A bit of a mess in the White House.

[amigo de christo]

The love they embrace is that of a Whore !
For they are of this world, that Jesus pointed out, is Full of Deceptions and Delusions !
Get that Jesus said Full of such !
We steped into it from birth ! it's just like stepping into dog do do ? but one can try and avoid such ! but how many just keep on with it ? on every level, one could say ?
My father and mother inlaw are in their 90's and some people go and tell of all of their own troubles and want to be helped out with money all the time, to people in their 90's !
It's such people who have ---- in their own Nest ! and brought everything on themselves in fact ! it's a never ending story.

Just like all of the issues of nowadays, it's all been brought on by ignorant slobs and fools ! and they want it to all hit the fan !

I got asked to be the Godfather to a 17yo and 19yo and his wife 44yo, who have just became Christians, I said No !
I am to old, he wants me to look after them and I can not look after them. only if they ask for Spiritual advice or some direction, but I do that for anyone.
I do not need dramer in my life or to force my wife to deal with more on her plate.
Am I being wrong ? Amigo.

why would anyone even go for that title Godfather . we aint GOD . no reggie i would not have taken that title either .

 

[Triumph1300]

Paul , as we can see , had his hope not in this world but in the LORD .
And so too do the sheep .
When the vapor of this life is done and all stand before CHRIST
the goats will realize too late what the sheep by grace had known all along .
That eternal life is forever and the blink we lived in was but for a speck of time .
And the sheep had hope in that which was not yet seen but had waited for it all along .
Their hearts hope simply was not in the earthen
but in the KINGDOM above and THE KING JESUS who had saved them .
Hope that is seen is not hope but what we wait for , what it not yet seen
BUT IS TRUE , IS REAL , IS ABOVE and NOT EARTHEN but one day shall descend
This life all will realize was but a blink
but the sheep , UNLIKE the goats whose hope was in men and the earthen , shall rejoice forever
the goats shall wail .
WHAT TRULY MATTERED SISTER
was not this life
IT was THIS LIFE , ETERNAL LIFE and WHO IS LIFE , BUT JESUS THE CHRIST and HE GIVETH LIFE
unto all who do beleive . IN this here life ye shall have tribulations , BUT BE OF GOOD CHEER
JESUS overcame this world , our faith in HIM so too do we . ITS NOT ABOUT THIS LIFE for me sister
IT USED TO BE , but now by grace its all about KNOWING HE WHO GIVETH THE TRUE ETERNAL LIFE
so that all who do BELEIVE IN HIM shall never die . this promise HAS NOT THE GOATS for the goats
BELEIVE NOT HIS WORDS and hope NOT IN HIS KINGDOM but rather in the earthern
and these cares and pleasures in this life . This life will not last sister
and its quite clear if anyone has eyes to see . FOR many generations have come and they have gone
But THERE IS TRUE LIFE , ETERNAL LIFE , and though the body die that soul shall live forever .
AND HIS WORDS are spirit and they are life and meat to the lambs . many eat from the tables of men and drink
of the cisterns of men , that bread cannot GIVE LIFE and them waters cannot give life . they drinking
FROM THE WRONG CISTERN and eaten of the wrong bread .

THE DECEPTOIN IS FAR AND WIDE NOW .

Paul , as we can see , had his hope not in this world but in the LORD .
And so too do the sheep .

Do not put your hope in this world, correct.
There is no hope in the political system.
Put your hope in Christ.

Slowly the US is on a path to civil war.
Be aware that the enemy is in full force trying to destroy the US.
Don't under estimate this effort.

 

[marks]

This was within the church, the body of Christ. We are not to confuse/conflate the church with government. The church is of God's spirit, government is of the world and its spirit. Now the bible says we may "use" the things of this world as practically necessary, but we are not to be enamoured or caught up with and entangled with those things. We need to discern between the holy and the common/profane and keep them separate....this is a huge theme in scripture.

Of course I agree with these things.

The thought was summarized in the part I quoted.

And do you understand the value, that should you see the poor being cheated in the marketplace, and you have the means to set that aright, that you so do? Or do you advocate just turning a blind eye and letting it go on?

Do you really think we should not be any earthly good? Should we only help those within the church, and leave the rest of the world to rot? I can't imagine that's really what you think!

Much love!

 

[Triumph1300]

In many cases the church is no hair better than the world.
Both need help, both are in trouble.

 

[Lizbeth]

Of course I agree with these things.

The thought was summarized in the part I quoted.

And do you understand the value, that should you see the poor being cheated in the marketplace, and you have the means to set that aright, that you so do? Or do you advocate just turning a blind eye and letting it go on?

Do you really think we should not be any earthly good? Should we only help those within the church, and leave the rest of the world to rot? I can't imagine that's really what you think!

Much love!

There is a way that seemeth so right to man......it seems right to the natural mind of natural man. We need the mind of Christ, and as believers we know there is only one solution for the ills and evils of this world brother. And that is what the church should be occupied with. If we can help in practical ways then we should do that too as we have means and opportunity. But Jesus didn't give us a mandate to take on governments........our mandate is to get souls saved through the gospel, as many as are appointed to eternal life.

God is ruling and reigning in all these things and "governments" are His business, not the church's. Israel was under the boot of Roman rule and oppression in the time of Jesus........it was the just judgment of God for her sins and apostasy. What did Jesus do about that and how worked up was He about it? Dealing with that the world's way was a temptation He had to overcome and flee....He repudiated it when the devil tempted Him in the desert and He fled it when the people tried to crown Him King of Israel. He remained submitted and obedient to the will of the Father, rather than walking in man's ways, and He understood there was only one solution, one way, and that is what He laid down His life for, setting the example that we should follow. It was even a reason why He was rejected as Israel's messiah....they were expecting a worldly king who would do things in a worldly way to free them from political oppression.

2Ti 2:4
No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.

 

[marks]

We need the mind of Christ,

The mind of Christ brings the Law of Love. Serve Christ in loving others, though whatever means God has placed in your disposal. The Bible teaches us to care for others spiritual and and and natural needs, not one to the exclusion of others.

Much love!

 

[marks]

..He repudiated it when the devil tempted Him in the desert and He fled it when the people tried to crown Him King of Israel.

You've never answered me, that I remember, do you believe that no Christian should have a role in human government? That only unbelievers and evildoers should be in leadership roles?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Israel was under the boot of Roman rule and oppression in the time of Jesus........it was the just judgment of God for her sins and apostasy. What did Jesus do about that and how worked up was He about it?

Jesus was actually Who was responsible for Israel being under Roman rule. That was part of their punishment for disobedience, and failure to keep the Law of the Temple as given to Ezekiel. Israel was cast out and put under gentile rule according to God's Law in Leviticus 26.

So, I'm not sure that's a straight across comparison. For us, I think the idea is, whatever position you are in, use it to serve the Lord, by serving others out of your love for them. And Paul taught that if we have opportunity to improve our position (the slave being able to obtain freedom), use it.

We should not neglect the means at our disposal to do good in this world. Yes, of course, not as a replacement for God, but in our service to God, and to others.

Much love!

 

[Wick Stick]

I would have thought of all people that conservative evangelicals and in America of all places, would be against the mixing of church and state.

The American separation of church and state was intended to go one way - that our federal government should not legislate some certain religion as the national religion. Many of the European settlers in the early American colonies came from places where this had happened and moved here as a result.

It was NOT originally intended to prevent churches from participating in politics, education, etc.

It also wasn't intended to stop individual states from being founded on certain religions. Maryland, for example, was founded as a Catholic state. New York by the Dutch Reformed. Pennsylvania by Quakers.

The separation of church and state is VASTLY OVERSTATED in America.

 

[Wrangler]

Saw this meme and though of this thread.

 

[ProDeo]

Saw this meme and though of this thread.

View attachment 61174

Budapest Memorandum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Forgot about that?

The US and some EU countries signed a contract to protect Ukraine.

Biden did.

The EU did.

Trump is about to break that treaty.

 

[Wrangler]

Budapest Memorandum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Forgot about that?

The US and some EU countries signed a contract to protect Ukraine.

Biden did.

The EU did.

Trump is about to break that treaty.

1st, You keep showing your ignorance of American politics. Under our Constitution, the POTUS does NOT have the authority to enter into treaties; that is the domain of the emissaries of the sovereign States, aka the US Senate.

2nd, what Biden did, Trump can undo.

3rd, motherly wisdom applies. Just because your friends jump off a financial bridge, is no reason for you to jump off a financial bridge.

4th, the citation you provided does not bind the US in the Ukraine-Russia war. Indeed, it restricts such action. Excerpt:

The memoranda, signed in Patria Hall at the Budapest Convention Center with U.S. Ambassador Donald M. Blinken amongst others in attendance,[3] prohibited Russia, the United States, and the United Kingdom from threatening or using military force or economic coercion against Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan, "except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations."​

 

[ProDeo]

1st, You keep showing your ignorance of American politics. Under our Constitution, the POTUS does NOT have the authority to enter into treaties; that is the domain of the emissaries of the sovereign States, aka the US Senate.

2nd, what Biden did, Trump can undo.

3rd, motherly wisdom applies. Just because your friends jump off a financial bridge, is no reason for you to jump off a financial bridge.

4th, the citation you provided does not bind the US in the Ukraine-Russia war. Indeed, it restricts such action. Excerpt:

The memoranda, signed in Patria Hall at the Budapest Convention Center with U.S. Ambassador Donald M. Blinken amongst others in attendance,[3] prohibited Russia, the United States, and the United Kingdom from threatening or using military force or economic coercion against Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan, "except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations."​

A treaty is a treaty and I don't have to be an American expert to understand what that means. Putin the dictator who kills every political opponent (Alexei Navalny and Yevgeny Prigozhin as the last 2 examples) broke the treaty in 2014 taking Ukraine land, the annexation of Crimea because Putin could not live with democratic choice of the majority of the Ukraine people to belong to the EU, starting a war in the east of the country supporting the separatists with Russian weapons and shot MH17 resulting in about 300 deaths, the majority Dutch people, upon this day still denying he (Putin) had nothing to do with the crime while the evidence is overwhelming.

The List Is Long: Russians Who Have Died After Running Afoul Of The Kremlin

The list of influential Russians who have been killed or died under murky circumstances after opposing, criticizing, or crossing Putin, the Kremlin, or the state is long. The latest addition is Aleksei Navalny, who crusaded against corruption and led anti-Kremlin protests.

www.rferl.org

Putin stepping into the footsteps of Stalin, killing every opposition.

Good luck making a deal with that man, president Biden after he met Putin -

• Biden said he once told Putin "I don't think you have a soul" during a 2011 visit to Russia.
• He said Putin replied, "We understand one another."

And that was 3 years before the trouble began.

 

[Wrangler]

A treaty is a treaty and I don't have to be an American expert to understand what that means.

<sigh> From your own citation that restricts US action and does not compel US action:

Budapest Memorandum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It's called the Budapest Memorandum, not the Budapest Treaty. A memorandum a memorandum and not a treaty. Again, from your own citation:

Russia violated the Budapest memorandum in 2014 with its annexation of Ukraine's Crimea.[6][7] As a response, the United States, United Kingdom, and France provided Ukraine with financial and military assistance, and imposed economic sanctions on Russia, while ruling out "any direct interventions to avoid a direct confrontation with Russia".[6]​

Notice how providing financial assistance is not given as a provision of the memorandum (or of the treaty)? Russia acted to violate what? Not the treaty but the memorandum. The US NOT providing financial assistance is NOT a violation of the memorandum.

What desperation to claim otherwise AND double down on it.

 

[Lizbeth]

You've never answered me, that I remember, do you believe that no Christian should have a role in human government? That only unbelievers and evildoers should be in leadership roles?

Much love!

I did answer that. I said something along the lines that I believe we should be as Daniel and Joseph in our secular jobs, which are merely practical, and do whatsoever we do as unto the Lord, for His glory.

Brother, we should just hear what the Spirit is saying instead of trying to reason. We are not to lean on our own understanding......because God's ways and thoughts are not as man's ways and thoughts....they are higher than man's. And for things we don't understand, we can seek Him for the wisdom and understanding..

 

[Lizbeth]

The American separation of church and state was intended to go one way - that our federal government should not legislate some certain religion as the national religion. Many of the European settlers in the early American colonies came from places where this had happened and moved here as a result.

It was NOT originally intended to prevent churches from participating in politics, education, etc.

It also wasn't intended to stop individual states from being founded on certain religions. Maryland, for example, was founded as a Catholic state. New York by the Dutch Reformed. Pennsylvania by Quakers.

The separation of church and state is VASTLY OVERSTATED in America.

I don't think there is such a thing as a one-way union. Otherwise it isn't a union. If you're mixing church and state together, it is by definition and nature going to be two-way, and historically it doesn't work out well at all. Just look at the bloody mess England was for centuries.

But then people's definitions of what they think of as being good or evil can be very changeable. There was a time when we in the largely Christianized west thought that persecuting the true gospel and believers was a bad thing...no guarantee at all that this will be the same thought process going forward in a time when good is called evil, and evil good, and truth is being thrown to the ground. Some of us here trying to remain true to God's word are already being called a disease and labelled as obstructionists. The whole idea of not mixing church and state was because of being wise to the flaws and weakness and fickleness of fallen human nature and was meant to safeguard against it.......but apostasy and sin leads to a loss of wisdom.

 

[Rockerduck]

I don't think there is such a thing as a one-way union. Otherwise it isn't a union. If you're mixing church and state together, it is by definition and nature going to be two-way, and historically it doesn't work out well at all. Just look at the bloody mess England was for centuries.

But then people's definitions of what they think of as being good or evil can be very changeable. There was a time when we in the largely Christianized west thought that persecuting the true gospel and believers was a bad thing...no guarantee at all that this will be the same thought process going forward in a time when good is called evil, and evil good, and truth is being thrown to the ground. Some of us here trying to remain true to God's word are already being called a disease and labelled as obstructionists. The whole idea of not mixing church and state was because of being wise to the flaws and weakness and fickleness of fallen human nature and was meant to safeguard against it.......but apostasy and sin leads to a loss of wisdom.

Separation of church and state does not exist in our constitution. There is a clause to not prevent the free exercise of religion. President Obama told churches that if they preach politics, they will lose their 503c status. That backed churches off but should not have. Churches have the right to preach the gospel and warn of pollical views. A pastor leads a church in Christ discipleship and should not be required to put their head in the sand. If abortion is wrong, the church should say it without fear. The church stands against immorality and the Obama administration was out to punish anyone who disagreed with "woke", and DEI policies. He lit the White House with rainbow colors. Anti-Christ he was.

 

[NayborBear]

Separation of church and state does not exist in our constitution. There is a clause to not prevent the free exercise of religion. President Obama told churches that if they preach politics, they will lose their 503c status. That backed churches off but should not have. Churches have the right to preach the gospel and warn of pollical views. A pastor leads a church in Christ discipleship and should not be required to put their head in the sand. If abortion is wrong, the church should say it without fear. The church stands against immorality and the Obama administration was out to punish anyone who disagreed with "woke", and DEI policies. He lit the White House with rainbow colors. Anti-Christ he was.

Gotta agree with ya Rockerduck!
The Victory is Assured!
Still have to "suit up" AND Fight though!
That's been the problem for WAY TOO long! And the reason why these several states have fallen so deep into this rabbit hole of darkness and perversiveness!
God is showing us even NOW that the democratic party have hitched their "collective" train cars to this "hell bound train!" Another way of putting it is the "left" have allowed people in their boat! But the have not come to float with 'em! No! They went aboard with drills! To drill holes in the boat! It's SINKING! And those who still "reverence/fear" God (which is the beginning of wisdom" are seeing this and like rats? Are bailing out!
To quote a cliche?
NOW is the time for all GOOD men to COME to the aid of their country!
If that includes getting into "politics?"
Gonna have to stand STRONG!
NO COMPROMISE!

 

[marks]

There is a way that seemeth so right to man......it seems right to the natural mind of natural man.

I have this distinct impression you are seeing stereotypes and not seeing me. But that's the way forums go, I suppose!

Much love!

 

[marks]

Separation of church and state does not exist in our constitution. There is a clause to not prevent the free exercise of religion.

If I remember my history lessons, the idea was that the state would not be allowed to elevate one Christian denomination over another, lest we end up with something like the Church of England.

Giving good governance is just one more things Christians should be doing, in my opinion. Those who think Christians should stay out of government would have us all ruled by evildoers, lest any Christian be found to be fleshy corrupt governors.

But I think that if someone serves Christ, and someone else doesn't, all other things being equal, I'd sooner have the one who serves Christ.

Much love!