Ultimately, it's not a matter of who is right and who is wrong... (?)

[St. SteVen]

"Ultimately, it's not a matter of who is right and who is wrong.
I need to follow my convictions. Especially as it concerns the character of God." - SteVen

(quoted from another topic) I thought it might be worth discussing as a topic.

My views on who is and isn't a Christian are pretty broad.
I can identify (and disagree with) nominal Christianity. But beyond that I am very inclusive.
I was raised Protestant, but I don't discount Catholics or Orthodox Christians.
Even if they discount me, which happens on occasion. (to be expected, I suppose)

If we put religious affiliations and doctrine aside:
- What is of most importance?
- What are your personal convictions?
- What about those who don't share your personal convictions?

[

 

[Keiw]

"Ultimately, it's not a matter of who is right and who is wrong.
I need to follow my convictions. Especially as it concerns the character of God." - SteVen

(quoted from another topic) I thought it might be worth discussing as a topic.

My views on who is and isn't a Christian are pretty broad.
I can identify (and disagree with) nominal Christianity. But beyond that I am very inclusive.
I was raised Protestant, but I don't discount Catholics or Orthodox Christians.
Even if they discount me, which happens on occasion. (to be expected, I suppose)

If we put religious affiliations and doctrine aside:
- What is most importance?
- What are your personal convictions?
- What about those who don't share your personal convictions?

[

Obeying is most important. Few even know what Jesus teaches. Yet the blind guides assure them-- you are saved= a croc. Any teachers assuring that--RUN FROM THEM. They do not know.

 

[St. SteVen]

Obeying is most important. Few even know what Jesus teaches. Yet the blind guides assure them-- you are saved= a croc. Any teachers assuring that--RUN FROM THEM. They do not know.

There is no assurance of salvation then? Wait and see?
What are the consequences if you don't make it?

[

 

[Windmill Charge]

What is most importance?

That one believes in and lives for Jesus.
As John3:16 says.

All sorts of extra and erroneous doctrine can be ignored, so long as the core of Christianity is there.

 

[Keiw]

There is no assurance of salvation then? Wait and see?
What are the consequences if you don't make it?

[

Jesus said-Matt 10:22--Those who endure until their end-WILL be saved.-- No mortal on earth knows if one will endure until their end. No mortal on earth has ever seen a single name written in Gods book of life. No mortal on earth can read ones true heart.
The true God set before all-LIFE or DEATH( Deut 30:19)--There is no literal eternal suffering, the blind guides teach it as literal.

 

[Jack]

Jesus said-Matt 10:22--Those who endure until their end-WILL be saved.-- No mortal on earth knows if one will endure until their end. No mortal on earth has ever seen a single name written in Gods book of life. No mortal on earth can read ones true heart.
The true God set before all-LIFE or DEATH( Deut 30:19)--There is no literal eternal suffering, the blind guides teach it as literal.

You just called Jesus a liar, again.

Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

 

[NotTheRock]

What is of most importance?

As Jesus said in the Great Commandment, "Love God and love one another".

That's all.

 

[Keiw]

You just called Jesus a liar, again.

Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

No one would serve your sadist God Jack.
So then you must think The rich man and Lazarus story is literal as well. Thus if you were in heaven and could look down daily and see your Mother or Father, or wife or child suffering daily in that place you think is literal--How much happiness would you have Jack?

 

[Wick Stick]

Jesus said-Matt 10:22--Those who endure until their end-WILL be saved.-- No mortal on earth knows if one will endure until their end. No mortal on earth has ever seen a single name written in Gods book of life. No mortal on earth can read ones true heart.

Those verses are about the the special resurrection for martyrs. Most of us won't become martyrs.

 

[Keiw]

Those verses are about the the special resurrection for martyrs. Most of us won't become martyrs.

There is another spot that teaches that. It pertains to all professing to be true followers.

 

[Jack]

No one would serve your sadist God Jack.

Matthew 25:41
41 Then He will also say to those on the left hand, 'Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:
Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

So then you must think The rich man and Lazarus story is literal as well.

Now you're catching on! Parables don't use LITERAL Biblical people! Yep, it's literal.

Thus if you were in heaven and could look down daily and see your Mother or Father, or wife or child suffering daily in that place you think is literal--How much happiness would you have Jack?

My happiness will be if I pull a JW from Hell fire!

 

[Keiw]

Matthew 25:41
41 Then He will also say to those on the left hand, 'Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels:
Revelation 20:10
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Now you're catching on! Parables don't use LITERAL Biblical people! Yep, it's literal.

My happiness will be if I pull a JW from Hell fire!

Jesus was in Hades for 3 days=hell, thus you must actually believe God condemned Jesus to suffer for those 3 days. But the bible is clear--All thought stops on the day of ones death. Thus if one cant think, he wouldn't even know if he were in heaven or hell. Try using the whole bible Jack.
Blind guides believe ones soul goes to heaven, because Revelation mentions souls under the alter. But at Psalm 89:48 it assures ones soul goes to Sheol=the grave=Hades=the grave.
The Revelation mention was symbolic---See Jack, one must use the whole bible.

 

[JohnDB]

Titus 1:16
They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.


So we have a LOT of people who are the poster children of this verse.

 

[St. SteVen]

I still chuckle when I read this.

I want to die like Grandpa, peacefully and in his sleep.
Not like the passengers in his car who were all screaming and panicking.

[

 

[Biblepaige]

As I see it,that's true to a point.

Human personality has everything to do with individual faith. God is our ultimate judge.
If we are his no thing changes this.

Praise him!

 

[Eternally Grateful]

"Ultimately, it's not a matter of who is right and who is wrong.
I need to follow my convictions. Especially as it concerns the character of God." - SteVen

(quoted from another topic) I thought it might be worth discussing as a topic.

My views on who is and isn't a Christian are pretty broad.
I can identify (and disagree with) nominal Christianity. But beyond that I am very inclusive.
I was raised Protestant, but I don't discount Catholics or Orthodox Christians.
Even if they discount me, which happens on occasion. (to be expected, I suppose)

If we put religious affiliations and doctrine aside:
- What is of most importance?

The gospel.

So important is this that Paul made a statement that if ANYONE teaches a different gospel. if even an ANGEL (heavenly being) teaches a different gospel. let them be accursed. which literally means let them be damned.

This limits the truth to one truth, not many truths. If we get this basic tenant of christianity wrong we have made a fatal mistake. because we have rejected the one truth. we have believed a different gospel.

so again, Paul says

Gal 1: 6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be [b]accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

we see here. Paul is saying they were turning away to another gospel. The greek word here is heteron. It means a different one, another one, ie, another kind.

then we see paul make a statement of fact. It is not another - the greek word here is not the same word. It is Allo- which means a different one, or a second one, ie, another gospel that will also have the same effect. in this case. make one saved.

When then see this other "type" of Gospel is a perverted gospel.

we then get a double negative. which shows the seriousness of this warning. If we (paul even includes himself) teach this different gospel. let them (us) be accursed. if even a heavenly angel teach it, let them be accursed..

from this point, it does not even matter what makes it different, it is the fact that it is different. what we can conclude from this is there is one way to heaven. Anyone who teaches that there is more than one way has serious problems. And if we are doing this, we need to examine ourselves. because we have problems ourself.

- What are your personal convictions?

I see one message that is proclaimed throughout the word, and that message is a message of grace being offered by God. and those who receive this grace in faith are saved.

Interestingly enough, this is the exact words paul uses. For it is by Grace we have been saved - the means of salvation is solely by grace, But God will not force you to take his gospel. so it is through faith that we receive it.

Jesus said I am the way the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father except through me.

Paul tells us our father (abraham) was made right with God through faith (romans 4) and that it is through this same faith we have in God. that we too are made right with God. Not based on anything we do (the issue with the galation church was works of the law. specifically being circumcized. they in affect where changing and buying into the perverted gospel that yes, we are saved by faith (Paul calls it begining in the spirit in Gal 3) but that they have to perfect. or they must complete the process of salvation, in thr flesh (by works) and called them fools if they thought this.

- What about those who don't share your personal convictions?

[

We all will be held accountable to God by what we believe. it does not matter what I think what matters is the truth and what God thinks.

 

[Biblepaige]

The gospel.

So important is this that Paul made a statement that if ANYONE teaches a different gospel. if even an ANGEL (heavenly being) teaches a different gospel. let them be accursed. which literally means let them be damned.

This limits the truth to one truth, not many truths. If we get this basic tenant of christianity wrong we have made a fatal mistake. because we have rejected the one truth. we have believed a different gospel.

so again, Paul says

Gal 1: 6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be [b]accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

we see here. Paul is saying they were turning away to another gospel. The greek word here is heteron. It means a different one, another one, ie, another kind.

then we see paul make a statement of fact. It is not another - the greek word here is not the same word. It is Allo- which means a different one, or a second one, ie, another gospel that will also have the same effect. in this case. make one saved.

When then see this other "type" of Gospel is a perverted gospel.

we then get a double negative. which shows the seriousness of this warning. If we (paul even includes himself) teach this different gospel. let them (us) be accursed. if even a heavenly angel teach it, let them be accursed..

from this point, it does not even matter what makes it different, it is the fact that it is different. what we can conclude from this is there is one way to heaven. Anyone who teaches that there is more than one way has serious problems. And if we are doing this, we need to examine ourselves. because we have problems ourself.

I see one message that is proclaimed throughout the word, and that message is a message of grace being offered by God. and those who receive this grace in faith are saved.

Interestingly enough, this is the exact words paul uses. For it is by Grace we have been saved - the means of salvation is solely by grace, But God will not force you to take his gospel. so it is through faith that we receive it.

Jesus said I am the way the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father except through me.

Paul tells us our father (abraham) was made right with God through faith (romans 4) and that it is through this same faith we have in God. that we too are made right with God. Not based on anything we do (the issue with the galation church was works of the law. specifically being circumcized. they in affect where changing and buying into the perverted gospel that yes, we are saved by faith (Paul calls it begining in the spirit in Gal 3) but that they have to perfect. or they must complete the process of salvation, in thr flesh (by works) and called them fools if they thought this.



We all will be held accountable to God by what we believe. it does not matter what I think what matters is the truth and what God thinks.

And said that prior to meeting with any of the Apostles.

And Paul repeatedly identified his teachings as his gospel. Which differs in many respects from that one Jesus taught his Disciples whom he later anointed and appointed as Apostles of The Great Commission.

 

[St. SteVen]

@Biblepaige
Welcome to the forum.

[

 

[Biblepaige]

@Biblepaige
Welcome to the forum.

[

Thanks.

 

[St. SteVen]

And Paul repeatedly identified his teachings as his gospel. Which differs in many respects from that one Jesus taught his Disciples whom he later anointed and appointed as Apostles of The Great Commission.

You might be interested in these topics.

The Gospel of Life - What life has taught you - God knew what you needed​

The Gospel according to St. Matthew, the Gospel according to St. Mark, the Gospel according to St. Luke, the Gospel according to St. John... ... the Gospel according to St. SteVen. (hey, why not?) What's your story? What has God taught you through your unique life experiences? ]

The gospel according to... ???​

How many gospels are there? The gospel according to... Matthew The gospel according to... Mark The gospel according to... Luke The gospel according to... John The gospel according to... Paul The gospel according to...Catholicism The gospel according to...Protestantism The gospel according...

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