God's Favor?

[POI]

Exactly. And she didn't resist, nor cry out. If it was force/rape, Holy Spirit would have inspired the writer to use another word as in verse 25, which is translated "force" but also could mean to seize upon, conquer, catch, prevail, restrain (you get the idea).

Verses 28 and 29 are talking about 2 consenting unmarried people. She isn't betrothed, so they must marry, having consensually engaged in sex. Now, if she had been betrothed, there would have been another course of action, such as death (as stated in previous verses) ...to put away sin. This is confirmed in the New Testament by Paul.

1 Corinthians 7 (KJV) ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ¹ Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. ² Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. … ⁸ I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I. ⁹ But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

“But if any man think that he behaveth himself uncomely toward his virgin, if she pass the flower of her age, and need so require, let him do what he will, he sinneth not: let them marry.” — 1 Corinthians 7:36 (KJV)

If the Verses eluded "two consenting adults', then I never would have posted this thread ;)

Please re-read the Verses:

"28 If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married [and rapes her] and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay her father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives."

For sake of argument, we can replace [and rapes her] with [and seduces her], [and coerces her], [and blackmails her], etc etc etc.... Nowhere does the Verses produce a 'slam dunk', that it was merely always consensual premarital sex alone ;). I would also imagine that the woman was told, by their father, again and again, that a single virgin, whom is ever known to be with a man, will seal her fate as never being married at all.

You seem to be desperately wanting the Verses to "clearly state" something the Verses do not clearly state. This is why the term 'rape', is used. If it was THIS clear the Verses were speaking about completely consensual sex, then the NIV would not be THIS clumsy with their translation :)

Care to address post #32 now?

 

[POI]

Those verses are speaking of consensual relations. I've addressed it 2 or 3 times. That is enough. You seem to have something against God and refuse to see the truth. That being the case, I believe I have no further need to discuss it .....with you. I will, however, discuss this with others who are genuinely seeking the truth.

"Truth' sometimes does not meet your own personal satisfaction or expectations. I have studied this direct topic, quite extensively. If you care not to explore what I stated in post #32, then you look to be deliberately ignoring my position; regardless of my background. Which then deems you not really in search of 'truth' anyways.

 

[amigo de christo]

Those verses are speaking of consensual relations. I've addressed it 2 or 3 times. That is enough. You seem to have something against God and refuse to see the truth. That being the case, I believe I have no further need to discuss it .....with you. I will, however, discuss this with others who are genuinely seeking the truth.

Often in these cases , sister , the person is doing as they do for other reasons .
And the most common group of these folks that try and make the law look bad , support the homosexual agenda .
If they can make the law look bad or say it was from men , they can they try and justify their own sin .
I seen this so many times sister . Now i dont know what this persons agenda is , well not his specific agenda .
But they sure do seem to be trying to make some things look real bad . And i bet its so they can justify some sin .
But God gave me something a long time ago sister .
Concerning those who were justifying the homo sexual agenda and saying GOD is love and etc .
Take them to the kjv bible . Show them the Godly definition of LOVE , CHARITY .
FOR YES GOD IS LOVE . BUT HIS LOVE does not rejoice in iniquity nor behave itself UNSEEMINGLY .
NOW , lets turn to the same new testament and read romans one .
AND Likewise the men left the natural use of the woman and they burned in their lust one towards another
working that which is UNSEEMINGLY . GOD showed me how to use this to witness for those who support that agenda .
Cause its all EVEN IN THE NEW TESTAMENT .

 

[POI]

Often in these cases , sister , the person is doing as they do for other reasons .
And the most common group of these folks that try and make the law look bad , support the homosexual agenda .
If they can make the law look bad or say it was from men , they can they try and justify their own sin .
I seen this so many times sister . Now i dont know what this persons agenda is , well not his specific agenda .
But they sure do seem to be trying to make some things look real bad . And i bet its so they can justify some sin .
But God gave me something a long time ago sister .
Concerning those who were justifying the homo sexual agenda and saying GOD is love and etc .
Take them to the kjv bible . Show them the Godly definition of LOVE , CHARITY .
FOR YES GOD IS LOVE . BUT HIS LOVE does not rejoice in iniquity nor behave itself UNSEEMINGLY .
NOW , lets turn to the same new testament and read romans one .
AND Likewise the men left the natural use of the woman and they burned in their lust one towards another
working that which is UNSEEMINGLY . GOD showed me how to use this to witness for those who support that agenda .
Cause its all EVEN IN THE NEW TESTAMENT .

Thus, according to you, it is 'good' to instruct that 'punishment' for the rape of a single virgin is for the male to pay and marry her, or. just pay and walk away?

 

[TLHKAJ]

But they sure do seem to be trying to make some things look real bad . And i bet its so they can justify some sin .

Yes, I agree. But the OP is obviously either not a believer, or has been so wounded they do not know or care to know the character of God. If someone has had a real experience with God through Jesus Christ, their heart will seek Him out and desire to know Him deeper. And that means asking Him to reveal the truth of His Word to our hearts.

 

[amigo de christo]

Yes, I agree. But the OP is obviously either not a believer, or has been so wounded they do not know or care to know the character of God. If someone has had a real experience with God through Jesus Christ, their heart will seek Him out and desire to know Him deeper. And that means asking Him to reveal the truth of His Word to our hearts.

Yes indeed dear sister . Let the glorious Lord be praised .

 

[lilygrace]

Can someone just report my posts? I regret bothering ....

 

[TLHKAJ]

Can someone just report my posts? I regret bothering ....

No way, sis. You did nothing wrong. This is an issue the OP has with God and has nothing to do with anything you said or asked.
*hugs*

 

[POI]

Yes, I agree. But the OP is obviously either not a believer, or has been so wounded they do not know or care to know the character of God. If someone has had a real experience with God through Jesus Christ, their heart will seek Him out and desire to know Him deeper. And that means asking Him to reveal the truth of His Word to our hearts.

Maybe you should buy a Lotto ticket? You seem to know me so well :)

The Bible says many things I would agree with... However, in this particular case, the Bible looks to handle this particular criteria questionably. You admit this, by even insinuating what you guys have here, in this thread...

The NIV would not be THIS clumsy, and use the term "rape", if Verses 28-29 were merely speaking about "completely consensual sex."

Hence, the punishment for being with a single virgin, is to either pay and leave, or pay and marry. Either way, the victim has no say in the matter.

All my reasons have been disclosed in the OP, and in post #32. Neither of you two wish to address them.

So please, by all means, ignore them. But this does not mean there exists no 'truth' to what I am saying. It just means you wish to turn a blind eye.

If God instructed these Verses, God gives favor to the father well above the victim. And I already told you two why.

Peace...

 

[POI]

support the homosexual agenda .

Concerning those who were justifying the homo sexual agenda and saying GOD is love and etc .

You seem to have a real axe to grind, with "homosexuality"? Maybe we can devote some time to this topic, since you clearly do not want to truly engage the topic I posted here.

Is who you are physically attracted to always a choice?

When did you decide to become heterosexual?

 

[amigo de christo]

Thus, according to you, it is 'good' to instruct that 'punishment' for the rape of a single virgin is for the male to pay and marry her, or. just pay and walk away?

Read other parts . If GOD says one thing it stands . Instead of hatred against the truth . Seek THE TRUTH
and find it you will . I will be praying for you . JESUS CHRIST is truly the only name where by one can be saved .
If we dont have him we have no salvation . Nor will we ever see the rightly divided truth .
You have a anger inside of you . A bitterness against the truth . Only Christ can set you free and give you salvation .
And that brings great joy and much hope .

 

[amigo de christo]

Does someone always have to cry or scream for it to count?

How many women have been drug date raped . So NO they dont have to cry always .
Look at how many small boys and girls get molested , most by family members , or rome or other sick leaders .
Do they cry out . No , not often . but its still rape and its still molestation .

 

[POI]

Read other parts . If GOD says one thing it stands . Instead of hatred against the truth . Seek THE TRUTH
and find it you will .

I've read all parts. Can you please acknowledge what MY OP actually says, as well as post #32?

If you are a single virgin, and are raped, coerced, manipulated, seduces, or other; here are the options available - (from the Bible):

1. The male pays the father and also marries the female. Under marriage, the female submits to the male.
2. The male pays the father and is then free. He can still go find another virgin and marry her, rape her as well, other...

Assuming, in some of these cases, that sex was NOT consensual, do you see the above two options as justified by your believed upon 'loving' God?

 

[lilygrace]

How many women have been drug date raped . So NO they dont have to cry always .
Look at how many small boys and girls get molested , most by family members , or rome or other sick leaders .
Do they cry out . No , not often . but its still rape and its still molestation .

i dont know though.
i just think taking stuff out of a book is not always conducive :/ even if its supposed to be God's word.

 

[amigo de christo]

i dont know though.
i just think taking stuff out of a book is not always conducive :/ even if its supposed to be God's word.

Lily my dear friend . Since the word of GOD shall stand and by THE WORD the world shall be judged ,
let us learn the word well . Cling to JESUS and just focus on reading those lovely gospels and letters of the apostels
and other doctrine . It will truly build you up . You are loved dear sister . But paul was right
and so was peter . Both men put a heavy emphasis on scripture .
Paul said it , for the holy scriptures make one wise unto salvation THROUGH our faith in CHRIST .
So just continue to read the bible often . You are loved and shall be prayed for as well .

 

[POI]

Lily my dear friend . Since the word of GOD shall stand and by THE WORD the world shall be judged ,
let us learn the word well . Cling to JESUS and just focus on reading those lovely gospels and letters of the apostels
and other doctrine . It will truly build you up . You are loved dear sister . But paul was right
and so was peter . Both men put a heavy emphasis on scripture .
Paul said it , for the holy scriptures make one wise unto salvation THROUGH our faith in CHRIST .
So just continue to read the bible often . You are loved and shall be prayed for as well .

So long as you perpetually re-read the Verses you like, and perpetually skip the ones for which you don't :)

 

[amadeus]

Does someone always have to cry or scream for it to count?

In the world there is saying, "the squeaky wheel gets the oil".

I hated the problems senselessly caused or made worse for people who needed help but for whatever reason would not speak up for themselves. They would get bumped out of line to be replaced by someone with a lessor need but who opened his mouth to complain. That is the world! It should not be like that among God's people but as we know not everyone who says he is Christian is really very much like Jesus. Men are respecters of persons, but God is not. Help us dear Lord!

 

[POI]

i dont know though.
i just think taking stuff out of a book is not always conducive :/ even if its supposed to be God's word.

May I ask of your take here?

If you are a single virgin, and are raped, coerced, manipulated, seduces, or other; here are the options available - (from the Bible):

1. The male pays the father and also marries the female. Under marriage, the female submits to the male.
2. The male pays the father and is then set free. He can then possibly repeat the process again.

 

[POI]

Note to all... I do not know if YHWH exists or not? I have no clue. All I'm saying here, is there exists specific passages, which look to be suspect. I'm here to investigate those passages.

Please take no offense. I was under the assumption the 'apologetics' arena is where such questions can be posed? If not, let me know? I will then ask in the appropriate arena.

 

[lilygrace]

Note to all... I do not know if YHWH exists or not? I have no clue. All I'm saying here, is there exists specific passages, which look to be suspect. I'm here to investigate those passages.

Please take no offense. I was under the assumption the 'apologetics' arena is where such questions can be posed? If not, let me know? I will then ask in the appropriate arena.

but this was the scripture you chose. why? arent there other topics that interest you?