Carnal Hypocrisy of Sabbath Commanders

[Phoneman777]

I posted the passage that gives the reason that Christians are not obligated to observe the Sabbath. But lets discuss it further since you obviously believe you are to observe it. Have you kept the Sabbath Pman?

If you believe INCORRECTLY that keeping the Sabbath involves any more than what is mentioned in Exodus 20:8-11 KJV - simply resting from routine labor and work performed on days 1 through 6 - then you will deny my answer, which is "yes", I keep the Sabbath every week.

 

[bbyrd009]

C'mon, we ain't legalistic. By definition, a Legalist is one who attempts to gain salvation by works.

SDAs teach works are merely the outward evidence of our chosen inward spiritual condition.

im sure there is plenty of variety even within SDA, and they seemed nice enough, if bound; but then that describes most believers imo. This was a small, older cong, likely not a mainstream example i guess

when the world went “Saturday is small business day, go shopping” that really sealed it for me

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Geez man, let others follow their own conscience. Don’t try to make them follow your conscience. Even if you know the law is for the inside of your cup and your conscience is not bothered, why would you try to disturb someone else’s conscience? And especially if you clearly see fruit of the Spirit, why would you do it??
Paul spoke so clearly on this…

I know sometimes the reverse of what we see in this thread happens in here, but you are talking with Cass and BL, who are mature believers who don’t bully people with their beliefs. I’ve never seen them do it once. If they think one day is more holy, what’s that to you? Let them honor God without your direction. Are you their worship leader? Gosh sakes…

 

[quietthinker]

Sorry Brake, you are mistaken, we have not been released from those laws sir.

Released from one and not the other of the same batch?.....hmmmmm ......I recall the text 'if you offend in one you offend in all'....referring to the Commandments........hmmmm.
We all offend in many things however if we in a planned way deliberately offend, if we justify our offence, I would say with Paul we are in trouble because effectually we are resisting the prompting of God's Spirit to establish our own theories.

 

[Phoneman777]

im sure there is plenty of variety even within SDA, and they seemed nice enough, if bound; but then that describes most believers imo. This was a small, older cong, likely not a mainstream example i guess

when the world went “Saturday is small business day, go shopping” that really sealed it for me

There's kooks in every gathering, unfortunately. Every hear of BTK? He was a faithful Sunday keeping dude who would even drive people to and from church. Imagine discovering that nice, quiet, faithful and devoted guy at church who's always helping out and hugging everybody was actually a monster in disguise.

 

[Phoneman777]

I posted the passage that gives the reason that Christians are not obligated to observe the Sabbath. But lets discuss it further since you obviously believe you are to observe it. Have you kept the Sabbath Pman?

Can you point me to that post?

 

[Brakelite]

1. I never read of them ever speaking of worshipping God, and if so, never in Spirit and in truth.

And so, the outer day is everything, and the inner man is nothing, since all we hear about is the outer and nothing of the inner.

2. They also excuse working their jobs on their Sabbath day, if it is required, such as military, police, emergency service, gvt rule, etc...

And they even try to pay penance by donating their pay elsewhere.

I thought the commandment was not to work, not to not to keep the pay for working.

3. The obvious of course is separating the commandments of the law of Moses from the law of Moses, so that they can circumcise themselves from other Christians by their Sabbath day, and not be debtors to do the whole law of Moses.

Is it still a sin to heal on the Sabbath day, or is this the reformed Sabbath keeping of the christian religion, as opposed to that of the jews religion?

Is the reformation of Christ simply to make a less strict religion?

I'm curious how a post without any reference to a scripture whatsoever qualifies as "Bible study"?

 

[Robert Gwin]

Oh, for Pete's sake. If I had a nickel for everytime someone has hashed out these verses...

I just have no , repeat, no clue, why it vexes so many of you that we keep Sabbath. Robert, you are happy you are released. Bully for you.
If we keep Sabbath and you guys think it is unimportant, then why worry about it? And further, why dog us for it?

I could ask you why you think you abstain from blood, when I'd bet money (all those nickels I got for you guys hashing out verses) that the steak you eat and the hamburger you eat has blood in it,lots, but I'm not gonna go " I am so thankful we have been released from eating blood, Rob" I don't think it is a sin to eat that, and I'm not going to diss you for it.

Many who post here that speak about how Sabbath is no more, do not do so in a loving christian manner. It is always like we Sabbathkeepers are stuck on the bottom of someone's shoe.

Here is the deal:

1. I'm not Sabbath "in your face." If your Bible and beliefs tell you that you don't need to keep Sabbath, then don't. You can read as well as I can.

2. It is not hurting you at all, or the country, for us to keep the Sabbath. no guns involved, no negativity on political fields. We fellowship together, and we keep the day. Many Sunday folk are just church and then a ball game or something. That's fine, if that is what you want to do, but don't talk stuff if we choose to spend the day with the Lord, and other believers.

We need to be wise like the fox, "A fox smells his own trail first." We can discuss things till the cows come home, but not in such an aloof manner. And be sure you are checking your stuff, while you are checking ours.

May I ask Cassy, do you obey the Sabbath?

We do not eat blood maam, I certainly cannot answer for others, but all meats I eat are purchased and supposedly inspected by the USDA, and are supposedly properly bled. We are more stringent with rules and regulations today but even in the first century if it was sold in a meat market it was acceptable for Christians to eat. (1 Corinthians 10:25) . . .Eat whatever is sold in a meat market, making no inquiry because of your conscience. There are exceptions of course, some stores sell blood sausage, which we are restricted from eating.

 

[Brakelite]

May I ask Cassy, do you obey the Sabbath?

You asked @Phoneman777 the same question. I'm curious. Why do you think it so difficult to obey, that you should be so relieved you are no longer obliged to do so ( wrongly I believe).

 

[Robert Gwin]

Well, I'm very glad to hear that. So you don't steal anymore? Or covet right? Are you therefore obeying those Commandments in order to be saved Robert?

Most of the time, I would definitely say that I at times covet, but I never act on it Brake.

 

[Robert Gwin]

If you believe INCORRECTLY that keeping the Sabbath involves any more than what is mentioned in Exodus 20:8-11 KJV - simply resting from routine labor and work performed on days 1 through 6 - then you will deny my answer, which is "yes", I keep the Sabbath every week.

Thanks Pman. Since you keep the Sabbath, are you willing to accept the judgment for disobeying it sir? May I ask as well what hours of the week do you keep the Sabbath?

 

[Brakelite]

Most of the time, I would definitely say that I at times covet, but I never act on it Brake.

Coveting is the same as lust. You don't need to act on it in order to be found guilty before a holy God. Why do you obey those Commandments?

 

[Brakelite]

So you don't steal anymore? Or covet right

Most of the time,

Coveting is the same as lust. You don't need to act on it in order t

are you willing to accept the judgment for disobeying it sir?

 

[Robert Gwin]

Released from one and not the other of the same batch?.....hmmmmm ......I recall the text 'if you offend in one you offend in all'....referring to the Commandments........hmmmm.
We all offend in many things however if we in a planned way deliberately offend, if we justify our offence, I would say with Paul we are in trouble because effectually we are resisting the prompting of God's Spirit to establish our own theories.

Simple truth is sir, in every government new laws come into force as needed, and some are removed off the books as no longer needed. Jehovah's Kingdom is no exception, however it is far more consistent in it's laws that any government formed by man.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Can you point me to that post?

I will just post the passage Pman. We do not observe the Sabbath based on these words from Paul:
(Colossians 2:13-17) . . .Furthermore, though you were dead in your trespasses and in the uncircumcised state of your flesh, God made you alive together with him. He kindly forgave us all our trespasses 14 and erased the handwritten document that consisted of decrees and was in opposition to us. He has taken it out of the way by nailing it to the torture stake. 15 He has stripped the governments and the authorities bare and has publicly exhibited them as conquered, leading them in a triumphal procession by means of it. 16 Therefore, do not let anyone judge you about what you eat and drink or about the observance of a festival or of the new moon or of a sabbath. 17 Those things are a shadow of the things to come, but the reality belongs to the Christ.

A better understanding would be likely if you read the whole chapter sir.

 

[Phoneman777]

May I ask Cassy, do you obey the Sabbath?

We do not eat blood maam, I certainly cannot answer for others, but all meats I eat are purchased and supposedly inspected by the USDA, and are supposedly properly bled. We are more stringent with rules and regulations today but even in the first century if it was sold in a meat market it was acceptable for Christians to eat. (1 Corinthians 10:25) . . .Eat whatever is sold in a meat market, making no inquiry because of your conscience. There are exceptions of course, some stores sell blood sausage, which we are restricted from eating.

Unless we're willing to recognize the verses which make a Biblical distinction - not a mere subjective distinction, but verses which make a Biblical distinction - between the Law God wrote and the one Moses wrote, we'll never come to a proper conclusion.

We'll assume NT verses which say the Law Moses wrote is nailed to the Cross/abolished/blotted out/a shadow of heavenly things/bondage/carnal, against us, etc., etc., etc....also apply to the Ten Commandments which Scripture says are forever not nailed to the Cross/established by us not abolished and blotted out/liberty not bondage/holy not carnal/contain blessing and promise not and are not against us, etc, etc, etc.

These verses are undeniable, untwistable, hopelessly relevant, and impossible to harmonize with an antinomianist position. How can anyone be antinomianist when such verses clearly teach the eternal nature of what God wrote with His own finger in stone?

 

[Phoneman777]

Thanks Pman. Since you keep the Sabbath, are you willing to accept the judgment for disobeying it sir?

Funny, I have the same question for those who argue they can't keep the Ten Commandments: are you willing to accept the consequences? Claiming inability to keep them or refusing to keep them results in the same thing according to James: "thou art become a transgressor of the law". Revelation 22 plainly says only those who do His commandments have a right to the Tree of Life, while those who say they're unable or unwilling to do them will go to hell.

BTW, keeping the Sabbath is easy peasy, lemon squeezy :)

 

[Phoneman777]

I will just post the passage Pman. We do not observe the Sabbath based on these words from Paul:
(Colossians 2:13-17)

There are four irrefutable reasons why Paul here is speaking of the yearly "sabbath" ceremonial Feast days of the ceremonial Mosaic Law here, not the weekly Sabbath of the Ten Commandments.

. . .Furthermore, though you were dead in your trespasses and in the uncircumcised state of your flesh, God made you alive together with him. He kindly forgave us all our trespasses

Grace is not a license to sin - the Christian is never free from his "reasonable service" obligation to keep God's law to not steal, lie, worship idols, break the Sabbath.

14 and erased the handwritten document that consisted of decrees and was in opposition to us. He has taken it out of the way by nailing it to the torture stake. 15 He has stripped the governments and the authorities bare and has publicly exhibited them as conquered, leading them in a triumphal procession by means of it. 16 Therefore, do not let anyone judge you about what you eat and drink or about the observance of a festival or of the new moon or of a sabbath. 17 Those things are a shadow of the things to come, but the reality belongs to the Christ.

Again, there are four irrefutable reasons for why this passage refers to the Mosaic Law, not the Ten Commandments. For instance, the Feast Days "sabbaths" were indeed "shadows of things to come" which pointed to the coming Messiah: Passover lamb, Unleavened Bread, First fruits, etc. However, the weekly Sabbath of the fourth commandment wasn't a shadow of anything future, it was made as a memorial to the past, according to Genesis 2:1-3 KJV and not among those things nailed to the Cross - we are to keep it now and for all eternity, says Isaiah.

Also, where Paul says it was "against us" can be shown to not refer to the weekly Sabbath, the entire list of Paul's things "nailed to the Cross" can be shown to only refer to what Moses wrote, not what God wrote in the Ten Commandments.

 

[Brakelite]

I will just post the passage Pman. We do not observe the Sabbath based on these words from Paul:
(Colossians 2:13-17) . . .Furthermore, though you were dead in your trespasses and in the uncircumcised state of your flesh, God made you alive together with him. He kindly forgave us all our trespasses 14 and erased the handwritten document that consisted of decrees and was in opposition to us. He has taken it out of the way by nailing it to the torture stake. 15 He has stripped the governments and the authorities bare and has publicly exhibited them as conquered, leading them in a triumphal procession by means of it. 16 Therefore, do not let anyone judge you about what you eat and drink or about the observance of a festival or of the new moon or of a sabbath. 17 Those things are a shadow of the things to come, but the reality belongs to the Christ.

A better understanding would be likely if you read the whole chapter sir.

Yet you contradict the way you interpret the above by your personal testimony that you obey the commandments regarding stealing, adultery, coveting etc. Are the Ten Commandments nailed to the cross our not? If not, what is the 4th Commandment the exception?

 

[quietthinker]

May I ask Cassy, do you obey the Sabbath?

We do not eat blood maam, I certainly cannot answer for others, but all meats I eat are purchased and supposedly inspected by the USDA, and are supposedly properly bled. We are more stringent with rules and regulations today but even in the first century if it was sold in a meat market it was acceptable for Christians to eat. (1 Corinthians 10:25) . . .Eat whatever is sold in a meat market, making no inquiry because of your conscience. There are exceptions of course, some stores sell blood sausage, which we are restricted from eating.

I see you thrash around in the rules you choose but dismiss the conscience of others who are persuaded differently.