The decline of Christianity in the West

[newlife]

There is definite decline in the number of people who identify themselves as Christian in the West. The trend toward secularism amd the denial of the supernatural began with the Enlightenment and now underpins Western thought. We are increasingly becoming a post- Christian society. This trend has accelerated recently. The decline is not only evident among nominal Christians and liberal churches but among evangelicals as well. People are not gravitating by and large toward New Age belief systems but are increasingly becoming indifferent to Christianity and also turning toward humanistic psophy, atheism/ agnosticism. Although I don't agree completely with its conclusions the Great Evangelical Recession by John Dickerson (2013) published by Baker Books provides considerable documentation of these trends. There has been considearble growth of Charismatic/ Pentecostal Christianity in Latin America, Subsaharan Africa and parts of Asia however.

According to the 2010 Eurobarometer poll 40 percent of the population of France denies the existence of God, Spirit or any form of life force, the highest rate of atheism in Europe, while 27 percent said that they believe there is a God. In Sweden 34 percent did not believe in God, Spirit or a life force while 18 percent believed in God. Overall among Euro Member states 51 percent affirmed a belief in God, with the highest rate of theism in Malta at 94 percent. Quite extraordinary numbers for a continent long considered to be at the center of Christian belief. The United States tends to be much more religous then Europe but delcline is evident here as well. In the US Gallup, Pew Research and the General Social Survey have noted a dramatic rise in the number of people with no religious affiliation placing that number between 16-18 percent of the general population with close to quarter of the population between 18-29 in that category.

The increasing acceptance of cohabitation and homosexuality, the acceptance of gay marriage as alternative lifestyles, the increasing crudity on television all reflect changes in mores among the public and a movement away from Biblical Christianity in the West.

Another book well worth reading and well researched is Ond Nation Without God: The Battle for Chrisitianity in an Age of Unbelief by David Aikman (2012) also by Baker Books.

In light of these trends I see Bblical Christians and Christianity itself as becoming increasingly marginalized. It will be increasingly difficult for Christians to remain true to Biblical principles, maintain employment and remain integrated within society without serious compromise. Any comments? I can cite further examples.

 

[OzSpen]

newlife,

What have you uncovered of the increasing evidence for apologists of the Christian faith who are addressing the issues raised by doubters of the faith once delivered to the saints?

One of the noticeable actions in the first few centuries of the church's existence when there was a culture of opposition to the faith, was the number of apologists for the faith. I'm thinking of: (1) Eastern apologists such as Justin Martyr (ca. 100-165); Tatian (ca. 110-172), a pupil of Justin; Athenagoras; Theophilus of Antioch; (2) Western apologists such as Tertullian (b. 160); Minucius Felix (ca 200). Then there were polemicists who tried to counter of false teaching, e.g. Irenaeus, Clement of Alexandria, Origen, etc.

Yes, we have active apologists today such as Bill Craig, Ravi Zacharias, Norm Geisler, etc. However, do you know of many local churches that are equipping people to be defenders of the faith and those who are active in countering false doctrine?

I see and hear the occasional defender of the faith on university campuses here in Australia, but there are more antagonists than there are respondents to doubt about God, Jesus and Christian things.

You have raised an excellent topic.

Back in 2009, I laid some of the blame at the feet of the church. See 'The church's role in national decay'.

How many of you are as old as I and are able to remember the Keith Green gospel song, 'Asleep in the Light'?

Oz

 

[Dan57]

Probably a sign of the end times, and I suspect it will get worse. Falsehoods, complacency, and a world full of lies make people not take anything too seriously or commit to anything. "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first" (2 Thessalonians 2:3)

 

[pom2014]

What needs to be kept in mind are the countless people through history that took on the label of Christian while flagrantly being in rebellion to the Kings commands.

The percentages are staggering.

There will be many that will say lord lord in the end.

 

[LightMessenger]

The decline is obviously due to many people finally opening their eyes to the fact that bigotry has for so long a time taken front row center. They are realizing that minorities, such as you mention (the LGBT community) are continuing to be marginalized under the holier-than-thou crowd. And the vast majority of Americans, including Evangelicals, are not accepting that anymore. (The latest count is around 59%, well over 50%) They are soundly rejecting bigotry, prejudice, and discrimination along with intolerance brought about by inappropriate Scriptures being used by some as a means to maintain their dominance and superiority over those whom they strongly dislike due to sexual orientation differences.

The bottom line to this is that you can continue to argue about the decline until you are blue in the face but the fact of the matter is that America is not a Theocracy. Therefore, religious rules do not apply in this country or society in order that they should take precedence over other laws of the land. You and others need to know and understand that.

 

[HammerStone]

Interesting how someone who has not posted in anything but threads about homosexuality also relates it to the decline of Christianity? And yet those nasty Conservative Christians are the ones so obsessed with what happens in the bedroom? Methinks thou doth protest too much.

There is clearly more than any single pet factor at work in this, most notable being simple things like relative peace and prosperity, technology, and an unheralded shifting worldview which is very much materialistic in emphasis. However, juxtapose that with Christianity growing in Asia and Africa where it very much costs you more than public opinion or even a fine to be a Christian. They don't have the luxury of labeling bigotry by opinions of sex, greed, or whatever. The bigots they encounter might just be standing just behind their bandana'ed eyes holding an AK-47 to them on a beach.

Persecution in the west is very much an intellectual pressure. Time will tell if it turns physical. To me, rather than fear any persecution or pressure, this should increase our urgency regardless of sexual opinions, desires or circumstance. This should make us pray and witness regardless of being Conservative or Liberal or whatever the label may be.

As Charles Spurgeon said so well:

“If sinners be damned, at least let them leap to Hell over our dead bodies. And if they perish, let them perish with our arms wrapped about their knees, imploring them to stay. If Hell must be filled, let it be filled in the teeth of our exertions, and let not one go unwarned and unprayed for.”

This is the attitude we should all pray that God gives us, again regardless of what we think of those homophobes, Sodomites, sick, lost, depressed, lonely, or __________. The other side is not just things, ideas, or ideology. They're people, all of them.

 

[StanJ]

Interesting how someone who has not posted in anything but threads about homosexuality also relates it to the decline of Christianity? And yet those nasty Conservative Christians are the ones so obsessed with what happens in the bedroom? Methinks thou doth protest too much.

There is clearly more than any single pet factor at work in this, most notable being simple things like relative peace and prosperity, technology, and an unheralded shifting worldview which is very much materialistic in emphasis. However, juxtapose that with Christianity growing in Asia and Africa where it very much costs you more than public opinion or even a fine to be a Christian. They don't have the luxury of labeling bigotry by opinions of sex, greed, or whatever. The bigots they encounter might just be standing just behind their bandana'ed eyes holding an AK-47 to them on a beach.

Persecution in the west is very much an intellectual pressure. Time will tell if it turns physical. To me, rather than fear any persecution or pressure, this should increase our urgency regardless of sexual opinions, desires or circumstance. This should make us pray and witness regardless of being Conservative or Liberal or whatever the label may be.

As Charles Spurgeon said so well:

“If sinners be damned, at least let them leap to Hell over our dead bodies. And if they perish, let them perish with our arms wrapped about their knees, imploring them to stay. If Hell must be filled, let it be filled in the teeth of our exertions, and let not one go unwarned and unprayed for.”

This is the attitude we should all pray that God gives us, again regardless of what we think of those homophobes, Sodomites, sick, lost, depressed, lonely, or __________. The other side is not just things, ideas, or ideology. They're people, all of them.

Not interesting at all Hammer... just more of the ONLY thing this member speaks about, accepting the LGBT agenda under the guise of being a Christian.

That we are more aware of sins today doesn't mean there are more of them, it's the age we live in and the Global Village gets smaller and smaller.

Are sinners getting bolder...maybe... but if that IS the case, then Christians have to get bolder as well, and confront the false teachings that continue to assail the BOC.
Persecution is not the same as false teaching and I don't believe we should treat then the same.

 

[FHII]

I agree with you hammerstone. I think there are a lot of things to consider as to why its happening. You touched on it, but I'll blame idleness and fullness of bread. In other words, when things are going great, societies tend to forget god. It happened to Israel often in the OT.

There's something to think about... point the finger at western society, but it isn't much different than when Israel prospered.

 

[newlife]

I thought I would cite a couple of concrete examples of attempts to coerce Christian's to abandon their principles. I see this as likely to become much more of a pattern in coming days. As i stated in a earlier post it will become increasingly more difficult for Christians in coming years to maintain employment and remain integrated within society without a willingness to compromise some of their fundamental beliefs.

Jen Keaton, a student at Augusta State University in Georgia, had asserted both in and outside the classroom that she considered homosexual behavior "a behavioral choice not a state of being" claiming her Christian beliefs was the basis for her stand on these issues. The college authorities insisted that Keaton submit to a "remediation program" and attend" sensitivity training" on homosexuality to alter her views as well a attend a "gay pride event" and prepare a report on it or be expelled from school. The case was appealed in court. The college argued that it was now a moot issue because she had already been expelled. (p. 26,One Nation Without God: The Battle for Christianity in an Age of Unbelief" by David Ackerman published by Baker Books (2012). The case was pending in Federal District Court at the time the book was published.

Julea Ward, was expelled from the counseling program at Michigan State University on 3/12/09 for refusing to change her religious convictions and endorse homosexual behavior. Ms Ward was told that the only way she could avoid expulsion was to submit to a "remediation program" so as to alter her views on homosexuality.The case was being appealed in court, pp 26-27 One Nation Without God:the Battle for Chritsianity in an Age of Unbelief.

 

[StanJ]

This type of coercion doesn't just exist as it pertains to homosexuality.

Here's one video on how academia persecutes those that hold to ID.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5EPymcWp-g

Here's another that shows how the World view is no more than propaganda.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXDDZrYOuAE

 

[winc]

This type of coercion doesn't just exist as it pertains to homosexuality.

Here's one video on how academia persecutes those that hold to ID.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5EPymcWp-g

Here's another that shows how the World view is no more than propaganda.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXDDZrYOuAE



the real reason/s why = false teaching/s by the Church and by our schools to todays children and yesterdays children/todays adults = confusion/uncertainty/doubt /disbelief = falling away in droves/school leavers and adults.

false church teaching = via google see and hear [Hell's best kept secret]

false school teaching = Juniors via google see and hear [Fact vs Faith]textbooks and for Seniors [www.EvolutionvsGod.com] - twinc

 

[River Jordan]

Like a lot of phenomena, people oftentimes make the mistake of looking for a singular explanation, when in fact there are multiple factors at play. Here in the US, Christianity is in pretty rapid decline among the young, and there are multiple reasons for it. Fortunately, we have some pretty good survey data to help us see what is behind the trend.

Six Reasons Young Christians Leave Church

 

[pom2014]

That's odd I have spoken to a number of ex-Christians that said their reason was they couldn't trust the church because of hypocrisy and lies.

I know that I've left a number of churches but nit the faith. I realised that the trouble was with men not God.

 

[HammerStone]

<Edit> Have to retype, the post feature borked on me!

 

[DogLady19]

Persecution in the west is very much an intellectual pressure. ...

As Charles Spurgeon said so well:

“If sinners be damned, at least let them leap to Hell over our dead bodies. And if they perish, let them perish with our arms wrapped about their knees, imploring them to stay. If Hell must be filled, let it be filled in the teeth of our exertions, and let not one go unwarned and unprayed for.”

This is the attitude we should all pray that God gives us, again regardless of what we think of those homophobes, Sodomites, sick, lost, depressed, lonely, or __________. The other side is not just things, ideas, or ideology. They're people, all of them.

Wow! That Spurgeon quote is spot on!

As I began to read this thread, my first thought was, "What is the Church doing that is drawing people to God, and what is the Church doing to drive people away?"

I was raised in a church that counted the number of pews filled as a measure of success. When I became an adult, I found churches that were more concerned about how well they did to teach the Truth and demonstrate God's love to the small number of new visitors each week. The latter tends to also take their witness to the workplace, into their home life, their everyday encounter with their neighbors. The former tends to preach, preach, point fingers, and hope no one from church sees them during the week. Their testimony to the lost is, "What a hypocrite!"... and we hear about that all the time...

We, the Body of Christ, are ultimately responsible for how the lost see God, for better or for worse. Most atheists I encounter are not truly atheistic. They are mad at God because he was presented as a magic genie who never grants wishes; and a God who is oblivious to His selfish, arrogant, flesh-indulging followers.

The mission is simple enough:
"Let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven." -Matthew 5:16

Simple, but not easy... but it's the only task God asks of us. It should be a focus for the Church and each of its members.

That's odd I have spoken to a number of ex-Christians that said their reason was they couldn't trust the church because of hypocrisy and lies.

I know that I've left a number of churches but nit the faith. I realised that the trouble was with men not God.

I also hear that a lot... and the sad part is, it means the attention was drawn to the people at the church instead of Jesus.

 

[StanJ]

<Edit> Have to retype, the post feature borked on me!

LOL...yeh it's done that to me a few times as well. :lol:

I realised that the trouble was with men not God.

INDEED!!!

 

[pom2014]

But sadly many young people think that the men and God are one in the same. Which is not true, perspective is often off with youth.

 

[DogLady19]

But sadly many young people think that the men and God are one in the same. Which is not true, perspective is often off with youth.

But then again, the right perspective often comes "from the mouth of babes"... It's only when they've been tainted by adults who have lost their perspective do they begin to think like that.

 

[Butch5]

There is definite decline in the number of people who identify themselves as Christian in the West. The trend toward secularism amd the denial of the supernatural began with the Enlightenment and now underpins Western thought. We are increasingly becoming a post- Christian society. This trend has accelerated recently. The decline is not only evident among nominal Christians and liberal churches but among evangelicals as well. People are not gravitating by and large toward New Age belief systems but are increasingly becoming indifferent to Christianity and also turning toward humanistic psophy, atheism/ agnosticism. Although I don't agree completely with its conclusions the Great Evangelical Recession by John Dickerson (2013) published by Baker Books provides considerable documentation of these trends. There has been considearble growth of Charismatic/ Pentecostal Christianity in Latin America, Subsaharan Africa and parts of Asia however.

According to the 2010 Eurobarometer poll 40 percent of the population of France denies the existence of God, Spirit or any form of life force, the highest rate of atheism in Europe, while 27 percent said that they believe there is a God. In Sweden 34 percent did not believe in God, Spirit or a life force while 18 percent believed in God. Overall among Euro Member states 51 percent affirmed a belief in God, with the highest rate of theism in Malta at 94 percent. Quite extraordinary numbers for a continent long considered to be at the center of Christian belief. The United States tends to be much more religous then Europe but delcline is evident here as well. In the US Gallup, Pew Research and the General Social Survey have noted a dramatic rise in the number of people with no religious affiliation placing that number between 16-18 percent of the general population with close to quarter of the population between 18-29 in that category.

The increasing acceptance of cohabitation and homosexuality, the acceptance of gay marriage as alternative lifestyles, the increasing crudity on television all reflect changes in mores among the public and a movement away from Biblical Christianity in the West.

Another book well worth reading and well researched is Ond Nation Without God: The Battle for Chrisitianity in an Age of Unbelief by David Aikman (2012) also by Baker Books.

In light of these trends I see Bblical Christians and Christianity itself as becoming increasingly marginalized. It will be increasingly difficult for Christians to remain true to Biblical principles, maintain employment and remain integrated within society without serious compromise. Any comments? I can cite further examples.

Have you looked at "Already Gone" a book by Ken Ham. He did research alone with the Barna group on why the church loses the young. The problem falls on us. Look at the church, so many different denominations and beliefs and then ask why are we losing them? As Christians we can't even agree on what the Scriptures say. Add to that the fact that many cannot answer simple Biblical questions. A child comes and asks his parents or pastor, how old is the earth? Parents can't answer, the pastor can't answer, and the child is told, you just have to have faith. In other words just believe it without evidence. That is not faith, Paul said, 'faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.' Paul knew that faith had evidence. So many today think that faith means to believe something without evidence. The child then goes to school and asks the science teacher, how old is the earth. He gets an answer, an answer that "appears" to be a logical well thought out answer. Now, one who has studied knows that the science teacher is talking in circles but the child doesn't. He goes to school and is taught by his teachers. He goes to math class and his math teacher tell him 10x10=100 and that is the truth. He goes to English class and the teacher tell him that the word "and" is a conjunction, and that is true, he goes to the science teacher and the teacher tells him the earth is 4.5 billion years old, and guess what? He believes that it is true.

In Church when you go into the kids section what do you find? Toys. You find pictures on the walls of different Bible stories portrayed as cartoons. Children make associations. Ask just about any Christian who grew up in church and they can tell you they remember those little posters portraying Biblical stories with cartoon figures. As children grow older they move away from cartoons but they don't forget. The memories that they have are of Bible stories as cartoons. Instead, why not seriously teach children the Bible.

How much good are we doing trying to bring others into the church when we can't keep the ones we already have? If we can't convince the ones who have grown up in the church how can we convince those no Biblical understanding?

 

[River Jordan]

A child comes and asks his parents or pastor, how old is the earth? Parents can't answer, the pastor can't answer, and the child is told, you just have to have faith. In other words just believe it without evidence.

They can't answer because it's not a theological or spiritual question.

The child then goes to school and asks the science teacher, how old is the earth. He gets an answer, an answer that "appears" to be a logical well thought out answer. Now, one who has studied knows that the science teacher is talking in circles but the child doesn't. He goes to school and is taught by his teachers. He goes to math class and his math teacher tell him 10x10=100 and that is the truth. He goes to English class and the teacher tell him that the word "and" is a conjunction, and that is true, he goes to the science teacher and the teacher tells him the earth is 4.5 billion years old, and guess what? He believes that it is true.

No, the teacher is not talking in circles. The teacher is doing what a science teacher is paid to do...answer in terms of what the world's scientific community has concluded.

The problem is actually the reverse of what you and Ken Ham describe. The problem is, too many kids are taught in church that science is untrustworthy, scientists are anti-God, and you have to choose between science and God. So what do a lot of these kids....kids who are inundated with technology....do? They go with science. If you look at the survey I posted, the anti-science attitude of Christianity is one of the reasons young people are leaving. Ken Ham and his group are only furthering that problem with their "it's either the Bible or science" rhetoric.

I mean, look at how AiG frames the issue....

According to them, it's extremely black/white where it's either young-earth creationism and God, or millions of years and watching gay porn while you get an abortion! And they wonder why kids are running, not walking, away from this nonsense? Come on...