Homosexuality: Is it the way a person is born?

[LightMessenger]

The Holy Spirit speaking through them was divine.

Yes of course. But they were not Divine. They were mere mortals.

 

[ATP]

Yes of course. But they were not Divine. They were mere mortals.

What part of "the Holy spirit speaking through them" is not clear to you.

 

[StanJ]

I asked the same question of you, StanJ, are YOU Gay? Why do you like posting in the Gay threads so much? And you too need to stop deflecting.

I am looking to Jesus for the answers rather than to His Apostles, Saints, followers, etc. who were mere men and not Divine. What you perceive to be ".... false assertions based on ignorance of the texts, ..." is not ignorance. I have stated my case well and it is you who cannot justify that Jesus' Words of love and compassion override those of men with their intolerant attitudes because it would completely destroy your case of prejudice against the LGBT community. Enough said.

And why do you attack the LGBT community instead of your own shortcomings, StanJ? It's time you spoke about that instead of about people you do not even know or care to fully understand but wish to indict as a whole. That's quite hypocritical.

See post 338 and 333...I'm not going to continually state the same things and repeat myself ad infinitum.

 

[LightMessenger]

What part of "the Holy spirit speaking through them" is not clear to you.

What part of "Did they fully OBEY the Holy Spirit" is not clear to you?

 

[pom2014]

Light I don't know why you're stifling so much on this.

Nowhere in scripture does God provide for marriage of the same genders.

If homosexuals cannot marry they cannot engage in sex with each other without it being a sin.

The sexually active homosexual cannot enter The Kingdom. Only the abstaining one can.

 

[LightMessenger]

Light I don't know why you're stifling so much on this.

Nowhere in scripture does God provide for marriage of the same genders.

If homosexuals cannot marry they cannot engage in sex with each other without it being a sin.

The sexually active homosexual cannot enter The Kingdom. Only the abstaining one can.

Please go and tell that to your Heterosexual counterparts first, many of whom regularly engage in sex whether premarital or just to make them feel good with never an intention or thought of getting married. They are the ones who really need to hear about that since there are millions if not Billions more Straights around the world who are sinners likewise.

As to homosexuals who cannot marry, that may all soon change in the 50 states after a favorable SCOTUS ruling let's not forget. May God guide the conservative Supreme Court to bring equality to this issue for those whose rights have been so suppressed and marginalized.
THE CHURCH, THE BLACK COMMUNITY AND HOMOSEXUALITY
By Keith Boykin

http://www.thenewblackmagazine.com/view.aspx?index=1092

"But Tutu didn't stop there. He also rebuked religious conservatives who claim that homosexuality is a choice. Although some evangelicals argue that homosexuality is a perversion, Tutu turned the language on them and argued that homophobia is a perversion. "It is a perversion if you say to me that a person chooses to be homosexual. You must be crazy to choose a way of life that exposes you to a kind of hatred. It's like saying you choose to be black in a race-infected society."
**************************************************************************************************
Nobel Peace Prize Winner Archbishop Tutu has nailed this one most correctly. He obviously knows and realizes that no person would willfully choose to be berated, scorned, hated, kicked and beaten, and even killed for who they are. He knows people are born with their sexual orientation, be it Gay or Straight, no matter what the right-wing bigots wish to say to the contrary in an excoriating manner which is typical for them.

KUDOS to the Archbishop! We thank the New Black Magazine for this fine article.

 

[ATP]

Light I don't know why you're stifling so much on this.

Nowhere in scripture does God provide for marriage of the same genders.

If homosexuals cannot marry they cannot engage in sex with each other without it being a sin.

The sexually active homosexual cannot enter The Kingdom. Only the abstaining one can.

I think it's time we move on, what do you think.

Rom 1:26-28 ESV For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error. And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.

 

[KingJ]

What part of "Did they fully OBEY the Holy Spirit" is not clear to you?

Did any of them continue in a sin that per the OT warranted a death penalty?

Did Paul continue murdering? Did Mary continue as a prostitute? You are reaching far for a straw.

Please go and tell that to your Heterosexual counterparts first, many of whom regularly engage in sex whether premarital or just to make them feel good with never an intention or thought of getting married. They are the ones who really need to hear about that since there are millions if not Billions more Straights around the world who are sinners likewise.

As to homosexuals who cannot marry, that may all soon change in the 50 states after a favorable SCOTUS ruling let's not forget. May God guide the conservative Supreme Court to bring equality to this issue for those whose rights have been so suppressed and marginalized.

THE CHURCH, THE BLACK COMMUNITY AND HOMOSEXUALITY
By Keith Boykin

http://www.thenewblackmagazine.com/view.aspx?index=1092

KUDOS to the Archbishop! We thank the New Black Magazine for this fine article.

DON'T shoot little animals!!! it is sick. How dare those who shoot animals judge those who shoot children!! But don't worry, soon shooting children will be legal. Then we will have eqaulity of rights :lol:. Thanks for sharing the joke LM. Shouldn't this be in the humour section???

 

[pom2014]

Please go and tell that to your Heterosexual counterparts first, many of whom regularly engage in sex whether premarital or just to make them feel good with never an intention or thought of getting married. They are the ones who really need to hear about that since there are millions if not Billions more Straights around the world who are sinners likewise.

As to homosexuals who cannot marry, that may all soon change in the 50 states after a favorable SCOTUS ruling let's not forget. May God guide the conservative Supreme Court to bring equality to this issue for those whose rights have been so suppressed and marginalized.

THE CHURCH, THE BLACK COMMUNITY AND HOMOSEXUALITY
By Keith Boykin

http://www.thenewblackmagazine.com/view.aspx?index=1092

KUDOS to the Archbishop! We thank the New Black Magazine for this fine article.

I constantly warn the straights about their sexual habits including the unholy remarriage they enter into and try to justify with scripture, much like you try to with gays.

And does God care or acknowledge the states gay marriage? No. Just as he doesn't the second, third, forth, fifth and more marriages of straights when their spouses are still alive.

You know what he sees in both cases, straight and gay? He sees sinners. Sinners that need to repent and do that sin no more.

He grieves for them all, because he knows that rebellion to the crown is death.

 

[LightMessenger]

Did any of them continue in a sin that per the OT warranted a death penalty?

Did Paul continue murdering? Did Mary continue as a prostitute? You are reaching far for a straw.


DON'T shoot little animals!!! it is sick. How dare those who shoot animals judge those who shoot children!! But don't worry, soon shooting children will be legal. Then we will have eqaulity of rights :lol:. Thanks for sharing the joke LM. Shouldn't this be in the humour section???

You are a very warped individual with a sick sense of humor. I will pray for you.

 

[KingJ]

Thanks LM!

I will also pray for you ok. It must be hard being so blind and clueless on the purpose and natural use of your God given body parts.

 

[LightMessenger]

Thanks LM!

I will also pray for you ok. It must be hard being so blind and clueless on the purpose and natural use of your God given body parts.

Prayers going out to you now, KingJ, as your hate and criticism has blinded you to the love that Jesus expects from you.

You should really see the following video from Dr. John Corvino who is a professor at Wayne State University and Chairman of the Philosophy Department. When he speaks he commands a big audience and his points are all very well taken.

"What's Morally Wrong With Homosexuality"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?annotation_id=annotation_728558&feature=iv&src_vid=SutThIFi24w&v=5iXA_0MED98

 

[pom2014]

Nothing is morally wrong with being a homosexual.

But it it's wrong to act on it. Same with heterosexuals and sex outside of marriage.

 

[LightMessenger]

Nothing is morally wrong with being a homosexual.

But it it's wrong to act on it. Same with heterosexuals and sex outside of marriage.

Well then, pom, how do you reconcile the fact that all human beings are sexual in nature and really have to act on those feelings in one way or another? On the one hand, you have the religious teachings that forbid that but on the other hand you have the basic (and very pressing) biological human need of both sexual orientations. Is it fair to ask each and every person in the world to suppress their feelings to want to make love to another person knowing that since those needs can strike at any moment and in fact, many times a day for most people, they are obviously not going to marry the person they want to have intimacy with most likely. How do they just suppress those innate feelings?

And of course, self-gratification would still fall under Biblical rules prohibiting even that practice however, the fact of the matter is that they did not take into account the fact that it is virtually impossible to comply simply because humans are not constructed in such a manner, such as robots, that they could totally abstain all of their life from having sex especially when they have absolutely no desire or intention of getting married as millions across the world have. And if anyone was to say that they can simply pray about it and the feelings of sex would subside, perhaps they would, for a moment or a little while but only to resurface perhaps even stronger than before which would leave them right where they began. I seriously doubt there is anyone who has never had sex in their life or who has had it only with the person they married. They need to be completely honest and forthright about that as God already knows their whole story full well and while they could lie to you and to me about it and try to fool us by saying they have abstained all of their life, they cannot lie to or fool God who knows them better than they know themselves.

 

[StanJ]

Well then, pom, how do you reconcile the fact that all human beings are sexual in nature and really have to act on those feelings in one way or another? On the one hand, you have the religious teachings that forbid that but on the other hand you have the basic (and very pressing) biological human need of both sexual orientations. Is it fair to ask each and every person in the world to suppress their feelings to want to make love to another person knowing that since those needs can strike at any moment and in fact, many times a day for most people, they are obviously not going to marry the person they want to have intimacy with most likely. How do they just suppress those innate feelings?

And of course, self-gratification would still fall under Biblical rules prohibiting even that practice however, the fact of the matter is that they did not take into account the fact that it is virtually impossible to comply simply because humans are not constructed in such a manner, such as robots, that they could totally abstain all of their life from having sex especially when they have absolutely no desire or intention of getting married as millions across the world have. And if anyone was to say that they can simply pray about it and the feelings of sex would subside, perhaps they would, for a moment or a little while but only to resurface perhaps even stronger than before which would leave them right where they began. I seriously doubt there is anyone who has never had sex in their life or who has had it only with the person they married. They need to be completely honest and forthright about that as God already knows their whole story full well and while they could lie to you and to me about it and try to fool us by saying they have abstained all of their life, they cannot lie to or fool God who knows them better than they know themselves.

Yes this is true LM, and Gen 2:18-24 explains the use of that. Notice it is for Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve.
As you understanding of biological need is skewed and flawed based on what the Bible DOES tell us you can't and don't have the right to tell anyone else how BIOLOGY works. Who said God's laws and creation is supposed to be FAIR according to your morality. God said it was GOOD, so what you say is against God and NOT relevant nor acceptable. Homosexuality is NOT innate, it is a choice and aberrant as the Bible tells us.

If your talking about masturbation, show us where the Bible teaches against it. Funny how you see what is NOT taught in scripture as wrong but what is taught against in scripture as right? The Bible tells us man can do what God commands. Nobody here is advocating that Christians actually live sin free lives, but we either choose to obey God and live according to His Word, or we don't. You apparently DON'T wish to live according to God's Word and I'm sure deep down you know God will eventually call you to give an accounting of yourself at which time you will fail miserably. The issue of the OP is justifying the homosexual lifestyle within the BOC, not justifying all sexual practice. None of us here have a problem with knowing what is right and wrong in that regard, only you.

 

[LightMessenger]

Yes this is true LM, and Gen 2:18-24 explains the use of that. Notice it is for Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve.
As you understanding of biological need is skewed and flawed based on what the Bible DOES tell us you can't and don't have the right to tell anyone else how BIOLOGY works. Who said God's laws and creation is supposed to be FAIR according to your morality. God said it was GOOD, so what you say is against God and NOT relevant nor acceptable. Homosexuality is NOT innate, it is a choice and aberrant as the Bible tells us.

If your talking about masturbation, show us where the Bible teaches against it. Funny how you see what is NOT taught in scripture as wrong but what is taught against in scripture as right? The Bible tells us man can do what God commands. Nobody here is advocating that Christians actually live sin free lives, but we either choose to obey God and live according to His Word, or we don't. You apparently DON'T wish to live according to God's Word and I'm sure deep down you know God will eventually call you to give an accounting of yourself at which time you will fail miserably. The issue of the OP is justifying the homosexual lifestyle within the BOC, not justifying all sexual practice. None of us here have a problem with knowing what is right and wrong in that regard, only you.

Your "explanation" is quite a pathetic attempt at correcting your own shortcomings I'm afraid. You see, both men and women, of both sexual orientations, have intense biological needs of that there can be no doubt, and I will most certainly repeat that again and from here on out because that is something they very much need to take care of whether they are Straight, Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, or Transgender. And to deny themselves that inherent right and gift is something few, if any, including clergy are able to fully comply with. And fyi, I very much know what is right and what is wrong. And what you are trying to pass off here is simply scorn, and intolerance since that is unfortunately the only things you know or ever reply with.

If one lives strictly according to God's Ten Commandments 100% of the time and are truly honest about it they will live a life few can ever live. But the problem is most don't since they are not perfect. And are you personally living strictly according to God's word as you like to tell others to do, StanJ? God knows the truth about that and you don't fool me either with what you write.

You need to read the following and view the video as God is not at all pleased with your "holier than thou" attitude.

Are Christians “Holier Than Thou”? They shouldn’t be!
from United Christian Broadcasters

http://321.revivalmedia.org/are-christians-holier-than-thou-they-shouldnt-be/

 

[StanJ]

There's only ONE proper, God created SEXUAL orientation LM, and if you actually knew God's word you would know that. Consequently as you obviously don't know or won't accept this truth, I will treat you like any other hostile person to God's truth.
You continue to deny the truth, and lie about your motivation under the guise of a Christian, which you most certainly don't demonstrate. The Bible tells us we know good from bad people by their works, so we know you are of the father of liars. We also know God's word, despite your attempts at prevarications and false piety. We know your father because he was ours before we were freed by Jesus.
What you continue to do is deflect and criticize the bretheren for believing and having faith in God's word, while proclaiming yourself the bearer of teaching that is FALSE!
What YOU need to do is actually READ God's word with understanding, repent from your wicked deeds, and get RIGHT with God. Only then will you have peace and live a Christ like life.

 

[pom2014]

Light just because your brain is wired to spread your genetic code over the lands doesn't mean you should.

This is why we are ethical animals, not merely animals.

We walk on two legs not on four.

You continued insistence on letting your genitals be free to do what they will shows me its an issue with remaining an old wineskin filled with old wine.

But you're part of a vast group of Christendom.
Old wine bibers very happy with their habit.

 

[LightMessenger]

There's only ONE proper, God created SEXUAL orientation LM, and if you actually knew God's word you would know that. Consequently as you obviously don't know or won't accept this truth, I will treat you like any other hostile person to God's truth.
You continue to deny the truth, and lie about your motivation under the guise of a Christian, which you most certainly don't demonstrate. The Bible tells us we know good from bad people by their works, so we know you are of the father of liars. We also know God's word, despite your attempts at prevarications and false piety. We know your father because he was ours before we were freed by Jesus.
What you continue to do is deflect and criticize the bretheren for believing and having faith in God's word, while proclaiming yourself the bearer of teaching that is FALSE!
What YOU need to do is actually READ God's word with understanding, repent from your wicked deeds, and get RIGHT with God. Only then will you have peace and live a Christ like life.

Today, as I read your words filled with vitriol against the truth, God gave unto me a passage from the Holy Bible that I heard Him say I should bring forth unto you and others who think as you do.

"Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake." -- MATTHEW 5:11 (KJV)​

 

[DogLady19]

"As to homosexuals who cannot marry, that may all soon change in the 50 states after a favorable SCOTUS ruling let's not forget. May God guide the conservative Supreme Court to bring equality to this issue for those whose rights have been so suppressed and marginalized."

Since when did God's laws change to conform to man-made laws???

And since every country has its own set of marital laws, we cannot assume that American marriage laws are in keeping with God's. That would imply that Christians in other countries where laws are different are sinning unless they obey US marital laws!

It is obvious that some are equating a state-issued marriage license with honoring God's definition of marriage, and I'm not so sure we can do that. The reason why a couple gets a marriage license is to form a gov't-recognized legal corporation called a "family" for tax and civil purposes. God's view of marriage is why people get a license, THEN get a minister to officiate the vows of fidelity. That is not a redundant act, ya know...

God presides over the real act of marriage, not the states.