"Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Faith" - Has 500 Years Taught Us Nothing?

[BreadOfLife]

It depends on how you define church. I do not accept the Catholic definition. I define it as first century only.
Catholics try to define it as the early Catholic church, which did not exist until centuries later.
Constantine was a true founder of the Catholic church.
Catholic Church has never been universal, despite its claims.
The title Pope had been fought over for centuries. One would try the claim it and others would stop it and reject the title
completely.
The history of the Catholic Church by Catholic historians is pure fabrication. There is no outside confirmation.
Many of the so-called early church fathers would be outraged and reject the Catholic Church of today.

Spoken like a guy who doesn’t know his history . . .

Ummm, first of all – the Church that Christ founded has been known as “The Catholic Church” since the FIRST century. We first read about it in St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch’s Letter to the Smyrnaeans in 107 AD:

St. Ignatius, Bishop of Antioch
“Follow your bishop, every one of you, as obediently as Jesus Christ followed the Father. Obey your clergy too as you would the apostles; give your deacons the same reverence that you would to a command of God. Make sure that no step affecting the Church is ever taken by anyone without the bishop’s sanction. The sole Eucharist you should consider valid is one that is celebrated by the bishop himself, or by some person authorized by him. Where the bishop is to be seen, there let all his people be; just as, wherever Jesus Christ is present, there is the Catholic Church” (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 107]).

There was no TV, no radio, no newspaper, no internet – just word of mouth. For Ignatius to have written to his readers using this term and expecting them to understand what he was talking about doesn’t make ANY sense unless it was universally recognized as “The Catholic Church”.

Secondly – Constantine was not IN the Church so he couldn’t have “founded” it. He wasn't even baptized until he was on his deathbed.
There is not ONE single document or decree to support your asinine claim.


Thirdly – your claim that the title of “Pope” had been fought over for centuries.

It might interest you to know that this is NOT a title of the Bishop of Rome. Over the years, he has garnered EIGHT official titles – and “Pope” is NOT one of them, Einstein. It is a term of endearment that simply means “Papa” (father).


The ONLY thing that is “pure fabrication” is YOUR moronic post . . .

 

[mjrhealth]

You know mj, people have always thought the end was near. I don't know that we're any nearer than 2,000 years ago. The Thessalonians thought Jesus was coming back in that very generation. But, I do believe we're closer than ever...why? Because man is beginning to think he's God...unless we're actually at that point already. You know, cloning and all that comes with it. We think we could create.

Also, when you're sick, where do you go?
If you want to learn math, where do you go?

I believe God has special messages for all of us...He sure did for me many years ago.
But if we want to know about something, we go to those that know more than we do.

Not to know God. Our relationship with God is just between us and Him.

But to know ABOUT God. I find there's so much to know that I probably never would have understood.

It's not a bad thing. God gave us a brain. Jesus said to love God with all your heart, soul and mind. He meant that we should know as much about our Father as possible.

Just a thought...I'm not criticizing your method...we all use it.

If you want to know God, ask Him. really I mean it, he has so much to show you about Himself, but if you dont ask you will never know, you can only get so much out of reading a book, if you want to know someone you must spend time with them, if you want to know God you must experience Him. He can do it if you will let Him. You will never regret it,

 

[GodsGrace]

We should expect the devil to muddy the waters to prevent the truth from being seen clearly. That's why Jesus said the most important concern for us all was to "let no man deceive you by any means."

There's only 3 schools of thought that are presented here: Protestant Historicism, Jesuit Futurism and Jesuit Preterism.

While I can punch massive holes into both Jesuit ideas, no one in this forum can find a single chink in the armor of Protestant Historicism. Every single objection to it can be easily overruled with Scripture, but if poeple choose to stubbornly hold onto their ideas, not even the Holy Spirit can make them change their minds.

It is stubbornly claimed there's a gap between the 69th and 70th week of Daniel, though I've pointed out not a single other Numerically Specific Time Prophecy in Scripture inserts a gap:

God's pleading with the Antedeluvians was the predicted 120 years, no gap.
The Egyptian enslavement was 400 years, no gap.
Elijah's drought was 3 1/2 years, no gap.

This is the case for everything else.

As I have done, others have to be willing to give up "their truth" when the Holy Spirit brings them to "the truth". BTW, thanks for not thinking I'm crazy :)

Look what's on YouTube.
I have no comment...

 

[GodsGrace]

If you want to know God, ask Him. really I mean it, he has so much to show you about Himself, but if you dont ask you will never know, you can only get so much out of reading a book, if you want to know someone you must spend time with them, if you want to know God you must experience Him. He can do it if you will let Him. You will never regret it,

I agree!

 

[Phoneman777]

I agree!

MJRHEALTH

Look what's on YouTube.
I have no comment...

I posted a comment about how Macron can't be the A/C. For one, when Daniel the prophet spoke about the "ten horns" or "ten barbarian nations" which arose out of the ashes of the fallen fourth beast - pagan Roman empire - he said "there came up among them ("the horns") another Little Horn", before 3 of the first horns were plucked up by the roots".

That "Little Horn" is the Antichrist, which arose way back in history.

 

[GodsGrace]

MJRHEALTH
I posted a comment about how Macron can't be the A/C. For one, when Daniel the prophet spoke about the "ten horns" or "ten barbarian nations" which arose out of the ashes of the fallen fourth beast - pagan Roman empire - he said "there came up among them ("the horns") another Little Horn", before 3 of the first horns were plucked up by the roots".

That "Little Horn" is the Antichrist, which arose way back in history.

All I know is this: Macron can't be the anti-Christ...I don't think he's liked much in France. Wouldn't the AC have to be loved?

I posted it to show how anyone could be made out to be the Anti Christ.
I think this was done for Trump too.

My belief is that we just don't know and shouldn't assume.

 

[Enoch111]

.I don't think he's liked much in France.

You have to wonder why the French even elected him when there was a better alternative to this bumbler. And why President Trump even gave him the time of the day, when Macron has been in cahoots with Merkel to destroy Europe.

You're right. The Antichrist will be a charismatic personality who will be loved by all who have been blinded to the truth. For more insight people should study Daniel.

 

[farouk]

My belief is that we just don't know and shouldn't assume.

Good to stick with what Scripture says and not speculate...

 

[GodsGrace]

You have to wonder why the French even elected him when there was a better alternative to this bumbler. And why President Trump even gave him the time of the day, when Macron has been in cahoots with Merkel to destroy Europe.

You're right. The Antichrist will be a charismatic personality who will be loved by all who have been blinded to the truth. For more insight people should study Daniel.

Hi E,
France was afraid of the far right, Le Penne, I do believe this is the whole problem.
I don't know too much about French politics and won't say too much. I do know that some promise to get each nation out of the EU but then when they're elected, they don't --- because it's very difficult to leave, as proven by England's woes.

It was a mistake from the beginning...a country should never give up its sovereignty.

 

[farouk]

Hi E,
France was afraid of the far right, Le Penne, I do believe this is the whole problem.
I don't know too much about French politics and won't say too much. I do know that some promise to get each nation out of the EU but then when they're elected, they don't --- because it's very difficult to leave, as proven by England's woes.

It was a mistake from the beginning...a country should never give up its sovereignty.

The multinationals prefer to have economies lumped together - whatever the people actually think....

 

[GodsGrace]

The multinationals prefer to have economies lumped together - whatever the people actually think....

Yes, I know.
And then we're told we're a free republic and that, as persons, we are free.
There's no such thing as freedom --- it's an illusion.
More persons than I thought are aware of this...it's just that we can't do anything about it. Our lives are totally controlled....

 

[farouk]

Yes, I know.
And then we're told we're a free republic and that, as persons, we are free.
There's no such thing as freedom --- it's an illusion.
More persons than I thought are aware of this...it's just that we can't do anything about it. Our lives are totally controlled....

Up here in Canada the multinationals have been very strong for decades...

 

[farouk]

You know mj, people have always thought the end was near. I don't know that we're any nearer than 2,000 years ago. The Thessalonians thought Jesus was coming back in that very generation. But, I do believe we're closer than ever...why? Because man is beginning to think he's God...unless we're actually at that point already. You know, cloning and all that comes with it. We think we could create.

Also, when you're sick, where do you go?
If you want to learn math, where do you go?

I believe God has special messages for all of us...He sure did for me many years ago.
But if we want to know about something, we go to those that know more than we do.

Not to know God. Our relationship with God is just between us and Him.

But to know ABOUT God. I find there's so much to know that I probably never would have understood.

It's not a bad thing. God gave us a brain. Jesus said to love God with all your heart, soul and mind. He meant that we should know as much about our Father as possible.

Just a thought...I'm not criticizing your method...we all use it.

Revelation 22 says: 'Amen, come, Lord Jesus...'

 

[GodsGrace]

Revelation 22 says: 'Amen, come, Lord Jesus...'

Maranatha...!

 

[Marymog]

I did not say I was against Catholic Christians. I clarified by saying I am anti-Catholic Church.

That's like saying, "I like sunshine, I just don't like the Sun". ;)

It doesn't work that way. You can't have one without the other.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Maybe this is the way to say it:
God hates sin. The CC sins in every Mass (idolatry) it performs. I think God hates your church.
But, I am commanded to love my enemies, so I must say I do not hate Catholic Christians, even though I hate your church.

Maybe this is the way to say it:

I hate the sun but I love sunshine. If we could just get rid of that darn sun life would be great.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

If you want to know God, ask Him. really I mean it, he has so much to show you about Himself, but if you dont ask you will never know, you can only get so much out of reading a book, if you want to know someone you must spend time with them, if you want to know God you must experience Him. He can do it if you will let Him. You will never regret it,

LOL.....Martin Luther, Huldrych Zwingli, John Calvin, Joseph Smith, Fred Phelps, mjrhealth and David Koresh all did they same thing. They all 'asked Him' and they all got different answers. Nice theory....... but it's not based on scripture.

I like (and liked) your post @GodsGrace....well done. This is my way of giving you double Kudos.

Mary

 

[GodsGrace]

LOL.....Martin Luther, Huldrych Zwingli, John Calvin, Joseph Smith, Fred Phelps, mjrhealth and David Koresh all did they same thing. They all 'asked Him' and they all got different answers. Nice theory....... but it's not based on scripture.

I like (and liked) your post @GodsGrace....well done. This is my way of giving you double Kudos.

Mary

Could you check out my Pope statement thread in Theology?
I think he was misunderstood....

 

[Phoneman777]

All I know is this: Macron can't be the anti-Christ...I don't think he's liked much in France. Wouldn't the AC have to be loved?

I posted it to show how anyone could be made out to be the Anti Christ.
I think this was done for Trump too.

My belief is that we just don't know and shouldn't assume.

But we can know if we follow the prophetic timeline, which identifies a succession of kingdoms with each successive one following on the heels of the previous one. Daniel 2 establishes Babylon as the starting point of that timeline, followed by Medo-Persian, Greece, Rome, the Ten Barbarian Divisions of Rome and the "Little Horn" which arose among them.

 

[mjrhealth]

LOL.....Martin Luther, Huldrych Zwingli, John Calvin, Joseph Smith, Fred Phelps, mjrhealth and David Koresh all did they same thing. They all 'asked Him' and they all got different answers. Nice theory....... but it's not based on scripture.

I like (and liked) your post @GodsGrace....well done. This is my way of giving you double Kudos.

Mary

another unbeliever - well Jesus it seems you may not find to much faith, just a lot of religion....