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Interesting, I didn’t know there were conflicts in the gospels. Can you give one of the errors?
Sure. Disagreement among the gospels on whether the Last Supper was a Passover meal as the Synoptics say (Mark 14:12, Mark 14:16-17, Matthew 26:17, Matthew 26:19-20, Luke 22:7–9, Luke 22:13-14), or was eaten the day before Passover as John says (John 13:1, John 18:28, John 19:14).
 
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IndianaRob

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Sure. Disagreement among the gospels on whether the Last Supper was a Passover meal as the Synoptics say (Mark 14:12, Mark 14:16-17, Matthew 26:17, Matthew 26:19-20, Luke 22:7–9, Luke 22:13-14), or was eaten the day before Passover as John says (John 13:1, John 18:28, John 19:14).
Thank you very much!
 

Pearl

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Sure. Disagreement among the gospels on whether the Last Supper was a Passover meal as the Synoptics say (Mark 14:12, Mark 14:16-17, Matthew 26:17, Matthew 26:19-20, Luke 22:7–9, Luke 22:13-14), or was eaten the day before Passover as John says (John 13:1, John 18:28, John 19:14).
Disagreements similar to those in press stories - same story different take on it.
 
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RedFan

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Disagreements similar to those in press stories - same story different take on it.
With one important different in focus. Press stories are generally efforts to report the facts. Gospels are generally efforts to persuade of the truth of an underlying message.
 

KUWN

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That's bit of a sweeping statement. And you would know because . . . . ?
Pearl,

I use to work as a textual critic. I would track variants within manuscripts. You need a base text and then you compare a manuscript to the base text and record all variants, that is, any place where the manuscripts differ. Doing this is basically how we know there are over 400,000 variants among the extant Greek manuscripts. It is not difficult work once you have been trained in Greek, but it does take up a lot of time to do it.
 
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St. SteVen

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Pearl,

I use to work as a textual critic. I would track variants within manuscripts. You need a base text and then you compare a manuscript to the base text and record all variants, that is, any place where the manuscripts differ. Doing this is basically how we know there are over 400,000 variants among the extant Greek manuscripts. It is not difficult work once you have been trained in Greek, but it does take up a lot of time to do it.
Which translation were you working on?

Perhaps a definition of "textual variants" would help?

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KUWN

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Which translation were you working on?

Perhaps a definition of "textual variants" would help?

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SteVen,

I didn't work with Translation, only Greek Manuscripts. Textual Critics don't work with Translations.
 

St. SteVen

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SteVen,

I didn't work with Translation, only Greek Manuscripts. Textual Critics don't work with Translations.
Yes, I understand.
But unless your textual criticism was a hobby, or an educational study, it was in preparation for translation work.
Perhaps you signed a non-disclosure agreement?

[
 

Pearl

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Pearl,

I use to work as a textual critic. I would track variants within manuscripts. You need a base text and then you compare a manuscript to the base text and record all variants, that is, any place where the manuscripts differ. Doing this is basically how we know there are over 400,000 variants among the extant Greek manuscripts. It is not difficult work once you have been trained in Greek, but it does take up a lot of time to do it.
Thanks for the explanation. I'm sure with any translation which has been done over and over by different groups there will be variants. Which translation do you consider the nearest to the original?
 

RedFan

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Very true. Every uninspired translator is only giving their opinions, biases and false doctrines they adhere to. The only way to possibly have an accurate bible today is if God inspired the translators.
Without agreeing that God must inspire a translator before his translation can be deemed accurate, how do we gauge whether such inspiration has occurred?