I don't know a great deal about Ms.White either. However,I do know there were women Apostles,and there are women called to ministry by God. So,perhaps Ms.White spoke to those God intended for his understanding .
From the pen of Ellen White
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It is telling that the above beautiful testimony to the love of God has been ignored by all those who came into this thread with the sole purpose to denigrate it.This is, by far, my favorite:
What Was Secured by the Death of Christ
It became Him for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in the redemption of the world to save sinners by the blood of the Lamb. The great sacrifice of the Son of God was neither too great nor too small to accomplish the work. In the wisdom of God it was complete; and the atonement made testifies to every son and daughter of Adam the immutability of God's law. The value of the law of Jehovah is to be estimated by the immense price that was paid in the death of the Son of God to maintain its sacredness.
The law of God is a transcript of His character; it portrays the nature of God. As in Christ we behold the brightness of His glory, the express image of His person, so also in the law the attributes of the Father are unfolded. Although the law is unchangeable, His having provided a means of salvation for the law-breaker does not in the least detract from the dignity of the character of God, since the penalty of man's transgression was borne by a divine Substitute. The Father Himself suffered with the Son; for "God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself." Man, with his human, finite judgment, cannot safely question the wisdom of God. Hence it is unbecoming for him to criticize the plan of salvation. Before the theme of redemption, let man lay his wisdom in the dust, and accept the plans of Him whose wisdom is infinite.
God grants men a probation in this world, that their principles may become firmly established in the right, thus precluding the possibility of sin in the future life, and so assuring the happiness and security of all. Through the atonement of the Son of God alone could power be given to man to establish him in righteousness, and make him a fit subject for heaven. The blood of Christ is the eternal antidote for sin. The offensive character of sin is seen in what it cost the Son of God in humiliation, in suffering and death. All the worlds behold in Him a living testimony to the malignity of sin, for in His divine form He bears the marks of the curse. He is in the midst of the throne as a Lamb that hath been slain. The redeemed will ever be vividly impressed with the hateful character of sin, as they behold Him who died for their transgressions. The preciousness of the Offering will be more fully realized as the blood-washed throng more fully comprehend how God has made a new and living way for the salvation of men, through the union of the human and the divine in Christ.
The death of Christ upon the cross made sure the destruction of him who has the power of death, who was the originator of sin. When Satan is destroyed, there will be none to tempt to evil; the atonement will never need to be repeated; and there will be no danger of another rebellion in the universe of God. That which alone can effectually restrain from sin in this world of darkness, will prevent sin in heaven. The significance of the death of Christ will be seen by saints and angels. Fallen men could not have a home in the paradise of God without the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Shall we not then exalt the cross of Christ? The angels ascribe honor and glory to Christ, for even they are not secure except by looking to the sufferings of the Son of God. It is through the efficacy of the cross that the angels of heaven are guarded from apostasy. Without the cross they would be no more secure against evil than were the angels before the fall of Satan. Angelic perfection failed in heaven. Human perfection failed in Eden, the paradise of bliss. All who wish for security in earth or heaven must look to the Lamb of God. The plan of salvation, making manifest the justice and love of God, provides an eternal safeguard against defection in unfallen worlds, as well as among those who shall be redeemed by the blood of the Lamb. Our only hope is perfect trust in the blood of Him who can save to the uttermost all that come unto God by Him. The death of Christ on the cross of Calvary is our only hope in this world, and it will be our theme in the world to come.
Oh, we do not comprehend the value of the atonement! If we did, we would talk more about it. The gift of God in His beloved Son was the expression of an incomprehensible love. It was the utmost that God could do to preserve the honor of His law, and still save the transgressor. Why should man not study the theme of redemption? It is the greatest subject that can engage the human mind. If men would contemplate the love of Christ, displayed in the cross, their faith would be strengthened to appropriate the merits of His shed blood, and they would be cleansed and saved from sin. There are many who will be lost, because they depend on legal religion, or mere repentance for sin. But repentance for sin alone cannot work the salvation of any soul. Man cannot be saved by his own works. Without Christ it is impossible for him to render perfect obedience to the law of God; and heaven can never be gained by an imperfect obedience; for this would place all heaven in jeopardy, and make possible a second rebellion.
God saves man through the blood of Christ alone, and man's belief in, and allegiance to, Christ is salvation. It is no marvel to angels that the infinite sacrifice made by the Son of God was ample enough to bring salvation to a fallen race, but that this atoning sacrifice should have been made is a wonder to the universe. It is a mystery which angels desire to look into. The angels are amazed at the indifference and coldness manifested by those for whom so great a salvation has been provided. They look with grief and holy indignation upon those who do not seek to appreciate the unspeakable gift of God. Instead of offering adoration to God, finite men think themselves capable, without divine unction, of determining what is worthy of praise or blame in their fellow-men. But to be glorified by man is no glory. We should learn to value the praise of man at what it is worth.
The Lord says, "Them that honor me I will honor." Let every breath of praise, every word of exaltation, flow to Him who is worthy, flow to Jesus, the Prince of life, the Lamb of God that taketh away the sin of the world. Elevate the cross of Christ. Elevate the Mediator. Lift up Jesus. In Him is everything noble. Contemplate God in Christ. He is surrounded with angels, cherubim and seraphim continually behold Him. Angelic voices day and night cry before Him: "Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.... Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honor and power; for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created." "Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honor, and glory, and blessing." "Great and marvelous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints. Who shall not fear thee, O Lord, and glorify thy name? for thou only art holy; for all nations shall come and worship before thee." But although God only is holy and worthy to be praised, human tongues are perverted to praise and glorify man rather than God.
The greatest gift that God could bestow upon men was bestowed in the gift of His beloved Son. The apostle says, "He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?" There was nothing held in reserve. No second probation will ever be provided. If the unspeakable gift of God does not lead man to repentance, there is nothing that ever will move his heart. There is no power held in reserve to act upon his mind, and arouse his sensibilities. The whole character of God was revealed in His Son, the whole range of the possibilities of heaven is displayed for the acceptance of man in the Son of the Infinite One. The way for man's return to God and heaven has no barriers. The matchless depths of the Saviour's love have been demonstrated; and if this manifestation of God's love for the children of men does not prevail to draw men to Himself, there is nothing that ever will.
Those who will be saved in the kingdom of God will be those who have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. The image of Christ will be perfected in every soul who accepts the gift of His grace, and those who are perfected through His grace, will stand before God equal in elevation, in power and purity, to the angels, and will be honored with them before the eternal throne. The angels of heaven will love those whom Christ has loved, and has bought with His own precious blood.
The attention of all the inhabitants of all worlds will be directed to the cross of Christ, around which will cluster the exceeding and eternal weight of glory. The imagination becomes exhausted in its stretch to comprehend the wonderful work of redemption. The plan of salvation is too high to be fully reached by human thought. It is too grand to be fully embraced by finite comprehension. The apostle says, "Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him." Can we wonder that Heaven is amazed because men act as though the gift of God were valueless? What will be the eternal loss of those who reject so great a salvation, offered freely through the merits of God's only-begotten and well-beloved Son!
Originally published in The Signs of the Times, December 30, 1889. (In the wake of the Minneapolis General Conference Session)
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I do notice denegration is very popular among some of the same people and in most threads.
Telling.
Hobie
Well-Known Member
Well, cant go into a conspiracy mode on everything being done, but you have to watch and see whats behind it.
We approach so many so called set-in- concrete scriptures as if God isn't permitted to change His mind according to circumstances. A little known fact about Ellen White's calling is that she was third in line after two men, after receiving visions and told by the Holy Spirit to share them, refused to go with it. So God chose the weakest of options, a teenage girl beset by illness and with minimal education. She went on to be one of the most prolific female authors in American history.
Magdala
Active Member
The first third of my 70 plus years was spent as Catholic. I heard of many so called mystics, visionaries, apparitions, bleeding statues, miraculous medallions, scapulars, rosaries, and relics. None of them, not one, nor the priests and nuns that promoted them, ever once suggested that any of the above was for the purpose of bringing someone closer to Jesus. I don't expect your Maria to be any different. Just as other Catholics that have been on the forum in the past, ever encouraged anyone here to come closer to Jesus. Come closer to the church. To Mary. To the saints. And let them intercede for you to bring you closer to Jesus.
Ellen White on the other hand, throughout her writings, in all her books, articles, letters, and sermons, constantly and with great passion and love for our Saviour, pleaded with all her readers to come to Jesus Who alone has the power, the Spirit, and the desire to bring all men and women to a place of salvation and holy living.
Magdala
Active Member
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
What I have consistently noticed is those who have not read EGW for the most part, are the most vocal against her.
I haven't read all her stuff and have no plans to but the main tenants of what I've read are encouraging, insightful and helpful. Why anyone would be opposed to writings of this nature baffles me.
I haven't read all her stuff and have no plans to but the main tenants of what I've read are encouraging, insightful and helpful. Why anyone would be opposed to writings of this nature baffles me.
Magdala
Active Member
On April 23rd, 1943 (Good Friday), Maria Valtorta began taking dictation from Jesus and later other heavenly persons, as well as receiving visions of scenes from His Mother's and His own life on Earth. At Jesus's behest, she wrote everything she saw and heard, filling 122 notebooks totaling thousands of pages. Maria received most of the revelations before 1947, but they continued until 1953. The writings were later published: The Gospel as Revealed to Me, or The Poem of the Man-God (a Work on the Life of Jesus), The Notebooks: 1943, The Notebooks: 1944, The Notebooks: 1945-1950, The Little Notebooks, Lessons on the Epistles of St. Paul to the Romans, and The Book of Azariah.
See the links in my signature for insightful reading material about Maria Valtorta and the writings. Then, if interested, you can read The Gospel as Revealed to Me, or The Poem of the Man-God: Vols. I-V, for free online here with download options, as well as The Notebooks: 1943, The Notebooks: 1944, and The Notebooks: 1945-1950. Or, you can buy copies of these writings in paperback or hardback from mariavaltortastore.com around €22 or less per book. Occasionally, inexpensive copies are sold on thriftbooks.com, abebooks.com, and eBay.com.
I've come to own and read them all, and Jesus has certainly brought me closer to Him by His Words through using Maria, who faithfully served Him whilst suffering from paralysis and many diseases, and so on, during a time of great evil (WWII ) and in following years. These writings are just as much a wealth of love as knowledge for us. If you have any questions, or would like to share any interests of yours, don't hesitate.
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I have.
Is 'The Poem Of the Man-God' Simply a Bad Novel? | EWTN
EWTN is a global, Catholic Television, Catholic Radio, and Catholic News Network that provides catholic programming and news coverage from around the world.
www.ewtn.com
Magdala
Active Member
I have.
Is 'The Poem Of the Man-God' Simply a Bad Novel? | EWTN
EWTN is a global, Catholic Television, Catholic Radio, and Catholic News Network that provides catholic programming and news coverage from around the world.
I have no reason at this time to think that you're biased, or someone who doesn't thoroughly research, so you must've forgotten to also link Jonathan A. Baker's response article titled "In Defense of the Poem".
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
The mystery of the cross explains all other mysteries. In the light that streams from Calvary the attributes of God which had filled us with fear and awe appear beautiful and attractive. Mercy, tenderness, and parental love are seen to blend with holiness, justice, and power. While we behold the majesty of His throne, high and lifted up, we see His character in its gracious manifestations, and comprehend, as never before, the significance of that endearing title, “Our Father.” GC 652.1
Magdala
Active Member
Not only did you answer that you had heard of her, you also cited Fr. Mitch Pacwa's article, but not Jonathan A. Baker's response article titled "In Defense of the Poem". If it's not because you forgot that you didn't cite his, then you either knew about it but deliberately didn't cite out of bias, or you didn't know about it because you didn't thoroughly research.
Did you read her "poem"?
Did you read the link, Is 'The Poem Of the Man-God' Simply a Bad Novel? | EWTN
I shared regarding her "poem"?
Magdala
Active Member
The Gospel as Revealed to Me, or The Poem of the Man-God: Vols. I-V, isn't a "poem" as in a composition in verse, but rather a Work on the Life of Christ. Jesus showed Maria Valtorta scenes from His Mother's and His own life on earth through visions, and she wrote down all that she saw and heard in great detail. What we have about Jesus's life in The Bible is sufficient for bringing people to belief and salvation, but it's an incomplete knowledge of Him.
I've also read her other writings compiled into the following books: The Notebooks: 1943, The Notebooks: 1944, The Notebooks: 1945-1950, The Little Notebooks, Lessons on the Epistles of St. Paul to the Romans, and The Book of Azariah. In these, you'll find that the Father, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, Mary, and others speak about various topics, as well the descriptions of visions that Maria received regarding various Christian martyrs, and so on.
These writings are a priceless source of wealth of love as much as it is knowledge for us. I continue to re-read them all. It has helped me to understand more than what I thought possible in this life, but more importantly, it has helped me to love and serve God better.
I have and more than once over the years. And, I'm actually working on my response to Fr. MItch Pacwa's article which I will send to him when completed. There's another response article already available for reading by Jonathan A. Baker entitled "In Defense of the Poem". Have you read that yet?
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No. Here's why I have no interest in other defenses of her condition.
Her "poem" was rejected by Rome!
Here's somethíng from a Catholic reporting source:
“A monument to pseudo-religiosity”: A case against <i>The Poem of the Man-God</i>
www.catholicworldreport.com
Her "poem" , as synopsized in the article I linked states of it, ""The Poem of the Man-God" is a five-volume "narrative" of the life of Jesus written in the 1940s by a sickly Italian woman named Maria Valtorta. "Poem" purports to fill in the details of Jesus' life left blank by the four Gospels. Such narratives have been produced since the second century A.D. Some were written by gnostic heretics. Some by New Agers and occultists. And some were produced by pious Christians who made up stories about Jesus to edify their readers and listeners.. .."
It's a bad novel. To be polite.
It is of no use to Christians. A sick woman filling in Jesus personal life details omitted in scripture is not to be held as anything but a novelist. Her work isn't of God.
If you believe in her,you're wrong.
Please don't presume to lead me to follow. And certainly don't try to defend her writing as of God. Because that's a lie.
Magdala
Active Member
No. Here's why I have no interest in other defenses of her condition.
Her "poem" was rejected by Rome!
Here's somethíng from a Catholic reporting source:
“A monument to pseudo-religiosity”: A case against <i>The Poem of the Man-God</i>
Her "poem" , as synopsized in the article I linked states of it, ""The Poem of the Man-God" is a five-volume "narrative" of the life of Jesus written in the 1940s by a sickly Italian woman named Maria Valtorta. "Poem" purports to fill in the details of Jesus' life left blank by the four Gospels. Such narratives have been produced since the second century A.D. Some were written by gnostic heretics. Some by New Agers and occultists. And some were produced by pious Christians who made up stories about Jesus to edify their readers and listeners.. .."
It's a bad novel. To be polite.
It is of no use to Christians. A sick woman filling in Jesus personal life details omitted in scripture is not to be held as anything but a novelist. Her work isn't of God.
If you believe in her,you're wrong.
Please don't presume to lead me to follow. And certainly don't try to defend her writing as of God. Because that's a lie.
Thank you for demonstrating your bias and failure to thoroughly research and verify sources.
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