The absurdity of Pretrib logic

[WPM]

Ok. Pretend the 7 trumpets are not in the 7th seal. I can't make the blind see. You will see pretty soon. I wish you well when you get your wish.

You do not seem to recognize the recaps.

 

[WPM]

I don't want to take the time to search for it because no matter the proof it will change nothing. There are five wise and five foolish.

That is because you have not addressed this.

 

[The Light]

And? What does that prove? Your reasoning has been repeatedly and solidly refuted on this thread. It is in pieces. This getting old. All you have now is impotent petty soundbites.

As I said. I already addressed your post. What's getting old is you copying and pasting and wanting answers to things that have been addressed.

Thanks for totally sidestepping my post again. You have to.

Thanks for reposting something that has already been addressed again.

I will take that as a complement that it is biblically irrefutable.

Already been refuted.

It is becoming abundantly clear to those watching on, no Pretrib can address the Posttrib arguments. That is because they are watertight. All Pretribs have is their evasive soundbites.

Don't you mean you taking the page of those that think they have replaced Israel and deny, deny, deny.

Your teachers have misled you. (1) Being a literal virgin does not in any way gain you entry into heaven. I do not know who would've taught you that, but they are deceiving you. That sounds like something that Islam would teach. (2) The foolish virgins have "no oil" in their vessels. They are unprepared. That is the thrust of this parable. Those that have eyes to see and do not have a theological agenda can see that. This is not talking about the Holy Spirit. He is not in a physical lamp but in a human life. This is not hard to get your head around.

I refer you back to the irrefutable avoided biblical evidence I presented.

Right. My teachers. How is it you are unable to come up with any possibilities.

The Lord says to watch and be ready. He will come in an hour that you think not. How you can possibly think that the rapture is after the wrath of God is beyond any comprehension. You are fooling yourself.

 

[The Light]

You are blind to the recaps because they demolish what you have been taught. You must live in denial holding a doctrine that is deeply unscriptural, enjoys not one prooftext, is crumbling throughout the world and is being abandoned by multitudes who have eyes to see and ears to hear.

Who teaches the truth of two raptures? Who are my teachers.

One rapture like the days of Noah and one like the days of lot.

Your doctrine was formed by unbelieving men who didn't believe that God would keep His promise to Israel. There are five wise and five foolish.

 

[The Light]

That is because you have not addressed this.

Was this the first time you have posted these cycles to me?

 

[WPM]

As I said. I already addressed your post. What's getting old is you copying and pasting and wanting answers to things that have been addressed.


Thanks for reposting something that has already been addressed again.


Already been refuted.

Don't you mean you taking the page of those that think they have replaced Israel and deny, deny, deny.


Right. My teachers. How is it you are unable to come up with any possibilities.

The Lord says to watch and be ready. He will come in an hour that you think not. How you can possibly think that the rapture is after the wrath of God is beyond any comprehension. You are fooling yourself.

The catching away occurs before the final destruction. Not sure why you thought Amils believe other.

 

[WPM]

Was this the first time you have posted these cycles to me?

You avoided then and you avoided here.

 

[WPM]

Who teaches the truth of two raptures? Who are my teachers.

One rapture like the days of Noah and one like the days of lot.

Your doctrine was formed by unbelieving men who didn't believe that God would keep His promise to Israel. There are five wise and five foolish.

The Bible doesn't teach your doctrine.

 

[honeycomb]

No PEtRA.
I was asking when Jesus mentioned the millennium as he was teaching his second coming in the Gospels.

For instance, this in matt 25...,

31 “But when the Son of Man comes in His glory and majesty and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him [for judgment]; and He will separate them from one another, as a shepherd separates his sheep from the goats; 33 and He will put the sheep on His right [the place of honor], and the goats on His left [the place of rejection].

34 “Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father [you favored of God, appointed to eternal salvation], inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.

41 “Then He will say to those on His left, ‘Leave Me, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels (demons);



Paul according to the word of the Lord put it this way...,

2Thess 1
5 This is a positive proof of the righteous judgment of God [a sign of His fair verdict], so that you will be considered worthy of His kingdom, for which indeed you are suffering.
6 For after all it is only just for God to repay with distress those who distress you, 7 and to give relief to you who are so distressed and to us as well when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in a flame of fire,
8 dealing out [full and complete] vengeance to those who do not [seek to] know God and to those who ignore and refuse to obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus [by choosing not to respond to Him].
9 These people will pay the penalty and endure the punishment of everlasting destruction, banished from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes to be glorified in His saints on that day , and to be marveled at among all who have believed, because our testimony to you was believed and trusted [and confirmed in your lives].

I see the end with nobody left to rule over post 2nd coming.
What I do see is the NHNE where the righteous will dwell.


2Pet 3

A New Heaven and Earth​

10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will vanish with a [mighty and thunderous] roar, and the [material] elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and the works that are on it will be burned up.

11 Since all these things are to be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be [in the meantime] in holy behavior [that is, in a pattern of daily life that sets you apart as a believer] and in godliness [displaying profound reverence toward our awesome God], 12 [while you earnestly] look for and await the coming of the day of God. For on this day the heavens will be destroyed by burning, and the [material] elements will melt with intense heat! 13 But in accordance with His promise we expectantly await new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells.

14 So, beloved, since you are looking forward to these things, be diligent and make every effort to be found by Him [at His return] spotless and blameless, in peace [that is, inwardly calm with a sense of spiritual well-being and confidence, having lived a life of obedience to Him].
15 And consider the patience of our Lord [His delay in judging and avenging wrongs] as salvation [that is, allowing time for more to be saved]; just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given to him [by God], 16 speaking about these things as he does in all of his letters.

God bless

Jeff, do you believe in a 1,000-year millennium? If so, when does this come to pass? Thx.

 

[jeffweeder]

Jeff, do you believe in a 1,000-year millennium? If so, when does this come to pass? Thx.

I believe the millennium is now.
The first resurrection is the spiritual resurrection.
You reacted to my post 137 in the vain babbling thread that explains more.
Also the post you reacted to in this thread about his coming, they go hand in hand to explain my position.



Jn 5 and rev 20 were both penned by John and do not contradict each other when it states us not coming under judgment and condemnation, which is the second death, and the time "now is". I assure you. Bodily resurrection not required to not come under the judgment of the second death.

Jn 5
24 “I assure you and most solemnly say to you, the person who hears My word [the one who heeds My message], and believes and trusts in Him who sent Me, has (possesses now) eternal life [that is, eternal life actually begins—the believer is transformed], and does not come into judgment and condemnation, but has passed [over] from death into life.

25 I assure you and most solemnly say to you, a time is coming and is [here] now, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear it will live.

Rev 20
6 Blessed (happy, prosperous, to be admired) and holy is the person who takes part in the first resurrection; over these the second death [which is eternal separation from God, the lake of fire] has no power or authority,


To partake of 1st resurrection is in this current age.... Now is, Has already passed from death to life,

 

[honeycomb]

Good morning , @jeffweeder

Who are the dead who will not live again until after the Millennium?

Revelation 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

 

[CadyandZoe]

That doesn't sound right
Rather, it was their rejection of Gods salvation.

Lk 19
41 As He approached Jerusalem, He saw the city and wept over it [and the spiritual ignorance of its people], 42 saying, “If [only] you had known on this day [of salvation], even you, the things which make for peace [and on which peace depends]! But now they have been hidden from your eyes.
43 For a time [of siege] is coming when your enemies will put up a barricade [with pointed stakes] against you, and surround you [with armies] and hem you in on every side, 44 and they will level you to the ground, you [Jerusalem] and your children within you. They will not leave in you one stone on another, all because you did not [come progressively to] recognize [from observation and personal experience] the time of your visitation [when God was gracious toward you and offered you salvation].”

Yes. And what action did Israel take that signaled her rejection of his salvation?

 

[CadyandZoe]

Rev 1
4 John, to the seven churches that are in [the province of] Asia: Grace [be granted] to you and peace [inner calm and spiritual well-being], from Him Who is [existing forever] and Who was [continually existing in the past] and Who is to come, and from the seven Spirits that are before His throne, 5 and from Jesus Christ, the]faithful and trustworthy Witness, the Firstborn of the dead, and the Ruler of the kings of the earth.

Is Jesus ruling the kings of the earth at the present time?

 

[CadyandZoe]

Hi @CadyandZoe . . . This is the first seal—Deception —Satan imitating Jesus Christ. Satan’s bow is made of a cheap fabric (Strong’s Concordance #5115)—definitely not the beautiful Shekinah glory that will surround the true Christ, the King of kings and Lord of lords when He comes at the 7th trump.

Jesus warns us in the book of Mark:


View attachment 49312PEtRA

Doesn't the New Testament also use the Greek word for "bow" to indicate a rainbow?

 

[CadyandZoe]

Not sure you will get this but the reason he is carrying a bow is because he is Apollo the false savior. Apollo of Greece is Horus of Egypt. Both are Tammuz. Tammuz is the false savior.

Ezekiel 8
14 Then he brought me to the door of the gate of the Lord's house which was toward the north; and, behold, there sat women weeping for Tammuz.

Look on the back of a dollar bill and you will see a pyramid with the eye of Horus on the back. The world is waiting for their false savior. If you look at most of the religions of the world you will find a false trinity with a false Messiah. This is Tammuz of Babylon, a real person, who is Horus of Egypt, Apollo of Greece, Thor of Norway etc, etc. Most claim these are myths. That would not be correct.

That is very Interesting. I didn't know that. Did Apollo or Horus carry a bow?

 

[CadyandZoe]

Rev14 :3
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

And the throne is in heaven?

 

[IndianaRob]

Doesn't the New Testament also use the Greek word for "bow" to indicate a rainbow?

The rider of the white horse is clearly Jesus. The bow represents Gods covenant. Jacob a type of Christ wore a coat of many colors.

Jesus rose into Jerusalem on an ass which is in the horse family.

Jesus wore a crown of thorns. The crown in Revelation is a stephanous crown which is a woven wreath.

Jesus came to conquer sin and death.

 

[The Light]

That is very Interesting. I didn't know that. Did Apollo or Horus carry a bow?

Apollo. He is the Greek god of archery. The Romans also borrowed Apollo from the Greeks.


Also, when He is discussed as the rider on the white horse, it is often claimed that he carries a bow with no arrows. That's a false conclusion. Thats like saying he carries a pistol with no bullets. Just because the arrows are not mentioned does not mean he is not carrying them.

You will find this false Messiah in most of the religions of the world. That is why, when he comes, he will be accepted so easily as the world is waiting for their false Messiah.

When the story of Jesus spread saying that God was His Father, the people of the world already knew that story. Tammuz the false Messiah was claimed that his mother Semiramis was impregnated by a ray of the sun. Nimrod at his death was claimed to be the sun in the false Babylonian religion.

It's the same story as Zeus the Greek god having relations with a human woman and their son was Hercules, the savior of the world. Satan know what was coming so he spread a false religion so the world would say we've already heard this story, and we already have our god.

On a sidenote, in most false religions the male god is the sun and the female god is the moon. However, in Islam, the male God is the moon. This is why there is a crescent moon on top of their masque.

 

[rebuilder 454]

The rider of the white horse is clearly Jesus. The bow represents Gods covenant. Jacob a type of Christ wore a coat of many colors.

Jesus rose into Jerusalem on an ass which is in the horse family.

Jesus wore a crown of thorns. The crown in Revelation is a stephanous crown which is a woven wreath.

Jesus came to conquer sin and death.

This is way off.
The 1st horse rider is not Jesus.
It is the false christ, the antichrist.
When Jesus comes on a white horse He is accompanied by millions of saints blackening the sky.
He comes on horses AFTER the 7 yr gt.
What you are supposing is impossible.
That false Jesus is at tge door , ready to appear.
You better research and get it straight.
You will be following the devil If you fall for the deception.
Millions of believers took the death jab, listening to the government "Wisdom" on covid.
Millions still think ivermecton and quinine are bogus drugs with no effect on covid.
Millions of believers fell for Obama, a wicked Muslim.
Millions will be deceived at the start of the gt., as declared in the bible.

 

[The Light]

The rider of the white horse is clearly Jesus.

Not a chance. The seals are not opened and will not be opened until after the fullness of the Gentiles comes in.

The bow represents Gods covenant.

Got any scripture to back that up or are you just passing things down from others?

Jacob a type of Christ wore a coat of many colors.

Thow that Bible away now. Try KJV. It says Joseph wore a coat of many colors.

Jesus rose into Jerusalem on an ass which is in the horse family.

It just keeps getting deeper and deeper. This nonsense gets passed down because people are making excuses to make their doctrine work.

I can do this too. Asses and horses eat grass, and the Jesus was born in a manger full of grass. Asses and horses drop manure, and the world has become a dung pile. Dung burns and the world will be destroyed by fire. Dung piles bring butterflies, and they spread manure all over the world. Butterflies fly into the heavens and represents the rapture. This nonsense is easy.

Jesus wore a crown of thorns. The crown in Revelation is a stephanous crown which is a woven wreath.

Jesus came to conquer sin and death.

Here is the stephanos crown, the symbol of the UN. A covenant with many will be made in the UN.