Christ vs the anti-Christ: Who is winning?

[Marymog]

No, sorry Mary, but your view isn't historically accurate.

I thank God for the Reformation, and it doesn't take much reading of Scripture to see that what you call "the church" was in error doctrinally and ruled in totalitarianism. History proves this.

I get what you're trying to promote: All is awry because not everyone is Catholic so if everyone were Catholic more would belong to Christ. No, Mary, more would be deceived because its gospel is not The Gospel.

I also get it that the moniker "Marymog" must mean "Mary, mother of God."

Anyhow, I've shown you biblically that Christ will save all he intends to save. You skipped right on over that truth. You don't really care about that, you just want everyone to be Catholic, so Biblical truth that dismantles your theory is overlooked because that really isn't on your agenda.

Please provide a biblical case for your OP or there is no reason to continue dialog.

Hi Preacher,

You thank God for the Church becoming divided and torn apart (the effect's of the Reformation)? I don't think that was God's doing so you should be ASKING him to restore His Church instead of thanking Him for something he didn't do.

You get to decide what is "in error doctrinally"? Since you KNOW the CC is in error please do tell me who else is in error?

You are conflating authority, which was given to the Apostles by Christ, with totalitarianism. Are you using totalitarianism when you and your ilk tell me that The Church was in error doctrinally? Or are you just trying to save my soul? Which one of you should I listen to? The Lutherans? Baptist? Methodist? Maybe the SDA's don't have any error in their doctrine? Who decides this???

I never said there was a biblical case for my OP. I am simply stating a facts. More people in this world are NOT Christian which means they do not follow the teaching of Christ. Do all facts have to be backed up with scripture?

Please provide a biblical case for NO Church authority. I can show you in Scripture where The Church has authority to decide what you and I will believe/practice.

Marymog (Mary, mother of God)

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Read my entire post instead of one portion of it......You have presented a nice theory.....it's not true.

So lets go with your theory. I talk to someone and give them the Truth of Scripture. They are gracious and listen to me. They then talk and give me their version of the Truth of Scripture. I am gracious and listen to them. They disagree with me. I disagree with them. We both were kind and fulfilled your criteria and listened to each other. Both of us have met your criteria for your theory "The one who bests listens to others....". HOWEVER neither of us are being heard by the other because we both believe we are right. We are both talking but not being heard by the other.....the other half of your theory.

What do we do? To whom do we go to settle the matter?

^This is not what I am advocating at all.

1) You meet person.
2) You care for and see the person as they actually are-- which includes listening to their beliefs and getting those facts straight. You don't have to agree, but you need to listen and understand.
3) You love them as Christ does.
4) They come to see that you really care and see Christ in you. They start to care.
5) You continue to serve.
6) Then you kindly share your views with them.

If the Spirit testifies of Christ and moves them, then they may change their beliefs. Regardless, you still keep loving and serving them.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

Hi Preacher,

You thank God for the Church becoming divided and torn apart (the effect's of the Reformation)? I don't think that was God's doing so you should be ASKING him to restore His Church instead of thanking Him for something he didn't do.

Yes, of course I thank God for this. The church was never divided, as you say, God simply brought his people out of Rome via the Reformation. In other words he kept his church intact. For that I am thankful.

 

[Naomi25]

I have struggled with this question and am not sure how to say that the teachings of Christ are winning. Even though some of the teachings are not anti-Christian teachings they don't conform to Christ teachings. There are over 7 billion people in this world, however, Christians only make up a little over 2 billion people. More people believe in a teaching that is not of Christ.

Is Satan winning?

I think we need to remember just HOW sovereign God is. The fall of mankind, Satan...everything, is not a "dang it" moment for God, and he's then spent all his time scrambling to get back on top. He's like a chess master, always ten moves ahead.
Are more perishing than are saved? Yes. But this is not a surprise. Jesus said that broad is the road to hell and many travel it. But...even beyond knowing that this is the case, what do we see about Christ's ministry? Do you remember when he had heaps of followers, and he told them that he was the bread of life; that they must 'eat his body and drink his blood'. They were, naturally, confused, and when he explained:

And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.” After this many of his disciples turned back and no longer walked with him. So Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you want to go away as well?” Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life, -John 6:65–68

He actually 'thinned his herd'. Why? Because in truth, while "many are called, only a few are chosen". And that's exactly how God has planned it.

So...is Satan winning? Not even a little. He might think he is. He's taken the line and he's running with it, but deep down he knows his time is short. He was always a defeated foe, even before Christ died on the cross, even back in the Garden; God made the prophecy that he would be defeated; and God's word always comes true.

 

[Phoneman777]

I have struggled with this question and am not sure how to say that the teachings of Christ are winning. Even though some of the teachings are not anti-Christian teachings they don't conform to Christ teachings. There are over 7 billion people in this world, however, Christians only make up a little over 2 billion people. More people believe in a teaching that is not of Christ.

Is Satan winning?

God is calling His people out of Babylon, a term meaning "religious confusion" derived from the Babel experience. There is no more a state of confusion so extreme and perilous as the state of believing man can create his own path to God. Babylon is comprised of among other things the false satanic systems of the world including Eastern religion, African spiritualism, etc. He says "come out of her, MY PEOPLE..." which means they are yet His people while they remain yet in Babylon.

 

[tzcho2]

Hmmmmmm...... (in general) One Church with One voice and One doctrine and One recognized leader of the Christian Church BEFORE the Reformation and then AFTER the Reformation everyone that could read suddenly knew better than The Church and they were personally guided by the Holy Spirit. The result: Now we have thousands of Churches with 2, 3 or 4 different interpretations of the same passage of Scripture with all of those different interpretation's given to them by the Holy Spirit. And you don't think the Reformation divided us or tore us apart? Have you read your Christian History?

You can't have heresy, false teachers or false gospels unless there is One authority to decide if it is a heretical teaching or if one is a false teacher or even what is Scripture if there isn't One authority soooooo your destroyed your own theory in your own statement.

There is one Scripture with 77 books. It is what The Church, One Church with authority, that decided what was Scripture roughly 1700 years ago. The Reformation changed that to 66 books......soooooo are you sure the Reformation didn't divide us and tear us apart? One Church before the Reformation.....thousands of Churches with hundreds of different teachings after the Reformation. We no longer speak as One. That was a positive....not a negative?

Mary

Yes the Reformation was a great thing. The RCC was/is very corrupt & adding their heretical false teachings, man- made writings & claiming the priests & Pope can forgive sins, RC dogma that has nothing to do with Jesus teachings & God's Word. It would have corrupted all of Christianity if it was allowed.

 

[Bobby Jo]

... Is Satan winning?

It's a thought provoking question, which seems fairly obvious to me. -- In the days of Noah the world had CLEARLY descended into sin and the world had to be destroyed by water. And so shall it be when the Son of Man is revealed when the world is destroyed by fire:

Luke 17:26
And as it was in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man: 27 They ate, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. 28 Likewise as it was also in the days of Lot: They ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built; 29 but on the day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. 30 Even so will it be in the day when the Son of Man is revealed.​

And so PLEASE expect that TODAY is the BEST DAY, because tomorrow with be worse, and the day after will be even worse, etc.

Sorry to have such a dismal forecast, but we are encouraged to ENDURE:

Rev. 13:10 ... Here is a call for the endurance and faith of the saints.
Rev. 14:12 Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.​

I hope you are "preparing" your household for these times, because they're here ...


With Best Regards,
Bobby Jo

 

[tzcho2]

If "winning" is a majority of people not following his teachings I would hate to see losing ;)

The Bible doesn't give us a head count as to who will be in heaven so, that is not the way to look at it. No person is fit to judge who is saved for the kingdom of heaven & who isn't or who is following Jesus teachings and who isn't. The Lord Jesus is the one who will judge.

 

[Nancy]

Major religious groups - Wikipedia

http://www.religionfacts.com/big-religion-chart

What are the most widely practiced religions of the world?

Does it matter???? I don't know......More people believe in a teaching that is not of Christ. Do you think it matters??

Mary

I think it matters in the area where we Christians lack-prayer against spiritual forces. I believe the more voices lifted to God at the same time would bring droves to Christ. It is true, sad and disturbing that most will not heed the Spirit of God, but not surprising.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

If "winning" is a majority of people not following his teachings I would hate to see losing ;)

Mary, can i ask you if you see Christ as being defeated at the crucifixion and satan winning? It had to appear so to many at that time, but not so. Consider what men saw with their eyes, the King of the Jews defeated and overcome by evil. But that wasn’t so. 2 Corinthians 13:4 For though he was crucified through weakness, yet he liveth by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we shall live with him by the power of God toward you.

 

[pompadour]

The bible said that the devil (Lucifer) was created by GOD ( how could HE defeat GOD) Lucifer tried to be like GOD. GOD judged him and sentenced him to turn to ashes from with in. Jesus defeated Lucifer on the cross.
How could Lucifer be winning?

There is so much going on in the world and the spirit realm that we do not know. GOD is in control and has a plan that we could not understand even if HE told us. God created the heavens and the Angles billions of years ago. What has been going all that time? WE don't know.
There is evidence of a very advanced civilization on Earth millions of years ago. If one would bother to look. (planet x )
In Genies Adam and Eve were the first people on Earth. NOT! When GOD kicked Cain out of the Garden of Edin, Cain said that the people would kill him so GOD put a mark on his head so they would not kill him. Cain then went into a far land and took him a wife. Where did the people and the wife come from.

John said that these things Jesus did and said and were written down in books so you would know. Then said that Jesus did and said many other thing, and if they were all written down in books I'm not sure the world could contain them all. ( there is a lot we don't know about what Jesus did and said.) Jesus told the Apostles, not even the half was told to them. ( A hole bunch more we don't know.)

Jesus said I must go, I have other folds I must tend to. WHAT! Who are are they? and how many others are there, and where are they? So much we don't know.
Trust GOD believe in Jesus and do the best you can, and keep your faith strong.
God has not carried out Lucifer's sentence yet. He will be cast out of Haven and thrown down to Earth soon. Where He will cause the great tribulation. God has a plain. Trust God.

 

[Enoch111]

There are over 7 billion people in this world, however, Christians only make up a little over 2 billion people.

That is how it has been and will always be. And your number of Christians could be on the high side. But there were only eight souls saved during Noah's Flood. That is reflected in the parable of the narrow gate and the broad gate, where only a few enter the narrow gate and the narrow way.

At the same time, God allows Satan and his evil angels freedom for *a season*. But when all is said and done, the Kingdom of God will be established on earth under the Lord Jesus Christ, while the Devil, the Beast (the Antichrist), and the False prophet remain eternally in the Lake of Fire (along with all the evil angels and the unrighteous). For those who scoff at the existence of a literal Hell, this is something they have to grapple with.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

I have struggled with this question and am not sure how to say that the teachings of Christ are winning. Even though some of the teachings are not anti-Christian teachings they don't conform to Christ teachings. There are over 7 billion people in this world, however, Christians only make up a little over 2 billion people. More people believe in a teaching that is not of Christ.

Is Satan winning?

I think that the number of true Christians is significantly lower than 2 billion. Does that mean Satan is winning? No he isn't. You have to keep Gods purpose in mind. What is God purpose for the Earth I ask. Did God create a planet Earth to Stand for a little while then vanish? Wasn't it God's purpose for the Earth to stand forever? God created Adam with the purpose of Adam living forever on a paradise Earth did he not? Adam represents humanity does he not? Is God purpose stopped because what happened in Eden regarding the serpent and Adam and Eve? Doesn't the scriptures tell us that whatever God wishes to do or whatever God purpose is, that purpose will happen or be fulfilled?

 

[Taken]

I have struggled with this question and am not sure how to say that the teachings of Christ are winning. Even though some of the teachings are not anti-Christian teachings they don't conform to Christ teachings. There are over 7 billion people in this world, however, Christians only make up a little over 2 billion people. More people believe in a teaching that is not of Christ.

Is Satan winning?

In very simple terms, in Brief, and with an Unchanging God in Control.

God WANTS, all to Believe In Christ Jesus.
....ALL Will believe In Christ Jesus.
....But not all Saved, because of timing of
....when they come into belief.

God has prepared a place for ALL men.
....The Place is called Earth.

Earth is Dry Land.
....A renewed Earth will be Dry Land without seas. (Oceans as are now).

"SAVED" believers shall occupy the Surface/Area of the Dry Land WITH their King.

"UNSAVED" believers shall occupy the Volume/Area within the Earth, WITHOUT thee Lord God King.

The Division of Water currently between Heaven and the Earths Surface shall be Opened.

The Division between the Crust of the Earth and Center of the Earth shall be Separated by Water.
(Same as when the flood waters were asuaged from dry land, separating the saved from the unsaved.)
(Same as when (before Jesus) a great fixed gulf of water separated the saved from the unsaved.)

Population exponentially growing projected to nearly One Billion per 20 year spans.

Bottom Line. All will Believe, by their own declaration, just as God desires.

So, if there is a Race to be won, God Prevails.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[brakelite]

One Church with One voice and One doctrine and One recognized leader of the Christian Church BEFORE the Reformation

I did a back and forth with BoL on this topic...he flatly rejects history and imagines that the churches in Celtic Britain...Ethiopia...Assyria...Afghanistan...and China among others, were the result of Catholic missionary endeavours. A laughable concept as the Papal church didn't exist until the 6th century as an organised religious entity...until then it was of a similar nature as any other church in the world...independent and having an overseer (bishop) who did not seek glory and pompous power over the entire Christian world church. BoL would have us believe that the Waldensian church was not a Christian church at all, but some heretical offshoot worthy of death...just as the Papal church thought several centuries ago by attempting to wipe them out. Are you aware Mary that entire nations in China (Seres) were Christian in the middle ages? That some of Genghis Khan's children and grandchildren were converted to Christianity as a result of missionaries from Persia and those Princes and Princesses of the Khan dynasty ruled over millions of Christians who had for themselves bishops (they called metropolitans) who oversaw hundreds of churches?

Maybe the SDA's don't have any error in their doctrine? Who decides this???

YOU DO!!! Or do you think yourself incapable of comparing SDA beliefs with scripture? Oh, of course. You don't believe in the authority of scripture. You just do as your church says. So if your church says SDAs are wrong, then they, the CC, must be right? So the CC is the final authority as to who is right and who is wrong. Guess what. When I am standing before the throne of God and am asked to justify my beliefs and practice, and to to give account for my life of faith and practice, I will not have the Pope standing at my side holding my hand and defending me. I will point to my Bible and simply say..."Thus saith the Lord"...

 

[mjrhealth]

I did a back and forth with BoL on this topic...he flatly rejects history and imagines that the churches in Celtic Britain...Ethiopia...Assyria...Afghanistan...and China among others, were the result of Catholic missionary endeavours. A laughable concept as the Papal church didn't exist until the 6th century as an organised religious entity...until then it was of a similar nature as any other church in the world...independent and having an overseer (bishop) who did not seek glory and pompous power over the entire Christian world church. BoL would have us believe that the Waldensian church was not a Christian church at all, but some heretical offshoot worthy of death...just as the Papal church thought several centuries ago by attempting to wipe them out. Are you aware Mary that entire nations in China (Seres) were Christian in the middle ages? That some of Genghis Khan's children and grandchildren were converted to Christianity as a result of missionaries from Persia and those Princes and Princesses of the Khan dynasty ruled over millions of Christians who had for themselves bishops (they called metropolitans) who oversaw hundreds of churches?
YOU DO!!! Or do you think yourself incapable of comparing SDA beliefs with scripture? Oh, of course. You don't believe in the authority of scripture. You just do as your church says. So if your church says SDAs are wrong, then they, the CC, must be right? So the CC is the final authority as to who is right and who is wrong. Guess what. When I am standing before the throne of God and am asked to justify my beliefs and practice, and to to give account for my life of faith and practice, I will not have the Pope standing at my side holding my hand and defending me. I will point to my Bible and simply say..."Thus saith the Lord"...

And what makes there religion wrong and your religion right, don the mormans believe they are right as so do the JW's the Anglicans etc etc, they will all just like you try justify there religion , because the bible says. Even you said all mens religions are an abomination, as do the catholics @Marymog who say theirs is the only right one. Jesus said there is only one way to heaven, by Him ,not any of mens abominations,

What a man is joined to.

Mat 6:20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
Mat 6:21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

There is no religion in this world that will stand righteous before Jesus when he comes.

 

[mjrhealth]

As to the OP.

God won before this all started, it is men who are loosing because they turned there backs on God, and the devil will have his little battle win, but his time is short, and he will bring death upon many before its over.

 

[Taken]

One man was given authority by Gods Promise to be the father of many Nations.

Abraham

One Spirit came forth out from God in the likeness as a man, as the Son of God and Son of man.

Abraham

Every man of the Nations of the Earth who becomes a son of God and son of man.

Becomes a son of;

Abraham

Abraham is a Converted mans Promised Earthly "FAITHFUL" father.

God is a Converted mans declared Holy Heavenly Father.

Not sure why people make up and appoint other men their "father"/ "holy father".

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[brakelite]

And what makes there religion wrong and your religion right, don the mormans believe they are right as so do the JW's the Anglicans etc etc, they will all just like you try justify there religion , because the bible says. Even you said all mens religions are an abomination, as do the catholics @Marymog who say theirs is the only right one. Jesus said there is only one way to heaven, by Him ,not any of mens abominations,

What a man is joined to.

Mat 6:20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
Mat 6:21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

There is no religion in this world that will stand righteous before Jesus when he comes.

The apostle James said...faith without works is dead. Now it is inevitable that groups of people...and individuals...who find themselves practising the same works as a result or fruit of their faith, will end up congregating together. That is how all churches started. They organised, because they considered by doing so their missionary activity could all the better be accomplished. This is what took place throughout history. That isn't creating a religion. It is following the example as set out by the apostles themselves, who appointed deacons, bishops, and provided for the needy among them. Even Christ sent people out "two by two" and had them report to "head office" so that He could guide and lead them further into faith and works.
In the time of the apostles, their field, or so they thought, was Israel. The Roman army dispersed them to Syria...Perea. They discovered a whole world out there hungry for the gospel. The churches they established organised themselves into well organised missionary stations, schools, hospitals, and centers for copying scriptures. Long before the Catholic church grew to its political power trip, God had an organised well oiled machine doing His work. Nothing to do with your warped view of "religion". Today, the world is in even more desperate need of the gospel. It is a global need. The gospel is a global message. And only a global church can effectively deliver that global message.

 

[mjrhealth]

The apostle James said...faith without works is dead.

Yes whos works

Joh_7:7 The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil.

why

Joh_10:37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.

because

Luk 17:7 But which of you, having a servant plowing or feeding cattle, will say unto him by and by, when he is come from the field, Go and sit down to meat?
Luk 17:8 And will not rather say unto him, Make ready wherewith I may sup, and gird thyself, and serve me, till I have eaten and drunken; and afterward thou shalt eat and drink?
Luk 17:9 Doth he thank that servant because he did the things that were commanded him? I trow not.
Luk 17:10 So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do.
If we do it to be approved of God, so eh can give us a pat on the back or to "earn" His love than it is all the flesh and profits nothing, we do what we do because it is what is expected of us, not to earn browny points, As for religion well we have some fine points of what is does right here on this forum and for all the preaching yet so few follow after Christ, and when He comes for those who are His the churches will still be fill,

Mar 7:6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
Mar 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Religion is just egypt with a different pharaoh who wont let Gods people go so they can worship Him, which is why it is written

Rev_18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

And many have come out, some not knowing what to do because religion has taught them nothing.