Heresy within Christianity

[Paul Christensen]

Never mentioned evolution, apes are apes they will never evolve into anything else but another species of apes. A fis is a fish it can never be anything else but a fish millions of years wont change that

I know you didn't mention evolution, but I just wanted to post my thoughts as they came, knowing that I am probably preaching to the choir. But there will be many "silent" ones reading these posts, and I wanted to add my thoughts to the mix without making it appear that I am arguing against anyone in particular.

 

[Enoch111]

Do you have teh photographs ???

Did you want a photograph of Noah's ark?

 

[mjrhealth]

@Enoch111 What has that to do with white men?? you are now making up stories to fill in a gap you know nothing of... And I know of that have wathced teh videos,

 

[mjrhealth]

I know you didn't mention evolution, but I just wanted to post my thoughts as they came, knowing that I am probably preaching to the choir. But there will be many "silent" ones reading these posts, and I wanted to add my thoughts to the mix without making it appear that I am arguing against anyone in particular.

Ye you like me, many read and never post. good thinking,

God bless

 

[Yehren]

You think you're perfect? What makes you think that a perfect God can't make imperfect things?

Because God is love,

So is your argument that God doesn't make us, or that we are perfect?

 

[Yehren]

It is not that evolution itself is to blame, but it is the way people have used evolution to view non-white people as being of an inferior race lower down on the evolutionary scale.

Evolutionary theory has shown that racism is foolish, since there are no biological human races. On the other hand...

Yet the prophecy again has its obverse side. Somehow they have only gone so far and no farther. The Japhethites and Semites have, sooner or later, taken over their territories, and their inventions, and then developed them and utilized them for their own enlargement. Often the Hamites, especially the Negroes, have become actual personal servants or even slaves to the others. Possessed of a genetic character concerned mainly with mundane matters, they have eventually been displaced by the intellectual and philosophical acumen of the Japhethites and the religious zeal of the Semites.
Institute for Creation Research founder Henry Morris The Beginning Of the World, Second Edition (1991), pp. 147-148

One prominent evolutionist stated that the intelligence level of black Africans is equivalent to a European 11 year old.

An unnamed "evolutionist" I see, with no date. On the other hand, into the 1990s, the founder of the largest YE creationist organization was blathering about the supposed intellectual and spiritual inferiority of black people.

That's not to say that all YE creationists are racists. Most are not. But it remains troubling that so many of the founders of YE doctrines are/were racists.

 

[Yehren]

Never mentioned evolution, apes are apes they will never evolve into anything else but another species of apes.

Which would include humans. Humans and chimpanzees are genetically closer to each other than either is to other apes.

 

[Yehren]

OIC "evening and morning, one day" cannot be a 24 hour day. Not sure which planet Augustine of Hippo was dwelling on at the time.

He noted that it was logically absurd to imagine real mornings and evenings with no sun to have them. So the text itself says that's not a literal history.

 

[Paul Christensen]

Evolutionary theory has shown that racism is foolish, since there are no biological human races. On the other hand...

Yet the prophecy again has its obverse side. Somehow they have only gone so far and no farther. The Japhethites and Semites have, sooner or later, taken over their territories, and their inventions, and then developed them and utilized them for their own enlargement. Often the Hamites, especially the Negroes, have become actual personal servants or even slaves to the others. Possessed of a genetic character concerned mainly with mundane matters, they have eventually been displaced by the intellectual and philosophical acumen of the Japhethites and the religious zeal of the Semites.
Institute for Creation Research founder Henry Morris The Beginning Of the World, Second Edition (1991), pp. 147-148



An unnamed "evolutionist" I see, with no date. On the other hand, into the 1990s, the founder of the largest YE creationist organization was blathering about the supposed intellectual and spiritual inferiority of black people.

That's not to say that all YE creationists are racists. Most are not. But it remains troubling that so many of the founders of YE doctrines are/were racists.

Look up Google, because your fingers and computer is as good as mine and you will find the reference to the racist who made the comment about Africans' intelligence level.

Creationists are not racists because they believe that we are all of the same family, coming from the same original parents, and that we all are same except for the different shades of brown in our skin. There is no white or black - these are racism terms. Some have darker brown skin than others depending on the parts of the world where they had their genetic origins.

 

[Yehren]

Well, let's take a look...
Genesis 2:17 But of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat. For in what day soever thou shalt eat of it, thou shalt die the death.

It say they will die in that day. No way to discount it.

Then you are actually making God out to be a liar, because Adam did not die that very day, but 900 years later.

Unless God was speaking of a spiritual death. If that's true, then God spoke the truth. Since God is truth, the only consistent understanding is that the death was not physical.


But the Scripture says that God is not a man that He should lie (Numbers 23:19). You have painted yourself into a corner, because if you add to Genesis, the idea that the death must be physical you have only two alternatives:
1. God did not say that Adam was going to die the day he ate the fruit;
or:
2. God lied when He said Adam would die the very day he ate the fruit, when in fact he died 900 years later.

Also, you are saying that God further lied when He said that He was not a man that He should lie, when He actually was lying when He said it! Do you see how adding your new doctrine to Genesis makes everything absurd? You have concluded that God cannot be depended on to tell the truth.

So, how can you know that you are truly saved if God cannot be depended on to tell the truth?

 

[Yehren]

(Unnamed "prominent evolutionist" at an unnamed time supposedly disparaged intelligence of black people)

Look up Google

Couldn't find it either, um? On the other hand, you just learned that the founder of the largest YE creationist group wrote a book about the supposed intellectual and spiritual interiority of black people. Today, racist evolutionists are pretty rare, because evolutionary theory has shown that there are no biological human races. That's pretty much a creationist fixation.

So there we are. You see why the race card is such a bad idea for creationists to use?

 

[mjrhealth]

Which would include humans. Humans and chimpanzees are genetically closer to each other than either is to other apes.

No we are not apes and not even of teh same species. Do you belong to the Science religion.

 

[mjrhealth]

You think you're perfect? What makes you think that a perfect God can't make imperfect things?



So is your argument that God doesn't make us, or that we are perfect?

Oh so now we start twisting words around,,, Is the truth offending you is it, than stop reading. or are you just one who loves arguing...

 

[Paul Christensen]

(Unnamed "prominent evolutionist" at an unnamed time supposedly disparaged intelligence of black people)



Couldn't find it either, um? On the other hand, you just learned that the founder of the largest YE creationist group wrote a book about the supposed intellectual and spiritual interiority of black people. Today, racist evolutionists are pretty rare, because evolutionary theory has shown that there are no biological human races. That's pretty much a creationist fixation.

So there we are. You see why the race card is such a bad idea for creationists to use?

Henry Fairfield Osborne - Natural History, April 1980, p129.

 

[Yehren]

Did you want a photograph of Noah's ark?
View attachment 8919

An eroded anticline is a picture of Noah's ark? It's a fold of rock with the top eroded.

A natural rock structure near Dogubayazit, Turkey, has been misidentified as Noah's Ark. Microscopic studies of a supposed iron bracket show that it is derived from weathered volcanic minerals. Supposed metal-braced walls are natural concentrations of limonite and magnetite in steeply inclined sedimentary layers in the limbs of a doubly plunging syncline. Supposed fossilized gopherwood bark is crinkled metamorphosed peridotite. Fossiliferous limestone, interpreted as cross cutting the syncline, preclude the structure from being Noah's Ark because these supposed “Flood” deposits are younger than the “Ark.” Anchor stones at Kazan (Arzap) are derived from local andesite and not from Mesopotamia.
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.5408/1089-9995-44.4.439?journalCode=ujge20

An old article in Creation magazine (September-November 1992), Special Report: Amazing “Ark” Exposé, laid to rest the Wyatt rumors about discovery of Noah’s Ark.


The main claims at a glance

• Turkish Government says it’s a boat……FALSE
• There is a regular metallic pattern……FALSE
• Lab tests show petrified laminated wood……FALSE
• Turkish scientists found metal rods……FALSE
• Metal artifacts have been proved by lab……FALSE
• There are ‘ship’s ribs’ showing……FALSE
• There is lots of petrified wood……FALSE
• Radar shows man-made (boat) structure……FALSE

Why do we mention these articles on our Web site again? Gray’s advertising insert Discovery Times has appeared in major secular newspapers in Australia and may appear in other newspapers, increasing the likelihood that Christians will be asked questions about these claims.


Being Tarred with the Same Brush

A lack of integrity causes great damage to the Christian cause, especially when people are “immunized” against the Gospel upon discovery that such claims are false.
Ark Discovered! . . . Again?

 

[Grailhunter]

We just take His Word for it.

Actually, we can't define perfection, because we have never seen it. We live in a fallen, imperfect world where everything around us has the curse of God on it because of Adam's disobedience. The whole planet is riddled with death and decay.

Just to add petrol to the fire: :)

A leading geneticist has stated that according to genetics, if mankind was millions of years old, we would have become extinct long ago, because of the running down of the genetic code. According to his research, the current genetic state of mankind is consistent with having just two original parents around 6000 years ago, and that the way that the genetic makeup of mankind is degrading, mankind will be extinct within another million years.

He bases his research on animals which have become extinct apart from man's affect on the environment, and has discovered that most extinct species died out because they got to the point where their offspring's genetic code was so degraded through continual mutation until offspring become so deformed that they cannot survive and continue breeding. He says that this will eventually happen to human beings.

Even if there were thousands of humans existing that provided the gene pool for mankind, the eventual day when mankind will no longer be able to produce healthy surviving offspring will not be significantly further away into the future than if there were just two original parents.

I found that quite interesting, and it shows that our world and everything in it is subject to decay and death, and therefore was not the original perfect world that God created.

A leading geneticist has stated that according to genetics, if mankind was millions of years old, we would have become extinct long ago, because of the running down of the genetic code.
Even if there were thousands of humans existing that provided the gene pool for mankind, the eventual day when mankind will no longer be able to produce healthy surviving offspring will not be significantly further away into the future than if there were just two original parents.

There is no logic or science to what you are presenting. What you present is a deception. There is no legitimate group of scientists or university that is going to agree with you.

Degeneration? You are laughable! We are living longer now than 2000 years ago. The squirrels in my yard are very healthy. The last deer I shot tasted very good and I got to inspect it inside and out. You don’t like science, next time you have a heart attack just stay home and read the Bible.

If you want to believe that the universe and the world were created in six days and few thousand years ago….I have no problem with that….but trying to say there is a science to support your view is ludicrous. But these beliefs are going to drive Christianity to its end and you will be at the helm.

Again, take a count on this worldwide forum, how many millennials are active members on this forum…this is worldwide. Your presentation of Christianity and the Bible takes it out of reality and puts in a form of fantasy.

It would be a smart thing to do to talk to the youth. What are their objections to Christianity and the Bible? You will find that it is this topic right here, creation and evolution, not the Bible as a whole. The old timers are counting their days, but the youth are the future of Christianity. For the youth, science is proven to them everyday of their lives while the deafening silence of God is something they have to contend with.

The New Testament is believable, but preaching this Jewish explanation for creation is anti-productive.

 

[Yehren]

You think you're perfect? What makes you think that a perfect God can't make imperfect things?

mjrhealth said: ↑
Because God is love,

So is your argument that God doesn't make us, or that we are perfect?

Oh so now we start twisting words around,,,

I think you should have considered what you said more carefully.

I think you might review your earlier claims. Or are you just one who loves arguing?

 

[Paul Christensen]

A leading geneticist has stated that according to genetics, if mankind was millions of years old, we would have become extinct long ago, because of the running down of the genetic code.
Even if there were thousands of humans existing that provided the gene pool for mankind, the eventual day when mankind will no longer be able to produce healthy surviving offspring will not be significantly further away into the future than if there were just two original parents.

There is no logic or science to what you are presenting. What you present is a deception. There is no legitimate group of scientists or university that is going to agree with you.

Degeneration? You are laughable! We are living longer now than 2000 years ago. The squirrels in my yard are very healthy. The last deer I shot tasted very good and I got to inspect it inside and out. You don’t like science, next time you have a heart attack just stay home and read the Bible.

If you want to believe that the universe and the world were created in six days and few thousand years ago….I have no problem with that….but trying to say there is a science to support your view is ludicrous. But these beliefs are going to drive Christianity to its end and you will be at the helm.

Again, take a count on this worldwide forum, how many millennials are active members on this forum…this is worldwide. Your presentation of Christianity and the Bible takes it out of reality and puts in a form of fantasy.

It would be a smart thing to do to talk to the youth. What are their objections to Christianity and the Bible? You will find that it is this topic right here, creation and evolution, not the Bible as a whole. The old timers are counting their days, but the youth are the future of Christianity. For the youth, science is proven to them everyday of their lives while the deafening silence of God is something they have to contend with.

The New Testament is believable, but preaching this Jewish explanation for creation is anti-productive.

So you believe that one of the foremost international geneticists is wrong? Here's a link:

 

[mjrhealth]

You think you're perfect? What makes you think that a perfect God can't make imperfect things?

So is your argument that God doesn't make us, or that we are perfect?

I think you should have considered what you said more carefully.

I think you might review your earlier claims. Or are you just one who loves arguing?

I consider that the one I was responding 2 was here for the truth, but I find more an more lately that very few care for Him. You know full well what I said, God made man perfect in the image of God, even a unlearned chritsian knows that,

but as the bible says, mankind like you are trying to make God in the Image of man, imperfect as we are now. You know this bit.

Rom_1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

 

[FollowHim]

I certainly don't demonstrate a Darwinian evolutionary understanding, because I don't believe that physical death entered the world before Adam. Evolution involves death because natural selection and survival of the species depends on less fit species dying out and strong species surviving. Of course this is happening in the present day with many species becoming extinct, but no species became extinct before Adam because none of the animals died.

I have a problem with this idea death entered the world because of the fall.
Death is part of life. The whole being may live on but their cells die.
Our guts are full of bacteria etc. which reproduce, live and die.

The image in scripture is of refreshing life with the tree of life.
That life is given strength to continue.

So is death actually significant death, ie of people, rather than death of living organisms.
Do we say a car has died when it fails to be able to work?

Is the 3rd law of thermodynamics an indication that everything runs down, but prior to the fall this was not true?
The fall of man was Adam accepting death with knowledge of good and evil over trusting and walking with God.
It was a path of independence which God declared would lead to death.

And boy was He right. But Adam at the time did not understand the death would work out because man could not access the tree of life, ie. part of living is dying unless we are refreshed. God bless you.