I would agree, with a slight caveat: the written scriptures contain His God-breathed message. The words conveying that message were chosen by the men who held the pens. God didn't tell them which words to choose.
Hellfire and brimstone has given way to eternal separation from God. - Why?
- Thread starter St. SteVen
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The gospel of the Lamb of God, Messiah/Christ, is being preached from cover to cover in the bible. And the counterfeit which causes men to fall called Mystery Babylon first showed up in the Garden of Eden. Couched in a question, "Did God really say....?" Yes unfortunately.....calling God's word (Truth) into question. Does that sound like anyone here?
My issue is not with God. My issue is with overly-zealous Bible-thumpers that think they own the truth.
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You don't believe they were "carried along by the Holy Spirit"...? God-breathed is referring to His Spirit....the breath of God is His Spirit. Eg, when Jesus breathed on His disciples and said receive ye the Holy Spirit.
If you are asking me whether the writers of the Bible had received the Holy Spirit when they wrote, my answer is Yes. Is that what you are asking me?
God's truth?
You just imposed Mystery Babylon on the Fall and then accuse me of "calling God's word (Truth) into question"?
Your posts smack of a superiority complex. (like many others on this forum)
You have a right to your opinion, but have gone too far. Since when are your imaginations "God's truth"?
No need to come unhinged at my comments.
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Is there a need for you to come unhinged?
If anyone is questioning whether God is saying what He does say through scripture and preaching/teaching that "ye shall not surely die"....well it is clear they are echoing the serpent and father of lies, isn't that so? Yes, this is Mystery Babylon which causes men to fall....fall away....from sound doctrine into lies that lead astray and cannot save. Promising liberty as per 2Peter 2, while they themselves are slaves of corruption. Sounds like the serpent to me. There is a falling away that must happen before the return of Christ and it is happening now, sadly.
No, I had this in mind:
2Pe 1:19-21
We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
Thanks for the clarification. When Second Peter uses the word προφητεία (prophecy), what portions of the Old Testament do you suppose the author had in mind?
How about you tell me which portions of the old testament are not reliable and should not be heeded........since ALL scripture is God-breathed and profitable for doctrine, reproof, correction and instruction in righteousness. And those who have the Spirit are helped by the Holy Spirit to understand and grow in understanding of them.
It's clear that some here with their constant game of 20 Questions are trying to cause people to doubt what God has said. These same people say ye shall not surely die. What spirit is that of? It agrees with the serpent and contradicts God. And like the serpent they hide their intentions behind their questions instead of bringing it into the light, because they have a flimsy case that wont' stand up to the light.
For example, what does the second death mean? How can that possibly mean they won't surely die? Does death, destruction and perish in the bible not mean what it says? It is called the second death because it is referring to the death/destruction of the soul, after the body has already died first (and their spirit also is already dead, cut off from the life of God, because of sin).
Rom 3:3-6
For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.
But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)
God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?
Do you want to have an intelligent discussion on this, or would you rather just lump me in with whatever group you feel are on this site just to "cause people to doubt what God has said?" Because if it's the latter, I won't waste my time and yours. But if it's the former, you need to be open to discuss the difference between "what God has said" and what the writers of the Bible have said. If you aren't open to that discussion, neither of us will profit from further engagement.
I'm open to discussion, but it appears that some here only want to ask questions and presumptuously lecture other posters like schoolchildren instead of putting their cards on the table openly and discussing, like now. If you have a point to make you have been free to make it all along.
You did -- with a limiting reference to "prophecy" in 2 Peter that I was trying to discuss with you before we got derailed. I don't know what portions of the OT you think the author was referring to as prophecy. The OT contains history, precepts, poems, praises, predictions (which might be akin to "prophesy") and lots more -- and we need to figure out which one (or more) the author of 2 Peter had in mind before we can point to 2 Peter as a blanket imprimatur on every word of the OT. I understood you to be arguing for that blanket imprimatur, and I was pushing back.
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We need the whole counsel of God, not just isolated scriptures, so I brought you another scripture which testifies about the scriptures. You appeared to be implying (while being careful not to directly say so) that the bible is not reliable because some of the words were chosen by mere men, whereas scripture itself testifies that ALL scripture is God-breathed.......therefore how can any of it be the words of men?
Maybe there are some parts of the OT that weren't written by prophets and holy men of God, if so feel free to point them out if you think you can. Even if that were the case, it doesn't nullify that all scripture is God-breathed.
You mention "another scripture which testifies about the scriptures" (I assume 2 Tim. 3:16). Clearly Paul was referring to the OT in that verse, not the NT. Was he correct? I happen to believe he was -- not because he said so (that would be circular reasoning; the Bible is not self-proving!), but because it is evident from even a cursory reading that the OT was inspired, useful for all the things that Paul mentions.
Like you, I believe 100% of the OT was "written by prophets and holy men of God." But authorship by such persons neither nullifies nor ensures that their words were "God-breathed," so I don't know why you bother to comment on their status. The Scriptures in question are "God-breathed" on their merits, holiness of the authors aside.
That said, "God-breathed" does not mean "factually inerrant." We know this because there are errors. That's the human element creeping in. God would not let His ultimate message be misstated, but the factual adornments in which the authors chose to couch their stories are another matter.
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You are in error-you and @St. SteVen.
Scripture is "God-breathed" and authoritative in all it teaches:
2 Timothy 3:16 (Lexham Bible): "All Scripture is God-breathed and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness."
This verse emphasizes that all Scripture is inspired by God. The term "God-breathed" (Greek: theopneustos) implies divine origin, not just guidance but the very breath of God. If the text originates from God Himself, it holds authority in both its spiritual and factual claims. The idea that the "factual adornments" can be mistaken would contradict the nature of a God who is Truth (John 14:6).
God’s Word is perfect and pure:
Psalm 19:7 (Lexham Bible): "The law of Yahweh is perfect, reviving the soul; the testimony of Yahweh is reliable, making the simple wise."
The psalmist declares the law of Yahweh to be "perfect" (tamim), which indicates completeness and soundness, leaving no room for human error. God's Word is not mixed with falsehood or human frailty but stands as a flawless revelation of His truth.
Psalm 12:6 (Lexham Bible): "The words of Yahweh are pure words, like silver refined in a furnace on the ground, purified seven times."
God's words are described as pure and thoroughly refined. This purity implies freedom from any imperfections, including factual or historical inaccuracies.
Jesus affirmed the authority and reliability of Scripture:
John 10:35 (Lexham Bible): "If he called them gods to whom the word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken."
Jesus affirms that Scripture cannot be "broken" or rendered void. This indicates that every aspect of Scripture—whether moral, spiritual, historical, or factual—is reliable. If any error were present, it would undermine this unbreakable quality that Jesus attributes to God's Word.
The human element in writing does not diminish divine accuracy:
2 Peter 1:20-21 (Lexham Bible): "Knowing this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture comes from someone's own interpretation. For no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit."
Though humans were the instruments through which Scripture was written, they were "carried along" by the Holy Spirit. This eliminates the possibility of human error creeping in, as the inspiration was guided by the Holy Spirit, ensuring accuracy in both spiritual truths and factual details.
God's Word endures forever without error:
Isaiah 40:8 (Lexham Bible): "The grass withers, the flower fades, but the word of our God will stand forever."
God's Word is not only eternal but also unchanging. This durability and permanence reinforce the inerrancy of Scripture because God's truth remains uncorrupted by human error throughout all generations.
God is not the author of confusion or error:
Numbers 23:19 (Lexham Bible): "God is not a man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. Has he said, and will he not do it? Or has he spoken, and will he not fulfill it?"
If God does not lie and His words are true, then to claim that the human authors of Scripture introduced errors contradicts God’s nature. His message is clear, truthful, and reliable in all its parts, including any historical or factual elements.
In light of these passages, the biblical case for the inerrancy of Scripture is strong. To say that "God-breathed" writings can contain human error would contradict these clear affirmations of the divine perfection, purity, and reliability of the Scriptures as a whole.
J.
Your superiority complex is impressive.
Since when are your opinions the standard for truth?
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