Sanctification is not a Process

[marks]

(I wonder if the Father had not turned His face away, as it were, briefly, could Jesus have died.)

That's a heavy thought! My wife and I just finished reading Psalm 119 in our morning reading, and from that, I'm inclined to think you have something there. I won't pretend that the mind of Christ on the cross is comprehensible to me! Though I think many of the Psalms show us Jesus' heart and mind.

True, but we're human, so there may be times when we're gonna react out of our pain at times. I was frustrated and angry with Him once and I know I've asked Him at times what is going on or whether I have stepped out of His will in some way.
I find that when I am real with Him, He answers quickly. And He is big enough to take our emotions. But it's a comfort to know that He will never leave us or forsake us....even though there are times when we will feel forsaken like Jesus on the cross in order that some aspect of our self-life can weaken or die.

Yes, I know this also, sometimes we just cry out in pain, just as you say. For me, realizing that I am naked before Him, an open book, and He knows me infinitely more than I know myself, I've had to learn/train to not hide from Him. Because there is no hiding!

Because I can trust Him, I can be completely open with Him. I can't tell Him a thing about myself! Even if I say to Him, I want Your will in my life, there's no point, He already knows just how much that may be true and not true.

Setting aside all pretence, though, means I'm not deceiving myself. If I try to hide from God, the only one I'm really hiding from is myself.

For He has said, I will never leave you, nor forsake you, this is one of those great and precious promises, by which we can become partakers of His nature. Being with Him works great change in us!

Much love!

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Let me be upfront with you, I'm not here seeking friends, but godly brothers and sisters that can help a fallen comrade, in this race to the celestial city.

Precious friend, I don't remember if I shared this with you or not - I will keep praying for you:

GRACE Word For our infirmities!

 

[Johann]

Precious friend, I don't remember if I shared this with you or not - I will keep praying for you:

GRACE Word For our infirmities!

Much appreciated
J.

 

[Lizbeth]

I don't rely on self, or self worth, sister, in fact, I don't like myself and don't know what my purpose in life is--I was whole in my marriage to my dear, godly wife and in the ministry we were in there was a sense of purpose and "being alive" and sensed the presence of the Holy Spirit--since then, the ministry closed and lost my wife--as if I'm not empty enough of "self"

Guess God is doing something--small beginnings--and instead of letting my emotions get the better of me, since I am human and not a super duper holy joe--I'll encourage myself in Christ or be encouraged by Him.

I'm not being sarcastic here re the "holy joe" and I don't suffer from an inferiority complex--but reaching out to others is difficult, for me, in a social manner.
Let me be upfront with you, I'm not here seeking friends, but godly brothers and sisters that can help a fallen comrade, in this race to the celestial city.

I don't worry much re the demons, they can't touch me or influence me and I have an Advocate with the Father.

Again, this is not a place to give my personal testimonies or reveal my weaknesses.

I sincerely hope you understand what I'm trying to convey to you.
J.

11 For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the LORD, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future.

Psalms 34:18
Praying for You
18 The LORD is close to the brokenhearted and saves those who are crushed in spirit.

Psalms 147:3
Brokenhearted
3 He heals the brokenhearted and binds up their wounds.

Revelation 21:4
4 ‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’ or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”

Matthew 4:23-25
23 Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, proclaiming the good news of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people.
24 News about him spread all over Syria, and people brought to him all who were ill with various diseases, those suffering severe pain, the demon-possessed, those having seizures, and the paralyzed; and he healed them.
25 Large crowds from Galilee, the Decapolis, Jerusalem, Judea and the region across the Jordan followed him.

Psalms 23
Your Daily Verse - Psalm 23:5
1 The LORD is my shepherd, I lack nothing.
2 He makes me lie down in green pastures, he leads me beside quiet waters,
3 he refreshes my soul. He guides me along the right paths for his name’s sake.
4 Even though I walk through the darkest valley,I will fear no evil, for you are with me; your rod and your staff, they comfort me.
5 You prepare a table before me in the presence of my enemies. You anoint my head with oil; my cup overflows.
6 Surely your goodness and love will follow me all the days of my life, and I will dwell in the house of the LORD forever.

2 Corinthians 1:3-8
3 Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of compassion and the God of all comfort,
4 who comforts us in all our troubles, so that we can comfort those in any trouble with the comfort we ourselves receive from God.
5 For just as we share abundantly in the sufferings of Christ, so also our comfort abounds through Christ.
6 If we are distressed, it is for your comfort and salvation; if we are comforted, it is for your comfort, which produces in you patient endurance of the same sufferings we suffer.
7 And our hope for you is firm, because we know that just as you share in our sufferings, so also you share in our comfort.
8 We do not want you to be uninformed, brothers and sisters, about the troubles we experienced in the province of Asia. We were under great pressure, far beyond our ability to endure, so that we despaired of life itself.

I don't ask or expect testimonies or anyone to reveal weaknesses, especially on the world wide web, unless they particularly want to, or are led to. Some people like to be more open, others not so much. I'm usually on the reserved side compared to some folks, and am neither offended by reticence nor am I wanting or expecting personal friendships to happen on the internet. People just fellowship and share things of God within the limitations afforded by the medium.

At the end of the day we all really stand alone before God - everyone's situations are in some ways similar, being human, and most adult believers are acquainted with grief in some shape or form......but in other ways circumstances are unique to the person and often complex. We all need perseverance/patience in our trials, or God is developing it in us through the trials.

Anyway, I'm sorry about your wife, and am sure you are missing her a great deal and pray the Lord to be near you in your grief.

 

[Lizbeth]

Another thought - “has become for us” wisdom, sanctification, etc. - doesn’t necessarily mean we are steeped in wisdom from day one of receiving the down payment of the Spirit. There’s still the renewing of the mind and learning what is right in Gods eyes. It doesn’t even mean we are incapable of turning away from the calling, cleansing, plowing, etc. We stumble many times, dirty our feet, get a little sideways as we begin to learn what is right/righteousness in Gods eyes.

Jesus has become everything we need, since He is the source of everything, and we became connected to Him, the Source, when we believed. Everything we need flows from Him like a river and like Ezekiel we are to be walking deeper and deeper into that River until it potentially can flood and fill and overflow everything that we used to be. As we keep seeking Him for it, seeking Him for everything, and learning to rely on Him for everything more and more.....wisdom, sanctification and holiness, faith, strength, etc.

The Jordan River being a lesson/ensample/parable to the church, being said to have been at flood stage, when the Israelites crossed over, I believe depicts us being completely and thoroughly immersed and cleansed and consecrated, ie, sanctified. Already accomplished with our baptism and faith in Christ, being washed in His blood that flowed, but in another way we are in process of apprehending it by taking ground little by little. This is what it means to be working out our faith with fear and trembling. We must not "seem" to have come short of that rest (Promised Land). It says "seem" in that verse because in one way it says "we who believe" have already entered that rest, but in another way we are in process of entering it, "perfecting holiness in the fear of the Lord". We have been made holy by the Blood of Christ, but in another sense we are to be perfecting it...working out our salvation. At least it all seems to make sense to me this way....it seems consistent with the scriptures as far as I can tell, but of course please test it, as we are to test all things.

 

[ChristisGod]

Jesus has become everything we need, since He is the source of everything, and we became connected to Him, the Source, when we believed. Everything we need flows from Him like a river and like Ezekiel we are to be walking deeper and deeper into that River until it potentially can flood and fill and overflow everything that we used to be. As we keep seeking Him for it, seeking Him for everything, and learning to rely on Him for everything more and more.....wisdom, sanctification and holiness, faith, strength, etc.

The Jordan River being a lesson/ensample/parable to the church, being said to have been at flood stage, when the Israelites crossed over, I believe depicts us being completely and thoroughly immersed and cleansed and consecrated, ie, sanctified. Already accomplished with our baptism and faith in Christ, being washed in His blood that flowed, but in another way we are in process of apprehending it by taking ground little by little. This is what it means to be working out our faith with fear and trembling. We must not "seem" to have come short of that rest (Promised Land). It says "seem" in that verse because in one way it says "we who believe" have already entered that rest, but in another way we are in process of entering it, "perfecting holiness in the fear of the Lord". We have been made holy by the Blood of Christ, but in another sense we are to be perfecting it...working out our salvation. At least it all seems to make sense to me this way....it seems consistent with the scriptures as far as I can tell, but of course please test it, as we are to test all things.

ah you have described the process of sanctification !!!

 

[Brakelite]

Have you ever considered that while God oversees everything, He may not be actively or directly involved in things on the earth, even though we correctly give Him ultimate credit for it?
I think we may over state the case at times saying, the holy Spirit did this, God did that, when in actual fact it was the direct work of angels? I think we tend to underestimate the work of angels in our lives, and the presence throughout the church and even in the world working and ministering on our behalf. We see them often in the old testament, even directing politics as revealed in Daniel. But I think we tend to downplay their role in our day, and believe it is God personally directing traffic so to speak.
We say the holy Spirit is working in our lives, and rightly so... But I am wondering if the holy Spirit is actually working through angels, and it is the angels, under supervision, who are creating circumstances and providing assistance in our lives without which we would be lost and in trouble. The whispers in the ear... The chance meetings... The inspiration when reading scripture... The sudden light that reveals truth... The "gifts of the Spirit"including but not exclusive to them, such as words of knowledge, intuition, discernment, those "warning bells" that lead us away from potential danger... Divine Providence... And even at times when necessary, physical intervention.
I see throughout scripture, old and new testaments, both spiritual and physical intervention by angels, both good and evil. Hence Paul's counsel to test the spirits. And the only sure way to test the spirits is by the word of God. Just as Jesus did..."it is written".
Relying on feelings, intuition, impressions, or other men regardless their diplomas and credentials, be they individuals or leading a denomination etc etc however can be dangerous. Relying on the impressions and feelings of others even more so.
If we are to test the spirits, even more so ought we test men. However. If our lives are His, and if we have surrendered to Him in faith and in a sure hope of His grace and mercy, we can know that God is leading us, not necessarily away from danger, but through danger and by trials and testing we learn more to trust in His power and wisdom.

 

[Johann]

ah you have described the process of sanctification !!!

Have you ever considered that while God oversees everything, He may not be actively or directly involved in things on the earth, even though we correctly give Him ultimate credit for it?
I think we may over state the case at times saying, the holy Spirit did this, God did that, when in actual fact it was the direct work of angels? I think we tend to underestimate the work of angels in our lives, and the presence throughout the church and even in the world working and ministering on our behalf. We see them often in the old testament, even directing politics as revealed in Daniel. But I think we tend to downplay their role in our day, and believe it is God personally directing traffic so to speak.
We say the holy Spirit is working in our lives, and rightly so... But I am wondering if the holy Spirit is actually working through angels, and it is the angels, under supervision, who are creating circumstances and providing assistance in our lives without which we would be lost and in trouble. The whispers in the ear... The chance meetings... The inspiration when reading scripture... The sudden light that reveals truth... The "gifts of the Spirit"including but not exclusive to them, such as words of knowledge, intuition, discernment, those "warning bells" that lead us away from potential danger... Divine Providence... And even at times when necessary, physical intervention.
I see throughout scripture, old and new testaments, both spiritual and physical intervention by angels, both good and evil. Hence Paul's counsel to test the spirits. And the only sure way to test the spirits is by the word of God. Just as Jesus did..."it is written".
Relying on feelings, intuition, impressions, or other men regardless their diplomas and credentials, be they individuals or leading a denomination etc etc however can be dangerous. Relying on the impressions and feelings of others even more so.
If we are to test the spirits, even more so ought we test men. However. If our lives are His, and if we have surrendered to Him in faith and in a sure hope of His grace and mercy, we can know that God is leading us, not necessarily away from danger, but through danger and by trials and testing we learn more to trust in His power and wisdom.

---And then you turn to the letters of Paul and James and John and Peter and Jude, and there’s virtually no teaching about the function of angels in our present experience — as messengers and protectors or guides. And I just stand back and say, “That’s amazing.” And the least it can mean, it seems to me, that all those letters have no teaching about the present experience of angels in our lives — the least it can mean is that the teaching about angels and how they serve Christians now was simply not essential for us to know. That’s my conclusion.

And my own guess about the reason for that is that the Lord Jesus himself promised that he would come to us. “I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you” (John 14:18). He promised he would be with us “to the end of the age” (Matthew 28:20), and that he would give gifts to the church (Ephesians 4:7–16), and that he himself would build his church so that the gates of hell would not prevail against it (Matthew 16:18). Jesus is doing that, not angels. All of this teaching about the immediacy of Christ himself in this age, along with the presence of the Holy Spirit, is so overwhelming, glorious, that it has preempted any prominent place that angelic activity in the lives of Christians might have.

Unaware of Angels
Now, let’s be careful: to say that there isn’t a prominent place, or that the knowledge about them isn’t essential, does not mean there’s no place. And the book of Hebrews, from which this question is coming, is the place where the most pervasive answer to the question “What are angels for?” is given. Hebrews 1:13–14 goes like this:

And to which of the angels has he ever said,

“Sit at my right hand
until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet”?

Are they [angels] not all ministering spirits sent out to serve for the sake of those who are to inherit salvation?

So, we have the preeminence of Christ over against angels being highlighted. But then there is the amazing statement that angels are ministering spirits sent out into the world by God — now in this age — to serve for the sake of Christians. In other words, everywhere that angels are active in the world, doing whatever God assigns them to do, it is for the sake of making everything work together for the good of Christians (Romans 8:28).

But notice: the writer of Hebrews doesn’t draw any explicit inferences from angelic ministry for our behavior, nor does he anywhere else in the book of Hebrews. The closest to it would be the text that Cortney refers to when she asked this question — namely, Hebrews 13:2, which says, “Do not neglect to show hospitality to strangers, for thereby some have entertained angels unawares.”

“The Christian life should be a hundred times more oriented on Christ than on angels.”


Now, most commentators think this is a reference to the time that Abraham entertained three angels in Genesis 18. But whether that’s the case or not, the point of the verse is that since, in fact, angels have been shown hospitality without the host knowing it, therefore don’t neglect this crucial ministry of showing hospitality to strangers — especially Christian strangers, people you don’t know. And that is the point: You don’t know them. If you knew them, you’d know that they weren’t angels. These are strangers.

So, I think the answer to Cortney’s question is yes, there are angels among us. They might take the form of a stranger who needs your hospitality. The point of saying that is to raise very high the enormous importance of Christians being generous with our homes.

Christ Among Us
But keep in mind two amazing things that should keep us back from an unhealthy speculation about angels coming to our homes.

One is that Jesus already gave a much more amazing incentive for hospitality than this text does. He told the parable of the final judgment. Those at the Lord’s right hand who had shown him hospitality ask,

[Lord], when did we see you a stranger and welcome you? . . . And the King will answer them, “Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.” (Matthew 25:38, 40)

Which is greater? To welcome a Christian pilgrim and find that it was an angel, or to welcome a Christian pilgrim and find that it was Christ?

And the second amazing thing to keep in mind is that three verses later, in Hebrews 13:5–6, when the writer encourages us not to worry about the money that we might spend on hospitality, he does not say, “Oh, the angel will take care of you.” He says,

Keep your life free from love of money, and be content with what you have, for [God in Christ] has said, “I will never leave you nor forsake you.” So we can confidently say,

“The Lord [not angels] is my helper;
I will not fear;
what can man do to me?”

So, the New Testament position seems to be this: Angels are real. They are sent into the world for the sake of Christians. You might entertain an angel without knowing it. But vastly more important is to grasp that Christ is among us; Christ has promised to take care of us; Christ will never leave us or forsake us; Christ may be entertained in the person of a believer. And therefore, the Christian life should be a hundred times more oriented on Christ than on angels, and for his sake — for his sake — our homes should be open.

John Piper (@JohnPiper) is founder and teacher of desiringGod.org and chancellor of Bethlehem College & Seminary. For 33 years, he served as pastor of Bethlehem Baptist Church, Minneapolis, Minnesota. He is author of more than 50 books, including Desiring God: Meditations of a Christian Hedonist and most recently Come, Lord Jesus.

 

[Johann]

Many have been taught that sanctification is a process. But this is a smokescreen. No one gets holier with time. Maybe just holier than thou.

The Catholics also have a smokescreen. They call it "purgatory". But it's the same scheme....only with a different approach

What is the scheme? It is a reference to a denial that we can walk with God in holiness in THIS life...by grace through faith. That is our salvation. To walk with God as Jesus walked. No one does that gradually...it's not by works. It is a gift given to all who surrender themselves fully to God.

There are two paths we can follow...according to the ways of God. These are the ancient paths to walk in.

The way of righteousness. This way is the way of humility, honesty, brokenness and the fear of the Lord. This is the low road

The way of holiness in Christ: This is the narrow way that very few will find. This is the way of resurrection life...to walk as Jesus walked. This is the high road

Now, most believers walk in neither the low road nor the high road...(neither hot nor cold) instead they try to raise themselves up through a religious process...exemplified by Babylon.

The way up is actually down. Only God translates people into the higher walk. No one attains it over time.

We are to receive with MEEKNESS the implanted word. But that's not what happens, in most cases. In most cases a person who begins well gets seduced into placing themselves in a much higher place than they ought to. Let no one esteem himself higher than he should.

All religious efforts end the same way.

You are in error--

Have you ever wondered why “sanctification” is missing from this golden chain in Romans 8:29-30?

Those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

Foreknown, predestined, called, justified, __________, glorified. Shouldn’t “sanctified" fill in that blank space? Romans 6:22 says that believers receive “sanctification and its end, eternal life.” And 2 Thessalonians 2:13 says that we are “saved, through sanctification by the Spirit.”

The answer is, no, “sanctification” does not belong in space because it is included in “glorified.”

In Paul’s mind the process called sanctification in this life—the process of transformation from one degree of holiness to the next—is the first stage of glorification. He says,

We all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit. (2 Corinthians 3:18)

The progressive change that happens in this life can be described in terms of holiness or glory—sanctification or glorification.

The age to come will be a place of great physical glory. But mainly it will be a place of infinite moral and spiritual glory. The main beauty will be the beauty of holiness.

Therefore be amazed and sobered that this life is not just a waiting period for that day. You are being changed now “from one degree of glory to the another.” You are being glorified. That is, you are being sanctified. That is, you are being made morally glorious for the age to come.

--but you have been warned from members and refuse to repent.

"JUST", "JUSTIFY", ETC.


1. dikaios = just, righteous. From dike , right Occ. eighty times; forty transl. "righteous"; thirty-three "just"; five times "right"; and thrice "meet". In two places (Rom_3:8. Heb_2:2) "just" is the rendering of endikos . No other word in N.T. for "just", or "righteous".
2. dikaioo is to set forth as righteous, to justify. Occ. forty times, of which fifteen are in Romans. Always rendered "justify", except Rom_6:7 ("freed"), and Rev_22:11 ("be righteous"). The participle is transl. "justifier" in Rom_3:26.
3. dikaiosune = righteousness. Occ. ninety-two times, of which thirty-six are in Romans. Always transl. "righteousness". Other words to which the same transl. is given are dikaioma (see below), and euthutes , which latter occ. only in Heb_1:8.
4. dikaioma is a righteous ordinance, a decree (of acquittal). See Ap. 177. 4. Rendered "righteousness" in Rom_2:26; Rom_5:18; Rom_8:4. Rev_19:8; and "ordinance" in Luk_1:6. Heb_9:1; Heb_9:10 : "judgment", Rom_1:32. Rev_15:4 : "justification", Rom_5:16.
5. dikaiosis = justification. Occ. only in Rom_4:25; Rom_5:18. The only other word rendered "justification" is dikaioma (see 4), in Rom_5:16.
Bullinger.

Keep on preaching the Cross and Him crucified and resurrected

1Co_2:2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.


2) "Not to know anything among you." (Greek ou ti eidenai) "Not to know or perceive anything." (Greek en humin) "Among you" . . . Paul determined not to present himself, his Greek, Hebrew, or Latin or philosophy as a basis of being known among the brethren. Act_20:18-27.

3) "Save Jesus Christ." (Greek ei me iesoun Christon) "If not or except Jesus Christ." This indicates Paul's sincere desire to present Jesus Christ, not himself or his own wisdom and person (Gal_6:14; 1Co_10:24).

4) "And him crucified." (Greek kai touton estauromenon) "And this one having been crucified." Gal_2:20; Tit_3:5; 1Co_1:17; 1Co_1:31.

Stay on this topic, and you won't go wrong.

 

[ChristisGod]

You are in error--

Have you ever wondered why “sanctification” is missing from this golden chain in Romans 8:29-30?

Those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

Foreknown, predestined, called, justified, __________, glorified. Shouldn’t “sanctified" fill in that blank space? Romans 6:22 says that believers receive “sanctification and its end, eternal life.” And 2 Thessalonians 2:13 says that we are “saved, through sanctification by the Spirit.”

The answer is, no, “sanctification” does not belong in space because it is included in “glorified.”

In Paul’s mind the process called sanctification in this life—the process of transformation from one degree of holiness to the next—is the first stage of glorification. He says,

We all, with unveiled face, beholding the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from one degree of glory to another. For this comes from the Lord who is the Spirit. (2 Corinthians 3:18)

The progressive change that happens in this life can be described in terms of holiness or glory—sanctification or glorification.

The age to come will be a place of great physical glory. But mainly it will be a place of infinite moral and spiritual glory. The main beauty will be the beauty of holiness.

Therefore be amazed and sobered that this life is not just a waiting period for that day. You are being changed now “from one degree of glory to the another.” You are being glorified. That is, you are being sanctified. That is, you are being made morally glorious for the age to come.

--but you have been warned from members and refuse to repent.

"JUST", "JUSTIFY", ETC.


1. dikaios = just, righteous. From dike , right Occ. eighty times; forty transl. "righteous"; thirty-three "just"; five times "right"; and thrice "meet". In two places (Rom_3:8. Heb_2:2) "just" is the rendering of endikos . No other word in N.T. for "just", or "righteous".
2. dikaioo is to set forth as righteous, to justify. Occ. forty times, of which fifteen are in Romans. Always rendered "justify", except Rom_6:7 ("freed"), and Rev_22:11 ("be righteous"). The participle is transl. "justifier" in Rom_3:26.
3. dikaiosune = righteousness. Occ. ninety-two times, of which thirty-six are in Romans. Always transl. "righteousness". Other words to which the same transl. is given are dikaioma (see below), and euthutes , which latter occ. only in Heb_1:8.
4. dikaioma is a righteous ordinance, a decree (of acquittal). See Ap. 177. 4. Rendered "righteousness" in Rom_2:26; Rom_5:18; Rom_8:4. Rev_19:8; and "ordinance" in Luk_1:6. Heb_9:1; Heb_9:10 : "judgment", Rom_1:32. Rev_15:4 : "justification", Rom_5:16.
5. dikaiosis = justification. Occ. only in Rom_4:25; Rom_5:18. The only other word rendered "justification" is dikaioma (see 4), in Rom_5:16.
Bullinger.

Keep on preaching the Cross and Him crucified and resurrected

1Co_2:2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.


2) "Not to know anything among you." (Greek ou ti eidenai) "Not to know or perceive anything." (Greek en humin) "Among you" . . . Paul determined not to present himself, his Greek, Hebrew, or Latin or philosophy as a basis of being known among the brethren. Act_20:18-27.

3) "Save Jesus Christ." (Greek ei me iesoun Christon) "If not or except Jesus Christ." This indicates Paul's sincere desire to present Jesus Christ, not himself or his own wisdom and person (Gal_6:14; 1Co_10:24).

4) "And him crucified." (Greek kai touton estauromenon) "And this one having been crucified." Gal_2:20; Tit_3:5; 1Co_1:17; 1Co_1:31.

Stay on this topic, and you won't go wrong.

in GRAVE ERROR.

 

[Johann]

Quite the opposite. The process people are trying to improve themselves is by the flesh. They just accuse me of that to deflect what they are doing back onto me.

Don't believe the propaganda. They are clever, but they don't bear witness to the truth.

Guess you should do a study on the Koine Greek Grammars--and you are here to rewrite the Scriptures, since you don't believe in the written word, we all hold dear--and many are dying for a page of the Bible--you have been corrected by so many--

TENSE
Present
Instantaneous Present (Aoristic or
Punctiliar Present), 221
Progressive Present (Descriptive
Present), 222
Extending-From-Past Present, 222–23
Iterative Present, 223
Customary (Habitual or General)
Present, 224
Gnomic Present, 224–225
Historical Present (Dramatic
Present), 226–27
Perfective Present, 227–28
Conative (Tendential, Conative)
Present, 228–29
Futuristic Present, 229–230
Present Retained in Indirect
Discourse, 230–31
Extending-from-Past Present
(Present of Past Action Still in Progress) ExSyn 519–20

a. Definition and key to identification. The present tense may be used to
describe an action that, begun in the past, continues in the present. The emphasis is on the present time. Note that this is different from the perfect tense in that
the perfect speaks only about the results existing in the present time. It is different from the progressive present in that it reaches back in time and usually, if not
always, has some sort of temporal indicator, such as an adverbial phrase, to show
this past-referring element. Depending on how tightly one defines this category,
it is either relatively rare or fairly common.9
The key to this usage is normally to translate the present tense as an English
present perfect. Some examples might not fit such a gloss, however.
The Present Tense 223
9 Fanning takes it to be a rare category, limiting it by description: “It always includes an
adverbial phrase or other time-indication” (Verbal Aspect, 217). But Brooks-Winbery define it
more broadly (Syntax, 77; see discussion in Fanning, Verbal Aspect, 217, n. 30).
b. Illustrations
Luke 15:29 tosauçta e[th douleuwv soi
I have served you for these many years
1 John 3:8 ajp∆ ajrchçß oJdiavboloß amJ artanv ei
the devil has been sinning from the beginning
➡4. Iterative Present ExSyn 520–21
a. Definition and key to identification. The present tense may be used to
describe an event that repeatedly happens. (The distributive present belongs here,
too: the use of the present tense for individual acts distributed to more than one
object.) This usage is frequently found in the imperative mood, since an action is
urged to be done. The iterative present is common. The key to identification is
translated using the English words “repeatedly” or “continuously.”
Diagram 49
The Force of the Extending-from-Past Present
Past Present Future
.———
Past Present Future
. . . . .
Diagram 50
The Force of the Iterative Present
b. Illustrations
Matt 7:7 Aitj eitçe . . . zhteitçe . . . krouev te Ask . . . seek . . . knock
The force of the present imperatives is “Ask repeatedly, over
and over again . . . seek repeatedly . . . knock continuously, over
and over again.”
Matt 17:15 pollavkiß pipv tei eijß to©puçr often he falls into the fire
Luke 3:16 ejgw© u{dati baptizv w uJmaçß I baptize you in water
This is an instance of a distributive present: John baptizes each
person only once, but the action is repeated.

➡5. Customary (Habitual or General) Present ExSyn 521–22
a. Definition. The customary present is used to signal either an action that
regularly occurs or an ongoing state. The action is usually iterative, or repeated, but
not without interruption. This usage is quite common. The difference between
the customary (proper) and the iterative present is mild. Generally, however, it
can be said that the customary present is broader in its idea of the “present” time
and describes an event that occurs regularly.

1. There are two types of customary present, repeated action and ongoing state.
2. The stative present is more pronounced in its temporal restrictions than the customary present or the gnomic present.
3. b. Key to identification. For action verbs, one can use the gloss customarily,
4. habitually. For stative verbs one can use the gloss continually.

224 The Basics of New Testament Syntax
10 Williams, Grammar Notes, 27. 11 Fanning, Verbal Aspect, 208.
c. Illustrations
Luke 18:12 nhsteuwv di©ß touçsabbavtou
I [customarily] fast twice a week
John 3:16 paçß oJpisteuwv n eijß aujto©n mh© ajpovlhtai
everyone who [continually] believes in him should not perish
This could also be taken as a gnomic present, but if so it is not
a proverbial statement, nor is it simply a general maxim. In this
Gospel, there seems to be a qualitative distinction between the
ongoing act of believing and the simple fact of believing.
John 14:17 par∆ uJmiçn menv ei kai© ejn uJmiçn e[stai
he continually remains with you and he shall be in you

Why not write to these scholars and tell them to review and correct their writings?--and put in your Episkopol--non-Biblical, since you don't believe in the Scriptures as it stands written--uninspired "works" to these scholars?

 

[Johann]

These verses are examples of the higher walk....among those who have been permitted to walk on that level.

quick notes: The "being" in the verses you quoted about the sanctified...are added in by religious translators...who lead you astray. The Greek has no "being" ...that is an invention by bible enthusiasts that are not in the truth.

Either one is sanctified or one is not. There is no 1/4 sanctified or 1/2 sanctified. It's like being pregnant. Either one is or one is not. Or like being dead. same thing

Heb 10:14 μιᾷG1520|A-DSF|By one γὰρG1063|CONJ|for προσφορᾷG4376|N-DSF|offering, τετελείωκενG5048|G5758|V-RAI-3S|He has perfected εἰςG1519|PREP|for τὸG3588|T-ASN|- διηνεκὲςG1336|A-ASN|all time τοὺςG3588|T-APM|those ἁγιαζομένουςG37|G5746|V-PPP-APM|being sanctified.


Them that are sanctified (tous hagiazomenous). Articular participle (accusative case) present passive of hagiazō (note perfect in Heb_10:10) either because of the process still going on or because of the repetition in so many persons as in Heb_2:11.


3) "Them that are sanctified," (tous hagiaz omenous) "The ones being or they who are sanctified," separated unto him, from condemnation to eternal life, Joh_10:27-29; 1Jn_5:13. This speaks of the redeemed who has the righteousness of God imputed to him in the regeneration of the new man, or implanted in him as the Divine, new creature, 2Co_5:17; 2Pe_2:4; Rom_4:7-8; Psa_32:2.



THE ROLE OF THE SPIRIT IN
PROGRESSIVE SANCTIFICATION

Who accomplishes the work of progressive sanctification? God? Man?

God's Work - We are sanctified by God the Father (Jude 1), God the Son (Heb. 2:11), and God the Holy Spirit (2 Thess. 2:13; 1 Pet. 1:2). Perfect holiness is God’s command (1 Thess. 4:7) and purpose. As Paul prayed, “Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely” (1 Thess. 5:23). Sanctification is a process that continues during our lives as believers (Heb. 10:14). Only after death are the saints referred to as “perfect” (Heb. 12:23). (NNID)

Man's Work - Numerous commands in the Bible imply that believers also have a responsibility in the process of sanctification. We are commanded to “be holy” (Lev 11:44+; 1 Pe. 1:15–16+); to “be perfect” (Mt. 5:48+); and to “present your members as slaves of righteousness for holiness” (Ro 6:19). Writing to the church of the Thessalonians, the apostle Paul made a strong plea for purity: “This is the will of God, your sanctification: that you should abstain from sexual immorality; that each of you should know how to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor, not in passion of lust, like the Gentiles who do not know God” (1 Th 4:3–5). These commands imply effort on our part. We must believe in Jesus, since we are “sanctified by faith in Him” (Acts 26:18+). Through the Holy Spirit we must also “put to death the evil deeds of the body” (Ro 8:13+). Paul itemized the many “works of the flesh” from which we must separate ourselves (Gal. 5:19–21+). Finally, we must walk in the Spirit in order to display the fruit of the Spirit (Gal. 5:22–24+). (NNID)

I am not an advocate of the Biblically inaccurate phrase "Let go, let God," for it is more Scripturally accurate to say "Let God and Let's go!" Notice the juxtaposition of God's part and our responsibility. The all too popular phrase "Let go, Let God," suggests that our role as believers is simply to passively surrender and God will do the rest, but that is not accurate. Paul says our role, our responsibility is to "Work out (present imperative = continually obey this command) your salvation in fear and trembling," (Php 2:12+) which is another way to say we are to actively participate in the process of progressive sanctification, the "Let's go" part of the preceding phrase.

Paul quickly explains how it is possible to continually work out our salvation, a command we could never obey relying solely on our natural strength. Our main problem is seen every morning in the mirror! Our problem is that we still have the indwelling residual "anti-God" tendency known as the flesh.

So Paul gives us the key to continually pursuing progressive sanctification, writing that "it is God Who is (present tense - continually) at work (energizing) in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure." (Phil 2:13+) The New Living version paraphrases it "For God is working in you, giving you the DESIRE and the POWER to do what pleases him." (Phi 2:13NLT+) I call the "DESIRE" the "want to" because the truth is when I rely on my old nature, I do not "want to" obey and work out my salvation.

While Paul does not "God the Spirit" in this Phil 2:13+, it is clear from other passages that it the Spirit of God Who indwells every believer and provides the necessary supernatural power to overcome the anti-God inertia of the flesh (see this juxtaposition of the Spirit and flesh and the ongoing spiritual war in Galatians 5:16-17+). As we daily surrender and yield and are filled and are controlled by the Holy Spirit (Eph 5:18+), And so the Spirit continually gives us the DESIRE (cf God's part = "Let God") to obey the commands (cf our responsibility = "Let's go"), and we are enabled to obey in a manner that is pleasing to God. It is vitally important to understand this truth, for it is the foundation of progressive sanctification. In fact I would suggest memorizing Php 2:12-13 and frequently meditating on it (cf Ps 1:2-3+, Joshua 1:8+), because it is that important to your spiritual growth. Reading the Bible without meditating on it is like eating without chewing.

I don't know why you are so vehemently opposed progressive sanctification--

 

[amigo de christo]

We shall point to Christ till our last breath . He is our hope and our salvation . There simply is no other name whereby one may be
saved . Believe In CHRIST JESUS whom GOD did send to be the savoir .

 

[Johann]

We shall point to Christ till our last breath . He is our hope and our salvation . There simply is no other name whereby one may be
saved . Believe In CHRIST JESUS whom GOD did send to be the savoir .

Amen @amigo de christo --too many variations on the doctrinal doctrines--and like Paul-- For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.


2) "Not to know anything among you." (Greek ou ti eidenai) "Not to know or perceive anything." (Greek en humin) "Among you" . . . Paul determined not to present himself, his Greek, Hebrew, or Latin or philosophy as a basis of being known among the brethren. Act_20:18-27.

3) "Save Jesus Christ." (Greek ei me iesoun Christon) "If not or except Jesus Christ." This indicates Paul's sincere desire to present Jesus Christ, not himself or his own wisdom and person (Gal_6:14; 1Co_10:24).

4) "And him crucified." (Greek kai touton estauromenon) "And this one having been crucified." Gal_2:20; Tit_3:5; 1Co_1:17; 1Co_1:31.

Shalom
J.

 

[amigo de christo]

Amen @amigo de christo --too many variations on the doctrinal doctrines--and like Paul-- For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.


2) "Not to know anything among you." (Greek ou ti eidenai) "Not to know or perceive anything." (Greek en humin) "Among you" . . . Paul determined not to present himself, his Greek, Hebrew, or Latin or philosophy as a basis of being known among the brethren. Act_20:18-27.

3) "Save Jesus Christ." (Greek ei me iesoun Christon) "If not or except Jesus Christ." This indicates Paul's sincere desire to present Jesus Christ, not himself or his own wisdom and person (Gal_6:14; 1Co_10:24).

4) "And him crucified." (Greek kai touton estauromenon) "And this one having been crucified." Gal_2:20; Tit_3:5; 1Co_1:17; 1Co_1:31.

Shalom
J.

Yes indeed . To the LORD be all the glory . To HE we owe all . Let the King be praised and thanked .

 

[amigo de christo]

The dire problem we have with some is that
they try and teach the cross without CHRIST .
We cant carry our cross with budda , we cant carry our cross with the allah of the muslims,
we cant carry our cross with any other mindset of any belief .
ITS CHRIST or its all vain . BELIEVE YE IN HIM and pick up that cross and follow HIM .

 

[amigo de christo]

the dire problem we have with some
is they think we can be sanctified without CHRIST .
Belief in budda and all the good works aint gonna save one nor are they sanctified .
SEEMS to me this concept they have is nothing more than TRYING to attain to justification , righteousness , redemption
WITHOUT FAITH IN CHRIST .
And boy do i got real bad news for that lie . The DIRE NECESSITY OF CHRIST has been trodden under foot .
And that will get exposed on my watch . WE POINT TO CHRIST and HIM CRUCIFIED , not budda , nor any other .
JESUS CHRIST . And the joy that surges through my soul just typing this is great joy .
BOAST IN THE LORD , GIVE THE GLORY to HIM and unto HE ALONE .

 

[amigo de christo]

March on in the trenches johann and all . WE GONNA POINT TO JESUS CHRIST . cause honestly
pointing to ourselves or any other path , IS JUST VAIN and will profit none who did so on the DAY of THE LORD .
So point to CHRIST everyone . Give HIM the GLORY and the HONOR and You give GOD the GLORY and the HONOR .
HE who honors the SON honors the FATHER . let us learn Christ Jesus well . And have all hope above on the glorious Lord .

 

[ChristisGod]

Heb 10:14 μιᾷG1520|A-DSF|By one γὰρG1063|CONJ|for προσφορᾷG4376|N-DSF|offering, τετελείωκενG5048|G5758|V-RAI-3S|He has perfected εἰςG1519|PREP|for τὸG3588|T-ASN|- διηνεκὲςG1336|A-ASN|all time τοὺςG3588|T-APM|those ἁγιαζομένουςG37|G5746|V-PPP-APM|being sanctified.


Them that are sanctified (tous hagiazomenous). Articular participle (accusative case) present passive of hagiazō (note perfect in Heb_10:10) either because of the process still going on or because of the repetition in so many persons as in Heb_2:11.


3) "Them that are sanctified," (tous hagiaz omenous) "The ones being or they who are sanctified," separated unto him, from condemnation to eternal life, Joh_10:27-29; 1Jn_5:13. This speaks of the redeemed who has the righteousness of God imputed to him in the regeneration of the new man, or implanted in him as the Divine, new creature, 2Co_5:17; 2Pe_2:4; Rom_4:7-8; Psa_32:2.



THE ROLE OF THE SPIRIT IN
PROGRESSIVE SANCTIFICATION

Who accomplishes the work of progressive sanctification? God? Man?

God's Work - We are sanctified by God the Father (Jude 1), God the Son (Heb. 2:11), and God the Holy Spirit (2 Thess. 2:13; 1 Pet. 1:2). Perfect holiness is God’s command (1 Thess. 4:7) and purpose. As Paul prayed, “Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely” (1 Thess. 5:23). Sanctification is a process that continues during our lives as believers (Heb. 10:14). Only after death are the saints referred to as “perfect” (Heb. 12:23). (NNID)

Man's Work - Numerous commands in the Bible imply that believers also have a responsibility in the process of sanctification. We are commanded to “be holy” (Lev 11:44+; 1 Pe. 1:15–16+); to “be perfect” (Mt. 5:48+); and to “present your members as slaves of righteousness for holiness” (Ro 6:19). Writing to the church of the Thessalonians, the apostle Paul made a strong plea for purity: “This is the will of God, your sanctification: that you should abstain from sexual immorality; that each of you should know how to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor, not in passion of lust, like the Gentiles who do not know God” (1 Th 4:3–5). These commands imply effort on our part. We must believe in Jesus, since we are “sanctified by faith in Him” (Acts 26:18+). Through the Holy Spirit we must also “put to death the evil deeds of the body” (Ro 8:13+). Paul itemized the many “works of the flesh” from which we must separate ourselves (Gal. 5:19–21+). Finally, we must walk in the Spirit in order to display the fruit of the Spirit (Gal. 5:22–24+). (NNID)

I am not an advocate of the Biblically inaccurate phrase "Let go, let God," for it is more Scripturally accurate to say "Let God and Let's go!" Notice the juxtaposition of God's part and our responsibility. The all too popular phrase "Let go, Let God," suggests that our role as believers is simply to passively surrender and God will do the rest, but that is not accurate. Paul says our role, our responsibility is to "Work out (present imperative = continually obey this command) your salvation in fear and trembling," (Php 2:12+) which is another way to say we are to actively participate in the process of progressive sanctification, the "Let's go" part of the preceding phrase.

Paul quickly explains how it is possible to continually work out our salvation, a command we could never obey relying solely on our natural strength. Our main problem is seen every morning in the mirror! Our problem is that we still have the indwelling residual "anti-God" tendency known as the flesh.

So Paul gives us the key to continually pursuing progressive sanctification, writing that "it is God Who is (present tense - continually) at work (energizing) in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure." (Phil 2:13+) The New Living version paraphrases it "For God is working in you, giving you the DESIRE and the POWER to do what pleases him." (Phi 2:13NLT+) I call the "DESIRE" the "want to" because the truth is when I rely on my old nature, I do not "want to" obey and work out my salvation.

While Paul does not "God the Spirit" in this Phil 2:13+, it is clear from other passages that it the Spirit of God Who indwells every believer and provides the necessary supernatural power to overcome the anti-God inertia of the flesh (see this juxtaposition of the Spirit and flesh and the ongoing spiritual war in Galatians 5:16-17+). As we daily surrender and yield and are filled and are controlled by the Holy Spirit (Eph 5:18+), And so the Spirit continually gives us the DESIRE (cf God's part = "Let God") to obey the commands (cf our responsibility = "Let's go"), and we are enabled to obey in a manner that is pleasing to God. It is vitally important to understand this truth, for it is the foundation of progressive sanctification. In fact I would suggest memorizing Php 2:12-13 and frequently meditating on it (cf Ps 1:2-3+, Joshua 1:8+), because it is that important to your spiritual growth. Reading the Bible without meditating on it is like eating without chewing.

I don't know why you are so vehemently opposed progressive sanctification--

The poster obviously hasn't studied sanctification otherwise he wouldn't be arguing against it since Scripture teaches we have been sanctified ( past) we are being sanctified ( present)and we will be sanctified ( future ). There is a past, present and future aspect just the same as there is with salvation. We are saved, being saved and will be saved. Faith is the same- we have believed, we believe and will believe- hope is faith in the future. :) The best thing about this is it gives other posters an opportunity to see the truth and those who are lurking too.

 

[ChristisGod]

March on in the trenches johann and all . WE GONNA POINT TO JESUS CHRIST . cause honestly
pointing to ourselves or any other path , IS JUST VAIN and will profit none who did so on the DAY of THE LORD .
So point to CHRIST everyone . Give HIM the GLORY and the HONOR and You give GOD the GLORY and the HONOR .
HE who honors the SON honors the FATHER . let us learn Christ Jesus well . And have all hope above on the glorious Lord .

exactly and a true prophet ( there are none the office has been done away with like Apostles ) would point others to Christ and not himself like a false prophet does. As we are observing the Apostles words below: 1 Corinthians 2- This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words. 14 The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit.

A few are teaching against the spirit with human wisdom that is wrapped up in "spiritual" lingo, mumbo jumbo.