Is the ability to procreate the only requirement for the "model" marriage?

[VictoryinJesus]

But Jesus said the lust for wanting to have (own her?) was adultery in his heart.

Matthew 5:28 NIV
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully
has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

/

Not disputing that.
Only brought it up for this reason: if we say Eve …or Adam …added the “don’t touch” what is desirable. Then if we then turn around and say it’s okay to look as long as you do not touch…isn’t it the same thing of changing or adding to as you pointed out Jesus said if you lust after a woman in your heart then you have already (eaten? Tasted?) of adultery. Yet sometimes I hear it changed or added to “you can look as long as you don’t touch”. my only point is in sometimes condemning Eve or Adam for the changing of or the adding to the word…saying “it’s okay to look as long as you do not touch” is the same thing. the same thing they condemn in the beginning of what God said of that tree they were not to eat of, changing or adding “don’t touch”….just thinking out loud. Can see how the serpent could really mess with their mind…did God say not to eat of it or don’t touch it? I don’t even know if I can answer that question. The ultimate gaslighting…before there was a term for it.

 

[Lambano]

Is the ability to procreate the only requirement for the "model" marriage?​

Unless God decides to reprise that Abe-and-Sarah, Elkanah-and-Hannah, Zack-and-Liz thing, that ain't gonna happen with me and my wife at our age, so I guess we're not a model marriage and never were. Won't keep us from tryin' though.

 

[St. SteVen]

Is the ability to procreate the only requirement for the "model" marriage?​

Unless God decides to reprise that Abe-and-Sarah, Elkanah-and-Hannah, Zack-and-Liz thing, that ain't gonna happen with me and my wife at our age, so I guess we're not a model marriage and never were. Won't keep us from tryin' though.

So, there is more to a successful marriage relationship than being a fertile opposite sex couple?

/

 

[BlessedPeace]

Is the ability to procreate the only requirement for the "model" marriage?​

No.

 

[BarneyFife]

So, there is more to a successful marriage relationship than being a fertile opposite sex couple?

/

"More to" but not "instead of." There is more within the male-female combination to bring social compatibility to the marriage framework than being reproductively viable.

That's why, when God thought out loud that Adam needed a suitable companion, He created a complimentary, but distinct person to fill the role.

I can't help but sense that we're somehow dancing around this for some reason.

.

 

[JohnDB]

I bring challenges.
I am re-evaluating a lot of things.

Do you see the forum as a glad-handing echo chamber?

.

Just like the Serpent and Eve in the Garden?

 

[St. SteVen]

Just like the Serpent and Eve in the Garden?

Imagine the potential outcome if Eve had been prepared with the correct answers. ???
And if Adam hadn't muddied the waters with his misinformation.
Or if Adam had stepped in when things started to go the wrong direction.
He stood by and said nothing. Eve handed the fruit to him and he ate too.
If only I had been there to help. - LOL

James 4:7 NIV
Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

/

 

[St. SteVen]

Imagine the potential outcome if Eve had been prepared with the correct answers. ???
And if Adam hadn't muddied the waters with his misinformation.
Or if Adam had stepped in when things started to go the wrong direction.
He stood by and said nothing. Eve handed the fruit to him and he ate too.
If only I had been there to help. - LOL

James 4:7 NIV
Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

/

@JohnDB
My post is a good example of what happens when we aren't satisfied
with the surface level facts and the little the church gave us.
When we are willing to probe deeper and give things a hard and challenging look.

/

 

[St. SteVen]

@JohnDB
My post is a good example of what happens when we aren't satisfied
with the surface level facts and the little the church gave us.
When we are willing to probe deeper and give things a hard and challenging look.

/

--- PARODY ---

Serpent: Did God really say... ?
Eve: He said don't eat and don't touch.
Adam: Oops, my bad, I said don't touch.
Eve: What?! God didn't say that? !!!
Adam: No, I added that because
I know you like to touch things without thinking.
Eve: So, you don't trust me? !!!
Adam: I'm looking out for our best interests. My job.
Eve: I see.
Serpent: Are you going to eat, or not? !!!
Eve: Let me check with the boss. - LOL
Adam: Scram serpent!
Serpent: Hiss... (walks away dejected)
Eve: Hey, let's check out that other tree.
Adam: Good idea!

Indeed.

/

 

[JohnDB]

Walks like a duck
Talks like a duck
Acts like a duck
But it's a sheep?

 

[St. SteVen]

Walks like a duck
Talks like a duck
Acts like a duck
But it's a sheep?

Proverbs 27:17 NIV
As iron sharpens iron,
so one person sharpens another.

/

 

[BlessedPeace]

 

[St. SteVen]

--- PARODY ---

Serpent: Did God really say... ?
Eve: He said don't eat and don't touch.
Adam: Oops, my bad, I said don't touch.
Eve: What?! God didn't say that? !!!
Adam: No, I added that because
I know you like to touch things without thinking.
Eve: So, you don't trust me? !!!
Adam: I'm looking out for our best interests. My job.
Eve: I see.
Serpent: Are you going to eat, or not? !!!
Eve: Let me check with the boss. - LOL
Adam: Scram serpent!
Serpent: Hiss... (walks away dejected)
Eve: Hey, let's check out that other tree.
Adam: Good idea!

Indeed.

/

 

[MA2444]

Adam and Eve's marriage = PASS or FAIL?

Is this really the model for marriage? A&E.
The result of this relationship was the Fall of humankind. FAIL.
(assuming we take the Genesis record as literal)

Adam failed as a husband and Eve failed as a wife. FAIL.
(although I think Eve was set up by bad leadership from Adam)

That's a fair question. I think I would lean towards that Adam passed his marriage before he fell. I'll explain...Adam was standing there in an unfallen state with Eve. He sees Eve take the fruit and eat it...what do you suppose was Adam's initial reaction? He knew she sinned and did wrong. Now then, this is my Wife, what shall I do? Of couse Adam loved Eve very much. She had to be knock down gorgeous. Adam is still unfallen for the moment...He knows that this sin will seperate his Wife from God. And I believe, that out of love for his Wife, Adam did not want her to be alone and have to go through all that by herself....So Adam intentionally ate the fruit knowing it would cause his fall, out of love for his Wife.

We tend to call men who would die for their wives as good men. He stuck by her side! So that's sort of a win as far as I (understand). But of course Adam did not win as a husband after the fall. How could he? He was seperated from God. So after the fall he failed. Eve too.
She divorced him anyway 23 years later and booted him out of the house, lol! (J/K).

 

[MA2444]

Example: Eve told the serpent that they were
not allowed "to touch" the forbidden fruit. Where did that come from?
God told Adam that he was not allowed to eat.
Nothing (in the text) was said about not touching.

That was satan's trick right there. He appealed to the woman's vanity. He said something incorrect to her formed as a question, and what woman dont like to correct a man? And when she did that (I can teach this one something!), she embellished it because she's a woman! (Lol!)

Your perceptive to have caught that God did not tell them to not touch it!

 

[3 Resurrections]

That's a fair question. I think I would lean towards that Adam passed his marriage before he fell. I'll explain...Adam was standing there in an unfallen state with Eve. He sees Eve take the fruit and eat it...what do you suppose was Adam's initial reaction? He knew she sinned and did wrong. Now then, this is my Wife, what shall I do? Of couse Adam loved Eve very much. She had to be knock down gorgeous. Adam is still unfallen for the moment...He knows that this sin will seperate his Wife from God. And I believe, that out of love for his Wife, Adam did not want her to be alone and have to go through all that by herself....So Adam intentionally ate the fruit knowing it would cause his fall, out of love for his Wife.

I remember my own father expressing this very sentiment. Presuming that overwhelming love for his wife caused Adam to take the fruit and eat what was forbidden.

This is totally mistaken. Adam put his love for Eve before his love for his Creator and His commandment. THIS IS IDOLATRY TO THE CORE. Christ taught that to follow Himself meant that affections for natural relationships were to take a back seat - ALWAYS. The OT taught this also; that even if the wife of a man's bosom, or his friend that was as his own soul tried to draw that man away from serving God, they were to be put to death by stoning (Deut. 13:6-11). Adam fell for this temptation - not only to partake of the fruit, but to idolize a fellow-human over God Himself. There was nothing commendable in Adam's decision at all.

 

[MA2444]

I remember my own father expressing this very sentiment. Presuming that overwhelming love for his wife caused Adam to take the fruit and eat what was forbidden.

This is totally mistaken. Adam put his love for Eve before his love for his Creator and His commandment. THIS IS IDOLATRY TO THE CORE. Christ taught that to follow Himself meant that affections for natural relationships were to take a back seat - ALWAYS. The OT taught this also; that even if the wife of a man's bosom, or his friend that was as his own soul tried to draw that man away from serving God, they were to be put to death by stoning (Deut. 13:6-11). Adam fell for this temptation - not only to partake of the fruit, but to idolize a fellow-human over God Himself. There was nothing commendable in Adam's decision at all.

You're right of course and I knew that when I typed it. But Adam already had that deep of a love for her, that, I guess he just couldnt help himself.

 

[O'Darby]

It would never have occurred to me that the account of Adam and Eve was supposed to tell me anything at all about marriage. The biblical model of marriage is the union of a man and a woman, the husband fulfilling the biblical male role and the wife fulfilling the biblical female role. Procreation and the raising of children in accordance with the biblical model is a key purpose but not the only one. The union of the husband and wife can have deep meaning and purpose and represent the union of Christ with His church without any children at all.

Because I'm a selfish turd and my own perpetual child, I decided at age 12 I'd never have any children. Fortunately, my late wife of 33 years had reached the same decision at about the same age. But we had an entirely model marriage - and far more biblical than most today. When I married my current wife, I inherited a long-distance 26-year-old stepdaughter who is now 43, so I get to play at being Dad without all the headaches (er, joys) of raising a child.

(Reminds me of what a Jewish attorney once said to me: "Let's face, it 99% of having kids is sh*t, but the other 1% is priceless." I replied, "Gee, with my cats I'd just about reverse those percentages.")

 

[St. SteVen]

Adam and Eve's marriage = PASS or FAIL?

Is this really the model for marriage? A&E.
The result of this relationship was the Fall of humankind. FAIL.
(assuming we take the Genesis record as literal)

Adam failed as a husband and Eve failed as a wife. FAIL.
(although I think Eve was set up by bad leadership from Adam)

Example: Eve told the serpent that they were
not allowed "to touch" the forbidden fruit. Where did that come from?
God told Adam that he was not allowed to eat.
Nothing (in the text) was said about not touching.

Therefore Adam was caught in his misstatement to Eve. (he added to God;s word) FAIL.
The serpent could easily disprove that death would not come from touching the fruit.
And Adam stood by and said nothing. FAIL.

Eve decided to take the fruit and eat based on here discussion with the serpent.
She did not consult with her husband. FAIL. And Adam followed her lead. FAIL.
Do we really want to declare A&E's failed relationship as God's model for marriage?
Perhaps we should look elsewhere? Open to suggestions.

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