A bit of a mess in the White House.

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Lizbeth

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Romans 13:3-6 LITV
3) For the rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the bad. And do you desire not to fear the authority? Do the good, and you will have praise from it;
4) for it is a servant of God to you for the good. But if you practice evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword in vain; for it is a servant of God, an avenger for wrath to the one practicing bad things.
5) Because of this, it is necessary to be subject, not only on account of wrath, but also on account of conscience.
6) For on this account you also pay taxes, for they are ministers of God, always giving attention to this very thing.

Governance is there to, among other things, put down crime. But when the criminals are in power, there is no one to do that.

I've been praying and asking God for Justice - not any one else, I ask Him - and perhaps this new administration will mete out that justice, and will support what is right, so that we can live peaceable lives.


Is it righteous to protect the weak and poor and powerless from evil men? I think so.

Much love!
Yes but what many are forgetting these days is that governments are God's business, not the business of the church. As Jesus Himself is our example. Things sure were in a bad state for Israel in His day, politically speaking. How much did He concern and involve Himself with it all, being in perfect submission to the Father? And in turn He only gave us a mandate to go and make disciples and spread the gospel, not to get overly invested and distracted by politics and external circumstances of this world.

Again I want to say brother, there is a difference between the wisdom of the world and the wisdom of God. Which wisdom should we be following?
 
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marks

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But the wisdom of keeping church and state separated used to be generally understood, but not nowadays it seems.
This separation of church and state, when you read what the founding fathers wrote about that, the idea was to keep the government from attempting to control the church, not the other way around.

The original idea was that the high calling and values of Christianity would keep the government on the high road. But that's only really when you have a strong Christian influence in government. There was never the idea that you mustn't let Christian leadership affect how the government functions.

We're supposed to be in the world but not of it.
Yes, and Paul also wrote to slaves, if you have the opportunity to gain your freedom, use it. This tells me we are to seek to increase our liberty and freedom to function when possible.

Interesting question . . . if Israel had elections, would Jesus have voted? But they didn't.

Do we have a moral duty towards civil matters? Given that we have the opportunity to influence and change the operations of our government, do we have a moral duty towards the weak and poor, the orphan and the fatherless? To make sure our countries resources are not wasted, nor stolen, nor mis-used, but that they will be used responsibly for the benefit of those who have need?

I think so.

That's what most of the church is doing these days.
Maybe your church but I don't see it in mine, at least as far as I can see.
All our hopes, affections, treasures and thoughts should be ABOVE.
Having your heart set on heaven doesn't mean we're to be blind to what's happening here.

Brass tacks . . . lives ended under Biden vs. Trump, lives destroyed under Biden vs. Trump, people impoverished under Biden vs. Trump, do you see where I'm going with this?

We're not talking about a national pastor, this is the CEO of the nation, and finally we've got a good one.

I say, let's not make it more than it is, nor less than it is.

Much love!
 
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marks

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Yes but what many are forgetting these days is that governments are God's business, not the business of the church.
Don't drain the passage of it's meaning and application. Yeah, I get it, we shouldn't be all caught up in politics to the ruin of other areas of our lives. Just the same . . . we have a responsibility to those who need our help.

And very specifically we are to pray for our leaders, and I hope you are praying for Trump and Vance and the cabinet, and congress, and the SC justices.

Much love!
 

marks

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If God sees fit to give you a "better" President, then I'm sure not against it.
To me that's the bottom line. You want a guy who knows how to make a Slurpee working at 7-11. And you want someone who knows about cars working at the repair shop. And you want someone who is a good executive to be the president.

I thank the Lord for President Trump and Vice-President Vance!

Much love!
 
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amigo de christo

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You trash your own leaders when you disagree with them. And people from outside your situation are usually the best ones to watch your backs. I don't know all the ins and outs of what is going on politically, too many moving parts for me to keep up with and how can you know what or who to believe? so for the most part I just try to keep my eyes on the Lord and what HE is doing.

But the wisdom of keeping church and state separated used to be generally understood, but not nowadays it seems. Now the ends justifies the means...........and many are willing to use evil to fight another evil. Anything goes as long as it gets the job done. That is Satan's kingdom (world) divided against itself, it is not the kingdom of God and its ways.


How did Jesus and the apostles teach His church to push back against evil and what example did He and they set? God's ways are not man's ways. Do we know the difference between this world's wisdom and the wisdom of God? We're supposed to be in the world but not of it. I'm talking about what our HEARTS are set on and invested in as believers and what we are placing hopes and trust and what we spend our energies on as the church of Christ. Peter only sank beneath the waves when he took his eyes off Jesus and focused on the waves instead. That's what most of the church is doing these days.


If God sees fit to give you a "better" President, then I'm sure not against it. But what many don't realize is that things to do with this fallen world, like politics, are a mixture of good and evil at best. Never seen a political party or President that does all things "good". Just for a general example, the Democratic party: civil rights good, socialism evil. The Republican party: conservative policies good, greedy corrupt big business evil. Both parties are beholden to those who make big contributions to their campaigns, don't kid ourselves. That's the way of the world for you.

As believers we should learn and know the difference between "good" and "perfect". And between the holy and the common/profane. There is nothing perfect in this world's kingdoms which are outside the kingdom of God. So which kingdom should we be invested in as the church of God? What KIND of army are we supposed to be? Political? Military? or spiritual? All our hopes, affections, treasures and thoughts should be ABOVE. Think there's a reason Jesus said when you see these things begin to happen, look UP for your redemption draws nigh. Adverse circumstances always tempt us to focus on them instead.
Many be the things of this world that be a snare to the soul .
Paul and all apostels understood something very well sister .
Something many today know not at all .
What Kingdom did they preach .
And what KINGDOM had CHRIST preached .
What had CHRIST warned about
That later all apostels would also warn about .
Take heed that no Man decieve you ............................
The Kingdom is heavenly sister but many a man has tried to merge that which is earthly with the heavenly .
And always has it led to deceptoin and destruction .
If we read the letter of acts , the gospels , the letters of the apostels
DID we ever see them standing behind and encouraging any kind of hope or trust in kings , politics
Or was the focus rather on evangelising Christ to the lost and doing all to , HOPE and TRUST IN GOD in HIS CHRIST .
You see cursed is the man whose hope be in man . and it cannot be in both man and IN GOD .
Many prophets have always arisen and their main focus is
on politics , on how men can give us a better life .
Yet i never seemed to remember JESUS saying if you want peace , if you want and desire
good things , THEN VOTE THE BEST MAN IN . THIS CHURCH AGE IS INFECTED with the wrong hope sister .
IN this world ye shall have triblulation . blessed are you when you are persecuted
Has now become lets vote a man in that can give us our best life now
and blessed are we when we have such men in power . What a nightmare has come upon this generation .
And neither side knows that both sides do one work . the work to lead all whose trust and hope was in men
whose love was of this world , whose love was full of the cares of pleasures of life
RIGHT TO their own demise and destruction . IT promises them peace n safety
and it brings unto this people the means to attain such peace n safety as it brings upon them
the interfaith lie . the very lie that has TROD CHRIST completely under foot .
The very lie that calls itself love and cliams to be of GOD and yet sure seems to have made the road to GOD
very broad as it accepts UNREPENTANT SINNERS and sin , as it accepts anyones belief
and path . AS IT CRIES doctrine does not matter .
AND NOW ITS ONLY DOCTRINE that it claims does matter is
If one just loves they know GOD . and yet that their love DENIES HIM . its all A DELUSION NOW SISTER .
And though it promised them all life , and though it promised them peace n safety
THE dead know not it will lead them NOT TO LIFE , NOT TO GOD , but to THEIR OWN SUDDEN DESRUCTION on the DAY OF THE LORD
of WHOM ITS LOVE DENIED . ITS COMING SISTER . i must sound like lott to many .
COME GET YOU OUT OF THESE POLITICS and OUT OF THESE CHURCHES , FOR THE LORD GOD SHALL DESTROY THEM .
and they just mock and laugh as though i be crazy . WELL they mocked lott too . BUT Remember
IT was not LOTT who was wrong and THEY SOON were destroyed . ITS COMING SISTER . seeing i desire not their death
i must continue to warn , though many mock .
 

amigo de christo

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Don't drain the passage of it's meaning and application. Yeah, I get it, we shouldn't be all caught up in politics to the ruin of other areas of our lives. Just the same . . . we have a responsibility to those who need our help.

And very specifically we are to pray for our leaders, and I hope you are praying for Trump and Vance and the cabinet, and congress, and the SC justices.

Much love!
rather odd i see versions of truth in this . and yet many are and many who even say this are caught up with politics and hopes in men .
NOT to mention , The same way we pray for trump and vance IS THE SAME WAY we ought to have been praying
FOR ALL LEADERS . yes including biden , harris and all .
AND thus when i say praying for them , I SURE AS HECK DONT MEAN THEIR AGENDAS
but rather FOR THEIR SOULS to repent and actually come to CHRIST before it is forever too late .
Rather odd many can preach the same stuff on the left about their leaders
and yet curse trump
and the same for the evangelical camp . I bet , and please lets be honest shall we
That you in no way pray for biden , harris as you do for trump and vance .
AND you know full well i am dead set against satans liberal progressive movement .
SO when i say pray for them , ITS FOR THEIR SOULS TO REPENT .
and ps , seeing i am so dead set against the vile wicked policies of the vile wicked progressive liberal ,
YOU MIGHT wanna ask yourself , WHY IT IS I warn agaisnt a man and his VP
who both cliam to be against such policies . CAUSE THEY ARE AT WORK on the largest liberal progressive policy
INTERFIATH . WE BEEN DUPED buddy .
 
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amigo de christo

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The whole system needs to be revamped. That's what Trump and Musk are doing. They don't need my money.
you know what trump and musk and vance
and biden and harris have in common .
THEY ALL SERVE the agenda of THE COOPERATIONS OF THIS WORLD .
and the sooner we realize that so many are in the same bed
and just decieve the people , THE BETTER OFF we had been .
THIS IS A BIG OL FAT DELUSIONAL DOG AND PONY SHOW .
Satan has been unleashed , a delusoin has been unleashed
and it will take any and all whose hopes were in men . EVEN IF THEY TRIED TO SAY THEIR HOPE was in GOD .
cause our hope JUST cannot be IN BOTH .
The oddest thing has occured . The blind holler at the other blind
and all the while they both headed right into the lie , greater and greater darkness
and all the while the same blind on the left , the same blind on the right
Offer up the same blind dead end false love lie solutoin . It has reached all camps too .
The blind false religoins buy into it
the blind within christendom buy into it
and one thing that both sides have in common , MAN they hate them fundamental bible beleivers
who EXPOSE THE SINS OF BOTH SIDES . man they love to listen to stories
and pipers who have sold them a lie which they call love .
 

amigo de christo

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Where do you think all the money is going they're taking away from all the millions who will no longer be getting medical coverage, or social security, or any other programs that our tax dollars went into? lol

With 2 con men in the WH, it's going right into their pockets.

The fraud con game didn't stop just because they wear a Republican label.
a madhouse sister . a table of confusion of faces and all out reprobation has occurred .
The blind on the left holler at the blind on the right , accusing one the other
and yet all the while never knowing or seeing , THEY BOTH DUPED
and that both sides are being programmed unto the false solution by means ofa false love
to buy the LIE that , that while it promised peace n safety , will have led them all as one
RIGHT TO sudden destruction . This delusion has infiltrated all realms now .
And though it cries LOVE , HEED IT NOT
Its love is of the world and it has led them all
and will lead them all right to one final solution .
That the only doctrine that matters is does one love . and yet that there love WILL DENY JESUS THE CHRIST .
And one thing they will agree upon is
Their hatred of the fundamental bible beleiver JESUS CHRIST Following saint . HECK its already in their minds .
BOTH SIDES already twist and omit the parts of the bible that get in the way of what they love most
And both sides hate the words and reminders of the true saints . NOW WHY IS THAT
cause the true saints dont pick and choose what sins to expose , THEY EXPOSE THEM ALL and BOTH SIDES DO LOVE SINS .
 
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Jack

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you know what trump and musk and vance
and biden and harris have in common .
THEY ALL SERVE the agenda of THE COOPERATIONS OF THIS WORLD .
and the sooner we realize that so many are in the same bed
and just decieve the people , THE BETTER OFF we had been .
THIS IS A BIG OL FAT DELUSIONAL DOG AND PONY SHOW .
Satan has been unleashed , a delusoin has been unleashed
and it will take any and all whose hopes were in men . EVEN IF THEY TRIED TO SAY THEIR HOPE was in GOD .
cause our hope JUST cannot be IN BOTH .
The oddest thing has occured . The blind holler at the other blind
and all the while they both headed right into the lie , greater and greater darkness
and all the while the same blind on the left , the same blind on the right
Offer up the same blind dead end false love lie solutoin . It has reached all camps too .
The blind false religoins buy into it
the blind within christendom buy into it
and one thing that both sides have in common , MAN they hate them fundamental bible beleivers
who EXPOSE THE SINS OF BOTH SIDES . man they love to listen to stories
and pipers who have sold them a lie which they call love .
I'll take Trump and Musk over the Dems any day.
 
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Jack

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From bad to much less worse... ... there, fixed it for you

It's always really rich when those that enthusiastically support baby killing and grooming
children to become sex perverts accuse others of wrong doing. Always hilarious! View attachment 60472
Isn't it amazing how Dems try to destroy everything and everyone decent! Even their own country.
 
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TLHKAJ

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From baby murderers to Trump is bad to worse?
Why have you people totally excused and condoned Trump's involvement with child trafficking? He mkst certainly had close connections with Maxwell and Epstein, and bragged about the "really young ones" he was with. He has openly bragged about the sexual harassments and abuses he has committed, and spoke about his daughter's bodies to other men as if he were marketing them. This is okay??

Baby killing is heinous. And so is child sex trafficking. And don't think for one minute that Trump hasn't had his hand in that cookie jar. They all do it ...on both sides of the political coin.

And don't call me a "Dem" or a "liberal" just because I don't follow after a political figure.
 
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Dan Clarkston

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Isn't it amazing how Dems try to destroy everything and everyone decent! Even their own country.

Yep, they will protect their view point even if it means destroying the nation.... kinda like the calvinists who will support their doctrines of demons in opposition to the whole counsel of God and they don't give a fat rats backside what the Lord thinks about it... till they end up in hell.
 
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Jack

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Why have you people totally excused and condoned Trump's involvement with child trafficking? He mkst certainly had close connections with Maxwell and Epstein, and bragged about the "really young ones" he was with. He has openly bragged about the sexual harassments and abuses he has committed, and spoke about his daughter's bodies to other men as if he were marketing them. This is okay??

Baby killing is heinous. And so is child sex trafficking. And don't think for one minute that Trump hasn't had his hand in that cookie jar. They all do it ...on both sides of the political coin.

And don't call me a "Dem" or a "liberal" just because I don't follow after a political figure.
How long ago were Trump's 'crimes'? Are they proven, or just media hatred? Nearly all the media LIES like the Devil. I know he saved many babies' lives! I haven't noticed Planned Parenthood donating MILLIONS to Trump lately.
 
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TLHKAJ

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How long ago were Trump's 'crimes'? Are they proven, or just media hatred? Nearly all the media LIES like the Devil. I know he saved many babies' lives! I haven't noticed Planned Parenthood donating MILLIONS to Trump lately.
He has never repented or asked God's forgiveness, by his own admission ...he thinks he's above that. What makes you think his crimes have not continued. And ...I believe his victims who have given their testimonies. Their testimonies only confirm his braggings and public actions.