Run AWAY from Calvinism!

[reformed1689]

https://www.northlandchurch.com/content.cfm?id=316&download_id=2173

Please check and then we can discuss...

I'm not purchasing a book. I can study Scripture just fine. Tell me which verses and we will discuss.

 

[Johann]

Only those granted by the Father can come to Christ. God chose before the foundation of the world those that would be in Christ.

...so, in your view, Christ died not for the sins of the whole world?

 

[reformed1689]

...in your view?
It is either/or...

I believe it happens at the same time. We are regenerated and we place faith in the same moment. But if you MUST make a choice, regeneration would come at least a split second before.

 

[reformed1689]

...so, in your view, Christ died not for the sins of the whole world?

Whole world? Yes. Both Jew and Gentile. All individuals? No.

 

[Johann]

But if you MUST make a choice, regeneration would come at least a split second before.

How is it possible to be reborn BEFORE you believe?

 

[reformed1689]

How is it possible to be reborn BEFORE you believe?

Or the better question, how is it possible to believe if you are dead? ;)

 

[praise_yeshua]

Or the better question, how is it possible to believe if you are dead? ;)

Dead men are in the ground. The Gospel can be accepted by any creature.

Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

 

[praise_yeshua]

regeneration happens before faith. You would never have faith without it. As for assurance, read 1 john.

Nonsense. That is your imagination. Prove it. I believe the Scriptures. Not you.

Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

 

[Johann]

Or the better question, how is it possible to believe if you are dead?

“Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;” (Acts of the Apostles 3:19).

Here we see Peter say in this above verse to....

#1. Repent and....
#2. Be converted.

This shows that conversion (or regeneration) happens after one repents or seeks forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ (intending not to sin again).

You mean to tell me a person dead in trespasses and sins cannot make a choice?
Then why the Imperative of Christ?
Your "logic" is firmly rooted in the reformed doctrines and not according to Scriptures.


Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

Spiritually nekros doesn't mean that the unregenerate can make a choice, not so?

 

[praise_yeshua]

John 3:1-21 you must be reborn.
Ephesians 2:1 we are dead in our sins and transgressions.

Nothing there remotely similar to what you claim.

Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

Romans 10:14 clearly establishes the order of salvation.

 

[Johann]

regeneration happens before faith. You would never have faith without it. As for assurance, read 1 john.

Absolute nonsense.

 

[praise_yeshua]

repentance is a gift from God. No one can repent unless God allows it. Esau couldnt repent, judas couldnt repent.

Repentance is where God and man agree. It takes place after hearing the Gospel. After a person expresses faith. Regeneration is the last step where God "GRANTS" the fullness of salvation.

 

[Johann]

repentance is a gift from God. No one can repent unless God allows it. Esau couldnt repent, judas couldnt repent.

So you hold, despite the evidence in scripture, that a "dead" person who is not yet planted in the grave cannot make a choice?


Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
Rom 10:15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
Rom 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

One foot in the reformers doctrines, one foot in the gospel...do not twist scriptures...there are many sincere believers who have become so disheartened by reading reformed doctrines and theology that they became atheists.
This forum is to rightly cutting straight the word of the Lord and and the good news is for ALL...so "dead" people (not yet planted in the grave) can make a decision.
Shalom LaChem mate.
J.

 

[Johann]

Regeneration is the last step where God "GRANTS" the fullness of salvation.

What about justification, sanctification, redemption

repentance is a gift from God. No one can repent unless God allows it. Esau couldnt repent, judas couldnt repent.

Act_17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

 

[reformed1689]

“Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;” (Acts of the Apostles 3:19).

Here we see Peter say in this above verse to....

#1. Repent and....
#2. Be converted.

This shows that conversion (or regeneration) happens after one repents or seeks forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ (intending not to sin again).

You mean to tell me a person dead in trespasses and sins cannot make a choice?
Then why the Imperative of Christ?
Your "logic" is firmly rooted in the reformed doctrines and not according to Scriptures.


Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Col 3:3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

Spiritually nekros doesn't mean that the unregenerate can make a choice, not so?

Ah, so you think conversion and regeneration are the same thing. I disagree.

 

[praise_yeshua]

What about justification, sanctification, redemption


Act_17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

Repentance does involve a "change of mind". However, the complete change of mind doesn't take place until after enlightenment through the new birth. It is where the mind of Christ and the mind of man are joined.

If you would, the "Spirit Incarnate" in us.

 

[reformed1689]

Dead men are in the ground. The Gospel can be accepted by any creature.

Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

So you do not agree when the Bible says we are dead in sin? I knew you denied Scripture.

 

[praise_yeshua]

So you do not agree when the Bible says we are dead in sin? I knew you denied Scripture.

No. We are dead in sin. We are still alive in flesh. That is what hears the Gospel. Man must literally hear the Gospel.

I believe the Scripture.

 

[reformed1689]

No. We are dead in sin. We are still alive in flesh. That is what hears the Gospel. Man must literally hear the Gospel.

I believe the Scripture.

So I guess deaf people are screwed then? You aren't making any sense.

 

[praise_yeshua]

So I guess deaf people are screwed then? You aren't making any sense.

Hearing can involve reading. It is a reference to the exchange of information.