What Mormons Believe--according to a Former BYU Professor

[Grailhunter]

Thank you, Giuliano, that's a good point.

Giuliano give me a break...do we really want to comb the scriptures regarding see God, no see God, wrestle with God, visit God.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Understanding God's truth....as in, my religion is the only correct religion? And your religion is wrong because it is different? Very few take the Bible back to the language level and very few know the cultural context, so very few could get close to the truth. Still the Bible provides various concepts that can be legitimately interpreted different ways.....ie all the denominations. The basics are what is important....3X5 card....and do not slander God or deny the deity of Christ.

Are you copying and pasting comments you've made in this thread MANY times? It certainly seems like it. If you're married, I wonder how your wife would feel about having a conversation like this.

 

[Giuliano]

Thank you, Giuliano, that's a good point.

I think it should have been a big red flag. How did Smith fall for it? I really have always wondered how he allowed himself to be fooled in that way.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

I think it should have been a big red flag. How did Smith fall for it? I really have always wondered how he allowed himself to be fooled in that way.

Delusion?

 

[Giuliano]

Giuliano give me a break...do we really want to comb the scriptures regarding see God, no see God, wrestle with God, visit God.

We can do that. I assure you that the Jews do not believe Jacob was wrestling with the One True God.

 

[Grailhunter]

Are you copying and pasting comments you've made in this thread MANY times? It certainly seems like it. If you're married, I wonder how your wife would feel about having a conversation like this.

No copy and paste...no wife. Is the universe the face of God....the see..no see....the manifestations of God and can He manifest as He wishes and even if He does, is it His true face?

 

[Prayer Warrior]

We can do that. I assure you that the Jews do not believe Jacob was wrestling with the One True God.

Maybe you could start a new thread for that? :)

 

[Grailhunter]

We can do that. I assure you that the Jews do not believe Jacob was wrestling with the One True God.

Again, God can manifest in many ways and could we see the face of God...and I am not a Jew.

 

[Giuliano]

Delusion?

I incline to think spiritual pride was behind it. We all need to question ourselves. It seems to me maybe Smith didn't ask himself if he was seeing right. He just assumed he was seeing things right -- that is pride, I think.

 

[Giuliano]

Maybe you could start a new thread for that? :)

It might not turn out well.

 

[Grailhunter]

I incline to think spiritual pride was behind it. We all need to question ourselves. It seems to me maybe Smith didn't ask himself if he was seeing right. He just assumed he was seeing things right -- that is pride, I think.

Speculation....If you tell of a spiritual event that has happened to you....it is open to criticism.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

No copy and paste...no wife. Is the universe the face of God....the see..no see....the manifestations of God and can He manifest as He wishes and even if He does, is it His true face?

No, Jesus is the face of God....

Col 1:12-17--Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

 

[brakelite]

While I cannot imagine the Father with flesh and blood, nor can I however imagine Him without form. The angels behold His face. He is not some amorphous blob.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

While I cannot imagine the Father with flesh and blood, nor can I however imagine Him without form. The angels behold His face. He is not some amorphous blob.

He is not without form, but He does not have flesh and blood like the form of a man.

 

[Grailhunter]

No, Jesus is the face of God....

Col 1:12-17--Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

Who is the image of the invisible God......Jesus is the face of God.....invisible face?

 

[Prayer Warrior]

No, Jesus is the face of God....

Col 1:12-17--Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

John 14:9--Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? He that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

 

[brakelite]

Speculation....If you tell of a spiritual event that has happened to you....it is open to criticism.

Well sorry, but if a couple of dudes appeared to me with bright lights and claps of thunder and lightning, and said, " hey bro, I'm Jesus and this is my dad", I would be asking them for some proof. And not miracles... They're a dime a dozen nowadays.

 

[Grailhunter]

John 14:9--Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? He that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

You are assuming I do not know scripture.

 

[Giuliano]

Again, God can manifest in many ways and could we see the face of God...and I am not a Jew.

Yes, let us realize God can manifest in many ways. Consider the lilies of the field, for example. We can learn much about God by His almost infinite manifestations. It is impossible however for the human being to "see" what is nonphysical and beyond our comprehension. What we can see are manifestations -- if you see an angel, for example, you have not seen God Himself; but you have "seen" that God is a reality since you saw a manifestation of Him in one of His ministers.

Many of the prophets are careful when describing their visions since they know what they are seeing is not how things truly are. They frequently use expressions like "as it were" and "like unto."

 

[brakelite]

He is not without form, but He does not have flesh and blood like the form of a man.

when scripture says we were made in the image and likeness of God, I tend to think that in appearance, we have some similarities.