Since more children and people have been killed by Israel than in the terrorist attack, should they stop?

[Scott Downey]

Zechariah 12
The [a]burden of the word of the Lord against Israel. Thus says the Lord, who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him: 2 “Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of [b]drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem. 3 And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it. 4 In that day,” says the Lord, “I will strike every horse with confusion, and its rider with madness; I will open My eyes on the house of Judah, and will strike every horse of the peoples with blindness. 5 And the governors of Judah shall say in their heart, ‘The inhabitants of Jerusalem are my strength in the Lord of hosts, their God.’ 6 In that day I will make the governors of Judah like a firepan in the woodpile, and like a fiery torch in the sheaves; they shall devour all the surrounding peoples on the right hand and on the left, but Jerusalem shall be inhabited again in her own place—Jerusalem.

7 “The Lord will save the tents of Judah first, so that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem shall not become greater than that of Judah. 8 In that day the Lord will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; the one who is feeble among them in that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the Angel of the Lord before them. 9 It shall be in that day that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

Mourning for the Pierced One​

10 “And I will pour on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced. Yes, they will mourn for Him as one mourns for his only son, and grieve for Him as one grieves for a firstborn. 11 In that day there shall be a great mourning in Jerusalem, like the mourning at Hadad Rimmon in the plain of [c]Megiddo. 12 And the land shall mourn, every family by itself: the family of the house of David by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of the house of Nathan by itself, and their wives by themselves; 13 the family of the house of Levi by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of Shimei by itself, and their wives by themselves; 14 all the families that remain, every family by itself, and their wives by themselves.

Zechariah 13
“In that day a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and for the inhabitants of Jerusalem, for sin and for uncleanness.

2 “It shall be in that day,” says the Lord of hosts, “that I will cut off the names of the idols from the land, and they shall no longer be remembered. I will also cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to depart from the land. 3 It shall come to pass that if anyone still prophesies, then his father and mother who begot him will say to him, ‘You shall not live, because you have spoken lies in the name of the Lord.’ And his father and mother who begot him shall thrust him through when he prophesies.

 

[dad]

Read Jeremiah 23, brought back to the land, then saved, and Zechariah agrees with that too.

1 “Woe to the shepherds who destroy and scatter the sheep of My pasture!” says the Lord. 2 Therefore thus says the Lord God of Israel against the shepherds who feed My people: “You have scattered My flock, driven them away, and not attended to them. Behold, I will attend to you for the evil of your doings,” says the Lord. 3 “But I will gather the remnant of My flock out of all countries where I have driven them, and bring them back to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase. 4 I will set up shepherds over them who will feed them; and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, nor shall they be lacking,” says the Lord.

5 “Behold, the days are coming,” says the Lord,
“That I will raise to David a Branch of righteousness;
A King shall reign and [a]prosper,
And execute [b]judgment and righteousness in the [c]earth.
6 In His days Judah will be saved,
And Israel will dwell safely;
Now this is His name by which He will be called:
[d]THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

7 “Therefore, behold, the days are coming,” says the Lord, “that they shall no longer say, ‘As the Lord lives who brought up the children of Israel from the land of Egypt,’ 8 but, ‘As the Lord lives who brought up and led the descendants of the house of Israel from the north country and from all the countries where I had driven them.’ And they shall dwell in their own land.”

All that is when Jesus returns and they are saved. David also of course.

 

[dad]

Zechariah 12
The [a]burden of the word of the Lord against Israel. Thus says the Lord, who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him: 2 “Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of [b]drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem.

Armageddon

3 And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it. 4 In that day,” says the Lord, “I will strike every horse with confusion, and its rider with madness; I will open My eyes on the house of Judah, and will strike every horse of the peoples with blindness. 5 And the governors of Judah shall say in their heart, ‘The inhabitants of Jerusalem are my strength in the Lord of hosts, their God.’ 6 In that day I will make the governors of Judah like a firepan in the woodpile, and like a fiery torch in the sheaves; they shall devour all the surrounding peoples on the right hand and on the left, but Jerusalem shall be inhabited again in her own place—Jerusalem.

Again, the end of the tribulation and Armageddon era

7 “The Lord will save the tents of Judah first, so that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem shall not become greater than that of Judah. 8 In that day the Lord will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; the one who is feeble among them in that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the Angel of the Lord before them. 9 It shall be in that day that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

Same as above

Mourning for the Pierced One​

10 “And I will pour on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced. Yes, they will mourn for Him as one mourns for his only son, and grieve for Him as one grieves for a firstborn. 11 In that day there shall be a great mourning in Jerusalem, like the mourning at Hadad Rimmon in the plain of [c]Megiddo. 12 And the land shall mourn, every family by itself: the family of the house of David by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of the house of Nathan by itself, and their wives by themselves; 13 the family of the house of Levi by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of Shimei by itself, and their wives by themselves; 14 all the families that remain, every family by itself, and their wives by themselves.

Same as above

Zechariah 13
“In that day a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and for the inhabitants of Jerusalem, for sin and for uncleanness.

2 “It shall be in that day,” says the Lord of hosts, “that I will cut off the names of the idols from the land, and they shall no longer be remembered. I will also cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to depart from the land. 3 It shall come to pass that if anyone still prophesies, then his father and mother who begot him will say to him, ‘You shall not live, because you have spoken lies in the name of the Lord.’ And his father and mother who begot him shall thrust him through when he prophesies.

Same as above

 

[Jack]

You are seeing compassion for terror victims as hatred.
When He brings them back, He will fight for them. Meanwhile they terrorize neighbors and head for a time of trouble unlike any other in history or the future. God is not on their side now. Nothing they do can be blamed on God.
That is prophesy and it is blasphemy to accuse God of spewing hatred.

I'm accusing Israel haters of spewing HATRED. Not the God of Israel!

This is long after Israel forsook God:

Luke 1
68 "Blessed is the Lord God of Israel, For He has visited and redeemed His people,

 

[dad]

I'm accusing Israel haters of spewing HATRED. Not the God of Israel!

This is long after Israel forsook God:

Luke 1
68 "Blessed is the Lord God of Israel, For He has visited and redeemed His people,

Jesus visited Israel and redeemed as many as would believe. The rest had lots of problems. Rather than Israel being redeemed for rejecting Jesus, they had their temple destroyed and got dispersed all over if they lived.

 

[Jack]

Jesus visited Israel and redeemed as many as would believe. The rest had lots of problems. Rather than Israel being redeemed for rejecting Jesus, they had their temple destroyed and got dispersed all over if they lived.

Were you ever unsaved? Are you in the Bible? Israel is in the Bible over 2500 times. Why do you think you're qualified to judge Israel? Honestly you sound like a Hamas puppet.

 

[dad]

Were you ever unsaved? Are you in the Bible? Israel is in the Bible over 2500 times. Why do you think you're qualified to judge Israel? Honestly you sound like a Hamas puppet.

If I was unsaved I would not expect either the blessing of God or to be able to kill children. The fact they are unsaved is obvious and undeniable. The fact that the land is only promised to be restored to them by God after they are saved is bible 101. It is not OK to mass murder families and torment a population by starving and depriving them of basic human needs like water and medical help. That is not of God and shows that Israel does not have the love of God in them, as Jesus pointed out. It also shows the justice of God when the judgments to come, as severe as they will be, falls on Israel.

 

[Jack]

If I was unsaved I would not expect either the blessing of God or to be able to kill children. The fact they are unsaved is obvious and undeniable. The fact that the land is only promised to be restored to them by God after they are saved is bible 101. It is not OK to mass murder families and torment a population by starving and depriving them of basic human needs like water and medical help. That is not of God and shows that Israel does not have the love of God in them, as Jesus pointed out. It also shows the justice of God when the judgments to come, as severe as they will be, falls on Israel.

How do you know that??? You're so full of hatred for Israel. What makes you think Israel is unsaved? Where are you mentioned in the Bible? Here maybe?

Genesis 12
I will curse him who curses you;

 

[BeyondET]

Is bombing apartment buildings and etc a war any more than the terrorists who killed innocent people in Israel was a war? Also, what is the Christian position on this? Some preachers say we must pray for 'Israel' and support it, as well as the massive revenge happening, ??

What should of happened when the hamas group entered Israel. Most surely they wouldn't have stopped at just the border towns.

 

[Jack]

What should of happened when the hamas group entered Israel. Most surely they wouldn't have stopped at just the border towns.

Dad is too busy attacking Israel to mention that Hamas started all this and beheaded 40 Israeli babies. Kind of like a Satanic Hamas messenger.

 

[BeyondET]

Dad is too busy attacking Israel to mention that Hamas started all this and beheaded 40 Israeli babies. Kind of like a Satanic Hamas messenger.

Hamas is more satanic like than Fatah but they both want the complete destruction of Isreal. They would if they could behead the whole population, like an Islamic Hitler or something.

 

[dad]

How do you know that??? You're so full of hatred for Israel. What makes you think Israel is unsaved? Where are you mentioned in the Bible? Here maybe?

Genesis 12
I will curse him who curses you;

Either they accept Jesus as Good and savior or not. Be honest. There is no other way, period. They are not blessed now and no one can be cursed for seeing that they do not have the love of God in them

 

[dad]

Hamas is more satanic like than Fatah but they both want the complete destruction of Isreal. They would if they could behead the whole population, like an Islamic Hitler or something.

That does not give Israel the right to kill children wholesale and hatefully deprive a population of basic needs. When you point a finger at Gaza remember there are three fingers pointing back at you

 

[Jack]

Hamas is more satanic like than Fatah but they both want the complete destruction of Isreal. They would if they could behead the whole population, like an Islamic Hitler or something.

Bingo!

 

[Jack]

Either they accept Jesus as Good and savior or not. Be honest. There is no other way, period. They are not blessed now and no one can be cursed for seeing that they do not have the love of God in them

Your Hamas like opinions do not overrule God of the Bible, Jesus the God of Israel.

Romans 11
26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27 For this is My covenant with them, When I take away their sins."

You should be so fortunate.

 

[Scott Downey]

Armageddon



Again, the end of the tribulation and Armageddon era


Same as above

Same as above

Same as above

Those people are saved at the very end of the age, not before. This is what God says.

 

[Chadrho]

Do you even understand Gaza at all? Obviously you can't comprehend.
The Palestinians were sold a bucket of crap. They trusted Hamas and Hamas uses the Palestinians the way the rest of the Middle East uses them. Not worthy of consideration. However, Israel has 20,000 Palestinians employed while the rest of the Middle East has made their voices heard loud and clear ......Palestine is not welcome in Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia. Yet if the Palestinians were not taught to dedicate their souls to eliminating JEWS and ruled themselves instead of depending on an entity that wishes nothing but blood ......Palestine and Israel would figure this out and work as one .......

Hamas has to go.

POOR Palestinians are trapped by poor choices. Selling their souls to Hamas. Hamas runs Gaza ....not the Palestinians ....

The two state solution is the experiment happening right now .....and the Palestinians by voting Hamas are failing ....They had two choices and failed in not having a third.

If Hamas gives up their guns .....Palestinians have peace. If Israel gives up their guns .......After Hamas, Iran and Hezbollah massacres the Jews in Israel .....who is next? Jews in Europe then America?

You pay no attention to history and history is not on your side. The squad will be be more than willing to put you on their campaign donation list along with Trudeau ........

I don't know why you think I would disagree that Hamas should go from what I wrote. Of course Hamas should go; they're horrible. But as I did say, you cannot identify Hamas with the Palestinian people in general.

People should try to put extreme views aside and think clearly about what is just given the history of this ongoing conflict and the massacre that ignited this particular rash of violence and destruction.

Pace the OP, what constitutes proportionality given the history of these two groups and the massacre? First and foremost: What's the proportional, just response given the massacre? I would say a well-reasond view looks something like this:

Proportionality is a complex matter, and I can’t set out the right view of what it involves here. But one rough and ready test that typically holds true is that the use of military force is proportionate only if the harms inflicted on non-liable people—innocent Palestinian civilians in this case—are significantly smaller than future harms prevented. The harms that are caused, and that weigh against the use of defensive force, include those that result from escalation. Some harms inflicted during the conflict will be the responsibility of those in conflict with Israel, including Hamas; but some harms inflicted by Hamas that result from the Israeli response will also be the responsibility of the Israeli government. The same thing is true for Hamas—the predictably violent response of the Israeli government is not only the responsibility of the Israeli government, but also the responsibility of Hamas.

Proportionality and Responsibility in the Israel-Hamas Conflict (guest post) - Daily Nous

What do the "moral constraints that apply to defensive force" imply in a situation as complicated as the conflict between Israel and Hamas? In the following guest post, Victor Tadros, professor of criminal law and legal theory at the University of Warwick, discusses the complexity of...

dailynous.com

Look at the numbers of Palestinian civilians that have died thus far compared to that of the initial massacre. Now, at this point, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. Or, the displacement of a million or so people to try and weed out Hamas will surely lead to the suffering and death of innocents that by far exceeds the initial attack on innocents. There has to be a better way than what we are seeing. It's not just.

 

[BeyondET]

That does not give Israel the right to kill children wholesale and hatefully deprive a population of basic needs. When you point a finger at Gaza remember there are three fingers pointing back at you

Then explain how Isreal should of handled it?

Israel isn't killing children wholesale, and I'm pointing the finger at hamas.

 

[dad]

Your Hamas like opinions do not overrule God of the Bible, Jesus the God of Israel.

Romans 11
26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27 For this is My covenant with them, When I take away their sins."

You should be so fortunate.

Your labeling compassion for terror victims in Gaza 'hamas like' is a cheap deflection attempt
All Israel is not saved now, but the few who are left alive one day will be saved. God has not turned ungodliness away from them yet, of course

 

[dad]

Those people are saved at the very end of the age, not before. This is what God says.

Not sure what you think the end of the age is. But it will be around the time Jesus returns