THE TRANSGENDERISM OF CHRISTIANITY

[Stewardofthemystery]

I do not see the reason its debated. Can some one clarify what exactly is the discussion looking for?
As the Bible is clear on the answer.
Thanks.

Some false doctrines teach that a born again believer cannot be made free from sin and from sinning. So basically they teach a sin and still be saved type doctrine that is pleasing to sinners.

Some even go as far as saying there is no need to repent of sin, and there is no need to stop sinning at all because they believe they are under grace and not under the condemnation of the law. This is A license to sin type doctrine.

Basically what they are doing is trying to blur the line between Light and darkness creating there own gray area. In scripture this would be called being lukewarm.

 

[Behold]

so then if you commit one sin, you are unrighteous.

Actually you are unrighteous if you don't have God's Righteousness.

Jesus came to restore unto us, "the Imputed righteousness of God".. that is "The Gift of Righteousness"

What is that?

That is "Christ's Righteousness" that we receive, at the same time Jesus becomes our Sin bearer, and dies for all our sin.

The CROSS is a "Divine Exchange".. Were Christ becomes our sin, and we become "Christ's Righteousness".

 

[TigersPaw]

Some false doctrines teach that a born again believer cannot be made free from sin and from sinning. So basically they teach a sin and still be saved type doctrine that is pleasing to sinners.

Some even go as far as saying there is no need to repent of sin, and there is no need to stop sinning at all because they believe they are under grace and not under the condemnation of the law. This is A license to sin type doctrine.

Basically what they are doing is trying to blur the line between Light and darkness creating there own gray area. In scripture this would be called being lukewarm.

Thank you for clarifying it I was reading back trying to get the angle.
I mean reading your posts, I agree with them as well.
The premise is pretty simple. And I have known false prophets before who taught their own prophecies.
Stating they were from God.


So there are others in this discussion that think what you mentioned?
1. We all sin, all are born as sinners.
2. We do not have to sin, we have free will to do so. But that does not make it by Grace.
3. Acceptance and Repentance are definitely the Biblical process.
But, I think. God is looking at the heart.
Struggling with Sin, is one thing. But sinning and rejecting God is another.
Grace does not protect you from this. One may Love Christ for what he did.
But if one is not even going to bother and try not to sin. Then why bother.
I studied law and this is the legal analogy.

God gave us a contract to sign, Jesus signed it, and man kind did as well.
The conditions, Acceptance and repentance and the contract will allow you into Gods Kingdom.
However, if you are found in default of that contract, you can not use a loop hole ( Grace) to
allow you out of the contract. Now things happen and it can be hard to honor the contract.
But there is a difference in delays ( sinning) and Defaulting ( ignoring the contract with God ).
We are not perfect, I know I am flawed badly. But God knows my heart. Just like he does all of us.
God knows, what was, what is, and what will be.

 

[Wrangler]

new guy here in the forum

Welcome to the forum.

there are three types of Those that believe in Christ.
Christians
Christ Followers
Lapsed Christian

Churches are failing as we all know.

Both of these points are worthy of being their own thread. Can you start threads n these points yet? If not, I can start these threads on your behalf.

 

[Wrangler]

My Sister was a False prophet, and that was difficult for me, being and ordained Pastor.

Wow! I can only imagine how difficult that was. How is your relationship with your sister now? Has she repented?

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

Thank you for clarifying it I was reading back trying to get the angle.

I personally believe a lot of these false doctrines are coming from religious types who have never experienced truly being born again of the Spirit and made free from sin.

They look at themselves and say, I cannot stop sinning so those verses that say you can be made free from sin must not be true.

So instead of believing what is written about being made free from sin, then instead pick out a few verses and distort there meaning in order to justify their own sinful lifestyle.

Basically they want a gospel message that says you can sin all you want and still be saved. Instead of desiring to be transformed into the image of Christ, they want a gospel made in their own sinful image.

 

[amigo de christo]

I personally believe a lot of these false doctrines are coming from religious types who have never experienced truly being born again of the Spirit and made free from sin.

They look at themselves and say, I cannot stop sinning so those verses that say you can be made free from sin must not be true.

So instead of believing what is written about being made free from sin, then instead pick out a few verses and distort there meaning in order to justify their own sinful lifestyle.

Basically they want a gospel message that says you can sin all you want and still be saved. Instead of desiring to be transformed into the image of Christ, they want a gospel made in their own sinful image.

When the born again speaks of the working of the SPIRIT
those who have never truly been born again will indeed often attack the message .
He who loves sin does not like the reminders nor THOSE who walk by the SPIRIT .
WHY . because deep within their own conscious
they do not want to believe it is possible . No man who loves sin
wants to believe that by the SPIRIT a man can walk righteously and even give righteous instruction .
Because deep within the heart of that man , HE KNOWS HE HAS NO EXCUSE for why he walketh as he walketh
and to see one walk by the SPIRIT is an abomination to such men . for those who walk by the SPIRIT
expose the deeds of wicked men who wanted SO badly to believe OH ITS NOT POSSIBLE , these are just legalistic
pieces of junk . MEN who love sin DO NOT LIKE a walk or any reminder that expose their sin . AND BUDDY that is fact .

 

[amigo de christo]

He who loves sin will run to a god who will not expose their sin but will promise them salvation .
He who loveth sin will by his own mind twist the image of GOD into an image more TO THEIR LIKING .
He who loveth sin will sit under men who preach another jesus and you can bet that jesus
WONT expose their sin .
He who loveth sin will not come to THE LIGHT lest their deeds be exposed be reproved .
MANY within christendom have no idea , for they have never experienced , what the NEW BIRTH BY THE SPIRIT
truly is and what it truly does .
He who loveth sin will not come to the LIGHT
but will come to he who can appear as an angel of light and through men preach unto them their own hearts desires .
He whose love is sin has no heart to PLEASE GOD
but rather will please and appease men , will overlook even their own faults , LEST THEIRS TOO BE EXPOSED and corrected .
AND they love company and will gather with the many who loveth sin .
He whose love is sin , HAS NOT BEEN BORN AGAIN . FOR THE LOVE that cometh OF GOD
LOVETH TRUTH and not inquity . But he whose love is for the god of the mirror , to find a god to please
the image of who they see when they look into a mirror , and they will fight tooth and nail
once they find pastors who preach that jesus and will hammer and attack and label the born again
as phariesses , as legalistic , anything and everything these men will tell themselves
to continue to believe a lie they so loved . We had better watch out for many now follow another jesus
another spirit and have come to the god who cannot save them , has only fed them and given
them their own lustful hearts desire and is leading them all to peridtion .

 

[ScottA]

Who is defending sin? Like I said the word flesh also denotes the sin nature working in mankind that opposes the Spirit of God.

This sin nature is the spirit of the Devil that is in the world and is also working in the children of disobedience.

Ephesians 2:2
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

Galatians 5:17
For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

James 4:5
Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?

You are going in circles to defend your Original Post point that some Christians, "Basically they believed the grace of God was like a license to sin." Which almost no one actually believes.

The issue here, though you seem to insist upon beating around the bush, is that apparently you do not believe the body of sin is as much as expected to continue sinning after one is born again also of the spirit of God. Which is simply a false gospel. This is why Paul gave witness and counsel regarding the flesh vs. the spirit, saying that what he himself willed to do, that he did not do, but what he willed not to do, that he did.

The fact is, the body of sin and death has a life of its own and is condemned to die, and continues without a new sinless life of its own until it passes away in physical death. To the contrary, the new life within one born again, is also its own life, which is everlasting. But the two, although seemingly together for a time, are two different bodies, the one unto death, and the other unto life. They are not the same body. Thus, sin dies with the flesh, and at best that body is merely under restraint or subornation to the spirit more or less--which is the counsel of God that it be so restrained.

Bottom line, there is no conversion of the body of sin and death, and salvation is not of the flesh, but of the soul by the Spirit. The flesh profits nothing.

 

[TigersPaw]

Wow! I can only imagine how difficult that was. How is your relationship with your sister now? Has she repented?

I have not spoken with her in about 22 years ( or my other sister similar cause). I am a sinner, but I also can not have satan that close.
He is close enough as it is each day. So no both my sisters I do not have a relationship with because God comes first.
They have not repented. In fact many have just encouraged their delusions which only gave them power.
I think this is why as a pastor, I have had some tough battles, because this is so close.
But in the end, I wish to see my wife and kids, and Jesus. And well satan has his hooks in many people.
We forget that even those we loved and call family can betray us. The Bible is so full of examples like this.
And the lesson is turn away from them, and turn to God.
Personally, sure I do on some level miss them, but the toxicity that their lives are I am far better without them.
I must say, the peace when I rebuked them.
God swooped in and gave me peace from being away from them. I feel very close to nothing about them.
Probably sounds weird to many I suppose.

 

[TigersPaw]

Welcome to the forum.




Both of these points are worthy of being their own thread. Can you start threads n these points yet? If not, I can start these threads on your behalf.

Welcome to the forum.




Both of these points are worthy of being their own thread. Can you start threads n these points yet? If not, I can start these threads on your behalf.

Yes I can create thread on this.
I will pray on and approach and look to doing so in the morning here.
Appreciate the support and welcome.

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

The issue here, though you seem to insist upon beating around the bush, is that apparently you do not believe the body of sin is as much as expected to continue sinning after one is born again also of the spirit of God.

The problem is that you think the word flesh only refers only to the physical body, when it also refers to the sin nature in man as it pertains to the heart/mind/spirit.

When a person is born again of the Holy Spirit their physical body does not change, it is their heart/mind/spirit that is renewed.

Jesus said it is that which is in the heart of man that defiles a man. So it is the inward man (heart, mind, spirit= his nature) that must be born again first in order to be a part of the first physical resurrection at the last day.

Jesus said if you first make clean the inside of the vessel, then the outside will also become clean.

Psalm 51:10
Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

Ephesians 4:23
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Romans 5:14
Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

In Adam all die

Next

Romans 2:12
For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;

And?

This does not show I am wrong

Are you ready to repent and that you still sin?

 

[Stewardofthemystery]

In Adam all die

If you are still in The Adam nature then you are still a sinner because you are made that way.

Romans 5:19
For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

But if you are truly born again of the Spirit of Christ you are now made righteous and you will no longer serve sin.

If you are made a sinner you will sin….

Matthew 12:33
Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.

If you are truly made righteous you cannot sin…

Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth goodfruit.

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

 

[Wrangler]

I have not spoken with her in about 22 years ( or my other sister similar cause). I am a sinner, but I also can not have satan that close.
He is close enough as it is each day. So no both my sisters I do not have a relationship with because God comes first.

Your story parallels mine very closely. I have 2 younger sisters that have not talked to me in over 15 years. The younger sister is a self-proclaimed witch, who believes she communes with the dead. I now believe she is interacting with demons and has unleashed them, perhaps unwittingly, into my life.

The hill that relationship died on is when I pushed, asking her in bold red, underlined, capital letters, “when will you make positive, support type comments regarding my trials and tribulations.” It was a WHEN question. Her brief answer, “I’ll decide when the time is right,” is a WHO answer.

In short, my sister’s embrace the idea that a relationship depends on them agreeing with every decision I make. As soon as I make a decision they don’t agree with, they put the entire relationship in jeopardy.

The 1st Thanksgiving after the divorce, the older sister called, confessing she wanted to wish my daughter a Happy Thanksgiving and called my ex-wife first. My daughter was with me that holiday and my sister took the risk of calling my ex-wife first rather than take the risk to call me first. In my heart, I know that if my daughter was not with me that day, I would have got no phone call from my sister.

The peace I feel when I rebuked them is amazing. My friend sent a simple email, asking me why do I have all the burden with my family? That opened my eyes to the toxic dynamic.

For many years I joked with them about having saved money buying only 1-way phones for they could only receive my calls (or return calls that I initiate). When I got divorced, it was like I was the in-law they no longer had anything to do with. Having an ongoing relationship with my ex-wife and no relationship with me, they naturally have no relationship with my current wife.

Of course, there is more to the story but, like you, “I feel very close to nothing about them.”

 

[TigersPaw]

Of course, there is more to the story but, like you, “I feel very close to nothing about them.”

I think this is God protecting us. I know I feel God intervened, it took awhile. But now I can feel like God put a barrier between me and them.
My Daughter in Law is in a similar relationship with her mom. We completely relate with each other. But she is hopeful and I remember those days.
But I fear it will only become more toxic. Family brings demons with them. And only God can remove them from us.
I feel the tug as it sounds like you do as well. That there is a constant pull of evil to try and break your will.
Great thing the older and longer you are with God the stronger you become and the weaker the enemy is .

 

[Wrangler]

I think this is God protecting us. I know I feel God intervened, it took awhile. But now I can feel like God put a barrier between me and them.
My Daughter in Law is in a similar relationship with her mom. We completely relate with each other. But she is hopeful and I remember those days.
But I fear it will only become more toxic. Family brings demons with them. And only God can remove them from us.
I feel the tug as it sounds like you do as well. That there is a constant pull of evil to try and break your will.
Great thing the older and longer you are with God the stronger you become and the weaker the enemy is .

It's sad. About a year ago my church had a sermon series on making room in your life for God. One week this included getting rid of relationships that go against God's will, including family. It's sad, yes, but also necessry to grow closer to God.

14 Stay away from people who are not followers of the Lord! Can someone who is good get along with someone who is evil? Are light and darkness the same? 15 Is Christ a friend of Satan? Can people who follow the Lord have anything in common with those who don't? 16 Do idols belong in the temple of God?
2 Corinthians 6 (CEV)

 

[Eternally Grateful]

If you are still in The Adam nature then you are still a sinner because you are made that way.

Romans 5:19
For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

But if you are truly born again of the Spirit of Christ you are now made righteous and you will no longer serve sin.

If you are made a sinner you will sin….

Matthew 12:33
Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.

If you are truly made righteous you cannot sin…

Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth goodfruit.

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

dude your all over the place. can you make up your mind and discuss one subject.

 

[ScottA]

The problem is that you think the word flesh only refers only to the physical body, when it also refers to the sin nature in man as it pertains to the heart/mind/spirit.

When a person is born again of the Holy Spirit their physical body does not change, it is their heart/mind/spirit that is renewed.

Jesus said it is that which is in the heart of man that defiles a man. So it is the inward man (heart, mind, spirit= his nature) that must be born again first in order to be a part of the first physical resurrection at the last day.

Jesus said if you first make clean the inside of the vessel, then the outside will also become clean.

Psalm 51:10
Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.

Ephesians 4:23
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

Thanks for explaining, but it is as I expected: But there is no "first physical resurrection." Which is not in contradiction to the verses that you posted, but in accord, as born again of a completely different body. As the word for "renew" is also defined simply, as "new." Which I do not say this as one who "thinks" it is so, but as one caught up to the third heaven in receipt of the truth from God directly.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

They called the doctrine “hyper grace”. As I debated their beliefs I found that basically what they believed in was a sin all you want and still be saved type doctrine.

No days that just call that grace meaning we are all once saved always saved so if one does get saved and continues living in sin, it's all good they still go to Heaven.

I think it's funny when some of these tares teach that if one lives in sin during this life, they will get a small mansion on the backside of glory but they will still be in Heaven.