I hate myself, and hate being an atheist.
- Thread starter Cerraco
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I told you what the requirements are. You’re interested in mental stimulation, not in becoming a Christian.
Matthias, you have made your point, dude. You said inspecting the details of Christ and giving yourself to God. A few of the answers you've given have been very general, and there's been quite a few times where I did inquire about things (not just talking about my personal issues). Not worth going in circles anymore.
I don’t fully agree with the details, but close enough. I concur with your conclusion.
If you become a Christian right now you will be like a new-born babe; knowing nothing and needing constant spiritual feeding. After a while you will begin to recognise your heavenly Father and feel his love and grow to love him in return. And as am infant grows so do new Christians until they become mature and strong in their faith.
Some people feel different immediately after their conversion, some don't. We are all unique and just as siblings in a family may have differing relationships with their parent so it is in us. We are all loved and in time we learn to respond to God's love by loving him.
And as for the 'mechanics' he hears our prayers but will only answer those that line up with his plans for us. And he does speak to us. Again, this can be in any number of ways such as directly into our spirits and we know immediately that it's God's 'voice', or through our bibles or a preacher or another person. And it is impossible to understand 'being a Christian' unless you are one.
Lambano
Well-Known Member
Just to repeat myself because I see the futility in this thread: a conversation that would find a resolution would require a face-to-face discussion with someone who knows the answers to your questions. A thread is not a format for a true life-changing conversation. Too many facets of communication are missing. Well, for me anyway. I need to hear tone of voice, see body language, facial expressions, etc. Maybe that is not true for everyone, but not everyone can write their views accurately. That is why schools teach both technical and creative writing - and even writing just for legal documents. In the case of this thread, a face-to-face meeting is more than likely required.
There’s no need for a believer to be discouraged by the futility of this thread. Walk away and walk on.
P.S.
I‘ve been speaking with someone else away from the forum for a while now about this thread. When I gave that person an update this morning it was pointed out to me that other believers might not yet see it that way. I was commended for encouraging fellow believers but lightly chastised for advising, or implying, that it was time for them also to walk away; that it’s a decision better left to the individual believer to make for himself or herself. I agree with that gentle correction. [Walk away only if / when you’ve become fully persuaded in your mind / spirit that the gospel has been rejected and walk on in the faith, not being discouraged by the other person’s rejection of salvation.]
My conversation with @Cerraco was a pleasant one. I should have thanked him for it after mutually agreeing to go our separate ways. I‘m making amends for that oversight now.
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From my X / Twitter feed today.
“When I discuss atheism, I adhere to the traditional definition: ‘ a person who does not believe in God’.
However, there is a contemporary trend to redefine atheism in a way that aligns more closely with what has been described as agnosticism, which is ‘the position of not knowing or being unsure about the existence of God’.
This redefinition seems to be motivated by an attempt to avoid the burden of proof traditionally associated with making positive assertions.
By framing atheism as merely a lack of belief rather than a positive claim, some atheists aim to shift the conversation away from needing to prove the non-existence of God.
No fruitful conversation can really be done with an individual not willing to even accept what atheism truly means.”
x.com
The conversation I had in this thread with a kind-hearted atheist is the first time I’ve personally experienced this reframing firsthand. My experience lead me to the same conclusion as the author of the tweet. I’m grateful for having lived it before reading about it. I’ll be better equipped if / when I encounter it again.
“When I discuss atheism, I adhere to the traditional definition: ‘ a person who does not believe in God’.
However, there is a contemporary trend to redefine atheism in a way that aligns more closely with what has been described as agnosticism, which is ‘the position of not knowing or being unsure about the existence of God’.
This redefinition seems to be motivated by an attempt to avoid the burden of proof traditionally associated with making positive assertions.
By framing atheism as merely a lack of belief rather than a positive claim, some atheists aim to shift the conversation away from needing to prove the non-existence of God.
No fruitful conversation can really be done with an individual not willing to even accept what atheism truly means.”
x.com
x.com
The conversation I had in this thread with a kind-hearted atheist is the first time I’ve personally experienced this reframing firsthand. My experience lead me to the same conclusion as the author of the tweet. I’m grateful for having lived it before reading about it. I’ll be better equipped if / when I encounter it again.
For Christians who deal with atheists, keep in mind that according to Paul in Rom 1 all humans know that God exists. We all know this intuitively. When someone tells me he/she is an atheist, I just smile.
Didn't expect this to keep going.
Since we're here. Might as well slip this one in: it was said that God has no plan for me, or at least doesn't because I don't believe in him. Then... why did he create so many people who he KNEW wouldn't believe in him anyway..?
???????
Since we're here. Might as well slip this one in: it was said that God has no plan for me, or at least doesn't because I don't believe in him. Then... why did he create so many people who he KNEW wouldn't believe in him anyway..?
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Lambano
Well-Known Member
I actually don't think this is true. As a Christian, I do trust that God DOES have a plan, and the plan includes all the pieces on the board, believers and non-believers. I may not understand how human free will and responsibility fits into the big picture, I dislike the suffering around us as much as anybody else does, I don't know what part you have to play, I don't even know for sure what my own role is. But I trust that there is a purpose and a plan, and "All things work together for good for those who love God". (I can quote chapter and verse on that if you like.)
I invite you to also step out with us in trust. Will you join me?
From my X / Twitter feed today.
“When I discuss atheism, I adhere to the traditional definition: ‘ a person who does not believe in God’.
However, there is a contemporary trend to redefine atheism in a way that aligns more closely with what has been described as agnosticism, which is ‘the position of not knowing or being unsure about the existence of God’.
This redefinition seems to be motivated by an attempt to avoid the burden of proof traditionally associated with making positive assertions.
By framing atheism as merely a lack of belief rather than a positive claim, some atheists aim to shift the conversation away from needing to prove the non-existence of God.
No fruitful conversation can really be done with an individual not willing to even accept what atheism truly means.”
x.com
The conversation I had in this thread with a kind-hearted atheist is the first time I’ve personally experienced this reframing firsthand. My experience lead me to the same conclusion as the author of the tweet. I’m grateful for having lived it before reading about it. I’ll be better equipped if / when I encounter it again.
“‘You see,’ said Aslan. ‘They will not let us help them. They have chosen cunning instead of belief. Their prison is only in their own minds, yet they are in that prison; and so afraid of being taken in that they cannot be taken out.’” - C.S. Lewis
This may not apply to all atheists - or even just to atheists - but I believe it applies to many.
A smart God does not create billions of people, knowing they will not all be Christians and believe things they cannot see, then act like a petulant child and send more than half of those people to hell. Seemed like a lot of those people were doomed from the start.
So what happens with people that live lives that are so horrible, they think, "No God would ever allow this, I'll never believe he is real!" Then what? Then that poor sap has to suffer? Didn't God create that guy's personality? Didn't God know the guy's future before it happened. Kind of awkward that God is a "jealous god" but is all-loving and all-knowing? Hmmmmm... Yeah no.
Uhhhhhhhh... yeah... I doubt it. Even if I believed in God right now, I couldn't be a Christian because the logic just never ever ever ever ever works. And a lot of Christians are dopey hypocrites that think they're going straight to heaven just because they think like X, Y and Z.
My mom is very close to death, and starting from a few days back, she was hospitalized and is - right now - no longer responsive. This just makes me angrier at life. I get to be a 36-year-old virgin in a country that value sex more than anything else, my hair is thinning, and it seems like life wants to keep screwing with me and trolling me, oh by the way, let's throw my mother on top of that, obviously the worst thing of all. I can't even see her at the hospital every day because it is excruciatingly painful to see her in that state.
Life can be very difficult for someone who wants to "judge God" by His works. I have to remind myself quite often that my mind cannot comprehend Yahweh's intents and plans. I'm like a 1985 PC with only 16k of ram trying to judge a new gaming computer today. Faith comes when I allow myself to acknowledge His power without criticizing those things that I cannot understand. It is not given to me to be able to do that. What I CAN do is to see how blessed my life has been since I turned it over to Him.
Lambano
Well-Known Member
Which is the real issue, then?
If you hate being an atheist, is it because you WANT to believe that there is a plan, there is purpose and meaning in a life filled with suffering and death? But you can't believe that a rational God would plan it that way, and make it so difficult to believe and trust in a good and loving God? Plus, you find that Hell club which Christians use to beat others into being afraid of this God that's hard to believe in anyway to be at best grossly unfair and at worst personally violating?
Or is the problem that deep down you DO believe God exists, but you're pissed-off at Him for making you the way you are (yes, I understand being considered lesser and considering oneself lesser because you don't meet the surrounding culture's expectations; and I remember full well what it's like to be young and lonely and horny), and for allowing what you're going through and what your mother's going through to happen?
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Lambano
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry.
We just lost our son to brain cancer. That's a bastard disease. Sometimes life really sucks. But despair is a sh**ty alternative.
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I would like to believe in God, because that means there's a sense of justice and purpose in life. If God exists, that would also mean there's an afterlife, meaning that life has a purpose, rather than just being born for no reason than dying into an infinite oblivion. But the Bible does not follow standard logic, and there will always be something that never ever ever makes sense. Some people can believe in God by just "going with it", but that line of thought will never work on me.
Some people will never hook up with someone and get married, so why give that person a sex drive? To humiliate them? People thank God for what they have, but there's people born in North Korea and Ethiopia and have to live a life of misery. What's "God's plan" there? This is why it's easier to believe that people are born just because two people humped. I find myself getting angrier and angrier at life. I'm so painfully tempted to find some chick on Craigslist or something and get it over with. I don't want to do that, but I find myself caring less and less about things. Maybe if some random accident killed me, I might get an easy way to heaven since it wasn't suicide.
Everything happens around me. For example, if I walked on water next to a guy that is also walking on water, people would shower the other guy with praise while someone would angrily tell me that I'm getting my shoes wet. Women always go for my friends. Every single time I'm near a woman I'm interested in, something dumb and embarrassing HAS to happen at that very moment. I can't explain how many times that happens, and no one would ever believe me. This is why I gave up on the whole "finding love" thing, because it seems that "the powers that be" don't want it to happen. Why try if the embarrassing curse remains? No point to keep sticking my hand on the stove if I already know it hurts.
No. She isn't exactly a full on Christian, but she does seem to believe in God and miracles. Also, she is making a full recovery, but needed many surgeries that might make her life worse.
Good lord, I'm very sorry. What's the other option other than despair? To put my faith in an invisible thing that may or may not help me?
Since this seems to be an inevitably event with you and the ladies you should have a plan at the ready when it happens .
You could say . " Wow , can you believe that just happened ! I think I could star in a TV show about the crazy things that happen to me ! Would you watch it ? "
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