Is BAPTISM MANDATORY for SALVATION...

[mjrhealth]

Yes Baptism is mandatory

Baptism by water adds nothing to salvation, yet many christianss keep adding it to salvation, as if Christ did not do enough. We are saved by grace through faith, and nothing else will do.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Baptism by water adds nothing to salvation, yet many christianss keep adding it to salvation, as if Christ did not do enough. We are saved by grace through faith, and nothing else will do.

My friend, my friend
It seems you may have "rejected" a large portion of the scriptures of the bible.
Have you read every passage of scripture on baptism, especially in the book of Acts?
There are 28 conversions in the book of Acts by immersion baptism.
John baptized in water. Jesus was baptized in water.
3000 were baptized on the day of Pentacost in water, and then 5000 more were baptized in water.
Paul himself was baptized in water.
All the major "GOOD GUY" players in the New Testament were baptized in water.

Years ago I to was mistaken in my faith but as I grew, and God opened my eyes slowly to the truth many years later


Stay around my friend and we will all grow together in truth and LOVE.

God bless you
My name is OLIGOS

 

[Willie T]

My friend, my friend
It seems you may have "rejected" a large portion of the scriptures of the bible.
Have you read every passage of scripture on baptism, especially in the book of Acts?
There are 28 conversions in the book of Acts by immersion baptism.
John baptized in water. Jesus was baptized in water.
3000 were baptized on the day of Pentacost in water, and then 5000 more were baptized in water.
Paul himself was baptized in water.
All the major "GOOD GUY" players in the New Testament were baptized in water.

Years ago I to was mistaken in my faith but as I grew, and God opened my eyes slowly to the truth many years later


Stay around my friend and we will all grow together in truth and LOVE.

God bless you
My name is OLIGOS

I used to be CoC, for 12 years, with that distorted view of baptism. Thank God, He got me out of that Legalistic trap.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

So, you are saying that faith alone in Christ is not enough?

To me, it is the same as saying that I was not really married until I put the wedding ring on my finger.

Well, if faith alone is enough then let's throw the rest of the bible away, kind of like some husbands do after they get their wives. Yeah, they do.

God bless you my brother Paul
My name is Oligos

 

[Candidus]

There are 28 conversions in the book of Acts by immersion baptism.

Name one. Take your best shot.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

There are 28 conversions in the book of Acts by immersion baptism.

Name one. Take your best shot.

Acts 2:40-41, "And with many other words Peter solemnly testified and kept on exhorting them, saying," be SAVED from this perverse generation"!
So those who had received his word were BAPTIZED and there were added (To the kingdom through baptism) THREE THOUSAND SOULS - THREE THOUSAND SOULS.

God bless you on your journey.
My name is OLIGOS

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Baptism by water adds nothing to salvation, yet many christianss keep adding it to salvation,

God has required baptism, therefore how can anyone add to the Bible what God has already put in the Bible?

as if Christ did not do enough

Hebrews 2:9 Christ death is enough to save every man yet every man will not be saved for every man will not be baptized in the name of the Lord.

In 1 Corinthians 1:13-14 "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul? "

Paul's point is that if your to be "of" someone then two things must be true of that someone, that someone:
1) must be crucified for you
2) you must be baptized in that someone's name

Since these two things are only true of Christ, then one cannot be of Paul or of any other man. Therefore Christ being crucified provides a pathway to salvation for every man but it is up to man to take that path by being obedient to Christ (Hebrews 9:5) by submitting to water baptism in the name of the Lord for remission of sins (Acts 2:28; Act 10:47-48). BOTH #1 and #2 must be true.. If just #1 is true then every man will be saved.

We are saved by grace through faith, and nothing else will do.

Eph 2:8----------------faith>>>>>>>>>>>>>>saves
Luke 13:3-------------repentance>>>>>>>>>>saves/not perish
Romans 10:9-10-----confession>>>>>>>>>>>saves
1 Pet 3:21------------baptism>>>>>>>>>>>>saves

Since there is just one way to be saved, no alternatives, then NT faith INCLUDES repentance, confess and baptism. Faith alone is dead being void of repentance confession and baptism.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

God has required baptism, therefore how can anyone add to the Bible what God has already put in the Bible?




Hebrews 2:9 Christ death is enough to save every man yet every man will not be saved for every man will not be baptized in the name of the Lord.

In 1 Corinthians 1:13-14 "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul? "

Paul's point is that if your to be "of" someone then two things must be true of that someone, that someone:
1) must be crucified for you
2) you must be baptized in that someone's name

Since these two things are only true of Christ, then one cannot be of Paul or of any other man. Therefore Christ being crucified provides a pathway to salvation for every man but it is up to man to take that path by being obedient to Christ (Hebrews 9:5) by submitting to water baptism in the name of the Lord for remission of sins (Acts 2:28; Act 10:47-48). BOTH #1 and #2 must be true.. If just #1 is true then every man will be saved.






Eph 2:8----------------faith>>>>>>>>>>>>>>saves
Luke 13:3-------------repentance>>>>>>>>>>saves/not perish
Romans 10:9-10-----confession>>>>>>>>>>>saves
1 Pet 3:21------------baptism>>>>>>>>>>>>saves

Since there is just one way to be saved, no alternatives, then NT faith INCLUDES repentance, confess and baptism. Faith alone is dead being void of repentance confession and baptism.

PERFECT :):):):):):):):):):):):):)

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Hi Oligos,

Surprised to see this post from you! I had no idea that you thought this way.

Aren't the 10 commandments a lower standard than what we're taught in the New Testament as God's children?

Much love!

On the contrary Marks.
The 10 commandments are of Gods highest standards, as they tell us how to treat man, and tell us how to obey God and not sin.
There, at least at the same level, if not higher, with the 10 commandments, are the 2 "ROYAL LAWS". Love the Lord God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength, and the 2nd is like the first, to love your neighbor as yourself
The 10 commandments covers all the sins we are not to participate in...ALL OF THEM!

God bless you Mark
My name is OLIGOS

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

It makes perfect sense! It's being a child.

Maybe this forum is God's rock polisher! This is us:

Much love!

ABSOLUTELY!!!

 

[marks]

It seems you may have "rejected" a large portion of the scriptures of the bible.

Does @mjrhealth "reject", or understand differently?

I assure you I don't reject portions of the Bible. I believe we are reborn before being water baptized, and I think that the NT portrays that very well. After rebirth, nothing we do or don't do changes the fact that we've been born from God. After rebirth, God will work in us towards doing those things He wants of us.

Not the cleansing of the flesh, but the inquiry of a good conscience . . . I see one salvific baptism, that baptism being into Jesus, into His death and burial and resurrection.

Much love!

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Does @mjrhealth "reject", or understand differently?

I assure you I don't reject portions of the Bible. I believe we are reborn before being water baptized, and I think that the NT portrays that very well. After rebirth, nothing we do or don't do changes the fact that we've been born from God. After rebirth, God will work in us towards doing those things He wants of us.

Not the cleansing of the flesh, but the inquiry of a good conscience . . . I see one salvific baptism, that baptism being into Jesus, into His death and burial and resurrection.

Much love!

Marks my brother :)

How do you see us being reborn before we are baptized??
Please explain ;)

God bless you
My name is OLIGOS

 

[lforrest]

I'm not going to say Water Baptism is required for salvation, but I believe it is symbolic and symbols may be essential. There are some things to consider for those who hold that Water baptism is essential. There are exceptions to the general trend in scripture where the Holy Spirit comes after water baptism.

Were the apostles water baptised? There is no record of Jesus doing this for them or anyone else in the flesh.
Yet Jesus himself declared them clean, except for one. I take this to mean their contience was clear. This was also before they received the Holy Spirit at Pentecost.

And the Gentiles who received the Holy Spirit before water baptism. Acts 10:47

 

[Nancy]

Like I said - LOT"S OF OPINIONS.

So glad I'm grounded in m


Marks my friend and brother in Christ.
One of the major discrepencies I have seen in the Christian faith for many decade is the idea of Christians seeing many things as one way or the other in the bible, but Christians have a hard time seeing things as being all inclusive.
Instead of choosing everything that makes faith, they choose one thing and reject everything else.

God says the 2 greatest commands are to love the lord your God with all your heart and soul and mind and strength.
And the 2nd is like the first to love your neighbor as yourself.

We're also told we are known by the love we have for one another as Christians.

We're also told to love our enemies and pray for those who persecute you.
Also the 10 commandments tell us how to live to treat man, and also how to please God.

Everything I have listed here is all inclusive .
The 2 greatest commands don't replace the 10 commandments. Nothing here replaces anything.
We're not supposed to be selective about which verses to obey as if it is some king of smorgasbord, we're supposed to obey them all. I do!!
That makes my faith complete instead of selective or opposed to scripture.
After all God's New Testament word is perfect, so we have to figure out how to find "HARMONY in Gods word instead of dividing it up and setting words and phrases against each other to try and make sense of something we haven't taken the proper time to understand properly because we're in to big of a hurry, or we've decided what it is we want to believe and then reject the rest of what the bible says about that topic.

God bless you my brother and I know you'll have more questions, so feel free to ask away.

What I posted as a thread and my answer here to you is "SHALLOW compared to the "COMPLETENESS of my faith.

It took me 42 years to get to the depth I'm at and only by the "INTENSE" leading of the Holy Spirit, and His Gracious patience, as I was overwhelmed more times than I can count or remember.

10's of thousands of hours of study to set me on a path that built a faith I find great Joy and assurance in at the feet of my SAVIOR.

This was a journey God chose for me and took me on, nothing I chose for myself.

Many biblical things revealed by God that I would never have found for myself, as my eyes had to be opened to see what God showed me in scripture.

What is wonderful is, no matter what anything anyone thinks of what I've posted, I am at peace with my creator and everything works for me.
I don't have to believe like anyone else does as some try to accomplish here, and no one has to believe what I post.

This is posted to be considered as an option, not a demand.

My name is OLIGOS

Hi Seasoned!
I understand what you mean by the big 10 points to what sin is. But, when we receive Jesus as Lord and Savior, and He gives us the 2 commandments to Love God and Neighbor...he also say's that all the Law hangs on those two so...if we obey and live the first 2 then, the rest would be impossible to break. We don't need tablets of stone as He already etched His laws on the lining of our hearts. I should say, we already KNOW right from wrong.
As far as "water" baptism goes, I personally do not believe it is a salvific issue.

"Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?" Acts 10:47.
It seems these folks are already saved and have His Spirit living in them...so, seeing as they were not yet "water" baptized had nothing to do with their salvation. Peter then says that nothing should prevent them from celebrating with water baptism.
It seems that in Acts 10, Spiritual birth came first and the outward confession of Christ through water baptism came second. Not to mention the thief on the cross...
At my local body, when we baptize, before being put under the water, the baptizer will ask for a public confession of Christ, tell them that "you were buried in Christ...dunks...then when they come p from the water the baptizer continues by saying "...and raised into newness of Life with Christ. So, I see this as a "confessing with your mouth" in front of witnesses.
Yes, Peter does say that "...baptism now saves you-not the removal of dirt from the flesh (water baptism)...but an appeal to God for a good conscience-through the resurrection of Christ." 1 Peter 3:21. So yes there is a "type" of baptism that saves and it isn't water IMHO.
" And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Acts 2:38. The Greek for "for" here does not always mean "to obtain"...it is also used for "as a result of", "or because of". It seems that Peter was urging them to repent, believe the truth of the Gospel and to be baptized in water because of the forgiveness through Christ, so freely given. And, we know that being dunked in water does not mean one is baptized in His Spirit.
Good and thoughtful post OLGIOS :)

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

I'm not going to say Water Baptism is required for salvation, but I believe it is symbolic and symbols may be essential. There are some things to consider for those who hold that Water baptism is essential. There are exceptions to the general trend in scripture where the Holy Spirit comes after water baptism.

Were the apostles water baptised? There is no record of Jesus doing this for them or anyone else in the flesh.
Yet Jesus himself declared them clean, except for one. I take this to mean their contience was clear. This was also before they received the Holy Spirit at Pentecost.

And the Gentiles who received the Holy Spirit before water baptism. Acts 10:47

Thank you Iforrest :)
This can be a "RATHER" toxic topic, but we here have decided to share our thoughts in love as we are all still growing, and some may even change where they are in there faith, as I have several times, and so has some others here too.
So your input is always welcome here, even if your views are different than other's here, but you will still be greeted in love and respect by most of us, including myself.

God bless you
My name is OLIGOS

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Hi Seasoned!
I understand what you mean by the big 10 points to what sin is. But, when we receive Jesus as Lord and Savior, and He gives us the 2 commandments to Love God and Neighbor...he also say's that all the Law hangs on those two so...if we obey and live the first 2 then, the rest would be impossible to break. We don't need tablets of stone as He already etched His laws on the lining of our hearts. I should say, we already KNOW right from wrong.
As far as "water" baptism goes, I personally do not believe it is a salvific issue.

"Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?" Acts 10:47.
It seems these folks are already saved and have His Spirit living in them...so, seeing as they were not yet "water" baptized had nothing to do with their salvation. Peter then says that nothing should prevent them from celebrating with water baptism.
It seems that in Acts 10, Spiritual birth came first and the outward confession of Christ through water baptism came second. Not to mention the thief on the cross...
At my local body, when we baptize, before being put under the water, the baptizer will ask for a public confession of Christ, tell them that "you were buried in Christ...dunks...then when they come p from the water the baptizer continues by saying "...and raised into newness of Life with Christ. So, I see this as a "confessing with your mouth" in front of witnesses.
Yes, Peter does say that "...baptism now saves you-not the removal of dirt from the flesh (water baptism)...but an appeal to God for a good conscience-through the resurrection of Christ." 1 Peter 3:21. So yes there is a "type" of baptism that saves and it isn't water IMHO.
" And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Acts 2:38. The Greek for "for" here does not always mean "to obtain"...it is also used for "as a result of", "or because of". It seems that Peter was urging them to repent, believe the truth of the Gospel and to be baptized in water because of the forgiveness through Christ, so freely given. And, we know that being dunked in water does not mean one is baptized in His Spirit.
Good and thoughtful post OLGIOS :)

Thank you Nancy my sister in Christ. :)

God bless you.
My name is OLIGOS

 

[Candidus]

Acts 2:40-41, "And with many other words Peter solemnly testified and kept on exhorting them, saying," be SAVED from this perverse generation"!
So those who had received his word were BAPTIZED and there were added (To the kingdom through baptism) THREE THOUSAND SOULS - THREE THOUSAND SOULS.

God bless you on your journey.
My name is OLIGOS

Where is immersion baptism stated in this passage besides an assumption?

 

[lforrest]

Thank you Iforrest :)
This can be a "RATHER" toxic topic, but we here have decided to share our thoughts in love as we are all still growing, and some may even change where they are in there faith, as I have several times, and so has some others here too.
So your input is always welcome here, even if your views are different than other's here, but you will still be greeted in love and respect by most of us, including myself.

God bless you
My name is OLIGOS

Yes, it can get toxic as many hold water baptism to be absolutely essential and fear for those who refuse baptism for no good reason.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Yes, it can get toxic as many hold water baptism to be absolutely essential and fear for those who refuse baptism for no good reason.

Thank you IForrest
I hold that tenet also, but it's not my job to be anyone's Holy Spirit. All any of us can do is share what we think is the truth IN LOVE _ NOT ATTACKING and hope that the truth as we see it from God's word, is used by the Holy Spirit at some point to change peoples hearts and lives.
At the end, everyone is responsible for their own choices that will decide their ultimate destination. All any of us can do is try.

Glad you posted back as it was nice to hear from you.
My name is OLIGOS

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Where is immersion baptism stated in this passage besides an assumption?

Acts 8:37-38,
As Philip and the eunuch traveled along the road, they came to some water and the eunuch said, "Look, here is water. What can stand in the way of me being baptized.37-38) And the eunuch gave orders to stop the chariot. Then both Philip and the eunuch went DOWN INTO THE WATER, and Philip BAPTIZED HIM.

Acts 10:47-48, "Surely, no one can refuse the WATER for these to be BAPTIZED who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he? And he ordered them to be BAPTIZED in the name of Jesus Christ.

I hope this helps you, and may you be blessed.
My name is OLIGOS