Imputation is based on the Old Testament

[Wrangler]

Seeing you have yourself reached the pinnacle of all understanding

Give the option to respond as Christ would or not, you always seem to pick the unlike Christ way, the way lacking humility and engage in personal attack.

I never said anything like what you claim, of reaching the pinnacle of all understanding. It's not that I understand everything but I understand hypocrisy and double standards.

I wish I failed to understand your arrogance but your reply confirms both. Can't you express yourself without putting yourself as a step above the rest of us? That'd go a long way brother.


Now I want you to know that Christ is the head of all men (except the Episkopos's of the world, and Episkopos's of the world are the head of all men), and a man is the head of a woman. But God is the head of Christ.
1 Corinthians 11:3 (CEV) (Emphasis Added)

 

[Episkopos]

Give the option to respond as Christ would or not, you always seem to pick the unlike Christ way, the way lacking humility and engage in personal attack.

I never said anything like what you claim, of reaching the pinnacle of all understanding. It's not that I understand everything but I understand hypocrisy and double standards.

I wish I failed to understand your arrogance but your reply confirms both. Can't you express yourself without putting yourself as a step above the rest of us? That'd go a long way brother.


Now I want you to know that Christ is the head of all men (except the Episkopos's of the world, and Episkopos's of the world are the head of all men), and a man is the head of a woman. But God is the head of Christ.
1 Corinthians 11:3 (CEV) (Emphasis Added)

Too funny bro! :) Your ego just hates the idea of being a step below (or behind). You are simply expressing the threat you feel as it appears real to you. You judge from your ego. I don't care who is ahead of whom? I am a learner and I pick up on things to further my understanding. But I am in the minority here. Most here seem to just want to be ego stroked for what they have received by rote from religious institutions. ANYTHING can beat that. Hence the threat you perceive coming from me...a student of God and the bible.

I'm speaking to you the only way I can...with some light-hearted comments about your religious inclinations. I take the subject seriously. But not myself. You are taking yourself too seriously...and the subject...well you aren't addressing the subject....you just assume I'm talking down to your ego.

How can you read the bible with that kind of attitude?

i don't get how so many here can ignore most of the bible.

PS. Doesn't you tag line at the bottom of your page contravene the forum policy?

No wonder you are unable to understand spiritual things. You limit Jesus to being merely human. So then I can't converse with you about deeper things.

BTW...it's Hear O Israel, the Lord your God (AND) the Lord ARE One (Echad)

Do a study on what echad means and how it is used in the bible.

 

[Wrangler]

I think too often I will say things that I put a LOT of time and seeking into....but without that same depth of seeking and prayer...it just bounces off people...it doesn't sink in.

That's because you are not practicing being all things to all people. But are putting undue burden on them: (1) jettison mysticism; (2) jettison reliance on ancient foreign languages. Then you will observe greater connections with God's children.

"It" is mysticism, which I pray will always bounce off me and the rest of God's children and not sink in.

The other day I demonstrated a point by referencing when my 2yo granddaughter took the empty bottle out of her mouth and uttered, "MORE." Surely, we do not have to go to a foreign language and do a study on variants to properly respond to this image bearer of God.

For instance there is the "earnest" of the Spirit...the "aravon". The root (It's a Hebrew word) of aravon is aravah...which means "desert".

Do a study on "aravon" and "aravah"

There is no way I am going to do a study on foreign language! (You can communicate in English. See below.)

I'm quite sure the 2 yo granddaughter was earnest in her utterance - without relying on an analysis of ancient foreign languages.

We are born again INTO THE DESERT walk....Read Exodus.

We were never born in Old Covenant. Surely, you are speaking metaphorically.

Beyond that, you actually believe people are born again, not into Christ but a desert? Unbelievable. Just unbelievable.

 

[Wrangler]

Your ego just hates the idea of being a step below (or behind).

Wrong. One of the best things about being saved is knowing there is no steps I can take to be loved by God. This is because I am already loved by God.

The full armor of God is on me and your flaming arrows are to no effect.

You are simply expressing the threat you feel as it appears real to you.

Only the threat of letting repetitious falsehoods go unchallenged, giving the false appearance they could be valid. This is why shutting down political opposition speech is so important to the power-seeking.

You judge from your ego.

And how do you judge?

 

[Wrangler]

I'm speaking to you the only way I can

A rare glimpse of humility.

Still, I challenge you to speak in non-mystical terms, jettisoning appeals to special knowledge.

 

[Wrangler]

well you aren't addressing the subject....you just assume I'm talking down to your ego.

There is no assumption sir. I know your comments were not directed to me. Still, those comments reveal so much.

Regarding not addressing the subject; just yesterday on Moody Radio, at noon, the preacher preached about the importance of knowing where your wisdom comes from. In this way, I am addressing the subject - just not in the way you'd prefer.

 

[Wrangler]

How can you read the bible with that kind of attitude?

What a God complex you have! Your words are not the words of God.

 

[Wrangler]

i don't get how so many here can ignore most of the bible.

I'm not ignoring ANY part of the Bible. I'm just rejecting mysticism applied to it.

 

[Wrangler]

BTW...it's Hear O Israel, the Lord your God (AND) the Lord ARE One (Echad)

Do a study on what echad means and how it is used in the bible.

I've done plenty of study on the definitive statement of God's monotheistic nature, that you are hoping to re-purpose. But we both know you are desperately shooting all your arrows in any direction to divert attention from the lack of humility you express with disturbing regularity.

 

[Wrangler]

So then I can't converse with you about deeper things.

The answer is profoundly simple (of how you can converse with me about deeper things). Be humble.

I read an article that humility is the most Christ-like characteristic. It is a fascinating article. 5 Key Characteristics of Walking with Christ: Humility - KevinCarson.com

Not to hijack the thread. The subject of imputed righteousness is a good one - provided it steers clear of mystically obtained special knowledge and the glofifying of your own ego. It gets in the way.

 

[Episkopos]

That's because you are not practicing being all things to all people. But are putting undue burden on them: (1) jettison mysticism; (2) jettison reliance on ancient foreign languages. Then you will observe greater connections with God's children.

FYI The bible was written in what you call "foreign" languages. They are only foreign to you because you have not taken the time and effort to know God's word properly.

I get that most Americans have never considered that other languages are not foreign to other people. As in..they have a word for THAT in another language? ;) It may come as a shock.

Do I not write legibly in English? What about my spelling? Can I spell neighbour the Canadian way?

And what you call mysticism is what the bible is about...resurrection life IN Christ.... walking on the spiritual plane in a kingdom of heaven realm. You must think Paul was NOT everything to all men since he uses so much "Christianese? that you are not comprehending.

My words are down to earth and practical...but I can't take away the meaning of spiritual things to make them non-spiritual. Then I would just be beating the air like so many posters here.

"It" is mysticism, which I pray will always bounce off me and the rest of God's children and not sink in.

If you only knew where that thought came from

Jesus said...you take away the key of knowledge of the kingdom and you do not enter in yourselves (paraphrased)

This is serious stuff here. Spiritual life is the kind of life that Jesus' followers are led into.

The other day I demonstrated a point by referencing when my 2yo granddaughter took the empty bottle out of her mouth and uttered, "MORE." Surely, we do not have to go to a foreign language and do a study on variants to properly respond to this image bearer of God.

Hebrew is not foreign. Greek is not foreign. These are human languages spoken by humans. And you need to go beyond a child-like understanding in wisdom. We are not to be as children in THAT way. Just concerning evil.

There is no way I am going to do a study on foreign language! (You can communicate in English. See below.)

I'm quite sure the 2 yo granddaughter was earnest in her utterance - without relying on an analysis of ancient foreign languages.


We were never born in Old Covenant. Surely, you are speaking metaphorically.

Beyond that, you actually believe people are born again, not into Christ but a desert? Unbelievable. Just unbelievable.

Again. What is with the reading skills here? No wonder the message of the bible is a mystery to most here.

Did I say that we are born again into a desert? Or did I say that we are born again into a desert WALK. Do you realize that when Jesus was baptized He went into the desert right away? Do you realize that the Israelites were saved from Egypt INTO a wilderness walk?

Please don't say that's too mystical.

 

[Episkopos]

I've done plenty of study on the definitive statement of God's monotheistic nature, that you are hoping to re-purpose. But we both know you are desperately shooting all your arrows in any direction to divert attention from the lack of humility you express with disturbing regularity.

I'm expressing what everyone else here is expressing....words that come from God. Bible verses come from God. And He is greater than you...so maybe you feel intimidated? There is authority in the word and the testimony of the word.

My point is to bring light...yes, to teach what I've learned. I have to. Keeping back the light only allows the darkness to prevail. If you think that is my ego...then you are simply not understanding what believers do...they testify to what they have experienced with God.

That's what I do. And non-believers can handle this a LOT better than "believers" Why? The ego has nothing to lose in non-believers.

Instead of trying to cross-examine me and my motives...listen to what I'm saying. Don't let your ego get in a religious snit. ;)

 

[Episkopos]

The answer is profoundly simple (of how you can converse with me about deeper things). Be humble.

I read an article that humility is the most Christ-like characteristic. It is a fascinating article. 5 Key Characteristics of Walking with Christ: Humility - KevinCarson.com

Not to hijack the thread. The subject of imputed righteousness is a good one - provided it steers clear of mystically obtained special knowledge and the glofifying of your own ego. It gets in the way.

I think you are evaluating human opinion...as humble as it may seem...to be on a par with the revelation of God.

Again, if I didn't know anything besides what I read and formulated in my own mind...then I could appear as humble to you...but I am speaking of what I know and experienced.

if you don't appreciate that...fine...just stop following me around to harass me. That's the ego trip YOU are on..not me.

If you want to discuss spiritual things...stop making this personal. You DON'T have the right kind of discernment here. You can't judge where what I say is coming from in me. Only if YOU said those things would it be ego...since you haven't experienced the higher walk.

So FOR YOU...it's ego. For me, it's testimony.

 

[Wrangler]

And He is greater than you...so maybe you feel intimidated?

Your passive-aggresiveness is noted.

You can speulate all you want on how I maybe feel. Clearly, you deny your ego is in play here. There is only the speck in my eye. Gotha!

Carry on, wayward son.

 

[Wrangler]

I think you are evaluating human opinion...as humble as it may seem...to be on a par with the revelation of God .... what I know and experienced.

There it is! The God Complex.

Make a Blessed Day

 

[Episkopos]

Your passive-aggresiveness is noted.

You can speulate all you want on how I maybe feel. Clearly, you deny your ego is in play here. There is only the speck in my eye. Gotha!

Carry on, wayward son.

A speck? Oh my...I'm trying to deal with your ignorance here. You are ignorant on many levels....as you wish for us to know, and me in particular. Why? I don't get your motivation..knocking me down? Making my words less true? It's a silly notion.

If you throw garbage at me...I will identify it by its smell. No need of ego for that...just a little discernment. ;)

But I am clearly not the person to help you. I think you are satisfied with your level of (non-) growth...since you have convinced yourself you know as much as you need to. Now, if you could be honest with yourself.

Why be satisfied with so much ignorance?

I don't get it. Why not want to study the words of Jesus AS HE SAID THEM. Why not desire the pure words of God as written originally in the language that God chose to convey them in????

God's words should never be seen as foreign...unless the originator of those words is also seen as foreign.

 

[Episkopos]

There it is! The God Complex.

Make a Blessed Day

See! because I say that I'm speaking of what I know...you call that a God complex. But that is your ignorance of God's way with people talking.

You shouldn't trust ANYONE that speaks for God then. You should throw out your bible since it was written by men.

And predictably right here you will think I'm comparing myself to the bible writers (as if they were not in fact human)...because the ego does that. It compares others with its own carnal proclivities.

But I'm speaking above ego...or should I say...below ego. But your own ego fog makes it impossible to see that.

If I was to pretend to be ignorant...to be accepted by carnal religious people...then I would be lying...and not trying to help as I would want to be helped if I was ignorant of God's ways.

I would look for consistency...and see if it worked on more than one level...and IGNORE who was talking to me. It's not about matching egos...it's about spiritual understanding...an understanding that is very hard to grasp. People need to help each other to get there.

 

[Wrangler]

A speck?

Here it comes ...

Oh my...I'm trying to deal with your ignorance here.

There it goes.

You are ignorant on many levels

Correct. I rationally ignore as much nonsense as I can. But you don't make it easy.

Listen friend, I too have had experiences with God. They leave me humbled beyond words. You have embraced a God complex.

When I mentioned the speck, that was a perfect opportunity to turn inward, at the plank in your own eyes. But anyone reading this can see humility and common understanding is not where you are with your "deeper things."

I watched a movie the other day about CS Lewis. To paraphrase something he said a mystic will look at a slum and says there is divine even here. A christian says nonsense. The meaning is not that God it not omnipresent but that we ought to aspire to the heights (not depths).

 

[Wrangler]

They are only foreign to you because you have not taken the time and effort to know God's word properly.

Says you.

The idea that Christians have a burden to study foreign languages is nonsense and nowhere in the Bible.

And what you call mysticism is what the bible is about

Obviously, we will have to agree to disagree about the very basics of our shared faith.

Hebrew is not foreign. Greek is not foreign.

<sigh> You are lost.

Did I say that we are born again into a desert? Or did I say that we are born again into a desert WALK.

Yes. Yes you did say that we are born again into a desert. The type of desert was a walk. Evidently, you are doubling down on the indefensible.

The phrase unsearchable riches of Christ comes from Ephesians 3:8–9. It says nothing about the desert, the desert walk. Unsearchable Riches. Desert. The exact opposite of the word of God. THE EXACT OPPOSITE.

 

[Episkopos]

Here it comes ...



There it goes.



Correct. I rationally ignore as much nonsense as I can. But you don't make it easy.

Exactly? That's how I feel about your intrusions here. That's why I try to stick mostly to my own threads. I find the premise of so much religious thinking is erroneous from its inception.

I am close to putting you on ignore...as you have abee in your bonnet...and have not once written anything concerning the OP. You must think what you have to say is very important.

Listen friend, I too have had experiences with God. They leave me humbled beyond words. You have embraced a God complex.

That is called...false humility. Anybody can say..."I too am great but it humbles me"...It takes very little discernment to hear the ego in what you are trying to "show" us. To try to appear as humble is the WORST lack of humility possible.

A poster the other day said..."I don't post a video of me playing because I'm not into self-worship"...or something like that. That assumes that he is MORE humble than people who do post songs, because he doesn't. Maybe his playing would take away from his ego when he realized he wasn't up to snuff.

These little ego games aside...do you realize this is a thread that has a spiritual topic?

When I mentioned the speck, that was a perfect opportunity to turn inward, at the plank in your own eyes. But anyone reading this can see humility and common understanding is not where you are with your "deeper things."

Why can't you see the plank you are swinging here on the thread? You are trying to injure my credibility...with a speck? No one uses a speck to swing at an opponent.

I watched a movie the other day about CS Lewis. To paraphrase something he said a mystic will look at a slum and says there is divine even here. A christian says nonsense. The meaning is not that God it not omnipresent but that we ought to aspire to the heights (not depths).

Does this mean you are not against the mystic, or that you really liked the movie?