The KJV of the Holy Bible is based on what? A question for all the KJO folks.

[KUWN]

1 John 5:7 isn't in modern translations, so take your pick. NLT, NIV, ESV, NASB, NET, CSB, NABRE.

The authors of the NET, for example, are not anti-trinitarians. Show me with these other translations that the translators were anti-trinitarian. I am not doubting you (except for the NET Bible) because I have not done a study on these translators. But I feel you have overstated your case with these other translations.

 

[Rockerduck]

Sorry about that. CT stands for Critical Text. This is a compilation of Greek manuscripts that are much OLDER than the Greek manuscripts from which the KJV Translation derives. The issue is between the CT and MT; MT is the majority text. This is a compilation of all the NEWER manuscripts. There are a lot more of these NEWER Greek manuscripts than the manuscripts for the CT.

For example, the oldest Greek manuscript behind the KJV is around the 10th century, if my memory serves me right. The oldest manuscript behind the CT is around the second and third centuries. The debate is over the age of the manuscripts supporting a text type. The CT is older than the MT, but the MT has a lot more manuscripts. Which is more important, the MORE there are or the OLDER they are.

The Critical text was created by Wescott and Hort, that hated the KJV. They were occultist and not at all Christian.

The authors of the NET, for example, are not anti-trinitarians. Show me with these other translations that the translators were anti-trinitarian. I am not doubting you (except for the NET Bible) because I have not done a study on these translators. But I feel you have overstated your case with these other translations.

Maybe I overstated, my bad. But to remove words and texts, based on a Critical text and not Majority text, and Received text, and not taking into account all the Latin texts. Seems myopic to a particular bias.

 

[Wrangler]

I just peeked in the Greek.
KJV has 1 John 5:7,8 exactly like the Greek.

You are getting bogus info

It's great that you are an ancient language expert and have no need for any English translation. I'll trust the half of millenia improvements in understading and expression made in the FROM and TO since this arhaic book was published.

 

[Taken]

Here is the Bible (the CT). This Bible is hundreds of years before the KJV. Notice it does not contain the disputed text.

CT…Critical Text was a concept of two Biblical scholars…Brooks Wescott and J.A. Horb…..who wrote their own version in Greek of the New Testament…in the appro…1880’s

7 ὅτι τρεῖς εἰσιν οἱ μαρτυροῦντες, 8 τὸ πνεῦμα καὶ τὸ ὕδωρ καὶ τὸ αἷμα, καὶ οἱ τρεῖς εἰς τὸ ἕν εἰσιν.

Which is translated: "For there are three that testify, the Spirit and the water, and the blood, and these three are in agreement." (NET Bible)

Regarding the Comma Johanneum, this note appears in the NET Bible:

"The evidence - both external and internal - is decidedly against its authenticity." (tc note 7)

NET…ie New English Translation…ca. 2005
Not impressed.

The deciding factor is whether or not one accepts the OLDER Greek manuscripts or the more recent ones. I believe that the OLDER ones are closer to the originals and are, therefore, more accurate.

Regarding…THREE….certainly can give the impression of …
One thing…
A Second thing…
A Third thing….

WHICH is TRUE, regarding…titles, that reveal PURPOSES…

However…OTHER Scriptures Reveal…
While the Father and Son, have Different Names, different Titles, different tasks (works) to Accomplish…
(THEY are ONE and the SAME)

John 10:
[30} I and my father are one.

Regarding…the SPIRIT / Power OF God…
Which IS that regarding the ALMIGHTY….
His absolute power, His absolute glory, HE “gives” to NOONE…
Yet…Jesus…who is REVEALED IS the Christ….AND IS the SAME who IS the POWER of God…

God has NO beginning or ending…
His IDEA, to create and make was revealed.
His POWER, (ability to create and make was revealed.
His WORD, (speaking His POWER to act, and establish what was NOT … to Be…Was…
(Knowledge revealed in the FIRST written Chapter of the Bible)

Gen 1:
[1] In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
[2] And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
[3] And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

The IDEA…the WHAT…the CREATION…the SPIRIT….the SPEAKING…

MISSiNG? THE “MAKING” of His CREATIONS…

Creation was established, finished, done….
In 6 days.

The MAKING of Gods CREATIONS was established….but not “FINISHED”….the MAKING Continues.

AND WHO IS THE MAKER of Gods Creations?

God…whom He called His WORD and His POWER…

John 1:
[1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:
[1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
[2] The same was in the beginning with God.
[3] All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

The THREE are distinct IN, names, titles, purposes….YET ONE entity, without beginning or ending….
Lord God Almighty.

I have zero issue with 1 John chapter 5.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Wrangler]

Don’t care to divert the topic to James.

Huh? My comments pertain to translations with that name in the title, e.g., KJ21, etc.

 

[Taken]

Sorry about that. CT stands for Critical Text. This is a compilation of Greek manuscripts that are much OLDER than the Greek manuscripts from which the KJV Translation derives. The issue is between the CT and MT; MT is the majority text. This is a compilation of all the NEWER manuscripts. There are a lot more of these NEWER Greek manuscripts than the manuscripts for the CT.

For example, the oldest Greek manuscript behind the KJV is around the 10th century, if my memory serves me right. The oldest manuscript behind the CT is around the second and third centuries. The debate is over the age of the manuscripts supporting a text type. The CT is older than the MT, but the MT has a lot more manuscripts. Which is more important, the MORE there are or the OLDER they are.

I looked it up….

it is not a surprise to me..that anyone taking on the task of translations or transliterations, particularly of scripture, by Scholars rather than Academics or Philosophers….
* would pray for guidance…
* would be fully aware their References would be Limited.
* and not a big secret…men (not identified in Scripture ), but held esteemed religious positions….(and some NOT particularly associated WITH a religious view but rather had political aspirations)……
AND could read and write….(both) had their own writings available for review and consideration….when a task of transcribing and transliteration….was to be accomplished by a group of men…regarding Scripture …with their own mixed views….and in-depth discussions.

I put my trust IN Lord God Almighty….that if I had NOT ONE text of Scripture, written on paper IN Ink, or the had the inability to READ….
THAT THAT which I ask of Him…
And THAT which He has written in my Heart..
Invisible to all men, including myself…
IS where the absolute TRUTH of God IS.

I believe IT is IMPOSSIBLE for the Lord God Almighty, without beginning, without ending, to REPRODUCE and Offspring “without a beginning”…

I believe IT is PRECISELY the works of the Lord God Almighty, to SEND FORTH out from His own Being…(while the same He sends forth continues to Remain IN Him)….
IS the Miracle of Gods ESSENCE…..

AND…created manKND …. And then ‘made’ manKIND to have the SAME LIKENESS as the Lord God…

Men…use multiple names, multiple titles, exert multiple tasks…AND every word that flows out of their mouth…remains IN them.

What came forth out from God…was His Ideas, His Power, His Word….and the very SAME essence remains IN God…who IS ONE, Creator AND Maker of ALL things; without beginning, without ending…
Lord God Almighty.

God bless you.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Huh? My comments pertain to translations with that name in the title, e.g., KJ21, etc.

When two already have a disagreement…to proceed to a worthy discussion…imo requires more than a passing reference. You mentioned James, but gave no quote.
Just saying…I do not care to research your references then guess what you think.

God bless you.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[rebuilder 454]

It's great that you are an ancient language expert and have no need for any English translation. I'll trust the half of millenia improvements in understading and expression made in the FROM and TO since this arhaic book was published.

We all have the internet.
None of us are anything special.
That includes you.

 

[Wrangler]

You mentioned James, but gave no quote.

I mentioned James in the title of translations.

 

[Taken]

I mentioned James in the title of translations.

Getting off track….

I have no issue with Faithful John or the interpretation of his writings in 1 John….

I have no doubt…”The Father, Son and Holy Spirit”….IS ONE and the SAME…
Lord God Almighty….everlasting without beginning or ending….Creator and Maker of all things….

God bless you.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[rebuilder 454]

Getting off track….

I have no issue with Faithful John or the interpretation of his writings in 1 John….

I have no doubt…”The Father, Son and Holy Spirit”….IS ONE and the SAME…
Lord God Almighty….everlasting without beginning or ending….Creator and Maker of all things….

God bless you.

Glory to God,
Taken

To deny Jesus is creator , is to deny Him entirely.
I hate that all watchtowers choose hell.
It is their choice.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Here is the Bible (the CT). This Bible is hundreds of years before the KJV. Notice it does not contain the disputed text.

7 ὅτι τρεῖς εἰσιν οἱ μαρτυροῦντες, 8 τὸ πνεῦμα καὶ τὸ ὕδωρ καὶ τὸ αἷμα, καὶ οἱ τρεῖς εἰς τὸ ἕν εἰσιν.

Which is translated: "For there are three that testify, the Spirit and the water, and the blood, and these three are in agreement." (NET Bible)

Regarding the Comma Johanneum, this note appears in the NET Bible:

"The evidence - both external and internal - is decidedly against its authenticity." (tc note 7)

The deciding factor is whether or not one accepts the OLDER Greek manuscripts or the more recent ones. I believe that the OLDER ones are closer to the originals and are, therefore, more accurate.

I looked it up.
The texts receptus has it as "are one"
I suspect that Greek text you quote is Alexandria text.

 

[rebuilder 454]

The Unreliability of the Alexandrian Manuscripts - Preserved Word Ministries

Bible scholarship of the past 150 years has placed much attention on a very small number of manuscripts. While there are over 5000 known New Testament manuscripts, attention has been placed on less than ten. Of these, Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Vaticanus have been exalted as the “oldest and...

www.preservedword.com

 

[KUWN]

I looked it up.
The texts receptus has it as "are one"
I suspect that Greek text you quote is Alexandria text.

The expression ἕν εἰσιν can be translated "are one" or "are in agreement." It is just which best explains the context. This is where the translator has wiggle room to translate it as he sees fit. This is one reason I don't use Translations.

 

[rebuilder 454]

All need to educate themselves into the Bible we can trust and depend on.
NIV = "not. Inspired version"

 

[rebuilder 454]

The expression ἕν εἰσιν can be translated "are one" or "are in agreement." It is just which best explains the context. This is where the translator has wiggle room to translate it as he sees fit. This is one reason I don't use Translations.

G1520 - heis - Strong's Greek Lexicon (kjv)

G1520 - εἷς heîs, hice; a primary numeral; one:—a(-n, -ny, certain), abundantly, man, one (another), only, other, some. See also , , , .

www.blueletterbible.org

 

[Taken]

To deny Jesus is creator , is to deny Him entirely.
I hate that all watchtowers choose hell.
It is their choice.

I believe many preachers of many denominations teach falsely….but do not believe ANY who personally believe in heart in the Lord God Almighty shall be rejected by the Lord God Almighty.

Each judged according to their own self.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[KUWN]

G1520 - heis - Strong's Greek Lexicon (kjv)

G1520 - εἷς heîs, hice; a primary numeral; one:—a(-n, -ny, certain), abundantly, man, one (another), only, other, some. See also , , , .

www.blueletterbible.org

LSJ
6. Math., τὸ ἕν unity, opp.πλῆθος, Pythag.Fr.5, etc.: pl., ἕνα units, Arist.Metaph.1056b21; ὁ ἀριθμός ἐστιν ἕνα πλείω Id.Ph. 207b7; τῶν προτέρων ἑνῶν Dam.Pr.460. 7. Philos., ἕν, τό, unity, the One, ἐκ πάντων ἓν καὶ ἐξ ἑνὸς πάντα Heraclit.10, cf.Emp.17.1, etc.: later indecl., ἓν εἶναι τοῦ ἓν παρουσίᾳ Plot.6.6.14, cf.5.5.5.

See BDAG 3rd Edition
pg. 292, to be of one mind, unite,
unity of the Pythagorean fellowship,
to hold the same view
and many more...

 

[Davy]

So the KJV translators were left up to their own devices, heh? No God involved, heh? So goes yet another bogus chapter by modern Textual Critics of the 1611 King James Bible. Maybe hippie Juan is a better title for Apostle John, since the modernists love thing anything new and improved is the way to go!

 

[IndianaRob]

So the KJV translators were left up to their own devices, heh? No God involved, heh? So goes yet another bogus chapter by modern Textual Critics of the 1611 King James Bible. Maybe hippie Juan is a better title for Apostle John, since the modernists love thing anything new and improved is the way to go!

It’s pretty obvious from reading the KJV that someone/something inspired them. I believe it was God.