The NT manuscripts are full of mistakes

[KUWN]

The NT hasn't even 400,000 words!

That is exactly right. It has about 138,162 words in the CT. In the Greek Manuscripts, there are about 3 variants per word!! About 80% are misspellings, there are tons of moveable nu. Most people don't like to hear these stats, but it should provide comfort. The Muslims have a Bible that has much less variants, but that is because they destroyed all manuscripts that different from one manuscript that they said represented the original Qur'an. They more than likely destroyed a manuscript that was closer to their original.

It is statistically impossible to discover another Greek manuscript that will alter the original text. Dr. Dan Wallace is a Greek scholar who says that we have about 103% of the original text. The job now of the textual critic is to eliminate the dross.

 

[Jack]

This provides an excellent illustration for those interested:

Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at an Elingsh uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt ...
...snip...
... and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae we do not raed ervey lteter by it slef but the wrod as a wlohe.

Huh???

 

[Matthias]

Huh???

He was making his point in a clever and creative manner.

 

[Skovand]

Ehrman seems to be taken serious by most biblical scholars on his work. They just disagree with the conclusions he lands on when he interprets the data.

Like Ehrman and most biblical scholars recognize that Genesis 1&2 are separate creation accounts. They are stitched together creating a biblical seam by a later redactor. So Ehrman comes to the conclusion that means it’s lies and not real while biblical scholars, the Christian and Jewish ones, comes to the conclusion it’s accomondationism for two separate sects of Judaism and that while both are myths, they are not lies, but rather stories to counter the violent creation accounts of other Mesopotamian tribes.

 

[Jack]

Ehrman seems to be taken serious by most biblical scholars on his work. They just disagree with the conclusions he lands on when he interprets the data.

Like Ehrman and most biblical scholars recognize that Genesis 1&2 are separate creation accounts. They are stitched together creating a biblical seam by a later redactor. So Ehrman comes to the conclusion that means it’s lies and not real while biblical scholars, the Christian and Jewish ones, comes to the conclusion it’s accomondationism for two separate sects of Judaism and that while both are myths, they are not lies, but rather stories to counter the violent creation accounts of other Mesopotamian tribes.

I truly doubt that your opinions overrule our Christian Bible.

 

[Skovand]

I truly doubt that your opinions overrule our Christian Bible.

So I’m a Christian too. But my opinion is more data backed than yours. I don’t reckon you know a lot about biblical scholarship as opposed to just plain English text reading that lacks anything even remotely smelling of contextual analysis.

So again. I’m a Christian too. My Bible is probably the same Bible as yours. The difference is I k ow how to read it. You know how to be told what someone who can’t read it says it says.

 

[Jack]

So I’m a Christian too. But my opinion is more data backed than yours. I don’t reckon you know a lot about biblical scholarship as opposed to just plain English text reading that lacks anything even remotely smelling of contextual analysis.

So again. I’m a Christian too. My Bible is probably the same Bible as yours. The difference is I k ow how to read it. You know how to be told what someone who can’t read it says it says.

So you believe the Bible is filled with errors?

 

[Skovand]

So you believe the Bible is filled with errors?

Yes. Many different kinds of errors. You have errors that are scientifically inaccurate, you have historical errors, you have errors about things like the earth is not flat nor does it have a dome over it. You have error created by biblical seams .

You have errors due to translation issues. You have errors due to copying errors of surviving manuscripts. You have errors of different types of bibles. The catholic bible is different from the coptic bible which is different from the Mormon bible which is different from the Protestant Bible and these are different further depending on if it’s the Septuagint, Masoretic or Dead Sea Scrolls. Or even if acts ends at this verse or that verse.

Do yo disagree? Which translation in which language is perfect?

 

[Jack]

Yes. Many different kinds of errors. You have errors that are scientifically inaccurate, you have historical errors, you have errors about things like the earth is not flat nor does it have a dome over it. You have error created by biblical seams .

You have errors due to translation issues. You have errors due to copying errors of surviving manuscripts. You have errors of different types of bibles. The catholic bible is different from the coptic bible which is different from the Mormon bible which is different from the Protestant Bible and these are different further depending on if it’s the Septuagint, Masoretic or Dead Sea Scrolls. Or even if acts ends at this verse or that verse.

Do yo disagree? Which translation in which language is perfect?

I bet you pick out the parts you like! Right?

 

[Skovand]

I bet you pick out the parts you like! Right?

Why would I need to do that? Cherry picking is one of the driving forces to developing clobber verses. I think a far healthier form of Christianity develops when you practice contextual analysis. Do you agree?

 

[Jack]

Why would I need to do that? Cherry picking is one of the driving forces to developing clobber verses. I think a far healthier form of Christianity develops when you practice contextual analysis. Do you agree?

Our English Bibles are quite consistent in major doctrines. Jesus is God, Hell Fire is everlasting, this is the terminal generation!

 

[Skovand]

Our English Bibles are quite consistent in major doctrines. Jesus is God, Hell Fire is everlasting, this is the terminal generation!

Well we are not allowed to discuss issues centered around the trinity.

You mention hell fire is everlasting. That’s an opinion you hold based off of how you interpret the Bible. Others would disagree based on how they interpret the Bible. Universalism and Conditional Immortality are both views of “hell” that are traced back to the first century. For 2,000 years Christians have believed those two doctrines because of the Bible. For centuries generations have swore theirs is the last. Again, your interpretation of those verses leading you to futurism is just your belief. Again, Christians have argued preterism, partial preterism, historicalism and pseudo autobiographical mythology from the first few centuries. All because they are certain it’s what the Bible teaches and what the Holy Spirit has guided them to after much prayer and fasting and it’s affirmed by many others they know.

 

[Jack]

Well we are not allowed to discuss issues centered around the trinity.

"Jesus is God" is not Trinity. Just Bible.

You mention hell fire is everlasting. That’s an opinion you hold based off of how you interpret the Bible.

No interpretation needed.

Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Others would disagree based on how they interpret the Bible. Universalism and Conditional Immortality are both views of “hell” that are traced back to the first century. For 2,000 years Christians have believed those two doctrines because of the Bible. For centuries generations have swore theirs is the last. Again, your interpretation of those verses leading you to futurism is just your belief. Again, Christians have argued preterism, partial preterism, historicalism and pseudo autobiographical mythology from the first few centuries. All because they are certain it’s what the Bible teaches and what the Holy Spirit has guided them to after much prayer and fasting and it’s affirmed by many others they know.

You should have stuck with READING the Bible, rather than the opinions of Bible haters.

 

[Rockerduck]

I had a of shelves full of commentary books. The Holy Spirit said (audibly) don't use them. He showed me one in particular to throw away. All are opinions, that's all. No more study bibles either. I sold them all. I was shown a vision of an open Bible with the words in red. Then the Holy Spirit said rely on me to teach you. All born again from above Christians should rely on the Holy Spirit to reveal the true meaning of God's Word.

 

[Matthias]

I had a of shelves full of commentary books. The Holy Spirit said (audibly) don't use them. He showed me one in particular to throw away. All are opinions, that's all. No more study bibles either. I sold them all. I was shown a vision of an open Bible with the words in red. Then the Holy Spirit said rely on me to teach you. All born again from above Christians should rely on the Holy Spirit to reveal the true meaning of God's Word.

Concerning the audible voice and the vision you were shown: Are none of the authors of Commentaries and Study Bibles taught by the Holy Spirit? Have none of them relied on the Holy Spirit to reveal the true meaning of God’s Word?

 

[Skovand]

"Jesus is God" is not Trinity. Just Bible.

No interpretation needed.

Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

You should have stuck with READING the Bible, rather than the opinions of Bible haters.

And you should know that they love the Bible. They enjoy studying the Bible and learning what it says more than you ever will.

You can always tell who is a fool because the foolish ignores the wisdom of the wise….. don’t read commentaries on the Bible by biblical experts….. instead just read the Bible …. That those same experts translated for you to read…. And lean on your limited understanding of the text as being enough to interpret it… and call your gut feelings…… the Holy Spirit.

 

[Skovand]

Proverbs 12:15
15 Fools think their own way is right,
but the wise listen to advice.

Proverbs 19:20
20 Listen to advice and accept instruction,
that you may gain wisdom for the future.

Proverbs 18:13
13 If one gives answer before hearing,
it is folly and shame.

Proverbs 1:22
22 “How long, O simple ones, will you love being simple?
How long will scoffers delight in their scoffing
and fools hate knowledge?

 

[Stumpmaster]

They enjoy studying the Bible and learning what it says more than you ever will.

Such Ad Hominem Fallacies always fail the Fruit Of The Spirit test.

 

[Skovand]

Such Ad Hominem Fallacies always fail the Fruit Of The Spirit test.

Far less so than those that think this… “ I don’t speak Hebrew, Aramaic or Greek, and I don’t know anything about bronze and Iron Age literature or ancient near eastern culture but I’m going to ignore all the wisdom of the worlds leading experts who speak Greek, Aramaic and Hebrew, and who studied the Bible professionally for 20+ years who had access to all the manuscripts and are the ones who translate it so you can read it……. But you have a gut feeling that it’s evil and so you just read their translations and presume you understand it perfectly….” lol.

And when it comes to the fruit of the spirit…….. you’ll find a blackberry worth among the thread. This thread is full of people who hate wisdom and are full of bigotry. I don’t think in my whole life I have ever seen so many anti wisdom hate fueled fools than I’ve seen in these threads.

 

[Rockerduck]

Concerning the audible voice and the vision you were shown: Are none of the authors of Commentaries and Study Bibles taught by the Holy Spirit? Have none of them relied on the Holy Spirit to reveal the true meaning of God’s Word?

Nope, they learned from collegiate institutions and repeated the same.