MYSTERY, BABYLON... IS NOT THE CHURCH OF ROME

[tailgator]

Those events actually occur starting when the "two witnesses" stand up, and those seeing it are shocked. Their standing up represents the "caught up" event of 1 Thessalonians 4:17. WITHIN that same hour the 7th Trumpet sounds with Christ's coming, which is the 3rd Woe.

We have to remember when studying prophecy in the Book of Revelation. Certain specifics of the events can take more time when described written down than they actually do in real time.

The events occur as I posted
Daniel 11 and the Olivet discourse Zechariah 14 all confirm the same events and how they unfold.

 

[tailgator]

Jerusalem being taken, and half of it going into captivity, happens just PRIOR to the "day of the Lord" which is the day of Jesus' 2nd coming. (Even right now, today, Jerusalem is half-taken by the nations of Islam). That is why those events are associated with the all nations being gathered against Jerusalem at the very end, just prior to Christ's coming. It's actually 6th Trumpet - 2nd Woe timing of Revelation 11:1-10.

As I said in my previous post.
Jerusalem is taken 3.5 days before the two witnesses stand on their feet.

The beast which ascends out of the bottomless pit and the ten horns(ten kings) which hate the prostitute attack and kill the two witnessss 3.5 days before the day of the Lord.

The ten kings and the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit are the nations in zech 14 that take Jerusalem .

The same attack takes place in Daniel 11:40 when the king of the norths armed forces occupying Jerusalem are attacked.The dead in Christ are raised shortly after in Daniel 12:2.And as I've noticed the last few times the north has moved it fleet of ships to help Israel,it takes a few days for them to arrive in position.It takes the 6th fleet about two days to travel from Naples to Israel.

 

[Jerry Huerta]

And there's another false doctrine FRAGMENT from men ADDED to The Word of God by the deceived and deceivers, the FALSE idea that the "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT..." of Revelation 17 represents the Roman Church.


The very last verse of Revelation 17 reveals what that "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT..." is...

Rev 17:18
18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.
KJV

Where is that "great city" it speaks of, Rome?? Nope!

Rev 11:7-8
7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
KJV

Well, that is JERUSALEM where our Lord Jesus was crucified!

JERUSALEM at the end of this world when the coming false-Christ is setup in a new Jewish stone temple there is that "great city" and thus that, "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT..." Harlot. That prophecy has not yet begun today, but is for the very END of this world when that final Antichrist (not a pope) shows up in JERUSALEM working those great signs and wonders and miracles which Lord Jesus showed in Matthew 24, and that Apostle Paul showed in 2 Thessalonians 2.

The great falling away of 2 Thessalonians 2 which Apostle Paul warned of, a great apostasy of believers, will be when that coming false-Messiah appears in Jerusalem proclaiming himself as The Christ! Lord Jesus called that coming false one a pseudo-Christ in Matthew 24:24.

Therefore, my Christian brethren coming to forums like this one, SHOULD ask their selves why... are some men in today's Church pushing the LIE that "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT..." means the Christian Church when the actual Bible Scripture is pointing to the city of JERUSALEM, regardless that it's Protestants doing that to accuse the Roman Church and their pope?? Who would most likely be behind that false doctrine pointing to Rome?

(And don't get me wrong about the Catholic Church, I am not a member of it. As a matter of fact, my French ancestors migrated to the Americas because they were among the first French Protestants, and were persecuted by the Catholic Church back in the 15-16th centuries. The Roman Church has un-Biblical doctrines that are from men's traditions and not God's Word, just as all Protestant denominations also have.)

The interpretation that Babylon represents the papacy comes from the Historicists, Protestant interpretation of Revelation. While the interpretation that the papacy fulfills the little horn in Daniel and the beast rising from the sea in Revelation is based on sound exegesis and historical accounts, it can’t be interpreted as Babylon for several reasons, one being that the beasts in Daniel and Revelation can’t fall in a moral sense, which is how Babylon is depicted in Revelation. The condemnation that Babylon fornicates with the kings of the earth cannot apply to an entity that is expected to oppose God, like the beasts in Daniel and Revelation, but must apply to an entity that IS expected to be faithful to God, which would be the apostate church or people of God,

2 Thessalonians 2:
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

According to Hebrews 6, the church in the fallen state is guilty of crucifying Christ all over again,

Hebrews 6:
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

The passage in Hebrews addresses how to interpret the “great city” in Revelation 11:8, which is highly cryptic. Preterists seem highly cryptic except when it suits their purpose; they insist on being literal.

 

[The Light]

Nope! Those who use their common sense with reading the Rev.11:8 verse well KNOW it is pointing to JERUSALEM as the "great city", simply because JERUSALEM is where Lord Jesus Christ was crucified.

Rev 11:8
8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
KJV

That's JERUSALEM as the "great city"! Easy Peasy!

Not as easy as you believe.

Does Jerusalem have a gold cup in her hand? Nope
Has Jerusalem made the merchants of the world rich by trade? Nope
Does Jerusalem dress in purple and scarlet? The predominate color is blue with some purple and scarlet.
Has Jerusalem been called Babylon? Nope. Jerusalem is called spiritual Sodom and Egypt.

Does Vatican City have a gold cup in her hand? Yep
Has Vatican City made the merchants of the world rich by trade? Yep
Does Vatican City dress in purple and scarlet? Yep
Has Rome been called Babylon? Yep.

1 Peter 5
13 The church that is at Babylon, elected together with you, saluteth you; and so doth Marcus my son.

How can Jerusalem be Babylon if Babylon is found no more?
Revelation 18
21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.

 

[The Light]

The interpretation that Babylon represents the papacy comes from the Historicists, Protestant interpretation of Revelation.

No. It comes straight from the Word of God. Peter was in Rome.

1 Peter 5
13 The church that is at Babylon, elected together with you, saluteth you; and so doth Marcus my son.

 

[The Light]

False
Tehran Iran is smack dab on the middle of the Medes kingdom.Tehran governs the majority of Media
The kurds govern dust.
Plus,any ole fool would know Iran wouldn't miss attacking Israel for the end of the world.

Zech 14
14 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.


View attachment 59156

Say what you want.....but the Medes are the modern day Kurds. And it is the Medes that will be used for judgement in the land of the Chaldeans in the day of the Lord.

 

[The Light]

You saying all nations don't attack Jerusalem on the day of the Lord as Zechariah says?
You saying Zechariah is wrong and you are right,?

The Medes will be in Babylon on the day of the Lord ransacking the houses and raping the women.

No. I'm saying the nations of the world do not come against any city.............IN THE VERSES YOU QUOTED. Here is your question.

What city do all the nations come against on the day of the Lord ransacking the houses and raping the women according to the word of God?

And here are the verses you quoted WHICH WAS YOUR PROOF. Do you see any nations coming against any city in the verse you quoted. No. It's the Medes coming against Babylon........the land of the Chaldeans. Also it is not Jerusalem that the Medes come against.

Isaiah 13
9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the Lord of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger.

14 And it shall be as the chased roe, and as a sheep that no man taketh up: they shall every man turn to his own people, and flee every one into his own land.

15 Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is joined unto them shall fall by the sword.

16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.


17 Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them, which shall not regard silver; and as for gold, they shall not delight in it.

18 Their bows also shall dash the young men to pieces; and they shall have no pity on the fruit of the womb; their eyes shall not spare children.

19 And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees' excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah.

 

[The Light]

Jerusalem is attacked and conquered 3.3 days before the seventh Trump sounds.

Have you never read of the two witnesses that lay dead in the street ?
While they are laying dead,the houses and being ransacked and the women raped just as Zechariah and isaiah prophecied would happen after the nations take Jerusalem.There will be great celebrations throughout the middle east and beyond for those 3.5 days.Then on the day of the Lord the two witnesses stand on their feet and ascend into heaven in a cloud as their enemies looked on.

The Day of the Lord is not when the two witnesses stand on their feet. The Day of the Lord is the ONE-YEAR wrath of God, which is the 7th seal.

 

[The Light]

The northern army (US armed forces)who occupy Israel for 42 months are attacked and killed.Their dead bodies will lay in the street of Jerusalem.
The king of the norths armed forces place the abomination of desolation. (Nuke ) in Jerusalem 3.5 days after it is taken by the Iranians ,Iraqis,Egyptians,Lebanese,Jordanians,Turks,Syrians and all the rest of the Muslims who attack Israel.
That's what causes the earthquake in Jerusalem and the cloud to ascend from Jerusalem on the day of the Lord.Its Israel policy that all Israel's enemies be nuked including its enemies in the land of Israel itself.

I'll go with the king of the North but not the rest of it.

 

[MonoBiblical]

@Davy I guess you know everything, and my simple statements about the last days being specifically about Israel, and their God-fearers are actually wrong.

 

[Jerry Huerta]

No. It comes straight from the Word of God. Peter was in Rome.

1 Peter 5
13 The church that is at Babylon, elected together with you, saluteth you; and so doth Marcus my son.

The papacy didn't exist in Peter's time, so how could he have related mystery Babylon symbolizes the papacy?

 

[MonoBiblical]

The papacy didn't exist in Peter's time, so how could he have related mystery Babylon symbolizes the papacy?

It doesn't symbolize anything. Babylon may have existed back then.

 

[Jerry Huerta]

It doesn't symbolize anything. Babylon may have existed back then.

Peter is addressing a region, not the Babylon in Daniel's time. It makes no sense in the narration of the Revelation; the region did not sit on seven mountains (Revelation 11:9), nor was it the place where Christ was crucified (Revelation 11:8).

 

[MonoBiblical]

Peter is addressing a region, not the Babylon in Daniel's time. It makes no sense in the narration of the Revelation; the region did not sit on seven mountains (Revelation 11:9), nor was it the place where Christ was crucified (Revelation 11:8).

The whore is Jerusalem. They whored with Babylon.

 

[Jerry Huerta]

The whore is Jerusalem. They whored with Babylon.

Revelation 17 states the whore IS Babylon, not that some other entity whored with Babylon. Poor exegesis.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Revelation 17 states the whore IS Babylon, not that some other entity whored with Babylon. Poor exegesis.

μυστήριον Βαβυλὼν ἡ μεγάλη
ἡ μήτηρ τῶν πορνῶν καὶ τῶν βδελυγμάτων τῆς γῆς
the secret of Babylon a great a mother of adulterers and abominations of earth.

Poor translation not poor exegesis.

 

[Jerry Huerta]

μυστήριον Βαβυλὼν ἡ μεγάλη
the secret of Babylon a great. Poor translation not poor exegesis.

Babylon is a mystery, but it doesn't solve the enigma saying Jerusalem whored with Babylon! As Revelation 17 states, the whore IS Babylon, not that another entity whored with Babylon. That's eisegesis.

 

[tailgator]

Say what you want.....but the Medes are the modern day Kurds. And it is the Medes that will be used for judgement in the land of the Chaldeans in the day of the Lord.

The Medes were an ancient Iranian people who founded the kingdom of Media in western Iran. They were part of a group of Indo-Iranian-speaking people who migrated from central Asia.

Origins:

• The Medes migrated west from central Asia around the end of the 2nd millennium BCE.
  
  
• • They settled in the Zagros highlands of northern Iran.
    
  • They were not Semitic people, unlike the Assyrians who preceded them.
    

Empire:

• • By the 6th century BC, the Medes had established their own empire.
  • It stretched from the Black Sea to Afghanistan and Pakistan.
  • It was the largest empire of its time until Cyrus the Great established the Achaemenid Empire.

 

[tailgator]

No. I'm saying the nations of the world do not come against any city.............IN THE VERSES YOU QUOTED. Here is your question.

What city do all the nations come against on the day of the Lord ransacking the houses and raping the women according to the word of God?

And here are the verses you quoted WHICH WAS YOUR PROOF. Do you see any nations coming against any city in the verse you quoted. No. It's the Medes coming against Babylon........the land of the Chaldeans. Also it is not Jerusalem that the Medes come against.

Isaiah 13
9 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the Lord of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger.

14 And it shall be as the chased roe, and as a sheep that no man taketh up: they shall every man turn to his own people, and flee every one into his own land.

15 Every one that is found shall be thrust through; and every one that is joined unto them shall fall by the sword.

16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.


17 Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them, which shall not regard silver; and as for gold, they shall not delight in it.

18 Their bows also shall dash the young men to pieces; and they shall have no pity on the fruit of the womb; their eyes shall not spare children.

19 And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees' excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah.

All nations come against Jerusalem according to the word of God.

Its God you are saying is wrong when you say no nations come against Jerusalem ransacking the houses and raping the women on the day of the Lord.

Zech 14

14 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.



Zechariah is a prophet of God delivering this message .You must have been ignorant of the word of God for you to say the nations do not come against any city on the day of the Lord.
Zechariah clearly says all nations come against Jerusalem.

 

[Hidden In Him]

So if you want to listen to a bunch mumbo-jumbo from men's false traditions that didn't get fulfilled like the old Reformers claimed about Rome and a pope, then go to, stay deceived by the doctrines of men.

I don't listen to men, especially the Reformers, and I in no way buy into what many claim about the Pope, so I think you may be talking to someone else here. I was talking about studying both passages in the original language. But hopefully we can get more into it at a later time. I've gotten more busy.

Blessings,
- H