James Was Not Talking about Faith in Jesus Christ for Salvation

[Keiw]

Even though too late to be accepted by the Bridegroom, and be denied by Him to get left behind, they are still saved.

• 2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

How Former Believers Are Still Saved?

No they are not saved. Jesus assures--one must endure ( living now to do his Fathers will,( Matt 7:21) in this satan ruled system) until their end and -will- be saved it says-Matthew 10:22, Matthew 24:13-- Those at Matt 7:22-23 did not do that. None who practice a sin( work iniquity) is doing that.

 

[Keiw]

We look to Jesus Christ to not only forgive us from our sins but to help us not to do them again.

The reason we have free will, is so that we can choose to sin or not to sin. Yes the flesh is very weak. Praying before one sins always is beneficial.

 

[Christ4Me]

So . . . how do you answer the question, your own words, what is justification?

Romans 6:7 YLT
7) for he who hath died hath been set free from the sin.

Literally reading, the one having died has been justified away from sin. What does that mean?

Much love!

The sin has no more dominion over him but that is also why believers are warned not to sow to the works of the flesh les they reap corruption.

 

[marks]

The sin has no more dominion over him but that is also why believers are warned not to sow to the works of the flesh les they reap corruption.

No answer to my question? OK.

 

[Titus]

Where did Paul make a statement one way of the other?

Acts 22:12-16 KJV
12) And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there,
13) Came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul, receive thy sight. And the same hour I looked up upon him.
14) And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
15) For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
16) And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Here, Paul is telling what Ananias said. Is that what you are thinking of?

Much love!

What came directly out of Paul's mouth?
Acts 22:16
And now why are you waiting? Arise and be immersed, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

When did Paul say he had his sins forgiven?
a). When he had faith only?
b). When he obeyed Jesus' gospel ie Mark 16:15-16 and was immersed in water, Acts 22:16?

Also if no obedience to Jesus' gospel commandments must be done by you to be saved.
Then can you be saved without obeying this commandment?
1John 3:23-24
And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment.

You explain to me how works of God, John 6:28-29 are not required for us to work in order to be saved?

 

[marks]

What came directly out of Paul's mouth?
Acts 22:16
And now why are you waiting? Arise and be immersed, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

He was quoting what Ananias said.

Much love!

 

[Christ4Me]

No answer to my question? OK.

I did give you an answer.

So what answer were you expecting that you rejected mine?

 

[marks]

When did Paul say he had his sins forgiven?
a). When he had faith only?
b). When he obeyed Jesus' gospel ie Mark 16:15-16 and was immersed in water, Acts 22:16?

Quote the passage where Paul tells us this, not where he relays what someone else said.

Right?

Is your focus on what Paul said? Or what Ananias said?

Much love!

 

[marks]

I did give you an answer.

So what answer were you expecting that you rejected mine?

What was the answer? What is Justification?

Much love!

Edit to add, I think I see what your answer is.

Much love!

 

[marks]

The sin has no more dominion over him

This is your definition of justification? Is that correct? It seems to me more of an effect.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Justify means to 'render righteous'.

 

[Christ4Me]

This is your definition of justification? Is that correct? It seems to me more of an effect.

Much love!

I had answered that question in post #95

Justification as in salvation, being bought with a price and sealed as His whereby we can call God Father is us having been reconciled to God through Jesus Christ. Discipleship is running that race by living that reconciled relationship with God through Jesus Christ as we trust him to help us lay aside every weight & sin to be accepted by Him when He comes as the Bridegroom, otherwise, He will finish His work in those left behind the hard way.

2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. 18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; 19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. 20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. 21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

In post # 103 you had asked a different question.

marks posted "So . . . how do you answer the question, your own words, what is justification?

Romans 6:7 YLT
7) for he who hath died hath been set free from the sin.

Literally reading, the one having died has been justified away from sin. What does that mean?" end of quote

Almost like you lost track of our discussion and asked that question in a different way.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Justification as in salvation, being bought with a price and sealed as His whereby we can call God Father is us having been reconciled to God through Jesus Christ.

That sound more like you are describing redemption. A purchase. Justification is something different.

Almost like you lost track of our discussion

Is that so? Or just that I have a hard time finding actual content in what you write.

I've yet to see you post a definition of what justification is. I'd love to have a discussion about that, but not like this.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Justify = render righteous
Redeem = purchase back
Sanctify = render holy
Reconcile = restore to friendship

 

[Titus]

Quote the passage where Paul tells us this, not where he relays what someone else said.

Right?

Is your focus on what Paul said? Or what Ananias said?

Much love!

Talk about dodging the question!

It is irrelevant if Ananias said it or Paul!

Paul was speaking in Acts 22:16!
Paul taught that his sins were washed away in immersion.
Paul is teaching how Ananias taught him the gospel.
When did Paul say His sins were washed away?
He said when he obeyed the gospel that Ananias preached to him!

Are you going to accuse Ananias of not preaching what Jesus directly told Ananias to preach?
Ananias taught Paul the truth, did he not obey Jesus?

Acts 9: 10-16
Acts 9:17-18.
And Ananias went His way and entered the house: and laying his hands on him he said, Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit.

No way Paul would recount his story of how he was saved if he did not believe that was the way in which he was saved.

Now answer, when did Paul say His sins were washed away.
a). When Ananias told him to be immersed in Jesus' baptism, Mark 16:15-16;Acts 22:16?
b). When he had faith alone before he was immersed in Jesus' baptism, Mark 16:15-16?

This is not difficult unless you hold to a false theology that will not allow the scriptures to speak for themselves.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

op: James was not talking about faith for salvation?
(James) "faith PLUS works" FOR salvation - What Saith The Scripture?:

"..faith PLUS .. works..."​

Is this TRUE?: Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
If NOT, then THIS must be false?:

Luk 7:29 And all the people that heard him, and the publicans,
justified God, being baptized with the baptism of John.
Luk 7:30 But the Pharisees and lawyers rejected The Counsel
Of God Against themselves, being Not baptized of him.

How about?:

Mar_1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach
the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
Luk_3:3 And he came into all the country about Jordan,
preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;

Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized
every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission
of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Now, Many believe this above is for us, BUT, must be, by "hermeneutics
and eisegesis," somehow be RE-interpreted and explained Differently,
in order to FIT IN with Paul's message, because, "God, with only
ONE gospel, Certainly CANNOT Contradict Himself." ie, the famous:

"No, baptism is required, but IT does not save anyone." Heard that before?

Instead of this chicanery/Confusion, God Has A Much Better Way!:

The above is God's program of prophecy and the law, and MUST be:

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That DIFFER!” {online}:

God's Other program Of GRACE In "His Revelation Of The MYSTERY!"

(Paul) "faith WITHOUT works" FOR salvation - What Saith The Scripture?:
(1 Corinthians 15:3-4; cp Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 3-5)

Conclusion: NO "changes" needed; just keep God's Word,
As It Is WRITTEN, In HIS "Contexts." (Rule #3 BsR) Amen?

More BIBLICAL Confirmation :
God's Approval!

 

[marks]

Talk about dodging the question!

It is irrelevant if Ananias said it or Paul!

Nothing in the Bible is irrelevant to me. But that's me. I've seen many who overlook "minor" things.

You are forming a question based on a slight mis-statement as if it is vital to your view.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Paul is teaching how Ananias taught him the gospel.

Galatians 1:11-12 KJV
11) But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
12) For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

No, Paul was repeating a conversation. Paul was specifically NOT taught the Gospel by man.

The Gospel taught by Paul is this:

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV
1) Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2) By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3) For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4) And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Much love!

 

[marks]

Ephesians 2:4-10 KJV
4) But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)
6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
7) That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10) For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

 

[marks]

"No, baptism is required, but IT does not save anyone." Heard that before?

I hear things like this called "tension" in the Scripture, as if self-contradiction is OK if you rename it.

Much love!