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Isn't sex between consenting partners for the purpose of sensual satisfaction just a form of second party masturbation.

Sex was created pleasurable to a degree of irresistibility in order to ensure the survival of the species. That's why rapist's cite the creator in mitigation. Oh dear, maybe I ought to stop posting.:rolleyes:

On a less frivolous note ..... two 5 year olds were chatting together: Child A "last evening my parent threw an enormous party in the garden for all our neighbours, and this morning I found a condom on the patio. Child B "What's a patio?"

I Corinthians 11:14 "Doth not even nature itself teach you........" I've seen every sexual deviation known to mankind being evidenced in the various realms of 'nature'.:eek:

Latest prognosis re Christine's cancer is just too devastating to explain in detail. A week ago she was given 2 years at best/6 months at worst, but yesterday the spread was deemed to be so intense that they will scan again in two week's time and expect to shorten the prognosis even further. An...

OK but please give me 'time' as I shall be otherwise preoccupied for a bit now that we enter a critical stage of my wife's cancer treatment. Likewise 'forum' will also have to take a back seat.

Sorry Nancy, It's an inclination that would offend most, if not all, and edify few ,if any, so best kept to myself. But you can have it privately if you insist on destroying a valued friendship, your choice.o_O

What does ywam stand for ?

I was only referring to those that I had encountered 'during my lifetime'. I would needed to have lived for 300 years to have embraced John Wesley in my overview. Whatever sought of mischief must the 1 John 1:8 self excusing sinners to whom he referred, have been getting up to?:rolleyes:

I like much of what you say Scoot, and in particular I like the way you say it. I've added you to my list of 'followers', each of whom have earned more 'likes' than 'messages posted'.;)

No appetite for cessationism at the moment. Its importance being drowned in my present 'soul obsession' with the difference between sola scriptura, text book strait-jacketed, 'Religion' and spirit led, text book influenced, 'Faith/Hope'. But I'm keeping that particular 'pearl' for the sole...

Never in all my many years amongst the denominations and in forums have I come across a single Christian who has used 1 John 1:8 as an excuse to sin.

Thanks Helen, That's certainly worth much prayerful consideration.

Is that your constructive response or is it a fudged evasion.

Could you then please explain Matthew 5:48 and 1 John 1:8 in words that you find not to conflict.

After over 70 years of faith I am still unable to find that illusive reconciliation so what then might it be be that I believe that is "something false"?

How did John Wesley reconcile Matthew 5:48 with 1 John 1:8?

No, and no (fwiw)

Work out you own salvation with unprejudiced sincerity, rather than with fear and trembling (if you can). Only God knows for sure whether he accepts your sincerity as being efficacious to salvation.