In exile from the church - disconnected from what?

[St. SteVen]

@Spyder
You may be interested in this from the OP. (post #1)

Anyway, back to the statistics. The Washington Post had an article about "dechurching",
based on a book written by Jim Davis and Michael Graham. Here's an article quote.
"The study included a survey of 1,043 Americans to determine the scope of dechurching — which was defined as
having attended service at least once a month in the past and now attending less than once a year.
That initial survey found that about 15% of Americans are dechurched." Source
This survey, at least, seems to indicate that the number is SOME, rather than MANY.

/

 

[Aunty Jane]

I have found snippets of this book and have observed that they are researching about people leaving organized religious churches. If have no clue about their concern for the growth of "home churches" or even "zoom churches."
I have zero problem with Christians leaving the non-profit businesses in order to spend time with fellow believers discussing scriptures and having fellowship outside of membership-related organisations.

Yes, this is how Christianity began....meeting in people’s homes in small groups. Paul also used the synagogue to instruct those who responded to his preaching concerning Jesus. At one stage, after they were forced from the synagogue due to opposition, Paul continued his instruction in a school auditorium. (Acts 19:8-10)

The building is not the church.....it’s the congregation. And all must be of one mind, with the same truth embraced by all. (1Cor 1:10) There are not many versions of the truth...there can be only one.

 

[Aunty Jane]

At first, I thought they were discussing the great falling away. Well, perhaps it is, but maybe it is falling away from the church that man built.

The question then is....”who or what is “Babylon the great”?
We are told in no certain terms to remove ourselves from that immoral entity. She is pictured as a harlot, who is “in bed” with God’s enemies, and has always had the political and commercial world to do her bidding....but in these last days, those who can identify her have to act before God does....(Rev 18:4-5)
She is going down!

She is an integral part of satan’s rulership over this earth.....he has three main elements with which he controls this world.....corrupt political, greedy commercialism and false religion....all three components are under his complete influence, so all of humanity are unwittingly kept under his control by means of these three key elements. It’s why Jesus said we must be “no part of the world”. (John 17:16)

“Babylon the great” is mourned by both the political and commercials elements, even though it is the political elements that attack her. (Rev 18:9-11) Therefore, BtG has to be a grander global version of what original Babylon was. The means by which false religion was spread into all the world. (Gen 11:1-9)

After the flood of Noah’s day, it wasn’t long before rebellion again reared it’s ugly head with Nimrod, Noah’s great grandson. It was Nimrod who rebelled against God’s instructions to spread abroad in the earth, wanting instead to stay put and build his own political and false religious empire. Babylon was the city he built with its famous tower “with its top in the heavens”...legend has it that this was so that if God flooded the world again, they would have a safe place to save themselves. (Much like modern day world leaders have their purpose built bunkers for when it all goes pear shaped....to save themselves, but no one else)

Babylon the great also pictures the captivity of the Israelites when, because of their continuing disobedience, God allowed the Babylonian world power of the day, to conquer his people and destroy their temple and their city, leaving it in ruins and the people carried off to that distant land as captives. Babylon was renown for never allowing their prisoners to go free.....so it looked as if Israel was in a hopeless situation.
Many in Christendom feel that way too, feeling trapped.....not knowing how to get out of what they see is a sham, pretending to be what it is not....having no beneficial purpose in the world.
Any wonder some want to discard religion altogether?

The captivity of the Jews was foretold to last 70 years (by Daniel who was himself a captive but because of favourable circumstances, and God’s blessing and direction, he became the second most important figure in the Babylonian Empire.)

But at the end of the foretold 70 years, God allowed another powerful nation to conquer Babylon, allowing a “remnant” of faithful Israelites to go back and rebuild their city and their temple.....it took a long time because of opposition from the prevailing rulers, but eventually God’s temple was restored to its former glory and true worship was reestablished in Israel.

God’s people were in Babylon by God’s own decision as a punishment for their disobedience...... Christianity has fallen in the same manner, and a greater Babylon was used, this time as a global empire, entrapping many in a variety of religious faiths, none of which were of God’s making. All had the same core of religious teachings......a multiplicity of gods....belief in an immortal soul....and a hell of firey eternal punishment for the wicked, but a heaven of bliss for the good. All false religion has these elements...the Bible has none of them.

“Babylon the great” is a world empire of false religion created by the devil to cater to all religious tastes and preferences.....the most reprehensible part is Christendom, who like the Jews, claimed to worship the same God that Jesus and his apostles preached, but were “far removed” from him in their teachings and conduct. (Matt 15:7-9)

History repeats because human nature does not change.....which is why the devil is so successful...he knows exactly how to take people away from God, as skillfully as he did the first humans. All he has to do is convince people that his lies are the truth and that God’s truth is all lies. He holds freedom and independence from God as the best choice, (do your own thing) but all it results in is slavery to him....religious, commercial, and political. Humans never learn....

Big picture.....

 

[Spyder]

The question then is....”who or what is “Babylon the great”?
We are told in no certain terms to remove ourselves from that immoral entity. She is pictured as a harlot, who is “in bed” with God’s enemies, and has always had the political and commercial world to do her bidding....but in these last days, those who can identify her have to act before God does....(Rev 18:4-5)
She is going down!

She is an integral part of satan’s rulership over this earth.....he has three main elements with which he controls this world.....corrupt political, greedy commercialism and false religion....all three components are under his complete influence, so all of humanity are unwittingly kept under his control by means of these three key elements. It’s why Jesus said we must be “no part of the world”. (John 17:16)

“Babylon the great” is mourned by both the political and commercials elements, even though it is the political elements that attack her. (Rev 18:9-11) Therefore, BtG has to be a grander global version of what original Babylon was. The means by which false religion was spread into all the world. (Gen 11:1-9)

After the flood of Noah’s day, it wasn’t long before rebellion again reared it’s ugly head with Nimrod, Noah’s great grandson. It was Nimrod who rebelled against God’s instructions to spread abroad in the earth, wanting instead to stay put and build his own political and false religious empire. Babylon was the city he built with its famous tower “with its top in the heavens”...legend has it that this was so that if God flooded the world again, they would have a safe place to save themselves. (Much like modern day world leaders have their purpose built bunkers for when it all goes pear shaped....to save themselves, but no one else)

Babylon the great also pictures the captivity of the Israelites when, because of their continuing disobedience, God allowed the Babylonian world power of the day, to conquer his people and destroy their temple and their city, leaving it in ruins and the people carried off to that distant land as captives. Babylon was renown for never allowing their prisoners to go free.....so it looked as if Israel was in a hopeless situation.
Many in Christendom feel that way too, feeling trapped.....not knowing how to get out of what they see is a sham, pretending to be what it is not....having no beneficial purpose in the world.
Any wonder some want to discard religion altogether?

The captivity of the Jews was foretold to last 70 years (by Daniel who was himself a captive but because of favourable circumstances, and God’s blessing and direction, he became the second most important figure in the Babylonian Empire.)

But at the end of the foretold 70 years, God allowed another powerful nation to conquer Babylon, allowing a “remnant” of faithful Israelites to go back and rebuild their city and their temple.....it took a long time because of opposition from the prevailing rulers, but eventually God’s temple was restored to its former glory and true worship was reestablished in Israel.

God’s people were in Babylon by God’s own decision as a punishment for their disobedience...... Christianity has fallen in the same manner, and a greater Babylon was used, this time as a global empire, entrapping many in a variety of religious faiths, none of which were of God’s making. All had the same core of religious teachings......a multiplicity of gods....belief in an immortal soul....and a hell of firey eternal punishment for the wicked, but a heaven of bliss for the good. All false religion has these elements...the Bible has none of them.

“Babylon the great” is a world empire of false religion created by the devil to cater to all religious tastes and preferences.....the most reprehensible part is Christendom, who like the Jews, claimed to worship the same God that Jesus and his apostles preached, but were “far removed” from him in their teachings and conduct. (Matt 15:7-9)

History repeats because human nature does not change.....which is why the devil is so successful...he knows exactly how to take people away from God, as skillfully as he did the first humans. All he has to do is convince people that his lies are the truth and that God’s truth is all lies. He holds freedom and independence from God as the best choice, (do your own thing) but all it results in is slavery to him....religious, commercial, and political. Humans never learn....

Big picture.....

Yes, my sister, I view this fallen condition of a Christianity based on unscriptural doctrines by a group that enforces their statements by shunning those who don't accept them, stigmatizing those who dare to speak up, and leaving those who loved being in a community of believers by themselves. However, Yahweh provides a way to have fellowship, but without the banquets or communion. (He doesn't leave me alone, thank God.)

For those who have been dear to me, my heart hurts. There are doctrines that cause sin and may be a salvific issue in nature. But, they still choose doctrines over scripture. I have to leave it in the hands of the One who can effect change - just as I depend on God for truth.

 

[St. SteVen]

New topic. Link below.

Is the Good News actual news? - No longer news to most

/

 

[Aunty Jane]

Yes, my sister, I view this fallen condition of a Christianity based on unscriptural doctrines by a group that enforces their statements by shunning those who don't accept them, stigmatizing those who dare to speak up, and leaving those who loved being in a community of believers by themselves. However, Yahweh provides a way to have fellowship, but without the banquets or communion. (He doesn't leave me alone, thank God.)

It is good news indeed that God is searching the world for us as much as we think we are searching for him.
No one can come to the Father unless it is through the son....and no one can come to the son without an invitation from his Father (John 6:65)....so that narrows it down to a specific group...not large in numbers (Matt 7:13-14) but big on scriptural truth, no matter how unpopular it is......look at Jesus....the majority of Jews took the side of the Pharisees and clamored for his death, not believing what he taught, but a remnant believed and became his faithful followers. (Matt 2:25)

For those who have been dear to me, my heart hurts.

Mine too....but I have found that Yahweh puts his hand over your heart to ease the pain.

There are doctrines that cause sin and may be a salvific issue in nature. But, they still choose doctrines over scripture. I have to leave it in the hands of the One who can effect change - just as I depend on God for truth.

These are the safest of hands...and he has a basis for judgment that cannot be faulted or interfered with by his adversary.
Those who come to Christ on the basis of who he really is, are going to inherit "everlasting life".

John 17:3....
"This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ."

Just in this one verse alone we can see what is a salvation issue.....we have to "know" the one who is "the only true God" AND the one he "sent". Those who confuse the Father and son and treat them as "one God", have just broken the first Commandment. (Exodus 20:3) There is no God but Yahweh....and we know that Jesus is never called Yahweh.

 

[St. SteVen]

New forum topic. Link below.

Is Lying a Violation of the Ten Commandments? - No. - Well, maybe... ???

/

 

[amadeus]

I have found snippets of this book and have observed that they are researching about people leaving organized religious churches. If have no clue about their concern for the growth of "home churches" or even "zoom churches."
I have zero problem with Christians leaving the non-profit businesses in order to spend time with fellow believers discussing scriptures and having fellowship outside of membership-related organizations.
At first, I thought they were discussing the great falling away. Well, perhaps it is, but maybe it is falling away from the church that man built.

Most of my life I attended church meetings regularly. For then it was seemingly a necessary thing for me. In November of 2018, the human powers that be put out our 93-year-old pastor. We went out with him. For a long time then I was visiting the various church services in our town hoping God would show me a new place to call "home". I was still visiting and looking in 2020 when most of them stopped having physical services. I never got into what they called "virtual services".

By the time most of the doors had reopened I had begun my fight with cancer so I did not resume my visits. I had weekly Bible studies with my old pastor in his trailer. This stopped not long before his death in November of 2022. In early 2023 we. moved into our daughter's home where we are now. None of my family regularly attends any services although they sometime watch their "home church" using a computer link. Until I am able to drive again [will that ever happen?], I remain at home and spend most of my time in my little study reading my Bible and other books or checking this forum.

 

[St. SteVen]

Why aren't you in church?

Excerpt from the OP.

The Washington Post had an article about "dechurching",
based on a book written by Jim Davis and Michael Graham. Here's an article quote.
"The study included a survey of 1,043 Americans to determine the scope of dechurching — which was defined as
having attended service at least once a month in the past and now attending less than once a year.
That initial survey found that about 15% of Americans are dechurched." Source

]

 

[Spyder]

While it may be rare for some to see, there are those who have left a church because "the church leaders" require those who want to serve God must first believe all of the doctrines that the church has in their "Statement of Faith." - even the ones that the same "the church leaders" cannot prove scripturally.

Having seen that, and recognizing that there are so many churches that effectively censor certain scriptures that cast doubt on their doctrines, communing with God and His Son does not require membership in a social organization that actually works against scriptural study.

 

[amigo de christo]

Most of my life I attended church meetings regularly. For then it was seemingly a necessary thing for me. In November of 2018, the human powers that be put out our 93-year-old pastor. We went out with him. For a long time then I was visiting the various church services in our town hoping God would show me a new place to call "home". I was still visiting and looking in 2020 when most of them stopped having physical services. I never got into what they called "virtual services".

By the time most of the doors had reopened I had begun my fight with cancer so I did not resume my visits. I had weekly Bible studies with my old pastor in his trailer. This stopped not long before his death in November of 2022. In early 2023 we. moved into our daughter's home where we are now. None of my family regularly attends any services although they sometime watch their "home church" using a computer link. Until I am able to drive again [will that ever happen?], I remain at home and spend most of my time in my little study reading my Bible and other books or checking this forum.

Onward in the Lord my friend . we shall keep up with our bible reading , prayers and learn and continue to grow in the Lord .
Many churches , though not all , have been taken over with a judge not which has allowed leaven to creep up
and engulf them . Till now they follow a love of the world which has turned them
against GOD , Christ and the true saints . Their love even has them to consider
parts of the bible as in error , and even hate speech . Its turned them against GOD
who spoke and inspired every word which was meant to be for their own good .
Every , and i do mean every Word of GOD is truth from the most dire warning and all
IT is meant for our good that do we take heed unto it .
WHY does GOD warn , WHY did CHRIST warn and correct , why did the apostels behold both the SEVERITY
and the goodness of GOD , cause it works to our own good .
GOD desires the death of none , He has always warned , sent others to warn
men to repent , BEFORE HE does destroy .
The problem is , today most wont heed the warnings about sin , or to repent
rather through a false version of the goodness of God , what they THINK is the love of GOD
they simply see that as archaic old stuff , no longer applying to us
and even hate speech . This will not bode well upon the unrepentant .
But even if the worst of the worst do repent , GOD is FULLL of mercy and compassion and would forgive them .
ONLY MOST WONT and only get worse and harder and harder against the truth .

 

[amigo de christo]

New topic. Link below.

Is the Good News actual news? - No longer news to most

/

More and more no longer even truly believe it .
They dont even believe one needs to beleive anymore .
They embrace the concept that even all other religoins serve the same God we do
and that they have no need to repent of the false religoin and to beleive JESUS is the CHRIST .
Just hold up your diverse and strange love flag and do some good works and all is well .
What a lie . what a whopper of all whoppers that is my friend .
And I KNOW who first began it and from whence this came and it was NOT OF GOD my friend .
Just a love the world could embrace is all this is to unify the religoins
to find common ground to merge as one under what they all think is GOD . ONLY , WELL IT AINT .

 

[amadeus]

Onward in the Lord my friend . we shall keep up with our bible reading , prayers and learn and continue to grow in the Lord .
Many churches , though not all , have been taken over with a judge not which has allowed leaven to creep up
and engulf them . Till now they follow a love of the world which has turned them
against GOD , Christ and the true saints . Their love even has them to consider
parts of the bible as in error , and even hate speech . Its turned them against GOD
who spoke and inspired every word which was meant to be for their own good .
Every , and i do mean every Word of GOD is truth from the most dire warning and all
IT is meant for our good that do we take heed unto it .
WHY does GOD warn , WHY did CHRIST warn and correct , why did the apostels behold both the SEVERITY
and the goodness of GOD , cause it works to our own good .
GOD desires the death of none , He has always warned , sent others to warn
men to repent , BEFORE HE does destroy .
The problem is , today most wont heed the warnings about sin , or to repent
rather through a false version of the goodness of God , what they THINK is the love of GOD
they simply see that as archaic old stuff , no longer applying to us
and even hate speech . This will not bode well upon the unrepentant .
But even if the worst of the worst do repent , GOD is FULLL of mercy and compassion and would forgive them .
ONLY MOST WONT and only get worse and harder and harder against the truth .

Thank you for your kind and truthful response my friend. I do miss the good Way that was in at least in a small measure found in many local church services. They have changed so often for the worse. The many 'hole in the wall' churches that were to be found everywhere are for the most part not even there anymore. I could go into one and easily talk to the handful of people and even the pastor about the things of God that were on my heart without needing an appointment... or I was able to stand and testify... or sometimes even to teach or preach without showing first my credentials according to their criteria.

I spend most of my days now alone in my study with no visits or calls from the many brothers I once knew during my days in churches. Of course, many of them have gone on to their final destinations... but not all of them. I do not blame them for I understand remembering when I could have visited those in need but did not.

Help us all dear Lord!

 

[amigo de christo]

Thank you for your kind and truthful response my friend. I do miss the good Way that was in at least in a small measure found in many local church services. They have changed so often for the worse. The many 'hole in the wall' churches that were to be found everywhere are for the most part not even there anymore. I could go into one and easily talk to the handful of people and even the pastor about the things of God that were on my heart without needing an appointment... or I was able to stand and testify... or sometimes even to teach or preach without showing first my credentials according to their criteria.

I spend most of my days now alone in my study with no visits or calls from the many brothers I once knew during my days in churches. Of course, many of them have gone on to their final destinations... but not all of them. I do not blame them for I understand remembering when I could have visited those in need but did not.

Help us all dear Lord!

An agenda that has come to transform from within has long been at work .
And this agenda and those taken into its false love
are darn determined to make sure certain parts of that BIBLE will NEVER be mentioned in their church EVER .
SINS are protected now . and even accepted now . but truth , NOT SO MUCH .
Its getting worse all the time my friend . All the time .
IF one is not an inclusivian , ONE WILL NOT SPEAK , be allowed to speak or even tolerated within the church .
The golden bull is UNITY and this UNITY cares not for the TRUTH , just for agreement and fellowship .
Its not looking good my friend .

 

[amadeus]

An agenda that has come to transform from within has long been at work .
And this agenda and those taken into its false love
are darn determined to make sure certain parts of that BIBLE will NEVER be mentioned in their church EVER .
SINS are protected now . and even accepted now . but truth , NOT SO MUCH .
Its getting worse all the time my friend . All the time .
IF one is not an inclusivian , ONE WILL NOT SPEAK , be allowed to speak or even tolerated within the church .
The golden bull is UNITY and this UNITY cares not for the TRUTH , just for agreement and fellowship .
Its not looking good my friend .

Well keep on working my friend, as God directs and leads you, even when most everyone around is against you remembering always...

Ro 8:31

What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

And also...

Lu 9:50

And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.

 

[amigo de christo]

Thank you for your kind and truthful response my friend. I do miss the good Way that was in at least in a small measure found in many local church services. They have changed so often for the worse. The many 'hole in the wall' churches that were to be found everywhere are for the most part not even there anymore. I could go into one and easily talk to the handful of people and even the pastor about the things of God that were on my heart without needing an appointment... or I was able to stand and testify... or sometimes even to teach or preach without showing first my credentials according to their criteria.

I spend most of my days now alone in my study with no visits or calls from the many brothers I once knew during my days in churches. Of course, many of them have gone on to their final destinations... but not all of them. I do not blame them for I understand remembering when I could have visited those in need but did not.

Help us all dear Lord!

the prophets of baal have cried unto the masses and the peoples have loved to have it so my friend .
March on my friend . You are not alone . The LORD is with the lambs my friend .
This love they preach is a man pleaser and as such
it has created the most narccist peoples who actually THINK they humble and loving .
And man they can be appear to be the most loving and caring
TILL their sin be exposed then its teeth .
ya best life now destroyed the churches . no one really gives a rip about anyone
or GOD . at most its a show. They might send a check or two to some ministry
but there is no real love in their hearts at all . its all about ME ME ME and what can i get in this short life
from the world . The very love they thought was coming from GOD
was a love that feeds the flesh my friend . The unholy god of the mirror has become the god of many
and if you dare expose their error , all ya heard is JUDGE NOT you bigot
and worse the judge not has led to a mind so hard against the truth that do expose their error
that they will cast out anything , parts of the bible , call it hate speech ,etc . ITS LEADING them
to a total and all out hate agaisnt GOD , CHRIST and the saints . ONLY THEY THINK its leading them to
world peace n safety .

 

[amigo de christo]

Well keep on working my friend, as God directs and leads you, even when most everyone around is against you remembering always...

Ro 8:31

What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?

And also...

Lu 9:50

And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.

notice luke nine fifty , then notice a verse or two above it .
The man was casting out demons IN JESUS NAME . HE was a believer . a convert .
As i am sure there were converts in said places and said towns JESUS had visited .
YET they did not all leave their certain towns .
BUT THEY prophesied of JESUS within their towns .
WHY do i say this .
because i seen a monster lie of the dragon and its men
who try and use that verse to say muslims and others who do good and etc
KNOW GOD and not to judge them . That be a LIE my friend . they twisting things , they twisting things .

 

[amadeus]

notice luke nine fifty , then notice a verse or two above it .
The man was casting out demons IN JESUS NAME . HE was a believer . a convert .
As i am sure there were converts in said places and said towns JESUS had visited .
YET they did not all leave their certain towns .
BUT THEY prophesied of JESUS within their towns .
WHY do i say this .
because i seen a monster lie of the dragon and its men
who try and use that verse to say muslims and others who do good and etc
KNOW GOD and not to judge them . That be a LIE my friend . they twisting things , they twisting things .

Yes, all of the true believers may not be within out particular little camp [assembly, church, denomination], but some are out there and when we meet them then it is by their fruits that we may know them.

 

[Aunty Jane]

While it may be rare for some to see, there are those who have left a church because "the church leaders" require those who want to serve God must first believe all of the doctrines that the church has in their "Statement of Faith." - even the ones that the same "the church leaders" cannot prove scripturally.

And isn’t this why the Boereans were commended because they made sure that what Paul was teaching was in accord with their Scriptures. They were not influenced by the Jews who tried to dissuade them.

Having seen that, and recognizing that there are so many churches that effectively censor certain scriptures that cast doubt on their doctrines, communing with God and His Son does not require membership in a social organization that actually works against scriptural study.

Wasn’t original Christianity an organised group? Did they not meet together for Bible instruction and worship, as well as fellowship? Did these not commune with God and through his son work as a unified collective?

I heard someone once put it this way....
How do you hide a 50 ft tree out in the middle of a cleared field? And the answer is you can’t......but if you have time up your sleeve, you can plant a whole forest of trees of the same kind all around it, and allow them to grow....eventually it will be extremely difficult to identify the original tree.
This is what the devil has done......and he has been extremely successful in hiding the original “tree” with a forest of counterfeits. Jesus told us to expect it.....in his parable of the “wheat” and the “weeds”.

There was a central governing body in Jerusalem who determined the outcome of any serious divisions that were occurring, such as the circumcision issue, and once a decision was made under the authority of the Holy Spirit, all then complied with that decision. Letters were written to the congregations and 1 Cor 1:10 was their reality.
Thinking that we can be ‘lone rangers’ somehow setting our chosen beliefs as our own religion, can be a trap. If no one else shares what we believe then Heb 10:24-25 is meaningless. We are to meet regularly with our brothers and sister in the faith and “all the more so” as we see the “day” of judgment approaching......this is the time when we need each other the most....a time when disunity hinders any real spiritual growth. Christianity is not claiming disunity to be the one thing that unites the collective.

A separation is under way as we speak.....those who have the right heart condition will not be among the disunited rabble who claim to be “the body of Christ”.......because it is a dismembered body that has bits of Jesus all over the place. (Matt 7:21-23)
Those whom Jesus recognises as his own will be viewed in the same “way” as what he started....a hated and persecuted minority, (John 15:18-21; Matt 5:11-12) who are seen as a threat to true worship....yet the opposers are oblivious to the fact that they have never practiced it themselves.

Christendom is a mirror image of first century Judaism....blinded by their own inculcated hatred for any deviation from their accepted doctrines.....blind to where those doctrines originated in the first place.

None of us can come to Christ without an invitation from his Father. (John 6:65)

 

[PS95]

None of us can come to Christ without an invitation from his Father. (John 6:65)

True. Have you received that invitation, Auntie Jane?

Do you belong to Jesus?

Are you a member of the body of Christ?

Are you in the New Covenant?

Is Jesus your only mediator?

Born anew of the Spirit, crying out Abba, Father?

a branch of the true vine?

An annointed child of God?

These are all simple yes or no questions. Either you are or aren't. No further info is requested. I'm just curious.